Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[QUOTE]This thread isn't about Portis...While portis has not been what we are accustomed, he has not performed poorly this year like Moss has.[/QUOTE]

you must be watching the skins in another universe if you think that.moss has had 1 bad game,portis has fumbled at least 3 times in the last 3 games.i hope they put his ass on the bench,and let betts play a lot more.but,on to the cardinals.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=The Zimmermans;364296]THIS many guys should not get hurt....we have to be doing something wrong for this many grown men to get hurt every week[/quote]

Forgot about last year already?

This is nothing compared to last season.


Sticking to the topic though, Moss is a mystery to me. He's never had bad hands like this. He DID cost us the game. Even if he is healthy, maybe he should start next week's game on the bench. We may need him, but he doesn't deserve to start right now. He needs something settled either physically or in his head.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

I wonder if the poor performances yesterday at a couple of key spots were due to players playing with injuries? There's no excuse for that mess yesterday but I would feel better if I knew that there was at least some sort of reason behind the bad play.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=redskinsfanatic;364548]you must be watching the skins in another universe if you think that.moss has had 1 bad game,portis has fumbled at least 3 times in the last 3 games.i hope they put his ass on the bench,and let betts play a lot more.but,on to the cardinals.[/quote]

Stop making things up.

Portis' fumbles:

MIA = 0 fumbles
PHI = 0 fumbles
NYG = 0 fumbles
-bye-
DET = 2 fumbles, 1 lost
GB = 1 fumble, 1 lost



Yes, and Betts was SO great for us at the end of the game vs. the Giants.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[QUOTE][B]Redskins WR Moss pulls himself from game, blames himself for loss to Packers[/B]
[I]By COLIN FLY, AP Sports Writer
October 14, 2007[/I]

GREEN BAY, Wis. (AP) -- First Santana Moss benched himself, then blamed himself for the Redskins' 17-14 loss to the Green Bay Packers on Sunday. His Washington teammates declined to pile on, saying Moss was being too critical of his play.

"I just didn't feel right. I took myself out," said Moss, who left the game shortly after a costly fumble. "Something wasn't feeling right with me and why go out there and keep another guy from helping us win? ... I wasn't making the plays that I should have been making."

Moss finished without a catch and allowed the go-ahead touchdown when he fumbled on a reverse that Charles Woodson picked up and returned 57 yards with 2:05 left in the third quarter.

"I can go home and sit there and probably break my TV based on what I'm going to see tonight," Moss said. "I know that's not the solution."

Despite a cramp in his leg, Moss kept the focus solely on his miserable performance, which included several uncharacteristic dropped passes.

"I'm going to blame me first," Moss said. "I look at myself way harder than any of you guys do or really harder than any teammate or coach is going to."

While Moss' honesty was refreshing, the truth was all the Redskins squandered multiple opportunities after looking in control with a 14-7 halftime lead.

"We all know that when you play as hard as he does there may be days like this that come up for you," Redskins coach Joe Gibbs said. "It's not any one guy, and I never look at it as any one guy. We had a lot of things happen to us today in a lot of different areas. It's Redskins together. It certainly wasn't any one player."

Washington went 0-for-7 on third down and 0-for-2 on fourth down in the second half and dropped at least eight passes during the game. It became apparent early in the third quarter that the momentum had shifted.

Jason Campbell found James Thrash for a 40-yard play that was nullified by offsetting penalties, including pass interference on Thrash. Moss couldn't catch the next pass in double coverage and Washington was forced to punt.

Moss also dropped another deep toss down the right side with 48 seconds left in the third quarter, and decided to let Keenan McCardell take his place. McCardell finished with two receptions for 30 yards, but Washington receivers only caught four of Campbell's 37 throws.

"He is a great person, and I don't want the city or anyone else to say anything bad about him or get down on him," Campbell said of Moss.

Moss, who signed a six-year, $31 million contract in 2005 after being traded from the Jets, hopes to forget about his bad day and bounce back quickly.

