Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=marius;438575]....This guy is one of the top 3 or 4 receivers in the league.[/quote]Better receivers right now than CJ.

Randy Moss, Reggie Wayne, Larry Fitzgerald, Terrell Owens (Ugh), Braylon Edwards, Torry Holt, TJ House-ma-zilly, Marvin Harrison.

Equal with better upside: Anquan Boldin, Greg Jennings, Andre Johnson, Calvin Johnson, Roy Williams, Marques Colston

The costs to get CJ (draft picks, cap space, team chemistry)are not worth it.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=mauiRedskinbarn;438158]ESPN's Todd McShay reports the Bengals have informed Oklahoma WR Malcolm Kelly that they're interested in him.
McShay speculates that the Bengals are smokescreening and hope to trade down, while John Clayton says the interest is "valid." Kelly will work out for the first time this offseason Wednesday. Following the release of Chris Henry, the Bengals may very well use a pick in the top three rounds on a receiver.

Looks like the Bengals are already looking to replace ocho cinco. I am not opposed to trading ladell Betts and ocho cinco straight up.[/quote]

Well it is Wednesday and did you hear how Kelly did at OU's pro day?
Kelly ran an ABYSMAL 40 time of 4.75 and 4.68 and only had a 32" vertical.

Kelly just dropped from the first round to the 12th round (if there were one).

[url=http://www.nfl.com/draft/story;jsessionid=3BFB7C37288A66D033C569836CC8319A?id=09000d5d806b4a39&template=with-video&confirm=true]Pro day workout updates[/url]

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;438614]I certainly never said Chad Johnson was washed up. Chad Johnson likely has several (3-4) highly productive years left in the tank, but it's [I]usually[/I] not smart to "buy" when the price is high and the value is in decline. Moreover, the question isn't whether CJ would add value to our team, the question is whether CJ adds more value to our team over the long haul than the draft picks and/or players we would likely have to trade to acquire him. In my opinion, the answer is no.[/QUOTE]


great approach! I couldnt agree more! Trading for CJ would be stupid on our part, although there is now possbility that it can be ruled out given our current reputation. But why would we trade for such a high dollar WR that will last 5 years at the most when we can draft a potential perennial pro bowler for 10+ years and a lower price plus the cost of development?

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

I remember when the bengals were terrible he was their only bright spot and helped turn them around. Motivation has alot to do with production. I think if he was a skin, he would have a lot to be motivated about. But I don't want the skins to reach on him there are some good recievers in this draft that can be developed into stars.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[url=http://nfldraft.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?sport=1&player=44490&type=scoutingreport#scouting]Paul Hubbard - College Football[/url]

Any thoughts on Paul Hubbard from Wiscousin. I looked up his profile on Scouts.com & ESPN, apparently he has a good combo of size and speed.

Looks like he'd be available in the 4th round and beyond. I'm intrigued.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;438614]I certainly never said Chad Johnson was washed up. Chad Johnson likely has several (3-4) highly productive years left in the tank, but it's [I]usually[/I] not smart to "buy" when the price is high and the value is in decline. Moreover, the question isn't whether CJ would add value to our team, the question is whether CJ adds more value to our team over the long haul than the draft picks and/or players we would likely have to trade to acquire him. In my opinion, the answer is no.[/QUOTE]

Exactly.
ps- it's not just your opinion either. There are plenty of us that share your opinion.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=Skinny Tee;438751][url=http://nfldraft.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?sport=1&player=44490&type=scoutingreport#scouting]Paul Hubbard - College Football[/url]

Any thoughts on Paul Hubbard from Wiscousin. I looked up his profile on Scouts.com & ESPN, apparently he has a good combo of size and speed.

Looks like he'd be available in the 4th round and beyond. I'm intrigued.[/QUOTE]

Welcome to the dark side:
[url]http://www.redskinswarpath.com/423015-post9.html[/url]

He's raw, a converted track star, but loads of potential. Another one to look at in the mid rounds would be Bruce Hocker

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

But anyway back to Chad Johnson, what's the bigger concern, his "attitude" or his age?

