Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[IMG]http://www.redskins.com/uploads/photos/perm/main/CFLGMLBAGBED/RJ4Y8368pg.jpg[/IMG]

It went right through his hands... If he made this catch we'd all be singing his praises.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=DGreene28;351142][IMG]http://www.redskins.com/uploads/photos/perm/main/CFLGMLBAGBED/RJ4Y8368pg.jpg[/IMG]

It went right through his hands... If he made this catch we'd all be singing his praises.[/QUOTE]

I watched it earlier this afternoon again.. He slowed/stopped his route and then accelerated when the ball was thrown. If he ran the route to completion he would have been in position and had leverage to make a proper play on the ball.. Still no excuse for jogging after the DB once the ball was picked off... I've been a defender, but now get the F out of DC Lloyd.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

ALL I KNOW is that he missed an easy block on the CB that would have released CP into the backfield....and possibly to the endzone. Half-hearted attempt

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=DGreene28;351053]I just watched the play in question on tape about 10 times frame by frame... Brandon gave 100% effort to get the ball. He also had both of his hands on the ball and almost made a really nice catch. Unfortunately the ball went through his hands and basically rested on the DB's facemask and allowed him to make the INT. After the INT Lloyd did not go all out however, could have been becausee the phins safety would have blocked him[/quote]

Excuses, excuses.

The bottom line is he didn't make the catch. He had the position, he [U]should[/U] have made that catch.

So he didn't go after the defender because he was scared of being blocked? Wonderful!

It really amazes me the excuses for this bum. It's always someone else's fault for his shitty play. When will the excuses run out for the Lloyd apologists?? When we're halfway through the season and he's got 10 catches? At the end of the season when he's got 20? When??

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;350810]We're getting way too caught up in this argument over Lloyd's effort on the end zone interception. To me, that's just a small piece of the puzzle.

The bottom line, the guy had one catch for five yards on Sunday. This after last year doing jack squat last year. Randle El struggled last year, and was brought into this offense at the same time as Lloyd, but he seemed to have caught on just fine on Sunday, putting up 5 catches for 108 yards (if you remove the flukey hail mary). What's Lloyd's excuse?

And Daseal, don't give me this crap about him not getting looks. The reason Randle El got the looks is because he ran very precise routes, and JC had confidence he'd be where he was supposed to be. 90% of a WRs job is getting open, making the catch is only 10% of the work. Lloyd just doesn't get open because he doesn't work hard enough to master the playbook, he could care less about learning the intracacies of route-running because all he wants to do is burn dudes deep.

I mean at what point can we just call a spade a spade. If it quacks, it's a duck. Not a hen, not a rooster, not a swan... it's a friggin duck people. Same damn thing happened with Ramsey, and it's happening with Lloyd. People see flashes every now and then, so they think if we just give him more looks, or if we just give him a chance, he'll be OK. No. He sucks. It's not that hard to make the judgment. He's a piece of shit because of his poor work ethic, and it's not going to get markedly better. Book it.[/QUOTE]

Bingo.

If what SS is right then the reason he doesn't get looks is because he isn;t where he is supposed to be. No QB in this league will take the time to look around the field for a guy running a wrong route. They just progress to the next target. At the end of the day Schneed hit it on the head. You are what you are and BL is a guy who hasn't nearly lived up to his contract. No other way to look at it to me.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

And the int is sort of irrelevant. The CB made a good play and BL just mistimed it. BUT...the point of that pass is to put the ball into one on one coverage and let BL make a play. His JOB in this case is to MAKE A PLAY. He didn't. JC didn't overthrow him, whoever said that needs to check reality. On a 50+ yard pass to miss by 1 foot isn't over throwing. It is life. BL was expected to make a play there and didn't. Not his fault the the ball was intercepted more than he simply failed, again, to do what he was supposed to do. It is a common theme.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=FRPLG;351183]And the int is sort of irrelevant. The CB made a good play and BL just mistimed it. BUT...the point of that pass is to put the ball into one on one coverage and let BL make a play. His JOB in this case is to MAKE A PLAY. He didn't. JC didn't overthrow him, whoever said that needs to check reality. On a 50+ yard pass to miss by 1 foot isn't over throwing. It is life. BL was expected to make a play there and didn't. Not his fault the the ball was intercepted more than he simply failed, again, to do what he was supposed to do. It is a common theme.[/QUOTE]