"I never had a game like this and I hope I never have another one," he said. "You've got to dig within and see what you have."[/QUOTE]

[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Aju1Gu5RPfL1f3l4z0JTotv.uLYF?slug=ap-redskins-moss&prov=ap&type=lgns]Redskins WR Moss pulls himself from game, blames himself for loss to Packers - NFL - Yahoo! Sports[/url]

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

I said this a while back and got ripped for saying it. Moss is not a number one wr IMO. He's a nice #2 and that's it. We are not getting the production out of the WR's that we should be getting. I would be careful of going out and paying big money to another FA WR. But Bryan Johnson would be interresting for the right price.

A while back someone started a thread about Santan Moss and Randy Moss. People were actually saying they would actually rather have Santana than Randy.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

And one of the fumbles in the Detroit game might not have been Portis' fault (i.e. the Direct snap fumble). Its hard to complain about the Portis fumble in this game b/c i think it was an anomaly. It resulted in no points lost and took very little time off of the clock.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=Buster;364556][URL="http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Aju1Gu5RPfL1f3l4z0JTotv.uLYF?slug=ap-redskins-moss&prov=ap&type=lgns"]Redskins WR Moss pulls himself from game, blames himself for loss to Packers - NFL - Yahoo! Sports[/URL][/quote]

WTF????? You take yourself out??????? How about getting your ass back in the game and help your team out. Your suppose to be our number one wr.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;364560]WTF????? You take yourself out??????? How about getting your ass back in the game and help your team out. Your suppose to be our number one wr.[/quote]

If he did it for injury, he did the right thing. I HOPE injuries are to blame for his pathetic performance. If he did it for any other reason, that's bad news for the future. If he's not confident in himself, he'll be another Rod Gardner.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=SouperMeister;364367]I'm a little concerned that unless Campbell learns to put more touch on deep balls, he will continue to miss wide open opportunities. Elite QBs do not miss the throw that Lloyd couldn't quite pull in. Campbell also missed Cooley on a fairly deep throw in the first half. Until he starts making those type of plays with more consistency, I don't believe you can characterize Campbell as a great deep passer. Hopefully the coaches are addressing his touch on deeper throws in practice. Of course the deep throw to Moss was pretty damn solid, and that could have turned the game in the Skins favor.[/quote]

Actually, Tom Brady missed Randy Moss by a mile on a deep pass yesterday, and Peyton Manning misses from time to time, so I'm not sure what you mean by "Elite QBs do not miss".

And Campbell absolutely should not have to put touch on a ball that hits his target in the face. That ball to Moss was a perfect throw. The toss to Lloyd was a little long, but "Touch" wouldn't have been the answer. Brett Favre put quite a bit of touch on his deep throws and got picked twice. He should've been picked three more times.

Overall I think Campbell played a good game, outside of the one yard pass on 4th and 2.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=redskinsfanatic;364548]you must be watching the skins in another universe if you think that.moss has had 1 bad game,portis has fumbled at least 3 times in the last 3 games.i hope they put his ass on the bench,and let betts play a lot more.but,on to the cardinals.[/quote]

betts sucks....dunno what happened to him....has no vision, can't block...and again couldnt make any big plays at the end of the game. Betts fumbles more than portis as well.....

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

Moss, wait for your blocks and you have a huge play. Don't get popped like a punk and fumble like a bitch. Offense stinks besides Campbell and Cooley yesterday. Those other guys are going to watch that film and I hope we do to Arizona what we did to Detroit. Then we're on the road at New England....

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

I thought Lloyd should have made that catch. He's known for making difficult grabs look easy and we definitely needed him to do that in that spot yesterday.

The one to Cooley was also just off his fingertips, with Cooley I thought he misjudged that ball a bit and it appeared that he slowed up a bit initially when he was going after it.

Campbell's touch still needs fine tuning but I've always thought if a receiver gets his hands on it then he should make the catch most of the time. Santana letting that one off his hands go for an INT and then letting the other one get too close to him and bouncing off his grill were just pathetic.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=Southpaw;364577]Actually, Tom Brady missed Randy Moss by a mile on a deep pass yesterday, and Peyton Manning misses from time to time, so I'm not sure what you mean by "Elite QBs do not miss".

