Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Southpaw;391909]I guess you haven't watched many Pats games before this season then. I haven't seen him do it as much this season, but a lot more people would call him out on it, considering he's got a stable full of great receivers. My main beef with Brady even before this season was that he admonished his receivers far too often.

And A. Smith ran his mouth to the media. I've never seen a flag thrown for talking smack on ESPN.

And where's the defense of Brady's constant bitching at the refs? That's just competitive fire I guess...[/quote]

I'm in a 4 player keeper league for fantasy football and I've kept Brady the last 4 years. I've seen a ton of Pats games over than time span. I can't recall seeing him yell at one wr. I've seen him talk to them but show one up? Not once.

Last year he was in a position where they let go of his two starting wr's. So he was in a situation where he was throwing to guys like Doug Gabriel, Caldwell and Chad Jackson. Those guys probably didn't know the playbook that well and I never ever saw him yell at those guys. If anything he complimented them. I remember him specifically saying good things about Caldwell after he was cut. I remember Brady not practicing for a day or two after Deion Branch was holding out. He did it in support of his teammate and it caused a stir in the media. So again, I'm not real sure where you are coming from.

A. Smith is a dumbass. Yes, you can run your mouth to the media. But you don't fire up an undefeated team that passes the ball every play and you are responsible for coverage against a great passing attack. He's only on the field becuase Troy P. is hurt. WTF was he thinking? He got what he deserved.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Southpaw;391924]I don't think anyone is denying that Tom Brady is a great quarterback. The problem is, he knows he's a great quarterback and makes sure that everyone knows it.

Right after the game, when asked about the A. Smith encounter, he said Smith was a good player, and probably was just trying to get his team hyped for the game. Then I hear an interview that he did yesterday on the radio where he said they purposely targeted Smith, and he's a third stringer that's only playing because of injuries. And why make the comment about the 4th & 1 play in the Ravens game, after you WON the effing game? The only reason to make that comment is to rub salt in the wound. Good quarterback or not, he's still a dick.

And no you don't see him doing commercials every five minutes... he's just on TMZ and the Enquirer all the time.[/quote]

LMAO. Well, I don't watch or buy that crap. Only chicks do.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Their games are like a buisness. I was ready to get sick when Brady throws it backwards to moss, who drops it, picks it back up, throws it to Brady, who finds Gaffney wide open in the endzone. They have no class, and their coach is an overconfident classless s**t.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=70Chip;391917]They respond well to him since Brady became the QB . Belichick is the Ringo Starr of the New England Patriots. He's just tagging along for the ride.[/quote]

C'mon, 70? You don't believe that, do you? Belichick is a great head coach and Brady is a great QB. They both have played a mutual role in the other's success, no doubt. I think Gibbs was right for his time and with all due respect, I certainly think Belichick is right for his too.

Unlike Gibbs of the 80s, Belichick has only won with one quarterback. But then again, name a head coach that has won more Super Bowls with different QBs other than Gibbs? None. And therein lies the genius of Joe Gibbs, in my opinion. You couldn't chalk up his success to one great player. Gibbs won with different running backs, different quarterbacks, different field goal kickers...everything....he's the man.

BB, on the other hand, has dominated in an era where free agency and parity have ruled - or at least tried. I think he deserves a lot of credit for that as well.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;391928]LMAO. Well, I don't watch or buy that crap. Only chicks do.[/quote]

Well I guess I'm a chick then... or perhaps I've stood in line at a grocery store a few times. One or the other.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=12thMan;391933]C'mon, 70? You don't believe that, do you? Belichick is a great head coach and Brady is a great QB. They both have played a mutual role in the other's success, no doubt. I think Gibbs was right for his time and with all due respect, I certainly think Belichick is right for his too.

Unlike Gibbs of the 80s, Belichick has only one with one quarterback. But then again, name a head coach that has won more Super Bowls with different QBs other than Gibbs? None. And therein lies the genius of Joe Gibbs, in my opinion. You couldn't chalk up his success to one great player. Gibbs won with different running backs, different quarterbacks, different field goal kickers...everything....he's the man.

BB, on the other hand, has dominated in an era where free agency and parity have ruled - or at least tried. I think he deserves a lot of credit for that as well.[/quote]

Yeah I agree.

