Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=skinsfan69;319828]How about you educate yourself on health and fitness before you start throwing around assumptions you can't prove. Jeez![/quote]

Ummmm, his arms more than doubled in size over 1 offseason. He used Steroids 100%. Not really going out on a limb with that one......

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

I'd take him in a heart beat! Think about it, who would you rather have as your number four WR: Thrash or McCardell? I hate to say this because Thrash is a "Core Redskins" and as served us so well for so many years but he is more washed up then McCardell is! Lets pretend that Lloyd winds up being terrible again this year or his attitude isn't so great (realistic may I add). Who would you rather have in your three wide out sets: Moss, ARE and McCardell or Moss, ARE, and Thrash.

I know you guys are all going to say, "Thrash...blah...blah...special teams...blah...blah..." He just doesn't contribute enough to his TRUE position of WR!

Thoughts?

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=JDALY27;319875]Ummmm, his arms more than doubled in size over 1 offseason. He used Steroids 100%. Not really going out on a limb with that one......[/quote]

I am not trying to insult you by any means but you are probably dead wrong. Read my previous post and that expalins it.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=Mattyk72;319872]Losing 16 pounds isn't very hard at all. It's much harder to put on 20 pounds of muscle.

Again just to clarify I'm not saying Lloyd is juicing. I was just very surprised when I saw him for the first time this year. I didn't even recognize him with the new haircut and guns. I really hope it's a change for the better.[/quote]

Well I wasn't trying to point you out and if you saw it that way i apologize. No one actually said yeah he's using steroids but the more posts I read the more it seemed to become a strong consideration. I mean I hope to shit that he isn't juicing because that would be a blower but I don't know. I know it's easier to lose weight just by eating right and taking a well stacked poo you'll be good. That's what my offseason consists of, excercising and eating right so when the season comes around I have nacho's, fried chicken/fish, a whole lotta chips, sausages, and of course beer room. Vodka is year round, heavy beer drinking is saved for football !

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=skinsfan69;319880]I am not trying to insult you by any means but you are probably dead wrong. Read my previous post and that expalins it.[/quote]


I'm not insulted.

Just don't see that being natural, that's all. Don't need you to agree with my opinion. Its cool.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=mmil12;319879]I'd take him in a heart beat! Think about it, who would you rather have as your number four WR: Thrash or McCardell? I hate to say this because Thrash is a "Core Redskins" and as served us so well for so many years but he is more washed up then McCardell is! Lets pretend that Lloyd winds up being terrible again this year or his attitude isn't so great (realistic may I add). Who would you rather have in your three wide out sets: Moss, ARE and McCardell or Moss, ARE, and Thrash.

I know you guys are all going to say, "Thrash...blah...blah...special teams...blah...blah..." He just doesn't contribute enough to his TRUE position of WR!

Thoughts?[/quote]

Can you name any #4 wr's in the NFL that don't play teams?? It hurts you on the roster spots if you have a #4 wr that does not play teams. A #4 wr has to be able to do more than just come in for 10 or so plays a game. No way it's going to work.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

I like the insurance that he gives versus what Thrash can give us when it comes to his overall WR skills. Let's face it, Moss - Hamstring issues, Lloyd- Attitude issues, ARE - totally fine, but can't do it alone, McCardell - formerly a #1 wide-out, Thrash - never better then a #2 WR and that was with he was with Philly and the number one was Freddy "alligator arms" Mitchell.

I agree with you that Thrash is an excellent special teams player, I would just rather have McCardell for the insurance at WR and honestly, I don't want to cut Espy. Moreover, the thought of carrying 6 WR's is just stupid.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[QUOTE=mmil12;319879]I'd take him in a heart beat! Think about it, who would you rather have as your number four WR: Thrash or McCardell? I hate to say this because Thrash is a "Core Redskins" and as served us so well for so many years but he is more washed up then McCardell is! Lets pretend that Lloyd winds up being terrible again this year or his attitude isn't so great (realistic may I add). Who would you rather have in your three wide out sets: Moss, ARE and McCardell or Moss, ARE, and Thrash.

