Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=dmek25;324517]this point makes no sense. coach gibbs made the trade that brought portis to washington. and if you are right, why wasnt a trade made after last season?[/quote]

When Gibbs got here he said it himself that he thought that Betts was just a 3rd down back. He later admitted that he was wrong. If Gibbs knew what he had in Betts when he first got here, do you think he makes the trade? Probably not.

I think that no trades were made because I think the staff realizes that they have one really good player and one great player. It's called quality depth.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=holcknowsbest;324518]you are crazy, and everyone needs too realize one thing. if betts was joe bugals and joe gibbs style then he would start....they would get rid of portis or at least use him as the back up...ask lavar arrington that one fellas, it doesnt matter how much you pay the guy as a coach you are going to play the better player(the player who is your style). quit making comments about portis v betts in terms of betts is better because he isnt other wise he would play over him. betts is a good back up, a f-ing perfect and awesome back up.

another comment is the ol LJ and Priest comparisons with Betts and Portis.....first off priest was better just look at the numbers, second off betts is not even close to on par with LARRY FREAKING JOHNSON!!! get a clue fellas.[/quote]

I never said Betts was better. I don't think he is better. But he does seem to run in between the tackles better and that is what Gibbs and Buges like. Portis is more of a slasher. When did a Joe Gibbs offense ever have a primary RB that was a 205lb slasher? Never. Riggins, Rogers, Byner, Riggs and even Ervins were all powerful in between the tackles type of runners. So IMO Betts fits that style better. But if your talking pure talent, Portis is the better back.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[QUOTE=djnemo65;324509]Why can't they both be great? Seems like a lot of people are attacking Betts in this thread and I don't get that. It's possible to think Portis is probably better without having to diminish what Betts was able to accomplish last year.[/QUOTE]

No kidding.

And another thing, why do so many people seem to act like Betts was some sort of walk-on free agent who stumbled onto the field from The Home Depot. Betts was drafted just a few choices after Portis. Based on that (and I understand it's somewhat rudimentary thinking) they shouldn't be too far apart in talent and ability

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

Coach Gibbs had a very similar backfield in the 80's with Riggo and Joe Washington. Joe Washington's lighting to Riggo's thunder, they have been described as. Unstoppable tandum back then.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=SmootSmack;324532]No kidding.

And another thing, why do so many people seem to act like Betts was some sort of walk-on free agent who stumbled onto the field from The Home Depot. Betts was drafted just a few choices after Portis. Based on that (and I understand it's somewhat rudimentary thinking) they shouldn't be too far apart in talent and ability[/quote]Thank you.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=skinsfan69;324523]But if your talking pure talent, Portis is the better back.[/quote]I think that this is the only thing that really matters...as long as you are including the mental part of the game in that talent assessment.

It's close though. It's not like Portis is a far better player than Betts. He's a bit better, and hes being paid a lot more. Thus he should see more carries.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=GTripp0012;324558]I think that this is the only thing that really matters...as long as you are including the mental part of the game in that talent assessment.

It's close though. It's not like Portis is a far better player than Betts. He's a bit better, and hes being paid a lot more. Thus he should see more carries.[/quote]


He is alot better it is not even close in talent.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

You guys are right. Betts is a good back. ONLY, if he can stay out of the HOSPITAL!

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

Betts will never be better than Portis.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

I am going to say it point blank. Anyone who thinks that Betts is a better back than Clinton Portis is a dumbass. No other way to say it.

I don't give a shit what stats you throw out there. I base my conclusion on two things:

One - I watch the game. Anyone who watches the game and is sane will come to the conclusion that Portis is the better back.

Two - A hall of fame coach who has won three Super Bowls has chosen Portis over Betts. What else do you need?

I guess you know more about running the football than Joe Gibbs?

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

A lot of the points being made in this thread are frusterating me. And its not because this topic isn't worth discussing. It's that people are taking sides, and saying very biased things for no good reason.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=GTripp0012;324617]A lot of the points being made in this thread are frusterating me. And its not because this topic isn't worth discussing. It's that people are taking sides, and saying very biased things for no good reason.[/quote]

The thread should be a non-issue. Joe Gibbs' toenail knows more about football than anyone in the Warpath and he has chosen Portis to be the starter.

Why is there even a debate?

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[QUOTE=Grim21Reaper;324618]The thread should be a non-issue. Joe Gibbs' toenail knows more about football than anyone in the Warpath and he has chosen Portis to be the starter.

Why is there even a debate?[/QUOTE]

Well that's fine then why do we even have this site?