I hate Belichick just like everyone else, but you have to tip your hat to what he's done in New England. To have this much success over such a long period of time is incredible and much more than just tagging along for the ride. Please, that's just ridiculous.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=70Chip;391917]They respond well to him since Brady became the QB . Belichick is the Ringo Starr of the New England Patriots. He's just tagging along for the ride.[/quote]

Man you are cracking me up. He's tagging along for the ride???? BB may be a dick, he may suck at media relations, me may suck at having a charming personality, but you can not deny that he is a great football coach. If you don't realize that then you don't know much about football.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Southpaw;391936]Well I guess I'm a chick then... or perhaps I've stood in line at a grocery store a few times. One or the other.[/quote]

But Brady can't help it that someone from TMZ is following him. Right? He can't help it if someone from a gossip magazine takes his picture. Right?

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;391902]That's great but the reality is people will find something to hate on regardless. Nobody is immune to the hate... hell people hate on Favre and that blows my mind.[/quote]

I don't disagree with this in principle, but the Pats are different than the typical "America hates you because you're good" scenario. The Colts have only lost nine games in the last four seasons combined, but you don't hear the constant "Eff the Colts" talk like you do with the Pats.

Peyton Manning has the All American, cornfed, country boy image, and Dungy is a humble, god fearing, all around nice guy. Tom Brady is a playboy that leaves his pregnant girlfriend for another woman, and has a smug little two-faced attitude. Belichick is worse, and he's giving the entire NFL the finger with his antics this season. ESPN.com had a front page article called "Good vs. Evil", with Dungy done up as an angel and Belichick as a devil for eff's sake. So I think it's a lot more that the Pats being "winners".

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Southpaw;391924]I don't think anyone is denying that Tom Brady is a great quarterback. The problem is, he knows he's a great quarterback and makes sure that everyone knows it.

Right after the game, when asked about the A. Smith encounter, he said Smith was a good player, and probably was just trying to get his team hyped for the game. Then I hear an interview that he did yesterday on the radio where he said they purposely targeted Smith, and he's a third stringer that's only playing because of injuries. And why make the comment about the 4th & 1 play in the Ravens game, after you WON the effing game? The only reason to make that comment is to rub salt in the wound. Good quarterback or not, he's still a dick.

And no you don't see him doing commercials every five minutes... he's just on TMZ and the Enquirer all the time.[/quote]
Well I would hope that if we are playing a team with a 3rd string starting at corner our team would attack that area of the field. Thats not new in football and I have heard other people say they do the same thing. If he is a third stringer then he should keep his mouth shut and just play football. We would be all over the guy if he was playing the Skins and said the same thing and then we would want to pound on the guy. Brady says they would have made the 1st down if there was not a timeout called. Wow a QB with confidence is a bad thing now days. Maybe thats how the skins find their players and they look for players with no convidence.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;391944]But Brady can't help it that someone from TMZ is following him. Right? He can't help it if someone from a gossip magazine takes his picture. Right?[/quote]

I think most of Brady's celebrity status has been imposed on him for the most part.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=firstdown;391949]Well I would hope that if we are playing a team with a 3rd string starting at corner our team would attack that area of the field. Thats not new in football and I have heard other people say they do the same thing. If he is a third stringer then he should keep his mouth shut and just play football. We would be all over the guy if he was playing the Skins and said the same thing and then we would want to pound on the guy. Brady says they would have made the 1st down if there was not a timeout called. Wow a QB with confidence is a bad thing now days. Maybe thats how the skins find their players and they look for players with no convidence.[/quote]

From a football standpoint, obviously you attack a teams weakness. My beef is with the fact that he was playing Mr. Nice Guy on TV and then decides to talk smack on the radio. Why make the complete 180? If you're going to lower yourself to that level, why not do it in front of everyone?

And I supposed there was a need to rub the Ravens face in the LOSS. Winning the game wasn't enough...

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Southpaw;391955]From a football standpoint, obviously you attack a teams weakness. My beef is with the fact that he was playing Mr. Nice Guy on TV and then decides to talk smack on the radio. Why make the complete 180? If you're going to lower yourself to that level, why not do it in front of everyone?

And I supposed there was a need to rub the Ravens face in the LOSS. Winning the game wasn't enough...[/quote]

Wait a minute, what standard are we hold Brady to - the Pope's? He's not perfect, and it's okay to fire back with a little smack of your own. There isn't anything unethical or being a douche about that.

The dude is football player, he 'aint running for Congress.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;391941]Man you are cracking me up. He's tagging along for the ride???? BB may be a dick, he may suck at media relations, me may suck at having a charming personality, [B]but you can not deny that he is a great football coach. If you don't realize that then you don't know much about football.[/B][/QUOTE]

[IMG]http://extensibletech.com/images/funny/referee_fallacy.jpg[/IMG]

It's a slow day at work, what can I say...