And Campbell absolutely should not have to put touch on a ball that hits his target in the face. That ball to Moss was a perfect throw. The toss to Lloyd was a little long, but "Touch" wouldn't have been the answer. Brett Favre put quite a bit of touch on his deep throws and got picked twice. He should've been picked three more times.

Overall I think Campbell played a good game, outside of the one yard pass on 4th and 2.[/quote]

Some people act like qb's are suppose to be machines or something. Deep passes are low % to begin with. By my count JC had 6-7 dropped yesterday. He should have been around at least 25-37 yesterday. And the INT was not his fault either. It was a little high but that is a very catchable ball. JC totally outplayed Farve by a mile yesterday.

Also what was that shitty call on Thrash all about? How can you call a penalty on both players?? It should have been a no call if anything. The db stood right in Thrash' way. Horrible call. Sometimes the refs need to let the guys play a little bit. That should have been a 40 play on our part.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

I thought the refs were bad on both sides yesterday. Some really ticky tacky calls.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

yeah, last thing we needed to add to the sloppy play was a whole bunch of BS from the Green Bay Packer refs

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;364591]Some people act like qb's are suppose to be machines or something. Deep passes are low % to begin with. By my count JC had 6-7 dropped yesterday. He should have been around at least 25-37 yesterday. And the INT was not his fault either. It was a little high but that is a very catchable ball. JC totally outplayed Farve by a mile yesterday. [/quote]

Yeah, I don't understand how people bitch when the starting quarterback can't throw a ball beyond 30 yards, then the same people bitch because the new starter throws too hard. I agree that his throws probably have a bit more velocity than the Washington receivers are used to, but that's no excuse when the ball hits your hands. And that argument holds little weight when Campbell fires rockets at Cooley and he seems to have no problem catching them.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

cooley catches the ball because he knows he needs to in order to make a big play....the rest of the guys yesterday seemed to just be worried about dropping the ball.....if they were 100% with the success of the team...and not worrying bad about looking bad they would have made those catches without an extra thought....gotta wonder about santana TAKING HIMSELF OUT instead of coming back in and WINNING THE GAME THAT HE HAD PREVIOUSLY COST US

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

TO is a clown...and he drops a million passes, but he always comes back and makes up for it later in the game regardless of how many people are booing him and how many people hate him

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

I don't have a problem with Moss not being in the game at the end. He didn't deserve to be in there, I was actually hoping it was the coaches that sat him down. His F ups cost us the game.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

yeah i wish that tooo.....i was very dissapointed when i heard he took himself out

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;364588]I thought Lloyd should have made that catch. He's known for making difficult grabs look easy and we definitely needed him to do that in that spot yesterday.

The one to Cooley was also just off his fingertips, with Cooley I thought he misjudged that ball a bit and it appeared that he slowed up a bit initially when he was going after it.

Campbell's touch still needs fine tuning but I've always thought if a receiver gets his hands on it then he should make the catch most of the time. Santana letting that one off his hands go for an INT and then letting the other one get too close to him and bouncing off his grill were just pathetic.[/quote]

Thank you. I think some of you Skins fans here are so jaded by years of terrible QB's and receivers that you forget that jumping/diving catches are pretty commonplace on teams that actually have decent personnel.

I'm definitely tired of people letting Brandon off the hook for dropping that pass. He could have caught that and done nothing else this year and I think most of us would go "you know, I forgive you for sucking so bad, Brandon"...

What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

In his first year as a Skin, Moss had 9 touchdowns, and went to the probowl, he hasnt put upthose numbers in the last 2.5 seasons. I know injury is slowing him down, but he has 0 td's this year. We cant go far if we have no desegnated #1 reciever. I think Cooley is great, but a TE can't do the work all alone.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

Must be a bad groin pull to the point were it slows him down and makes him an average receiver. I think that he's toughing it out instead of resting, I'm sure if he was fully healthy that he would be like his old self.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

It is something that I have always wonder about.. Was it just a fluke or not? I mean, he shows lot of stuff and yet for some reason, he doesn't do it another half of times..