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=SmootSmack;438759]But anyway back to Chad Johnson, what's the bigger concern, his "attitude" or his age?[/quote]

I side with what Sheriff Gonna Getcha is saying about the cost and magnitude of acquiring CJ is not going to be worth passing up on bringing young talent to the team now so we can be stable and competitive in the future.

I think CJ is a great player and free of charge I wouldn't mind him being a Redskin but the Skins can't bear the cost.

Between age & attitude, I would say attitude by default because 30 is not old enough to worry about him retiring anytime soon. I don't think his attitude is a problem either, unless provoked by contract renewal.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;438751][URL="http://nfldraft.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?sport=1&player=44490&type=scoutingreport#scouting"]Paul Hubbard - College Football[/URL]

Any thoughts on Paul Hubbard from Wiscousin. I looked up his profile on Scouts.com & ESPN, apparently he has a good combo of size and speed.

Looks like he'd be available in the 4th round and beyond. I'm intrigued.[/quote]


I swear that if we Draft Paul Hubbard, I will buy his jersey as soon as it is available. As of right now I do not own a Jersey. My kids do though, so back off!


Chad Johnson is no more of a headache than Clinton Portis. People forget that Portis was walking aroung on the sidelines in Denver with a Championship belt (modeled after boxing) around his waist after scoring. Chad is alot like Portis. He celebrates and makes jokes win the team is winning and is serious when the team is losing.

The irony is that no one considers Portis a headache, because he cares. So does Chad and that is why he wants out of Cincy.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=Stuck in TX;438701]great approach! I couldnt agree more! Trading for CJ would be stupid on our part, although there is now possbility that it can be ruled out given our current reputation. But why would we trade for such a high dollar WR that will last 5 years at the most when we can draft a potential perennial pro bowler for 10+ years and a lower price plus the cost of development?[/QUOTE]

We get Johnson and we almost certainly (as much as you can be certain in these things) get 4-5 years of high quality production. We rely on the draft and yes, we might get a perennial pro bowler for 10+ years, but we are more likely to get Desmond Howard, Michael Westbrook, Rod Gardner or perhaps Taylor Jacobs. Drafting WRs is a lottery (that the Redskins have been particularly unlucky in) whereas grabbing Chad Johnson is not. I'd give up Betts and a 3rd for this guy without a thought.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=marius;438818]We get Johnson and we almost certainly (as much as you can be certain in these things) get 4-5 years of high quality production. We rely on the draft and yes, we might get a perennial pro bowler for 10+ years, but we are more likely to get Desmond Howard, Michael Westbrook, Rod Gardner or perhaps Taylor Jacobs. Drafting WRs is a lottery (that the Redskins have been particularly unlucky in) whereas grabbing Chad Johnson is not. I'd give up Betts and a 3rd for this guy without a thought.[/QUOTE]

Yeah I agree, Betts and a third, but only if we take a chance and draft a WR in the 1st or 2nd. For some reason, given the circumstances with the WR corps in Cincy, they wont go for a third, and they could pawn off CJ to another team for a bigger name RB. You are right about the drafting thing but if we never take a chance we will be paying old guys forever. CJ is a quickish fix, and frankly, IMO, our need at WR isnt quite bad enough to trade away potential good picks for.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

manningham for johnson is more than fair to the bengals one would think.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=angryssg;438768]Chad Johnson is no more of a headache than Clinton Portis. People forget that Portis was walking aroung on the sidelines in Denver with a Championship belt (modeled after boxing) around his waist after scoring. Chad is alot like Portis. He celebrates and makes jokes win the team is winning and is serious when the team is losing.

The irony is that no one considers Portis a headache, because he cares. So does Chad and that is why he wants out of Cincy.[/QUOTE]

Portis didn't routinely draw 15 yard penalties for engaging in excessive celebration. That Chad Johnson repeatedly did so, despite knowing it would hurt his team speaks volumes about his character. Moreover, I don't seem to recall Portis ever physically assaulting one of his coaches.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

SGG, that assault claim is shaky at best.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;438917]SGG, that assault claim is shaky at best.[/QUOTE]

I know the details are sketchy, but I thought Chad acknowledged Hue Jackson had him in a headlock and a former Bengal recently acknowledged that Chad took a swing at either Hue or Marvin Lewis. Obviously, I'll defer to you and your sources. I'm just repeating what I've heard from the rumormill.