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=12thMan;391957]Wait a minute, what standard are we hold Brady to - the Pope's? He's not perfect, and it's okay to fire back with a little smack of your own. There isn't anything unethical or being a douche about that.

The dude is football player, he 'aint running for Congress.[/quote]

I don't care that he talks smack at all. It's his two-faced, smug attitude that I have a problem with. I think the underlying reason for this debate is because different people value different personality traits.

As I said, I don't think anyone disagrees that he's a great quarterback, and from a purely football standpoint, I respect him. From a personality standpoint, he's a dick. He just carries himself in a way that says "I'm hot shit". Some people see it, some people don't, and some others see it, but don't care.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=12thMan;391951]I think most of Brady's celebrity status has been imposed on him for the most part.[/QUOTE]

Imposed on him in the "choosing to bang famous chicks kind of way," yes. (not that I blame him...)

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Southpaw;391963]I don't care that he talks smack at all. It's his two-faced, smug attitude that I have a problem with. I think the underlying reason for this debate is because different people value different personality traits.

As I said, I don't think anyone disagrees that he's a great quarterback, and from a purely football standpoint, I respect him. From a personality standpoint, he's a dick. He just carries himself in a way that says "I'm hot shit". Some people see it, some people don't, and some others see it, but don't care.[/quote]

I personally don't think he carries himself that way. But that's me.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

i dont hate the pats and i actually respected coach B until the spygate thing came out and he said crap like "we had a different interpretation of the rule then the NFL" and things along those lines that show what kind of POS he is.

im glad vladamir putin punked him for his superbowl ring.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Southpaw;391946]I don't disagree with this in principle, but the Pats are different than the typical "America hates you because you're good" scenario. The Colts have only lost nine games in the last four seasons combined, but you don't hear the constant "Eff the Colts" talk like you do with the Pats.

Peyton Manning has the All American, cornfed, country boy image, and Dungy is a humble, god fearing, all around nice guy. Tom Brady is a playboy that leaves his pregnant girlfriend for another woman, and has a smug little two-faced attitude. Belichick is worse, and he's giving the entire NFL the finger with his antics this season. ESPN.com had a front page article called "Good vs. Evil", with Dungy done up as an angel and Belichick as a devil for eff's sake. So I think it's a lot more that the Pats being "winners".[/quote]

See this bothers. How do you know Brady left his pregnant g/f? It seems that they broke up around the time she got pregnant. It looks like it was good bye sex. He started dating someone else and she decides to keep it. Why? If you ask me she trapped the guy. Why are you going to have a baby with someone that you are not with anymore? Why not try and meet someone else and have a baby with that person you are going to be with? If you ask me that's bad on her part. It's not fair to the child to be put in that situation.

I know alot women that have done this for all the wrong reasons.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;392007]See this bothers. How do you know Brady left his pregnant g/f? It seems that they broke up around the time she got pregnant. It looks like it was good bye sex. He started dating someone else and she decides to keep it. Why? [B]If you ask me she trapped the guy. Why are you going to have a baby with someone that you are not with anymore?[/B] Why not try and meet someone else and have a baby with that person you are going to be with? If you ask me that's bad on her part. It's not fair to the child to be put in that situation.

I know alot women that have done this for all the wrong reasons.[/QUOTE]

There's a whole lot of religious/moral reasons that make people choose to go through with having a baby once it is conceived, independent of their relationship status. I think that assuming a millionaire actress purposefully got pregnant to trap someone that didn't want to be with her is a stretch. More likely, they just weren't being all that careful...

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Arrogant cheaters. I have a bigger problem with Belichek then the Patriots team. He was a head coaching failure in CLeveland and he was failing in NEw England until he stumbled upon Tom Brady...now it's like his arrogant ass invented the football. Your a pretty good coach who stumbled on an ALL TIME Great QB...get over yourself.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

I have no problem with Tom Brady. He is arguably the best quarterback in the NFL. His school boy looks alone make some men jealous. Belichek is the scrub I don't like. He is arrogant and obnoxious. He has been caught cheating and his reaction is to prove to the rest of the NFL, he doesn't have to cheat, even though he did.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=celts32;392016]Arrogant cheaters. I have a bigger problem with Belichek then the Patriots team. He was a head coaching failure in CLeveland and he was failing in NEw England until he stumbled upon Tom Brady...now it's like his arrogant ass invented the football. Your a pretty good coach who stumbled on an ALL TIME Great QB...get over yourself.[/quote]

Actually he got Cleveland to the playoffs and he was D-coordinator for both NYG Super Bowls.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;392011]There's a whole lot of religious/moral reasons that make people choose to go through with having a baby once it is conceived, independent of their relationship status. I think that assuming a millionaire actress purposefully got pregnant to trap someone that didn't want to be with her is a stretch. More likely, they just weren't being all that careful...[/quote]

Well none of us will ever know the real story. And that is why it's silly to say he ran out on her, and it's silly to say she trapped him.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Personally, I think the hate for the Pats comes down to Belichick. He gives a poor first impression (and second and third). Nobody here really knows him, so their perception of him is based on what little information we have to go on.