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=Grim21Reaper;324618]The thread should be a non-issue. Joe Gibbs' toenail knows more about football than anyone in the Warpath and he has chosen Portis to be the starter.

Why is there even a debate?[/quote]Of course if we all thought that Gibbs knew more than all of us on every issue, there wouldn't even be dissenting opinion, so this is not necessarily true.

Joe Gibbs is a great football coach. That doesn't make him right 100% of the time. It just makes him good at what he does (coaching).


Now, whats frusterating me is that we are debating the [B]past[/B]. Theres no debate. Portis, excluding this season, has been better every year than Betts both in total and broken down per play.

However, if we debate what the future holds, then you could make a case that Betts will be better going foward. I tend to feel they will both be pretty good, and somewhat interchangable. If I had to pick one, I'll assume Portis will still be above league average coming back from injury, and Betts will regress towards the average after last year. Means I'm taking Portis. But its still a good debate...as long as we debate 2007, and not 2002-2006.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=GTripp0012;324623]Of course if we all thought that Gibbs knew more than all of us on every issue, there wouldn't even be dissenting opinion, so this is not necessarily true.

Joe Gibbs is a great football coach. That doesn't make him right 100% of the time. It just makes him good at what he does (coaching).


Now, whats frusterating me is that we are debating the [B]past[/B]. Theres no debate. Portis, excluding this season, has been better every year than Betts both in total and broken down per play.

However, if we debate what the future holds, then you could make a case that Betts will be better going foward. I tend to feel they will both be pretty good, and somewhat interchangable. If I had to pick one, I'll assume Portis will still be above league average coming back from injury, and Betts will regress towards the average after last year. Means I'm taking Portis. But its still a good debate...as long as we debate 2007, and not 2002-2006.[/quote]


I do not want to build my running game on a guy who is just as likely to fumble as he is to get you in the endzone.

Betts has been a fumbler since we drafted him. No one can argue that. I just don't think that a team that wants to go for it all can trust him as a feature back.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=SmootSmack;324622]Well that's fine then why do we even have this site?[/quote]

Is the Warpath's fate hanging in the balance because of Betts vs. Portis?

That softball just went 350....

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=Grim21Reaper;324641]I do not want to build my running game on a guy who is just as likely to fumble as he is to get you in the endzone.

Betts has been a fumbler since we drafted him. No one can argue that. I just don't think that a team that wants to go for it all can trust him as a feature back.[/quote]People who are chronic fumblers tend not to stay that way. If they have desirable carrying skills, they get it corrected. See: Barber, Tiki.

Betts isn't half as bad as Barber was and he turned out alright.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[QUOTE=Grim21Reaper;324643]Is the Warpath's fate hanging in the balance because of Betts vs. Portis?

That softball just went 350....[/QUOTE]

I think you missed the point

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

I guess what annoys me is threads based on moot points.

Someone could spend hours studying film of every carry by Portis and Betts, break down all of their stats and compare every single variable about them but at the end of the day Portis is the starter. Let me repeat. Clinton Portis is the starting runningback for the Washington Redskins. So what is the point? Now if someone wants to claim that Betts is "quicker" or "more powerful", I guess that is worth a discussion but the argument of who is better is a waste of time.

I am going to trust the three time Championship winning Hall of Fame coach when it comes to picking the runningback. You can criticize Gibbs' personnel moves and his goofy laugh and predictable cliches after a loss but if we are going to talk about picking the best runningback for a team, I would completely, wholeheartedly and blindly accept his decision.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=Grim21Reaper;324652]I guess what annoys me is threads based on moot points.

Someone could spend hours studying film of every carry by Portis and Betts, break down all of their stats and compare every single variable about them but at the end of the day Portis is the starter. Let me repeat. Clinton Portis is the starting runningback for the Washington Redskins. So what is the point? Now if someone wants to claim that Betts is "quicker" or "more powerful", I guess that is worth a discussion but the argument of who is better is a waste of time.

I am going to trust the three time Championship winning Hall of Fame coach when it comes to picking the runningback. You can criticize Gibbs' personnel moves and his goofy laugh and predictable cliches after a loss but if we are going to talk about picking the best runningback for a team, I would completely, wholeheartedly and blindly accept his decision.[/quote]I don't think hes making a wrong decision at all. Then again, Rock Cartwright has been nothing but money for years, and he's lucky to ever see the ball.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=GTripp0012;324649]People who are chronic fumblers tend not to stay that way. If they have desirable carrying skills, they get it corrected. See: Barber, Tiki.

