Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;342377]I always thought that Marshall was pretty good in coverage and sub-par in run-blocking (which isn't surprising considering he is a 230 lb. MLB).[/quote]

I didn't see him as a run stopper either, he was always better in coverage.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[QUOTE=saden1;342379][URL="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp07/news/story?id=2984529"]ESPN[/URL] is now reporting the story. Clearly Lamar lost his staying power when he was demoted in favour of London Fletcher. I wouldn't be surprised if he was disgruntled and asked to be released. I mean, I would. I don't think personal pride would allow you to be demotion.[/QUOTE]

I thought the same thing, but JLC's blog "reports" that Marshall was shocked by his release.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[QUOTE=Paintrain;342253]Why would the release Marshall when there is so much other camp fodder they could cut to free up a roster spot? I call BS on this until there is a link from a reputable website.[/QUOTE]

Well actually, maybe this is a good idea we have rookie LB's with talent that need to start.We got H.B blades and starz so lets no worry boys but ill always remember Marshall.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

This is pretty shocking. I will wait to pass judgement until I hear Gibbs talk to the media after practice.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Defensewins;342359]This reminds me of the Ryan Clark situation.[/quote]

I don't see any similarities at all.

Godfrey is not being brought in as a starter, he's depth and nothing more. Plus he's played for GW before.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;342377]I always thought that Marshall was pretty good in coverage and sub-par in run-blocking (which isn't surprising considering he is a 230 lb. MLB).[/quote]

Same here. I thought he was better in pass coverage. Even more so than Pierce, but he lacked in run defense.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

this release, if true is one of the stupidest things we could have done. and i say ONE of the stupidest because i could think of a few more that i wouldnt be suprised to see.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

I think Godfrey is this year's version of James Posey. Plain and simple.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Mattyk72;342386]I didn't see him as a run stopper either, he was always better in coverage.[/quote]

Wasn't Lemar a safety in college?

I thought I heard that once on a broadcast. At 225ish pounds, he was undersized as a LB.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

I'm not saying that Marshall deserved to start or was some stud, but I do remember a lot of big plays.

#1. In Week 16 of the 2005 season, Drew Bledsoe threw a pass over the middle to Witten and Marshall tipped the ball into Marcus Washington's hands, who then ran about 40 yards downfield.

#2. In Week 17 of the 2005 season, Eli Manning threw a pass to Shockey and Marshall picked the pass and ran do the Giants' 20 yard line.

#3. In Week 7(?) of the 2005 season, Marshall picked off a pass by Kerry Collins and scampered into the endzone for a TD.

I'm sure there are more, but he was a playmaker in 2005.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[QUOTE=chrisl4064;342392]this release, if true is one of the stupidest things we could have done. and i say ONE of the stupidest because i could think of a few more that i wouldnt be suprised to see.[/QUOTE]

It is true, it is now on [url=http://www.redskins.com]Washington Redskins[/url]

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Paintrain;342370]The timing of it is curious.. Why cut him now rather than after the next game unless it was just so obvious he was not going to make the team?[/quote]Because we've seen a lot of Lemar Marshall. If we are only going to keep 6-7 LBs, and you have Godfrey now along with Sartz, Blades, Trucks, Washington, Fletcher, and Rocky Mac, and we think Godfrey is an upgrade over Marshall, then why not make it.

Now is Godfrey an upgrade over Marshall? I'd say probably, but it is pretty late here to add him and have him learn the system overnight. Though he has played for Grilliams in the past.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

This is real -- on Redskins.com.

Idiots.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

All I know is that this move is pretty inconsistent with the team's (and coach's) public stance that Lemar Marshall provides invaluable depth along the LB corps, because he's versatile and has played a number of positions.

Now all of a sudden the team has changed its mind and has deemed the depth he provided as expendable.

There had to be a catalyst for this move. Maybe it's grumbling on Marshall's part, injury, a sudden character problem, or salary cap motivation to clear room to extend Cooley. But it had to be something; the team didn't just all of a sudden change its mind on him. I find it hard to believe he was simply outplayed by Blades & Sartz; after all, Marshall was jettisoned for ANOTHER LB.