So, here's what we have to go on:

1.) Football Etiquette -
Relentless attack. No mercy. Score as many points as possible -- not as many points needed to win.

2.) Outward Appearance -
Unkempt. Disheveled. Unprofessional.

3.) Press Conferences -
Poor speaker. Rude. Blunt. Inconsiderate. Unemotional, if not angry.

4.) Media Gossip -
Cheated on his wife. Cheated in the NFL.

Put Dungy on the Pats, even with Brady and everything else, and I think most of the hate for the Pats goes away. In short, it's hate for Belichick -- not Brady or the Pats as a team. Thats my analysis anyways.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;392110]Personally, I think the hate for the Pats comes down to Belichick. He gives a poor first impression (and second and third). Nobody here really knows him, so their perception of him is based on what little information we have to go on.

So, here's what we have to go on:

1.) Football Etiquette -
Relentless attack. No mercy. Score as many points as possible -- not as many points needed to win.

2.) Outward Appearance -
Unkempt. Disheveled. Unprofessional.

3.) Press Conferences -
Poor speaker. Rude. Blunt. Inconsiderate. Unemotional, if not angry.

4.) Media Gossip -
Cheated on his wife. Cheated in the NFL.

Put Dungy on the Pats, even with Brady and everything else, and I think most of the hate for the Pats goes away. In short, it's hate for Belichick -- not Brady or the Pats as a team. Thats my analysis anyways.[/quote]
The first one I like and wish the Skins would play that way. Second I really don't care what a coach wears. I think thats his way of telling the NFL that he is a grown man and can decide what to wear without their help. Which I agree and there was one coach who had to get permision (yes a grown man asking permision) to wear a suit. Third the press is just as blunt, incosiderate, etc as you say he is to the press. Just look at the reports and editorials when ST died. Fourth nothing to argue about both are wrong.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=The Zimmermans;391498]I think it's the fact that "THEY GOT CAUGHT CHEATING". That definitely couldn't be helping.[/QUOTE]

That is my reason plus no one actually know how long they have been cheating since Belbitch has been coach them probably. If I told you that MJ & the Bulls cheated during there championship run you probably won't respect them either. That is the real reason behind them running up the scores on opponents because they got caught. I feel if the Pats told Goodell "Hey man we have been cheating for the last 7 years." he would go public with it for the sake of the NFL. They would lose plenty of money & sponsors probably.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Yeah, well the Broncos cheated during their two SB years (salary cap infractions), and no one thinks any less of them.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Someone mention the class of the Colts and how they pulled PM after they had a hugh lead this week. They also forgot to mention that with the second string QB that hit a deap pass right off the bate and scored. I'd have to say running a play like that would be running up the score if we use the same standard applied to the Pats.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Speaking of running it up, does anyone want to bet that the Pats will be looking to run it up on Mangini this weekend? They might score 60+.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;392312]Someone mention the class of the Colts and how they pulled PM after they had a hugh lead this week. They also forgot to mention that with the second string QB that hit a deap pass right off the bate and scored. I'd have to say running a play like that would be running up the score if we use the same standard applied to the Pats.[/QUOTE]

If you've got backups in, at least you can use the excuse of trying to get them ready for any game situation...

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;392313]Speaking of running it up, does anyone want to bet that the Pats will be looking to run it up on Mangini this weekend? They might score 60+.[/quote]

Man, they are going to kill the Jets this weekend.

What's the over/under on Brady playing all four quarters in the season finale?