*Edit-When I say "rumormill," I'm not just referring to pft.com. Boomer also "reported" that Chad was involved in a locker room fight.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;438921]I know the details are sketchy, but I thought Chad acknowledged Hue Jackson had him in a headlock and a former Bengal recently acknowledged that Chad took a swing at either Hue or Marvin Lewis. Obviously, I'll defer to you and your sources. I'm just repeating what I've heard from the rumormill.

*Edit-When I say "rumormill," I'm not just referring to pft.com. Boomer also "reported" that Chad was involved in a locker room fight.[/QUOTE]

Yes on the headlock, more of a bearhug from what I've heard (to calm CJ down), as for taking a swing only one person has said that. I understand that people believe that Johnson and Lewis are lying to cover their tracks, but everything I've heard about the situation and Johnson in general tells me that's not what happened.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=marius;438818]We get Johnson and we almost certainly (as much as you can be certain in these things) get 4-5 years of high quality production. We rely on the draft and yes, we might get a perennial pro bowler for 10+ years, but we are more likely to get Desmond Howard, Michael Westbrook, Rod Gardner or perhaps Taylor Jacobs. Drafting WRs is a lottery (that the Redskins have been particularly unlucky in) whereas grabbing Chad Johnson is not. I'd give up Betts and a 3rd for this guy without a thought.[/quote]

Your're right that wr is a tough position to draft, but let's look at those picks for a minute, all of them were influenced heavily by the coaches. Howard is the only one that was definitely made by a true GM - Casserly, though Gibbs loved Howard.

IF Vinny is really running the show, I think it's worth it to take a chance on a wr w/a 2nd and/or 3rd round pick. He's supposedly already said he doesn't feel strongly enough to take any of these wr's in the 1st round, so that reduces the risk by using lower picks.

I hope we don't trade for CJ, but even if we do it's worth it to take a wr in the draft if there's a good one there in those middle rounds.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;438921]I know the details are sketchy, but I thought Chad acknowledged Hue Jackson had him in a headlock and a former Bengal recently acknowledged that Chad took a swing at either Hue or Marvin Lewis. Obviously, I'll defer to you and your sources. I'm just repeating what I've heard from the rumormill.

*Edit-When I say "rumormill," I'm not just referring to pft.com. Boomer also "reported" that Chad was involved in a locker room fight.[/quote]

It does sound like something bad went down & it's now gotten ugly in public w/CJ talking so much.

Anyone watch on the clock last night? they talked about the bengals, Hoge said he thinks that Lewis & Carson Palmer are totally different people since CJ started this trade talk and that the bengals need to trade him to get rid of the negativity.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

if a few more bengals get thrown in jail it's gonna be intresting!

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

It also seems as if manningham isn't worthy of the #21 overrall selection, and the bengls could get the same play for less money by trading with a team like jacksonville or god forbid Dallas

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;438915]Portis didn't routinely draw 15 yard penalties for engaging in excessive celebration. That Chad Johnson repeatedly did so, despite knowing it would hurt his team speaks volumes about his character. Moreover, I don't seem to recall Portis ever physically assaulting one of his coaches.[/quote]

Every player has gotten penalties to hurt the team in some form or fashion. Even the beloved Sean Taylor got a 15 yard penalty on the "no spike" rule. As far as I know the coach and teammates of Chad Johnson said that the "Assault" didn't take place.

I think you are being a bit nit picky on this one.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=angryssg;439034]Every player has gotten penalties to hurt the team in some form or fashion. Even the beloved Sean Taylor got a 15 yard penalty on the "no spike" rule. As far as I know the coach and teammates of Chad Johnson said that the "Assault" didn't take place.

I think you are being a bit nit picky on this one.[/QUOTE]

Not too mention the couple (b/c there were at least two) of 15 yard penalties by Laron Landry. I know I know, he was a rookie, but still.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

I'm just doing my part to keep this thread up near the top so others won't be tempted to start another thread. Even though someone already has. I thought it would be cute to have both threads in the top 5 hopefully. LOL. This way it can irritate those who do not want us to trade for Ocho. LOL. Hope all is well with everyone this fine weekend.