Hopefully JLC can shine some light for us.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=GTripp0012;342404]Because we've seen a lot of Lemar Marshall. If we are only going to keep 6-7 LBs, and you have Godfrey now along with Sartz, Blades, Trucks, Washington, Fletcher, and Rocky Mac, and we think Godfrey is an upgrade over Marshall, then why not make it.

Now is Godfrey an upgrade over Marshall? I'd say probably, but it is pretty late here to add him and have him learn the system overnight. Though he has played for Grilliams in the past.[/quote]


What have we seen of Godfrey to think he's an upgrade? I would think if he's an upgrade, then that places him in "starters" category. And if he's good enough to start, why has he been bouncing around the league for the past five years? Unless it's an obvious upgrade, then it's not an upgrade in my opinion. Godfrey won't even if be Skin next year...hell, he might not even make through camp.

Obviously the coaches are privy to something that we aren't as fans.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;342377]I always thought that Marshall was pretty good in coverage and sub-par in run-blocking (which isn't surprising considering he is a 230 lb. MLB).[/quote]Marshall has been downright terrible against the pass the last two seasons. Ranked 95th among LBs in pass yards against last season (9.2), 104th in 2005 (8.1).

Against the run last season, Marshall was pretty bad. He was better in 2005, but still pretty overrated. Lavar was a beast (when he played) here in 2005, and I'm guessing that some of that perception rubbed off on Lemar (Including me, I thought he was much better than he was).

His best season as a pro was that pro bowl caliber 2004 he had on the weakside.

I know he was a converted safety, but he can't cover anyone. Perhaps why he was converted?

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

Ironic that he sucked in pass coverage but lead our team in picks in 2005. Now that is irony.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;342419]Ironic that he sucked in pass coverage but lead our team in picks in 2005. Now that is irony.[/quote]

He's always gotten most of my INTs on Madden too. :D

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=12thMan;342414]What have we seen of Godfrey to think he's an upgrade? I would think if he's an upgrade, then that puts him "starters" category. And if he's good enough to start, why has he been bouncing around the league for the past five years? Unless it's an obvious upgrade, then it's not an upgrade in my opinion. Godfrey won't even if be Skin next year...hell, he might not even make through camp.

Obviously the coaches are privy to something that we aren't as fans.[/quote]I don't think he's starters material. I don't know a lot about Godfrey, but I can only see him here one season. At age 34, he provides immediate depth at all the positions Lemar did.

Either way, Godfrey probably won't be around next season, and Marshall wouldn't have been around. I think the thing that the coaching staff is "privy" to, is that Lemar Marshall has been a weak link in the defense for the last two years. Obviously, the collective of the Warpath doesn't think so, and throw me in with the "Lemar is good depth" crowd, but the stats definately support the coaching staff's position, which again, shouldn't be surprising.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

Remember kids, the NFL is in the entertainment business. Always business, never personal. Next time a player holds out don't think ill of him, he is after all taking care of his business.

I wish Marshall all the best and I'm sure he'll find a taker.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=12thMan;342414]Obviously the coaches are privy to something that we aren't as fans.[/quote]

And that's basically all we have to keep in mind here. I know the armchair GMs are pulling their hair out right now, but I doubt we'll looking back a year from now saying damn, if Marshall were here it would have been a different season.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;342419]Ironic that he sucked in pass coverage but lead our team in picks in 2005. Now that is irony.[/quote]Irony, no. Coincidence, yes.

Anyway, 4 INTs is always a good season, but wouldn't Rogers have had like 6 if he just caught the ball?

INTs aren't a good measure of pass coverage, as vital to success as they are.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

Yeah, I totally disagree that Marshall sucked in pass coverage last year. He was definitely solid; I don't care what the stats say on that.

The only conclusion I can come to is it was one of a few salary cap moves or it was his shoulder. Could Joe Salavea be next guys?

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=GTripp0012;342418]Marshall has been downright terrible against the pass the last two seasons. Ranked 95th among LBs in pass yards against last season (9.2), 104th in 2005 (8.1).