I know you guys are all going to say, "Thrash...blah...blah...special teams...blah...blah..." He just doesn't contribute enough to his TRUE position of WR!

Thoughts?[/QUOTE]

How is Thrash more washed up than McCardell? Thrash is five years younger than him.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

Numbers don't lie...here are the last three years for both players. Does this explain why McCardell would be a better receiver then Thrash? McCardell has almost as many reception last year as thrash has had the last three years combined.

Thrash:
2004 WAS 17 203 11.9 0
2005 WAS 14 194 13.9 0
2006 WAS 12 151 12.6 1

McCardell:
2004 SDG 31 393 12.7 1
2005 SDG 70 917 13.1 9
2006 SDG 36 437 12.1 1

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

Here's something to chew on:

I put on over 50 lbs in about 4 months (the majority of which is fat). However, if I ever decided to work out, I could probably shed that and turn it into at least 20 lbs of muscle.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=jdlea;319909]Here's something to chew on:

I put on over 50 lbs in about 4 months (the majority of which is fat). However, if I ever decided to work out, I could probably shed that and turn it into at least 20 lbs of muscle.[/quote]


sounds like you been chewing

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[QUOTE=mmil12;319905]Numbers don't lie...here are the last three years for both players. Does this explain why McCardell would be a better receiver then Thrash? McCardell has almost as many reception last year as thrash has had the last three years combined.

Thrash:
2004 WAS 17 203 11.9 0
2005 WAS 14 194 13.9 0
2006 WAS 12 151 12.6 1

McCardell:
2004 SDG 31 393 12.7 1
2005 SDG 70 917 13.1 9
2006 SDG 36 437 12.1 1[/QUOTE]

Sure, but I don't think we're talking about Thrash or Keenan as the #1 guy here. We're talking about the #4 receiver. When you're talking about the #4 receiver I don't think number of catches is the key factor to look at. These are the guys who are, as previously mentioned, playing special teams; making the key block on a long run, and all those other intangibles.

Sure, if injuries happen and the #4 becomes the #1 then yeah you want Keenan over Thrash. But you can't approach it that way.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=skinsfan_nn;319587]Yes, this is a tough one. I don't think we would let thrash go, it would proubally be Espy....? I like McCardell a good vet that would be nice to have, if he has any gas left in the tank.

I think Espy has a strong upside, he just needs a chance, and had a really strong showing at mini-camp he was in the top four list of best camp players, he just needs a chance to prove himself in a real game.

I guess if I had to pick it would be the proven vet IF HE CAN STILL PLAY, with a year, but not so sure. This is a tough call![/quote]Thrash plays special teams and is a player-coach. It's good news that Espy is making strides but, it won't hurt Espy to sit another year to see how Lloyd pans out.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

JLC's take on McCardell:

Made some calls this morning and the Skins are in fact negotiating with McCardell, 37, to bring him into camp. He has good size and has been a quality possession guy for a long time. Not great speed and nearing the end, but the Skins could definitely use someone as a big target for Jason Campbell as a slot guy.

From what I have heard, they essentially offered McCardell the veteran minimum, which would be the logical initial move in this case. There would be no guarantees that McCardell, a former Skins draft pick who never actually played for them, would make the team. This late in free-agency game, guys aren't getting big bucks and Keenan would realize that.

McCardell (6-1, 191) lives in Houston and was offered the minimun by the Texans. So if he's going to sign someplace for that money, might as well do it at home I would presume. But from what I gather, the Skins have some legit interest here - which speaks to the odd way they comprise their roster and how, after spending so many millions on complimentary receivers, they still have a need.

If they step up and give McCardell a decent little signing bonus, I think it gets done. He's a bit part at this point, but has assets the team lacks. Lloyd and Randle El have never proven to be No. 2 WRs to this point in their career - although one of them had better do so in 2007 - and McCardell did manage to start 11 games for the AFC powerhouse Chargers in 2006, though with limited production (36 catches, 437 yards, no TDs).