Maybe not the thread for it but your post reminded me... JC throws one of the nicest deep balls I've seen in a long time. He's got work to do obviously but his accuracy from beyond 20 yards is really special.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=DGreene28;351053]I just watched the play in question on tape about 10 times frame by frame... Brandon gave 100% effort to get the ball. He also had both of his hands on the ball and almost made a really nice catch. Unfortunately the ball went through his hands and basically rested on the DB's facemask and allowed him to make the INT. After the INT Lloyd did not go all out however, could have been becausee the phins safety would have blocked him[/quote]

it wasnt the effort when the ball was in the air that is in question. i was at the game on sunday to and i dont care what replay you saw, he didnt give 100%. He quit running his route only to speed back up once he realized campbell was throwing the ball in his direction. JC threw it high so that lloyd would have a chance but since he stopped his route he was too busy trying to catch up to where JC threw it. Since he was trying to make up for his mistake he didnt have enough time to get position or a good read on the flight of the ball. so he couldnt time his jump because he was too busy rushing to get to the spot. bottom line is, i am a very patient man because of these redskins but he needs to look in the mirror and actually become the player that his athletic talents tell us he is.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon. Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=12thMan;350623]A couple of guys I know that were at the game said that one of Campbell's interceptions was B. Lloyds fault. He never went up for the ball or something. I'm not saying it was, just what heard.[/QUOTE]
I won't say he didn't jump, but there is no way he was the more aggressive one to catch the ball. What incensed me was his reaction after the int. He slowed up in his pursuit of the CB. Reminded me of Randy Moss when things don't go his way.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;351171]Excuses, excuses.

The bottom line is he didn't make the catch. He had the position, he [U]should[/U] have made that catch.

So he didn't go after the defender because he was scared of being blocked? Wonderful!

It really amazes me the excuses for this bum. It's always someone else's fault for his shitty play. When will the excuses run out for the Lloyd apologists?? When we're halfway through the season and he's got 10 catches? At the end of the season when he's got 20? When??[/QUOTE]

Well I was an advocate bringing him to D.C., now I will join you and concur that Brandon Lloyd has run out of excuses. He's suppose to be a possession WR and he hasn't possessed a damn thing.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

If B. Lloyd doesn't get his receiving game together, I'm not buying any of his hip hop music.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=holcknowsbest;351194]it wasnt the effort when the ball was in the air that is in question. i was at the game on sunday to and i dont care what replay you saw, he didnt give 100%. He quit running his route only to speed back up once he realized campbell was throwing the ball in his direction. JC threw it high so that lloyd would have a chance but since he stopped his route he was too busy trying to catch up to where JC threw it. Since he was trying to make up for his mistake he didnt have enough time to get position or a good read on the flight of the ball. so he couldnt time his jump because he was too busy rushing to get to the spot. bottom line is, i am a very patient man because of these redskins but he needs to look in the mirror and actually become the player that his athletic talents tell us he is.[/quote/]

You're crazy thinking you can see better from the stands then on TV. Why do you think the refs have instant replay. You think you know... but you have no idea.

You go to watch the game in person to get the flava and the comradery. You watch in HD to see the best angles on every play.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote/]You're crazy thinking you can see better from the stands then on TV. Why do you think the refs have instant replay. You think you know... but you have no idea.