Against the run last season, Marshall was pretty bad. He was better in 2005, but still pretty overrated. Lavar was a beast (when he played) here in 2005, and I'm guessing that some of that perception rubbed off on Lemar (Including me, I thought he was much better than he was).

His best season as a pro was that pro bowl caliber 2004 he had on the weakside.

I know he was a converted safety, but he can't cover anyone. Perhaps why he was converted?[/quote]

Thank you. He was an alright player. He did an admirable job and I wish him luck on finding another NFL job, but this is not any kind of shocking news.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Buster;342420]He's always gotten most of my INTs on Madden too. :D[/quote]


For me it has been Sean Taylor (because I use him) But Marcus Washington gets the most by someone I am not using.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Mattyk72;342424]And that's basically all we have to keep in mind here. I know the armchair GMs are pulling their hair out right now, but I doubt we'll looking back a year from now saying damn, if Marshall were here it would have been a different season.[/quote]LOL!

C'mon Matty, you know if we only win seven games this year, 70% of the Warpath will be all like "It's all Gibbs' fault, he shouldn't have gotten rid of Marshall!"

Seriously though, Lemar was one of my most favored Redskins, but outside of shock value, this is a pretty meaningless transaction from a team standpoint. The Redskins aren't any worse, nor much better at all for this move.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=wilsowilso;342427]Thank you. He was an alright player. He did an admirable job and I wish him luck on finding another NFL job, but this is not any kind of shocking news.[/quote]

It's shocking only because as fans we tend to overvalue our own players.

In reality Marshall is probably not considered to be starting material for most teams. He's a backup.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=GTripp0012;342425]Irony, no. Coincidence, yes.

Anyway, 4 INTs is always a good season, [B]but wouldn't Rogers have had like 6 if he just caught the ball?[/B]

INTs aren't a good measure of pass coverage, as vital to success as they are.[/quote]


I thought it was like 9 he would have had.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=GTripp0012;342418]Marshall has been downright terrible against the pass the last two seasons. Ranked 95th among LBs in pass yards against last season (9.2), 104th in 2005 (8.1).

Against the run last season, Marshall was pretty bad. He was better in 2005, but still pretty overrated. Lavar was a beast (when he played) here in 2005, and I'm guessing that some of that perception rubbed off on Lemar (Including me, I thought he was much better than he was).

His best season as a pro was that pro bowl caliber 2004 he had on the weakside.

I know he was a converted safety, but he can't cover anyone. Perhaps why he was converted?[/quote]

That stat can be a little misleading in that GW had him singled up on WRs a lot. That's asking a bit much of any LB. I remember him having to cover Jerry Porter of the Raiders one on one down the middle. Not a chance. Later that year, the Eagles got the same matchup in the season finale and the Seahawks got it in the playoffs as well. WR matched up down the middle with Lemar. I remember thinking, GW is being catalogued. He's calling the same defense in the same situations too much. The opposing coaches are loving that film.

The way I see it, Marshall played well outside, but the move to mike never really took. I am surprised by his release, though, because he knows the system and could have filled in anywhere. I think the earlier point was important, though too. It probably just came down to him being outplayed by the younger guys in camp, coupled with an opportunity to pick up Godfrey who has a skill set they think can fill a role in some package they are worried about. (However, if they think Randall Godfrey can cover the deep middle by himself, they will be disappointed again)

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

GTripp,

I appreciate that you back up your claims with stats, but I definately believe that stats can and oftentimes do lie. How exactly do your stats determine how good someone is in coverage? Are the statmakers privy to our playcalls so they can decide who is and who is not responsible for X offensive player or X area of the field? Or, do the statmakers simply divine what the playcalling was based on game tape?

Moreover, those stats likely do not account for what the coaches are asking players to do. For example, you will never see Trotter asked to cover WRs downfield. Conversely, Marshall was frequently asked to cover WRs [I]downfield[/I]. Just because Marshall gets a pass completed on him 20 yards downfield, whereas Trotter does not, does not mean that Trotter is better than Marshall in coverage. So sorry, but I've got to call B.S.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;342432]I thought it was like 9 he would have had.[/quote]Exactly. Lemar caught the balls thrown to him. His interceptions that year came off studs like Kyle Orton, Mike McMahon, Kerry Collins, and Eli Manning.