In 2005, though, McCardell started all 16 games, had 70 catches had nearly 1,000 yards; he caught 9 TDs and had 50 first-down catches - which is exactly the kind of thing the Skins need, someone savvy to move the chains and make catches in the high-traffic areas,

So we'll see what the Skins do over the next little while. Ball is in their court. I was surprised they didn't even take a look at Keyshawn - even with his issues - and to me it makes a lot of sense to throw a bonus at McCardell and a $1 million base and give Lloyd and that bunch a little something to consider. The 16-year vet. would be a positive influence on the younger guys if nothing else, and has been known as a locker room leader type for a long time.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=jdlea;319909]Here's something to chew on:

I put on over 50 lbs in about 4 months (the majority of which is fat). However, if I ever decided to work out, I could probably shed that and turn it into at least 20 lbs of muscle.[/quote]

Damn dude. That a lot of lbs. I see your in College Park. I use to live there from 91-94. Back then my diet was Cluck U Chicken, $4 Jerry's Cheese Pizza, MaDonalds and Olympia beer.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

McCardell would be an excellent addition to the team. James Trash hasnt done anything since before he left for philly. His hands are questionable and he is like another WR here......scared to go across the middle. McCardell is an all around great posession reciever and a great LEADER something this team needs with the emphasis on the youth of this team.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=21plus30equalsbashbros;320055]McCardell would be an excellent addition to the team. James Trash hasnt done anything since before he left for philly. His hands are questionable and he is like another WR here......scared to go across the middle. McCardell is an all around great posession reciever and a great LEADER something this team needs with the emphasis on the youth of this team.[/quote]

you raise a good point but like other people said James Thrash plays special teams while mccardell does not. But if Mccardell comes I think Espy is out.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=21plus30equalsbashbros;320055]McCardell would be an excellent addition to the team. James Trash hasnt done anything since before he left for philly. His hands are questionable and he is like another WR here......scared to go across the middle. McCardell is an all around great posession reciever and a great LEADER something this team needs with the emphasis on the youth of this team.[/quote]

What? Thrash has questionable hands, done nothing AND is scared to go across the middle?
He may have the best hands on the team play for play. I don't recall Thrash dropping anything since we got him back, but I'm sure he's dropped a couple as any wr does. He has played maybe 20% of the snaps and he's blocked & caught the ball when his # is called. I've only missed a couple games on tv the last few years & my view of Thrash is the polar opposite of yours. I'm not even talking about his contributions on spec. teams, which is substantial, just his ability as a wr. His only flaw is that he's not a game breaker, but he still fights for extra yardage & I have no idea why you say he has questionable hands & is scared to go across the middle. Most every pass that comes his way is in traffic.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;319971]Damn dude. That a lot of lbs. I see your in College Park. I use to live there from 91-94. Back then my diet was Cluck U Chicken, $4 Jerry's Cheese Pizza, MaDonalds and Olympia beer.[/QUOTE]

Yeah...a whole lot of beer and sitting at a desk all day doesn't much help. My weight has actually been odd recently though because I was 180. Then I got up to 215, got back down to 185 and now I'm about 235. That's been about the last 18 months. Most of it is also because I grew to 6'3 in high school and now I'm filling out my frame some, so I don't mind the weight...outside of not having a lot of muscle.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[QUOTE=EARTHQUAKE2689;320058]you raise a good point but like other people said James Thrash plays special teams while mccardell does not. But if Mccardell comes I think Espy is out.[/QUOTE]

I think that's a mistake. The Skins have a kid in Espy who could develop into a decent wide receiver. I don't think there's any reason to bring a guy who is going to set him back or have him end up being cut. If he doesn't work out, it's not that big of a deal, but I would rather the Skins keep a 24 year old to going out and getting a 37 year old.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

I know people love the underdogs but c'mon, if you have a chance to sign a proven veteran like McCardell to a veteran minimum deal vs. keeping a complete unknown practice squad caliber player like Espy you take the vet every day of the week.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=Mattyk72;320090]I know people love the underdogs but c'mon, if you have a chance to sign a proven veteran like McCardell to a veteran minimum deal vs. keeping a complete unknown practice squad caliber player like Espy you take the vet every day of the week.[/quote]Yeah, for sure McCardell is going to be the better option this year, but what will his impact be? Remember, if we roster Keenan McCardell, thats one spot on the 53 man that can not go to a young guy. And does he make this team any better? Not a whole lot if any.