Betts isn't half as bad as Barber was and he turned out alright.[/quote]


To compare Tiki Barber and Ladell Betts is insane. Come on. Is Betts your brother in law?

He had a single good half season where he still fumbled away more than one victory. If you look at the body of work, Betts cannot be trusted. Last year was an exception for him. If you were realistic you would expect him to be hurt often even as a 3rd down back.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=GTripp0012;324654]I don't think hes making a wrong decision at all. Then again, Rock Cartwright has been nothing but money for years, and he's lucky to ever see the ball.[/quote]


Rock is another fumbler. Why do you obsess over guys who cannot hold onto the ball?

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

Well, the question at the beginning of the thread was who would have more yards rushing

Granted, the assumption is the starter would have more but still...

Plus, if you think it's a worthless thread just ignore it

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=SmootSmack;324661]Well, the question at the beginning of the thread was who would have more yards rushing

Granted, the assumption is the starter would have more but still...

Plus, if you think it's a worthless thread just ignore it[/quote]

If you don't like my opinion why don't you ignore me?

Two way street, chief.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=Grim21Reaper;324657]To compare Tiki Barber and Ladell Betts is insane. Come on. Is Betts your brother in law?

He had a single good half season where he still fumbled away more than one victory. If you look at the body of work, Betts cannot be trusted. Last year was an exception for him. If you were realistic you would expect him to be hurt often even as a 3rd down back.[/quote]Don't be stupid when it can be avoided. I'm using Barber to make a point about the nature of "fumble prone" backs. It's quite simple.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=GTripp0012;324669]Don't be stupid when it can be avoided. I'm using Barber to make a point about the nature of "fumble prone" backs. It's quite simple.[/quote]

And putting them in the same sentence is simply wrong.

Smarten' up.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[QUOTE=Grim21Reaper;324662]If you don't like my opinion why don't you ignore me?

Two way street, chief.[/QUOTE]

You missed the point again, but whatever

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[QUOTE=Grim21Reaper;324674]And putting them in the same sentence is simply wrong.

Smarten' up.[/QUOTE]

Damn Reaper, I thought after that whole fiasco with Sean Taylor and training camp, where you made some sweeping claims and in the end were basically made to look like an alarmist fool, you would lighten up your rhetoric and be more humble about calling people out when their predictions or opinions differ from yours. Guess I was wrong.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

There's really no reason for this thread going downhill like it has.

GrimReaper, if you think this topic is below you and not worth discussing, ignore it. You can't just kick up a shitstorm and then tell people to ignore you, sorry but it doesn't work that way around here.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

GTripp has a point. Barber used to be fumble prone until Coughlin taught him a different way to hold on to the ball. Now maybe we should make him hold the ball a different way, but he still isn't on the same level as Betts. And how is everyone doing this morning?

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

Grouchy, the day after a holiday blows at work.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=Mattyk72;324691]Grouchy, the day after a holiday blows at work.[/quote]


Good thing I got the day off today. My GF wasn't as lucky and she was pissed at me when she left.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

I'm taking tomorrow off, so I just have to make it through today.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=Mattyk72;324696]I'm taking tomorrow off, so I just have to make it through today.[/quote]


Damn I got a double-shift tomorrow. 7:30 am to 9:00 pm. God I hate my double shifts.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

I'm working from home today. Not really by choice though, had some bad Applebee's yesterday

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

My double shift starts at 930 damn it.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=djnemo65;324678]Damn Reaper, I thought after that whole fiasco with Sean Taylor and training camp, where you made some sweeping claims and in the end were basically made to look like an alarmist fool, you would lighten up your rhetoric and be more humble about calling people out when their predictions or opinions differ from yours. Guess I was wrong.[/quote]

O.k. so I was a year early on that. Big deal, better to be too early to the party than to never show up.

I will leave this topic with one stat.

In 2006, Betts' breakout season, he had 5 total touchdowns and 6 fumbles. Hmmm.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

If i remembered didnt portis fumble alot his first year here. All RB fumble. Betts did a great job in there. I would feel very comfortable with him as our starter if Protis wanst here.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[quote=CHIEF CHUCKING MY SPEAR;326874]If i remembered didnt portis fumble alot his first year here. All RB fumble. Betts did a great job in there. I would feel very comfortable with him as our starter if Protis wanst here.[/quote]

Portis had 3 fumbles in his first season.

Re: Portis vs. Betts
 

[QUOTE=EARTHQUAKE2689;327076]Portis had 3 fumbles in his first season.[/QUOTE]

He had 5, losing 4 of them.

[url=http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302215]NFL.com - Clinton Portis[/url]