"Where you at 85?" ...........Washington.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

its probably about time to start recirculating the photo of him holding up an 85 jersey with his name on it.

and come on, you know the only reason we cut Llyod in his prime was to prevent their being a number conflict with Ocho Cinco!!

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

I wanted to provide one more point that I believe all the "for" CJ people are trying to make.

These teams should have passed on these WRsby ED THOMPSON, Scout.com
Updated: April 21, 2008, 7:15 AM EST 61 comments add this RSS blog email print You often hear the stories from NFL GMs and coaches about the player they really wanted to select but weren't able to pick during the NFL Draft because another team snatched them away just a pick or two earlier. But you don't hear them talk much about their one-pick misfires involving a player at the same position who was picked right after they made their choice — and who turned out to be a colossal oversight.

Ten teams have made the most noteworthy one-pick misfires over the past decade involving wide receivers. Take a look at the receivers they chose — and the receivers they allowed to slip just one pick away in that year's draft.


Read more at...

Get more on the draft at Scout.com
Steuber's NFL Draft mailbag
No, 1 pick: Boom or bust
NFL Draft Q&A: Colt Brennan
2008 Mock Draft, Round 1 | Round 2
Scout.com Draft rankings
Head 2 Head: Long vs. Gholston
Head 2 Head: Kelly vs. Thomas
Full NFL Draft, free-agency coverage
7-day FREE trial at Scout.com

Miami: Remember Larry Shannon? Well, you have a better memory than mine if you did. He was the Dolphins' third-round pick out of East Carolina back in 1998. And although he made two game appearances, he never caught a pass in a regular season game. By contrast, the next receiver selected in that draft just ten picks later was a Hines Ward out of the University of Georgia, who has caught 719 passes for 8,737 yards and 65 touchdowns during his pro career. You've most likely heard of him.

New England: With the 13th pick in the second round of the 2003 draft, the Patriots chose Texas A&M wide receiver Bethel Johnson, who provided more spark as a kickoff return specialist than he ever did as a receiver during his three seasons in New England. After making just 30 catches for the Patriots, he spent a year as a reserve receiver for Minnesota and was cut at the end of training camp by the Texans last year. If the Patriots would have chosen the next receiver selected in that draft instead, it's likely that they wouldn't have bothered to acquire Randy Moss last year. Quarterback Tom Brady would have already had his deep-threat receiver on board — Anquan Boldin — who was picked nine slots after Bethel Johnson when the Cardinals made their second-round pick. Boldin has 413 career catches for 5,438 yards and 29 touchdowns after five NFL seasons in Arizona.

Philadelphia: In 1991 the Eagles used the 25th overall pick on UCLA wide receiver Freddie Mitchell, who finished his four-year career in Philadelphia with 90 catches for 1,263 yards and five scores. The receiver who was picked next at number 30 in that round, Reggie Wayne, has posted four consecutive 1,000-yard seasons in Indianapolis, including a 104-catch season last year for 1,510 yards and 10 touchdowns. He's caught 47 touchdown passes in his seven seasons with the Colts.



NFL Draft Answers


Got a question about the NFL Draft
Subject:

Comment/Question:

Name: (ex, john doe)
Email: (ex, a@b.c)
Hometown:





Detroit: The Lions have used four first-round picks on receivers over the past 10 years, and two of those players are no longer with the team — Mike Williams and Charles Rogers. While they've had better luck with their other two first-rounders, Roy Williams and Calvin Johnson, Rogers' failure was particularly costly. The second overall pick in the 2003 draft, Rogers caught just 36 passes for 440 yards and four touchdowns during his three years in Detroit. The next receiver taken in that draft, with the very next selection, was Andre Johnson, who was picked by the Houston Texans. Can you imagine the sleepless nights that Roy Williams, Andre Johnson and Calvin Johnson would be causing defensive coordinators if Detroit hadn't made that mistake? Or would the Lions have even picked Calvin Johnson if they already had a Williams-Johnson tandem in place?