It's kind of meaningless in the big picture either way, but I'd rather not have two receivers who don't play teams on my roster.

McCardells just not what he used to be.

Do we even know if he's still a better option than Thrash? Thats the mistake we made last year with Lloyd and Randle El, we forgot to consider the possibility that the incumbant by default might be a better player.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=mmil12;319879]Who would you rather have in your three wide out sets: Moss, ARE and McCardell or Moss, ARE, and Thrash.[/quote]Moss, Cooley, and Betts. Somewhat serious.

In passing situations, how can you not have Portis, Betts, Moss, Cooley, and ARE all on the field. Those are your five best offensive weapons. Putting anyone else on the field would decrease our offensive potential.

You could make the arguement that McCardell>ARE at receiver, a valid statement, but the difference probably isn't big enough to mitigate ARE's versatility, especially when you are considering giving a roster spot to Keenan or not.

In today's game, the most versatile offensive players can be receivers in 3-4 receiver personel packages. Betts can be a good slot receiver, and Cooley can split wide. We should ONLY be adding receivers who are better than Lloyd/ARE, instead of just rostering more players for the sake of having more players.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=jdlea;320087]I think that's a mistake. The Skins have a kid in Espy who could develop into a decent wide receiver. I don't think there's any reason to bring a guy who is going to set him back or have him end up being cut. If he doesn't work out, it's not that big of a deal, but I would rather the Skins keep a 24 year old to going out and getting a 37 year old.[/quote]


I hear that but we have 3 recievers already in their 20's that make Espy look like a scrub, if anyone goes it will be him.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

Adding another WR would not be a bad idea. But he has got to be a young guy that we can develop. KM is not going to beat out BL or ARE for the 2nd and 3rd wr spots. Sorry guys but it's just not going to happen. So that leaves JT. Why in the hell would you bring in an old 4th wr that does not play teams?????? IT MAKES NO SENSE AT ALL.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=skinsfan69;320102]Adding another WR would not be a bad idea. But he has got to be a young guy that we can develop. KM is not going to beat out BL or ARE for the 2nd and 3rd wr spots. Sorry guys but it's just not going to happen. So that leaves JT. Why in the hell would you bring in an old 4th wr that does not play teams?????? IT MAKES NO SENSE AT ALL.[/quote]

I think JLC's point is a good one - KM being there would have an influence. I don't always buy that vet leadership line (see bruce smith), but JLC's point is that it would send a message to BL et al, that they will have to compete for a roster spot & playing time. That didn't happen last year, as the job was basically handed to Loyd. Both ARE & JT outplayed him.

IF KM is signed I would expect him to not be on the active roster until someone gets hurt. Since we'd have 4 wr's who don't play teams, that could present some roster shuffling challenges I'll admit, but I really think this could work & the guy that is being challenged is Loyd. Whether they sign KM as a threat to his pt, or as insurance against him turning TO on us, it seems a good strategy.

On the other hand, if it comes down to KM & Espy all thing being equal in terms of production, I would prefer to see Espy get a spot. I just don't believe that Espy has demonstrated that he's ready for sundays. Hopefully he'll get some time w/the first unit in preseason & shine.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

right now the skins have a somewhat young receiving corps. why bring in Mccardell? to me this move makes absolutely no sense

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=freddyg12;320105]I think JLC's point is a good one - KM being there would have an influence. I don't always buy that vet leadership line (see bruce smith), but JLC's point is that it would send a message to BL et al, that they will have to compete for a roster spot & playing time. That didn't happen last year, as the job was basically handed to Loyd. Both ARE & JT outplayed him.