You go to watch the game in person to get the flava and the comradery. You watch in HD to see the best angles on every play.[/quote]

well why dont we go watch it in super slow mo 10 times....i will bet my life i saw what i saw and that you are wrong. 85 quit his route and then had to speed back up and could not get there in time to time his jump. think what you want boss but i know i am right, and to a man 85 would tell you himself. go watch it in super slow mo on HD again. the only thing is you arent watching the entire route, you are watching the last 10 yards at most in HD super slow mo. go tackle your wife buddy.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=DirteePosse;351227]If B. Lloyd doesn't get his receiving game together, I'm not buying any of his hip hop music.[/quote]


Yeah that will teach him.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Clearly there are advantages to both, watching the game live or watching on tv. It's not worth name calling over.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

sorry for the harshness but you need to realize that there is a reason teams game tapes come from the endzone at the top of the stadium. it allows them to see the whole field, they dont call up CBS and ask for HD replay of the game for a reason. i had just turned to my boy next to me and told him watch lloyd up top on this play because the safety was shifting towards moss on the presnap every play. i hope you realize what I saw now wise guy.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;351320]Clearly there are advantages to both, watching the game live or watching on tv. It's not worth name calling over.[/quote]

haha its what i do man, i cant help it, where are all the damn eagle fans so i can get after them.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=holcknowsbest;351321]sorry for the harshness but you need to realize that there is a reason teams game tapes come from the endzone at the top of the stadium. it allows them to see the whole field, they dont call up CBS and ask for HD replay of the game for a reason. i had just turned to my boy next to me and told him watch lloyd up top on this play because the safety was shifting towards moss on the presnap every play. i hope you realize what I saw now wise guy.[/QUOTE]

No need for "wise guy" at the end there.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon. Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=Frost;350626]yea i dont know what to think about brandon anymore. in someway im still waiting for him to have that one great game to break the ice, for some reason i think this guy could be pretty damn good and also from the game on Sunday i dont recall JC throwing to him more than once or twice, just like he did with cooley, so i dont know. i think in about 2 or 3 more games we should have our answer on mr Lloyd.[/QUOTE]

Dude needs to get open if he wants JC to throw him the ball. Apparently his route running is bad otherwise why wouldn't the quarterback throw to him? Just one more cat who came to the Skins for The Danny's money. If he doesn't get his act together, they can get rid of his ass next year.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;351320]Clearly there are advantages to both, watching the game live or watching on tv. It's not worth name calling over.[/quote]

I watched it yesterday again on TiVO and it looked to me that Lloyd at least made a decent play on the ball, but you actually cannot see him running the route on the CBS replay, they showed two angles but neither showed Lloyd running the entire route, only the end of the play. Their angle did show Lloyd fail to even try to persue the DB who picked the ball and basically give up because there looked to be another DB coming to block him. I think you'd have to see the coaches tape to know for sure, HD or not CBS just did not have the angle. Based on previous knowledge I'd say there is a pretty good chance that he did give up on the route just as was said above. You've also got to believe that there is a reason that the guy only ever seems to run 9 routes and almost never gets the ball thrown to him. He's just not the player they thought he was, and you can question why they ever thought he was a player because I've never heard a good thing said about him even when he was in San Francisco, but he's not long for D.C. regardless.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;351324]No need for "wise guy" at the end there.[/quote]


I don't believe I've heard the words "wise guy" and "boss" in years. :)

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=DGreene28;351142][IMG]http://www.redskins.com/uploads/photos/perm/main/CFLGMLBAGBED/RJ4Y8368pg.jpg[/IMG]

It went right through his hands... If he made this catch we'd all be singing his praises.[/quote]
Maybe its his face mask but it looks like his eye's are closed to me!!

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

That picture makes it even worse for BL's case if you ask me, the ball is going right through his hands. Pathetic.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;351424]That picture makes it even worse for BL's case if you ask me, the ball is going right through his hands. Pathetic.[/quote]


Think he miss timed his jump. Looked like he was coming down when ball was there. He should have been at his highest point not coming down. Was a really tough play but those results will teach Campbell to look at other options. Moss comes up with that ball.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=JDALY27;351437]Think he miss timed his jump. Looked like he was coming down when ball was there. He should have been at his highest point not coming down. Was a really tough play but those results will teach Campbell to look at other options. Moss comes up with that ball.[/QUOTE]
Moss had his own problems that day....