Cleveland: The Browns also had a pair of noteworthy one-pick misses. The first one involved Quincy Morgan, who spent his first four years in Cleveland after being chosen with the second pick of Round 2 in the 2001 draft. A steady, yet unspectacular performer, he caught 133 passes for the Browns for 2,056 yards and 15 touchdowns before bouncing around the league as a free agent. Despite some solid performances by Morgan, what made the pick so awful for Cleveland was that it turned out to be a double-whammy of sorts. A division rival was the next team to select a wide receiver with the fifth pick in that round. The Cincinnati Bengals chose Oregon State's Chad Johnson, who would become a major nuisance to the Browns' secondary for years to come. He's caught 559 passes for 8,365 yards and 49 touchdowns during his first seven years in Cincinnati.

The other one-pick mishap by the Browns occurred during the 2000 NFL Draft when they selected JaJuan Dawson with the 17th pick in the third round. They cut him loose after two seasons with just 31 catches under his belt. The receiver that the Seattle Seahawks picked with the next selection in that round, Darrell Jackson, turned in three 1,000-yard seasons during his seven seasons in Seattle while scoring 47 touchdowns and amassing over 6,400 receiving yards before signing with the 49ers in 2007.

Baltimore: Oregon's Demetrius Williams was picked by the Ravens in the fourth round of the 2006 draft. The 14th selection in that round, Williams is still with the team and has been making nice progress, catching 42 balls in his first two seasons for 686 yards and two touchdowns. But the Ravens, who haven't had much luck with the 10 receivers they've selected since the 2000 NFL draft other than Mark Clayton and Travis Taylor, could have had the next wide receiver selected — Brandon Marshall — who was picked by Denver with the 22nd selection in that round. Marshall caught 102 passes for 1,325 yards and scored seven touchdowns last year. None of the Ravens' twelve drafted wide receivers over the past ten years have posted a 1,000-yard season in Baltimore.

Jacksonville: The Jaguars made the University of Washington's Reggie Williams the ninth overall pick in the 2004 draft. And while he hasn't been a washout by any means, he can't match the production of the player that Buffalo took when they selected the next wide receiver just four picks later. While Williams has made 152 catches for 1,958 yards and scored 15 touchdowns, those numbers pale by comparison to the Bills' Lee Evans who has 233 catches for 3,727 yards and 29 touchdowns during the same four-year span.

Prior to that one-pick misjudgment, the Jaguars had selected USC wide receiver R. Jay Soward with the 29th overall pick in the 2000 draft. He played for one stormy season and caught 14 passes during 13 game appearances and two starts. After being suspended several times by the NFL for violating the league's substance abuse policy, he ended up playing a few seasons in the Canadian Football League for the Toronto Argonauts. Ironically, the receiver who was selected next with the first pick in Round 2 was Dennis Northcutt, who signed with the Jaguars in 2007 as a free agent after providing the Browns with seven solid years of work as a receiver and punt return specialist.

Kansas City: The Chiefs had to be fairly satisfied with the value they got from their fourth-round pick in 2004 when they added Oregon's Samie Parker to their roster with the ninth selection in the round. Parker made a noticeable contribution in three of his first four seasons with a total of 110 catches for 1,529 yards and seven touchdown catches. But Kansas City misfired by overlooking the next receiver that was snatched up by the New York Jets just three picks later — North Carolina State's Jerricho Cotchery — who has caught 82 passes in each of the last two seasons and accumulated 2,402 receiving yards and eight touchdowns during his first four years in the league.

New York Giants: The Jets were also the beneficiary of a misguided pick by their NFC neighbors in the 2000 NFL Draft. With the 11th pick in the third round, the Giants sent the name of Ron Dixon to the podium. He ended up catching 36 passes for them over a three-year period. The Jets then used the 16th pick in that same round to grab a Florida State wide receiver that the Giants bypassed — Laveranues Coles, who is in his second-stint with the Jets and is heading into his eighth NFL season. He's caught 561 passes for 7,245 yards and 37 touchdowns during his career.

Tennessee: In 1998 they were known as the Tennessee Oilers, not the Titans. And they were the first team to grab a wide receiver when they made their selection with the 16th overall pick. The relocated team opted for Utah's Kevin Dyson, who spent five years with the organization and caught 176 passes for 2,310 yards and 18 touchdowns before leaving for Carolina as a free agent. But one wide receiver pick later, the Minnesota Vikings chose Marshall's Randy Moss, who has rolled up over 12,000 receiving yards and has scored 124 times during his NFL career.