Hard to say that any warm body in the same position wouldn't have had 4 ints, and from a sentimental standpoint, I'm glad an undrafted player enjoyed that kind of success here.

But I would rather that undrafted player be Pierce :(

j/k

Good luck Lemar Marshall.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;342434]GTripp,

I appreciate that you back up your claims with stats, but I definately believe that stats can and oftentimes do lie. How exactly do your stats determine how good someone is in coverage? Are the statmakers privy to our playcalls so they can decide who is and who is not responsible for X offensive player or X area of the field? Or, do the statmakers simply divine what the playcalling was based on game tape?[/quote]You have to admit though, yards against per pass attempt is a better metric than "he was a safety in college". As 70 chip pointed out, it can be skewed in a small sample by matchups.

The reason I can say confidently that Lemar was bad in coverage is because he started two full seasons, and the pass coverage data is nearly identical. He's not good at it. If it was conflicting, I'd prefer a wait and see approach with him. But that was 2006. We did wait and see, and we were not only horrible covering backs and tight ends, but Holdman and Marshall were [B]clearly[/B] the problems. Washington gets no blame in this, he was quite literally double as effective vs the pass last year as the other two guys.

It will be better with Fletch and Rocky there, [B][I]a lot[/I][/B] better.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

think he'll sign with the eagles or giants anybody?

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[QUOTE=redskinsfanatic;342439]think he'll sign with the eagles or giants anybody?[/QUOTE]

Eagles a not likely since they said they'll start Gaither to switch in the MLB postion.Giants have Peirce already so its pointless.Maybe Raiders could need a LB and Bills to on the ROLB position. theres alot out there

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

Why would we release Lemar Marshall, when we could have released Sartz, Trucks, Jones, Sinclair, or even K.Campbell instead. Lemar is familiar with the system, and he can play every LB position. I really thought Lemar was going to be a valuable backup for us this year, but I guess they see more in Randall Godfrey. It makes you wonder how good Godfrey really is if NO other team picked him up in FA. This is truly shocking news, I really hate to see Lemar go.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=RMSkins;342443]Why would we release Lemar Marshall, when we could have released Sartz, Trucks, Jones, Sinclair, or even K.Campbell instead. Lemar is familiar with the system, and he can play every LB position. I really thought Lemar was going to be a valuable backup for us this year, but I guess they see more in Randall Godfrey. It makes you wonder how good Godfrey really is if NO other team picked him up in FA. This is truly shocking news, I really hate to see Lemar go.[/quote]I would have dumped Trucks personally, but I guess maybe they see something in Trucks that make them want to keep him around.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=GTripp0012;342418]Marshall has been downright terrible against the pass the last two seasons. Ranked 95th among LBs in pass yards against last season (9.2), 104th in 2005 (8.1).

Against the run last season, Marshall was pretty bad. He was better in 2005, but still pretty overrated. Lavar was a beast (when he played) here in 2005, and I'm guessing that some of that perception rubbed off on Lemar (Including me, I thought he was much better than he was).

His best season as a pro was that pro bowl caliber 2004 he had on the weakside.

I know he was a converted safety, but he can't cover anyone. Perhaps why he was converted?[/quote]
Can I ask you where you got those stats from? I think it would be interesting to look at.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

I do realize that when we realized our LBs were a big problem last year, everyone jumped on Holdman, but Lemar was every worse last season, albeit with a lot more responsibility.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=redskinsfanatic;342439]think he'll sign with the eagles or giants anybody?[/quote]


I bet the Giants bring him for a look. Yep, to fill the same spot left by LaVar.

Re: Lamar Marshall released for Randall Godfrey??
 

[quote=GTripp0012;342444]I would have dumped Trucks personally, but I guess maybe they see something in Trucks that make them want to keep him around.[/quote]


This was pretty painful to read.