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

The difference is Moss has been about 70% of our aerial attack. BL has yet to earn his keep. He unfortunately has not worked out for us thus far

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=JDALY27;351437]Think he miss timed his jump. Looked like he was coming down when ball was there. He should have been at his highest point not coming down. Was a really tough play but those results will teach Campbell to look at other options. Moss comes up with that ball.[/quote]

Yeah I thought he didn't time his jump well either. That was a perfect ball for him to go up and get. I don't fault JC at all, one on one coverage and a nice throw. The WR needs to make that play.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

But how about ARE is he still a bust?

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Redskin;351460]But how about ARE is he still a bust?[/quote]
I think that with ARE last year we did not us him like we should have and maybe we saw in last weeks game what ARE can really do giving the time to play.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=holcknowsbest;351318][quote/]You're crazy thinking you can see better from the stands then on TV. Why do you think the refs have instant replay. You think you know... but you have no idea.

You go to watch the game in person to get the flava and the comradery. You watch in HD to see the best angles on every play.[/quote]

well why dont we go watch it in super slow mo 10 times....i will bet my life i saw what i saw and that you are wrong. 85 quit his route and then had to speed back up and could not get there in time to time his jump. think what you want boss but i know i am right, and to a man 85 would tell you himself. go watch it in super slow mo on HD again. the only thing is you arent watching the entire route, you are watching the last 10 yards at most in HD super slow mo. go tackle your wife buddy.[/quote]

Don't make me come down there and teach you some manners!
I did see the entire route. I have what we call in the business a "Melt"
which is every single angle from the stadium. They will show maybe 2 or 3 on any given replay on network tv... A melt will have between 15 and 20 different angles including ISO's. Apparently you need to value your life more or drink and type less. I'm not going to argue with you anymore because you are clearly a fool. Ohh, and mention my wife again in that way and we will have a serious problem.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=DGreene28;351540][QUOTE]well why dont we go watch it in super slow mo 10 times....i will bet my life i saw what i saw and that you are wrong. 85 quit his route and then had to speed back up and could not get there in time to time his jump. think what you want boss but i know i am right, and to a man 85 would tell you himself. go watch it in super slow mo on HD again. the only thing is you arent watching the entire route, you are watching the last 10 yards at most in HD super slow mo. go tackle your wife buddy.[/quote]

Don't make me come down there and teach you some manners!
I did see the entire route. I have what we call in the business a "Melt"
which is every single angle from the stadium. They will show maybe 2 or 3 on any given replay on network tv... A melt will have between 15 and 20 different angles including ISO's. Apparently you need to value your life more or drink and type less. I'm not going to argue with you anymore because you are clearly a fool. Ohh, and mention my wife again in that way and we will have a serious problem.[/QUOTE]

good point about the melts. I forgot about that. I should swing by and see it sometime.

Anyhow, let's just drop it and move on. And don't worry, he won't make any comments about your wife again

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;351424]That picture makes it even worse for BL's case if you ask me, the ball is going right through his hands. Pathetic.[/quote]

So? Moss dropped a ton, that hit his hands. Same with Smoot on the interception. That doesn't mean he didn't try. The argument here is that he just gave up on the catch and let it get picked off. He clearly didn't.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Props to Arkowi at ES for this. Doesn't show all that much leading up to the INT but it does show some lethargy on the part of Lloyd after the fact

[url]http://www.arkowi.com/misc/skins/lloyint.mp4[/url]

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Hooskins made a great point, I don't see anyone jumping on Santana for all those drops, I sure am he KILLED my fantasy team.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Cowell;351551]Hooskins made a great point, I don't see anyone jumping on Santana for all those drops, I sure am he KILLED my fantasy team.[/quote]

He didn't kill my fantasy team, but his 3.5 fantasy points didn't help. I had him as my 2nd WR last week.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=hooskins;351547]So? Moss dropped a ton, that hit his hands. Same with Smoot on the interception. That doesn't mean he didn't try. The argument here is that he just gave up on the catch and let it get picked off. He clearly didn't.[/quote]

There's a big difference between Moss and Lloyd. Moss has proven himself here, Lloyd hasn't.