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

It appears at least for now santana has turned into #2 WR. El is the go to guy and himself and JC are clicking nicely. El will hopefully click this week against the jets.

But not counting SM out by any means, he will still get his shots. Would like to see him be more productive when he gets his chances.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

Repeat Thread. This thread already exists.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

THe groins hurts and he has always been nicked up the past 2 seasons it seemed like. We got him for that afterburner speed of his. Without that speed he is an average NFL Wr that happens to be grossly undersized against CBs or S in the league. We need to acquire guys built like Randy, Marques Colston, or even TO. NOt saying trying to get those guys, but guys with their build. Tall, physical specimens that can take punishment jump for high balls, etc. Santana is a smurf out there.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan_nn;372826]Repeat Thread. This thread already exists.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, this was talked about weeks ago.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

who knows, but hed better snap out of it....

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

Another high paid free agent overpaid injury prone bust li ke B lloyd.How can these people make this type of money and complain about groins and hamstrings.For that type of money i'd play with a broke assbone.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[QUOTE=SFREDSKIN;372822]Must be a bad groin pull to the point were it slows him down and makes him an average receiver. I think that he's toughing it out instead of resting, I'm sure if he was fully healthy that he would be like his old self.[/QUOTE]

His hamstring has nothing to do with his hands.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

Here is the answer to your question:

The Chemistry between Moss & Cambell is not quite there. And also, Cambell is known to throw a ball with less velocity and with more power compared to Brunell. Santana probably has problems holding on to the ball that is thrown with so much force and not enough air under it. Whereas Brunell's ball was more aired out with more touch and less then force.

With Brunell at the helm, I dont think I've seen Moss drop more then 2 or 3 balls.
Moss is not overrated. Comparing him to Lloyd is justified in anyway ANd I'm not here to defend him although I do still think he's a dangerous man every time the ball is in his hands. He's just not used to JC's throws and I hope that in time the two will sync together, but I'm starting to think it might not....

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

Same ol' Moss, always hurt, not so productive.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

I don't know but I don't think two identical threads is the answer.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

they dont throw him the ball that the problem. He stunk of the joint in GB and has a few drops but hell our Wr havent done the job because we are afraid of making mistakes.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=CHIEF CHUCKING MY SPEAR;373695]they dont throw him the ball that the problem. He stunk of the joint in GB and has a few drops but hell our Wr havent done the job because we are afraid of making mistakes.[/quote]

I agree. Campbell has a habit of throwing to the check down receiver. A lot. Granted, the CD is the last option but there are times when he does that when there are WRs open or throwing to the intended WR, when the option WR is open.

As for Moss, he did a good job today because we actually threw to him more than once. Of course Moss isn't going to produce when we don't throw to him more than a couple times a game.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

I'm just going to at this point say that its on everyone as to why the WR arent getting into the game. Playcalling, Jason, and The Receivers themselves all deserve some of the blame as for the lack of production. I do think Jason tends to check down more than he should, which inst nessicarily terrible at this stage in his career; but you can see the effects its having. I really thought he hit Moss on that bomb in OT, too.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

i blame the play calling on Gibbs. When AL was with Stl or Kc they had a vertical offense and alot free wheeling to it. Not this i hope we dont make mistakes that we are running now.

Re: What is wrong with Santana Moss?
 

[quote=CHIEF CHUCKING MY SPEAR;373710]i blame the play calling on Gibbs. When AL was with Stl or Kc they had a vertical offense and alot free wheeling to it. Not this i hope we dont make mistakes that we are running now.[/quote]

It would seem like a conflict of interest hm?

Gibbs wanting a power running game.
Saunders wanting more focus on throwing.

Do you think Gibbs and Saunders butt heads from time to time about what they think is right for the team? Or does Gibbs word = law?