For more draft coverage, visit ScoutNFLexperts.com.



This is exactly why some of us are saying lets trade for CJ. He's proven and there's no way of knowing how some newbe is going to turn out in the draft. By picking a WR in the first round we are taking a crap shoot and probably waisting a pick. If we trade we may be trading alot in your standards but not others and we will already know what we are getting. We will not be taking a chance on a possible dud.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[quote=SBXVII;441051]I wanted to provide one more point that I believe all the "for" CJ people are trying to make.

These teams should have passed on these WRsby ED THOMPSON, Scout.com
Updated: April 21, 2008, 7:15 AM EST 61 comments add this RSS blog email print You often hear the stories from NFL GMs and coaches about the player they really wanted to select but weren't able to pick during the NFL Draft because another team snatched them away just a pick or two earlier. But you don't hear them talk much about their one-pick misfires involving a player at the same position who was picked right after they made their choice — and who turned out to be a colossal oversight.

Ten teams have made the most noteworthy one-pick misfires over the past decade involving wide receivers. Take a look at the receivers they chose — and the receivers they allowed to slip just one pick away in that year's draft.


Read more at...

Get more on the draft at Scout.com
Steuber's NFL Draft mailbag
No, 1 pick: Boom or bust
NFL Draft Q&A: Colt Brennan
2008 Mock Draft, Round 1 | Round 2
Scout.com Draft rankings
Head 2 Head: Long vs. Gholston
Head 2 Head: Kelly vs. Thomas
Full NFL Draft, free-agency coverage
7-day FREE trial at Scout.com

Miami: Remember Larry Shannon? Well, you have a better memory than mine if you did. He was the Dolphins' third-round pick out of East Carolina back in 1998. And although he made two game appearances, he never caught a pass in a regular season game. By contrast, the next receiver selected in that draft just ten picks later was a Hines Ward out of the University of Georgia, who has caught 719 passes for 8,737 yards and 65 touchdowns during his pro career. You've most likely heard of him.

New England: With the 13th pick in the second round of the 2003 draft, the Patriots chose Texas A&M wide receiver Bethel Johnson, who provided more spark as a kickoff return specialist than he ever did as a receiver during his three seasons in New England. After making just 30 catches for the Patriots, he spent a year as a reserve receiver for Minnesota and was cut at the end of training camp by the Texans last year. If the Patriots would have chosen the next receiver selected in that draft instead, it's likely that they wouldn't have bothered to acquire Randy Moss last year. Quarterback Tom Brady would have already had his deep-threat receiver on board — Anquan Boldin — who was picked nine slots after Bethel Johnson when the Cardinals made their second-round pick. Boldin has 413 career catches for 5,438 yards and 29 touchdowns after five NFL seasons in Arizona.

Philadelphia: In 1991 the Eagles used the 25th overall pick on UCLA wide receiver Freddie Mitchell, who finished his four-year career in Philadelphia with 90 catches for 1,263 yards and five scores. The receiver who was picked next at number 30 in that round, Reggie Wayne, has posted four consecutive 1,000-yard seasons in Indianapolis, including a 104-catch season last year for 1,510 yards and 10 touchdowns. He's caught 47 touchdown passes in his seven seasons with the Colts.



NFL Draft Answers


Got a question about the NFL Draft
Subject:

Comment/Question:

Name: (ex, john doe)
Email: (ex, a@b.c)
Hometown:





Detroit: The Lions have used four first-round picks on receivers over the past 10 years, and two of those players are no longer with the team — Mike Williams and Charles Rogers. While they've had better luck with their other two first-rounders, Roy Williams and Calvin Johnson, Rogers' failure was particularly costly. The second overall pick in the 2003 draft, Rogers caught just 36 passes for 440 yards and four touchdowns during his three years in Detroit. The next receiver taken in that draft, with the very next selection, was Andre Johnson, who was picked by the Houston Texans. Can you imagine the sleepless nights that Roy Williams, Andre Johnson and Calvin Johnson would be causing defensive coordinators if Detroit hadn't made that mistake? Or would the Lions have even picked Calvin Johnson if they already had a Williams-Johnson tandem in place?