We're not going to jump on Moss for one lousy game. If it becomes a trend however he'll definitely catch heat.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;351554]There's a big difference between Moss and Lloyd. Moss has proven himself here, Lloyd hasn't.

We're not going to jump on Moss for one lousy game. If it becomes a trend however he'll definitely catch heat.[/quote]

Moss normally has SICK hands. He had an awful day, and he'd probably be the first to admit it. In my mind it's an aberration until it becomes a trend. I hope both he and Cooley contribute a lot more in the passing game this week.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=DGreene28;351540]
Don't make me come down there and teach you some manners!
I did see the entire route. I have what we call in the business a "Melt"
which is every single angle from the stadium. They will show maybe 2 or 3 on any given replay on network tv... A melt will have between 15 and 20 different angles including ISO's. Apparently you need to value your life more or drink and type less. I'm not going to argue with you anymore because you are clearly a fool. Ohh, and mention my wife again in that way and we will have a serious problem.[/quote]

well i am done arguing myself because today on redskin radio which i dont think you get in Conn. they were talking about how he quit on the route......enough said, sorry that the "melt" didnt pick that up. nothing like the ol naked eye. plus threating me doesnt help, only makes me reach deeper but in posts in other threads you said "i almost tackled my wife" in reference of your excitement. i am clearly a fool, i agree, i am extremely disliked on this board for a reason. my opinions are strong and most of the time right, and when i am not i own up. this arguing is over, sorry for you mistaking my comments on your wife....and well leave it at that



there you go smootsmack, no name calling and an apology, its a first for me........but just admit i am right

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;351550]Props to Arkowi at ES for this. Doesn't show all that much leading up to the INT but it does show some lethargy on the part of Lloyd after the fact

[url]http://www.arkowi.com/misc/skins/lloyint.mp4[/url][/QUOTE]

I used to think it was 50/50 Lloyd missed and campbell overthrew...now I am positive it was Campbell after seeing that replay. If you notice, the Dolphins defender was in front of Lloyd the whole time...so why "lead" Lloyd when he should have underthrown? Yes, Lloyd could have made the catch and missed it, but like some have already pointed out, it's not like Moss would have caught it. So it's more like 80% Campbell's fault. It's his job to get the ball in the bread basket of the WR. When you're playing catch with your buddy do you throw it 4 feet above his head or do you try to hit his "numbers"? Again, Lloyd missed it, but it would have been a tough catch for anyone.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=holcknowsbest;351559]well i am done arguing myself because today on redskin radio which i dont think you get in Conn. they were talking about how he quit on the route......enough said, sorry that the "melt" didnt pick that up. nothing like the ol naked eye. plus threating me doesnt help, only makes me reach deeper but in posts in other threads you said "i almost tackled my wife" in reference of your excitement. i am clearly a fool, i agree, i am extremely disliked on this board for a reason. my opinions are strong and most of the time right, and when i am not i own up. this arguing is over, sorry for you mistaking my comments on your wife....and well leave it at that



there you go smootsmack, no name calling and an apology, its a first for me........but just admit i am right[/quote]

I apologize too... I think we just had a misunderstanding in the 1st place. You are not a fool as you clearly love the Redskins which makes you a smart man in my book.

I would definitely rather be at every game too, I was just utilizing my resources to disect to share my opinions about the play to add to the discussion. I look forward to agreeing and disagreeing with you on the future in a civilized manner.