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Brady might break the single game record for TDs this weekend.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;392102]Actually he got Cleveland to the playoffs and he was D-coordinator for both NYG Super Bowls.[/QUOTE]

If you have to judge his cleveland stay as a success or failure it's a failure. Cleveland agreed since they fired him. And no one ever said he was not a good DC he is obviously that. I don't think he is a bad coach I just think the media is trying to turn him into the next coming of Lombardi which is just rediculous.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[quote=celts32;392347]If you have to judge his cleveland stay as a success or failure it's a failure. Cleveland agreed since they fired him. And no one ever said he was not a good DC he is obviously that. I don't think he is a bad coach I just think the media is trying to turn him into the next coming of Lombardi which is just rediculous.[/quote]
I'm not sure that the Browns fired him as it was more that he did not move with the team to Balimore after the 95 season. I think he now has 4 SB rings with one as a DC. Say what you want about him but find me the list of coach with more SB rings than him and I'm sure that will be a short list.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

Slight edit. ;)


[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;392110]Personally, I think the hate for the Pats comes down to Belichick. He gives a poor first impression (and second and third). Nobody here really knows him, so their perception of him is based on what little information we have to go on.

So, here's what we have to go on:

1.) Football Etiquette -
Relentless attack. No mercy. Score as many points as possible -- not as many points needed to win.

2.) Outward Appearance -
Unkempt. Disheveled. Unprofessional.

3.) Press Conferences -
Poor speaker. Rude. Blunt. Inconsiderate. Unemotional, if not angry.

4.) Media Gossip -
Cheated on his wife (AND BROKE UP SOMEONE ELSE'S MARRIAGE). Cheated in the NFL.

Put Dungy on the Pats, even with Brady and everything else, and I think most of the hate for the Pats goes away. In short, it's hate for Belichick -- not Brady or the Pats as a team. Thats my analysis anyways.[/quote]

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;392144]The first one I like and wish the Skins would play that way. Second I really don't care what a coach wears. I think thats his way of telling the NFL that he is a grown man and can decide what to wear without their help. Which I agree and there was one coach who had to get permision (yes a grown man asking permision) to wear a suit. Third the press is just as blunt, incosiderate, etc as you say he is to the press. Just look at the reports and editorials when ST died. Fourth nothing to argue about both are wrong.[/QUOTE]

I agree about the relentless attack -- it could be perceived as good or bad. On one hand he is performing exceptionally, and on the other he is doing more than necessary. I liken it to a person who corrects another, and then goes on and on about why the other was wrong and they were right, even after the other person has conceded.

I don't care what a coach wears either, but some people do. That is why Belichick should care. I don't think it would be acceptable for the President of the United States to wear flip-flops and cut-off shorts to a UN meeting -- do you? Appearance matters.

Just because other people are blunt and inconsiderate doesn't mean that it is acceptable. Two wrongs don't make a right. Don't confuse what IS with what OUGHT to be. Just because something IS that way, doesn't mean that it OUGHT to be that way.

"Both are wrong"? I'm not sure what you mean by that. Are you telling me the Patriots didn't cheat, and they were docked a 1st round pick for nothing? Please explain.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;392359]I'm not sure that the Browns fired him as it was more that he did not move with the team to Balimore after the 95 season. I think he now has 4 SB rings with one as a DC. Say what you want about him but find me the list of coach with more SB rings than him and I'm sure that will be a short list.[/QUOTE]

The Browns fired him. He is a good defensive coach but the facts are that he was nothing as a head coach until he stumbled upon Tom Brady. He was 35-47 as a head coach over 6+ seasons with 1 winning season before finding Tom Brady. Six years is not exactly a small sampling...he could not get it done as a head coach without one of the best QB's ever. Facts are facts...he's a good coach but this is not Vince Lombardi no matter how many Super Bowls Tom Brady wins him.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=celts32;392502]The Browns fired him. He is a good defensive coach but the facts are that he was nothing as a head coach until he stumbled upon Tom Brady. He was 35-47 as a head coach over 6+ seasons with 1 winning season before finding Tom Brady. Six years is not exactly a small sampling...he could not get it done as a head coach without one of the best QB's ever. Facts are facts...he's a good coach but this is not Vince Lombardi no matter how many Super Bowls Tom Brady wins him.[/QUOTE]

The Browns fired him because he wanted to rebuild and cut their "beloved" quarterback Bernie Kosar (whoever the hell that is). Belicheck is a genius coach who made the Patriots who they are today. Yes, Brady is really good and makes things happen. If it wasn't for Belicheck coaching as well as he does, the Patriots would be a mediocre team at best.

Re: Why All The Hate Toward The Patriots?
 

[QUOTE=TheMeatLoafCabana24;392624]The Browns fired him because he wanted to rebuild and cut their "beloved" quarterback Bernie Kosar (whoever the hell that is). Belicheck is a genius coach who made the Patriots who they are today. Yes, Brady is really good and makes things happen. If it wasn't for Belicheck coaching as well as he does, the Patriots would be a mediocre team at best.[/QUOTE]

35-47 with 1 winning season out of 6 without Brady...I did not make that up...those are the facts.