Cleveland: The Browns also had a pair of noteworthy one-pick misses. The first one involved Quincy Morgan, who spent his first four years in Cleveland after being chosen with the second pick of Round 2 in the 2001 draft. A steady, yet unspectacular performer, he caught 133 passes for the Browns for 2,056 yards and 15 touchdowns before bouncing around the league as a free agent. Despite some solid performances by Morgan, what made the pick so awful for Cleveland was that it turned out to be a double-whammy of sorts. A division rival was the next team to select a wide receiver with the fifth pick in that round. The Cincinnati Bengals chose Oregon State's Chad Johnson, who would become a major nuisance to the Browns' secondary for years to come. He's caught 559 passes for 8,365 yards and 49 touchdowns during his first seven years in Cincinnati.

The other one-pick mishap by the Browns occurred during the 2000 NFL Draft when they selected JaJuan Dawson with the 17th pick in the third round. They cut him loose after two seasons with just 31 catches under his belt. The receiver that the Seattle Seahawks picked with the next selection in that round, Darrell Jackson, turned in three 1,000-yard seasons during his seven seasons in Seattle while scoring 47 touchdowns and amassing over 6,400 receiving yards before signing with the 49ers in 2007.

Baltimore: Oregon's Demetrius Williams was picked by the Ravens in the fourth round of the 2006 draft. The 14th selection in that round, Williams is still with the team and has been making nice progress, catching 42 balls in his first two seasons for 686 yards and two touchdowns. But the Ravens, who haven't had much luck with the 10 receivers they've selected since the 2000 NFL draft other than Mark Clayton and Travis Taylor, could have had the next wide receiver selected — Brandon Marshall — who was picked by Denver with the 22nd selection in that round. Marshall caught 102 passes for 1,325 yards and scored seven touchdowns last year. None of the Ravens' twelve drafted wide receivers over the past ten years have posted a 1,000-yard season in Baltimore.

Jacksonville: The Jaguars made the University of Washington's Reggie Williams the ninth overall pick in the 2004 draft. And while he hasn't been a washout by any means, he can't match the production of the player that Buffalo took when they selected the next wide receiver just four picks later. While Williams has made 152 catches for 1,958 yards and scored 15 touchdowns, those numbers pale by comparison to the Bills' Lee Evans who has 233 catches for 3,727 yards and 29 touchdowns during the same four-year span.

Prior to that one-pick misjudgment, the Jaguars had selected USC wide receiver R. Jay Soward with the 29th overall pick in the 2000 draft. He played for one stormy season and caught 14 passes during 13 game appearances and two starts. After being suspended several times by the NFL for violating the league's substance abuse policy, he ended up playing a few seasons in the Canadian Football League for the Toronto Argonauts. Ironically, the receiver who was selected next with the first pick in Round 2 was Dennis Northcutt, who signed with the Jaguars in 2007 as a free agent after providing the Browns with seven solid years of work as a receiver and punt return specialist.

Kansas City: The Chiefs had to be fairly satisfied with the value they got from their fourth-round pick in 2004 when they added Oregon's Samie Parker to their roster with the ninth selection in the round. Parker made a noticeable contribution in three of his first four seasons with a total of 110 catches for 1,529 yards and seven touchdown catches. But Kansas City misfired by overlooking the next receiver that was snatched up by the New York Jets just three picks later — North Carolina State's Jerricho Cotchery — who has caught 82 passes in each of the last two seasons and accumulated 2,402 receiving yards and eight touchdowns during his first four years in the league.

New York Giants: The Jets were also the beneficiary of a misguided pick by their NFC neighbors in the 2000 NFL Draft. With the 11th pick in the third round, the Giants sent the name of Ron Dixon to the podium. He ended up catching 36 passes for them over a three-year period. The Jets then used the 16th pick in that same round to grab a Florida State wide receiver that the Giants bypassed — Laveranues Coles, who is in his second-stint with the Jets and is heading into his eighth NFL season. He's caught 561 passes for 7,245 yards and 37 touchdowns during his career.