IF KM is signed I would expect him to not be on the active roster until someone gets hurt. Since we'd have 4 wr's who don't play teams, that could present some roster shuffling challenges I'll admit, but I really think this could work & the guy that is being challenged is Loyd. Whether they sign KM as a threat to his pt, or as insurance against him turning TO on us, it seems a good strategy.

On the other hand, if it comes down to KM & Espy all thing being equal in terms of production, I would prefer to see Espy get a spot. I just don't believe that Espy has demonstrated that he's ready for sundays. Hopefully he'll get some time w/the first unit in preseason & shine.[/quote]

I see what you are saying but the guy is 37, he can't run anymore and has no future here. It reminds me of signings like Andre Reed and Troy Vincent. I would rather them try and see if Espy can take a step up since it's his 2nd year in the system. Why is it that we are always going after older guys that are not going to be here in 2-3 years?

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

Yeah, I'd rather see us live or die by our younger players than AGAIN overpay for a vet (mercenary) who won't be here...

I could think of worse scenarios than to sign McCardell, but I'd love to see what we have in Espy first.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

I think what we have in Espy is a guy that wont play

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

Why does a player have to have a future to be worth signing? You can't have an entire team full of young guys, veterans have to be part of the mix as well. We have our share of youth at WR with guys like Moss, ARE and Lloyd all under the age of 30.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

I don't have a problem with vets. What I have a problem with is that since he's rejected our veteran minimum offer, that we'll overpay for a position that we need to explore what we have in, or else we're going to stunt their growths.

For me, I feel like signings like that are for when you're on the cusp and just need one more guy to put you over the top.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=Mattyk72;320138]Why does a player have to have a future to be worth signing? You can't have an entire team full of young guys, veterans have to be part of the mix as well. We have our share of youth at WR with guys like Moss, ARE and Lloyd all under the age of 30.[/quote]


That is what I have been saying

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

Anyone else think this thread title is sort of misleading? Saying he's considering "return to NFL" makes it sound like he's Cris Carter, and has sat out for a few years. He played 11 games just last year

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[QUOTE=EARTHQUAKE2689;320141]That is what I have been saying[/QUOTE]

Someone needs to train you on sig etiquette. How many lines and spaces do you really need?

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

when you put it that way it does seem a little misleading.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

I see both sides of this, and as I mentioned earlier I'd love to see Espy break out & make the roster from day 1, but let's not get carried away thinking that he is based on some good preseason games last year. I think we have a tendency to over value some guys w/the hope that they become good players, but truth is they're a dime a dozen till they prove otherwise.

KM is old, but I bet he can beat out espy as a wr. If we add spec. teams in, that's a different story, but first Espy has to show the coaches enough as a wr to make the case.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=Mattyk72;320138]Why does a player have to have a future to be worth signing? You can't have an entire team full of young guys, veterans have to be part of the mix as well. We have our share of youth at WR with guys like Moss, ARE and Lloyd all under the age of 30.[/quote]OR, we could give Espy a shot, and if he doesn't set the world on fire, cut him and move on with 4 recievers on the 53 man.

I don't get this. Are we happy letting Lloyd and ARE prove themselves or not? We say we are, and now we want McCardell?

Re: WR McCardell considering signing with Redskins, Texans
 

Just 4 WRs?

That's leaving things a little thin there.

I don't think McCardell is a threat to Lloyd or ARE's playing time. He'll be a quality guy for depth and situational type stuff.

Re: WR McCardell considering return to NFL with Redskins, Texans
 

[quote=GTripp0012;320178]OR, we could give Espy a shot, and if he doesn't set the world on fire, cut him and move on with 4 recievers on the 53 man.

I don't get this. Are we happy letting Lloyd and ARE prove themselves or not? We say we are, and now we want McCardell?[/quote]

Remember that the people who are considering this have been watching OTA's. I've heard Campbell, Mcintosh, and Cooley singled out for praise, but not Lloyd. If they see a problem I would like them address it now. Let's not limp along hoping things improve on their own.