Tennessee: In 1998 they were known as the Tennessee Oilers, not the Titans. And they were the first team to grab a wide receiver when they made their selection with the 16th overall pick. The relocated team opted for Utah's Kevin Dyson, who spent five years with the organization and caught 176 passes for 2,310 yards and 18 touchdowns before leaving for Carolina as a free agent. But one wide receiver pick later, the Minnesota Vikings chose Marshall's Randy Moss, who has rolled up over 12,000 receiving yards and has scored 124 times during his NFL career.

For more draft coverage, visit ScoutNFLexperts.com.



This is exactly why some of us are saying lets trade for CJ. He's proven and there's no way of knowing how some newbe is going to turn out in the draft. By picking a WR in the first round we are taking a crap shoot and probably waisting a pick. If we trade we may be trading alot in your standards but not others and we will already know what we are getting. We will not be taking a chance on a possible dud.[/quote]


The building through the draft vs free agency is always going to be an argument. I think trading for guys like Chad Johnson, Randy Moss, Deanglo Hall, Jared Allen...guys of this caliber is a smart move if you have the money. You know what you are getting. Money clearly is a conern, as is age. A lot of times trades involve older players.

Im a big proponent of drafting 'best availble' and not need. Take this year, when the skins pick odds are there will have been a lot of corners and ends taken. The odds that there are five stud ends or five stud corenrs in the first round is so small. Id rather take my chances with the top safety, or the second best guard, or mabye even the first or second best receiver.

Theres going to be a tremendous amount of talent available we just need a great scouting department to find it. I think when you pick for need you start reaching for guys and usually make a bad pick.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

I said it once and will say it again. I believe that some players are not going to make it at the NFL level but find it hard to believe so many don't. I have to think some of it is the player and the scheme being run and other times it maybe the coach's ability to develope the player into something special. ie: I'm not a fan of our WR coach.....is it Stan Hixon? I know he was reported to be one of the best in college but so was Spurrier. I have not seen us developing WR talent and wonder where the break down is. Yes we can go out and draft a top 10 WR in the draft but does our team have the ability to develope the player for our needs? I have a tendancy to think no. Which is why I keep saying we need to trade for a talented, experienced WR. Plus he has 4-5 yrs left in him. Lets say we draft a WR, most contracts are 4-6 yrs with the last 1-2 bing able to be opted out of. Which in essence is a 4-5 yr contract anyway. This would allow us some time to pick up a young replacement WR in the draft to learn and be an understudy of the vetran. If you look at all the great WR you will see that they had someone in front of them to show them the ropes prior to them stepping up and making a name for themselves. They will even achnoledge that fact. Who do we have? An ailing #1 (Moss) who has had more Hammies then almost anyone at a deli, and a #2 (Randel El) who is good but not great. I almost forgot Thrash. Everyone else is a no name I believe. We either need a top notch WR coach to develope players or a WR that brings something to the table as far as talent goes.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

I don't know if we can blame stan hixon. Was it his fault that Taylor Jacobs didn't ever produce? We shipped him to San Fran & it was the same story there.

I agree w/all that are pointing out how difficult it is to draft a wr & have them produce for you. It's a high bust position for sure, but that's all the more reason to draft them in rounds 2-4 and stay away from round 1 unless you have that odd talent like Calvin Johnson last year.

also, some wr's go to other teams and are successful in a different system, as mentioned by SBXVII. That indicates that drafting a wr is as much about fitting them in the scheme as it is their talent, work ethic, etc.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

True enough :>

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

Im going to make note that theres another thread about Roy Williams being traded. Until someone changes this thread title its about vets, and Roy Williams fits that bill. Even though all the talk has been about CJ.

[url=http://gcobb.com/content/view/1371/46]GCOBB.COM::The One Stop Shop For Philadelphia Eagles Fans[/url]

theres the link.

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

I didn't want to start a new thread so...

[url=http://www.cbc.ca/sports/football/story/2008/04/21/boston-argos.html]Argos sign receiver David Boston[/url]

Re: Redskins draft day trade for veteran WR
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;441165]I didn't want to start a new thread so...

[url=http://www.cbc.ca/sports/football/story/2008/04/21/boston-argos.html]Argos sign receiver David Boston[/url][/QUOTE]

Damn, I was hoping we could sign him to a vet minimum, and he could bring some depth to WR, I hope that he plays well there and can rejuvenate his NFL career.