Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=mheisig;469261]It's a fact? How so?

Do you have quantitative data to backup a massive, sweeping assertion about what the "rest of the world" thinks?

Have you spoken with a sufficient portion of the non-U.S. population of the world to extrapolate that "the rest of the world" holds a certain view of the U.S.?

Simply declaring something a fact doesn't make it so. I can declare that up is down and red is blue as well, but it doesn't make it any more rational.[/quote]'

England has had Queens ... Queens they loved and died for. American is young, THAT is a fact.. and I just don't see us being ready to respect and love a woman as it's leader, but I hope I am wrong. I just don't think we are ready.. and it's that simple.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

I still can't exactly grasp exactly what change he is referring to. I am not talking about specifics of policies. I'd just like to have a clear defintion of what "change" is to him. It can be simple or complicated but at last define it. He is so vague with the "change" talk. Hell he could actually get me to vote for him if his idea of change was to actually fix Washington but I don't think his idea of change and mine are compatible.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=FRPLG;469275]Again with the joking. It was intended satirically.[/quote]

I understand. Just saying...know your audience.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=saden1;469277]Colin Powell? Yes with an astrik. Condi Rice? Absolutely Not! Senior Alberto? No comment.[/quote]
So quality is only if they have the same ideas as you?

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Buster;469241]Yep. The Bush administration has put more Hispanics, Blacks and other minorities in HIGH-LEVEL cabinet positions and staff than the Clinton admin...yet Bush is still the racist and Clinton, who had an all-white cabinet is the one who represents minorities.

Aren't stereotypes great?[/quote]

Clinton had an all-white cabinet? That doesn't sound right. What about Ron Brown, Henry Cisneros, and Mike Espy?

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

Bill Richardson too.

[quote=SmootSmack;469290]Clinton had an all-white cabinet? That doesn't sound right. What about Ron Brown, Henry Cisneros, and Mike Espy?[/quote]

Wait...how did Mike Espy have time to being a Cabinet Official while being on our practice squad?

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Buster;469279]HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA [IMG]http://www.teamzx2.com/images/smilies/rofl.gif[/IMG]

Obama released this statement, "She is not the change we need."


This man can not put a rational thought together.[/quote]

I am the way, the truth, and the life
-Barrack 14:6 ??
Or was that Jesus? I get the two confused...........

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=FRPLG;469267]Anyone else think it is ironic that McCain, the painted womanizer, choose a younger attractive female as is his running mate? I wonder if CIndy said "Oh no you di'nt!"[/quote]

Next thing you know they'll be reports about them knocking boots ....

I'm telling ya, we are not ready...

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=FRPLG;469281]I've never understood what Condi Rice did to be so derided?

And Colin Powell gets no asterisk from me. If he had been given a larger voice in Bush's administration he'd have been a superstar. I love the guy and see Bush's failure to use him as a resource over Rumsfeld as his biggest political screwup. Powel is infinitely more capable of guiding, leading and making the right decisions than Rummy ever was.[/quote]

Secretary Rice worked during the Bush Presidency, so she must be evil!

She had an incredible background and life experience and is one of the most educated women ON THE PLANET. She also doesn't back down from dictators and is very skilled in diplomacy to avoid conflicts. She would make a great President if she wanted the job.

But, since she worked for this President, she must be destroyed. If she worked under Clinton and we criticized her, we'd be called racists AND sexists.

Ditto for Powell. I read his autobiography about 7 years ago and was VERY impressed.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=FRPLG;469292]Bill Richardson too.



Wait...how did Mike Espy have time to being a Cabinet Official while being on our practice squad?[/quote]

That's why he could never make it as an NFL receiver, he just wasn't committed to the job.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=hesscl34;469295]Next thing you know they'll be reports about them knocking boots ....

I'm telling ya, we are not ready...[/quote]

When is anybody REALLY ready for radical change? It always has some fallout....
BUT for trash like Bin Laden, he will understand and respect pretty damn fast when confronted by our first lady VP and a compliment of Delta force?

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=SmootSmack;469298]That's why he could never make it as an NFL receiver, he just wasn't committed to the job.[/quote]
Time management is EVERYTHING!

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Buster;469279]HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA [IMG]http://www.teamzx2.com/images/smilies/rofl.gif[/IMG]

Obama released this statement, "She is not the change we need."


This man can not put a rational thought together.[/quote]

The script goes something like this:

[B]Obama:[/B] "We need change! Change, and hope!"

[B]General Audience:[/B] "Sounds good! But what kind of change? What are we changing TO?"

[B]Obama:[/B] "Just change. And hope too, don't forget the hope."

[B]Liberals:[/B] "Can't argue with that, change is good! Long as we go somewhere, who cares where it is, right?"

[B]Conservatives:[/B] "Change is scary. That nice looking old white man looks more reliable."

[B]Obama:[/B] "pssst...change! (and hope)"

[B]McCain:[/B] [I]Unavailable. Currently having some soldering work done on his iron lung.[/I]

[B]Obama:[/B] "We're hopeful FOR change! And the change will bring us hope!"

[B]General Audience:[/B] "I don't know, still not sure what's changing or what it's changing to.

[B]Liberals:[/B] "YEAH! We'll just hope that the change takes us where we want to go! We'll hammer out the specifics later."

[B]Conservatives:[/B] [I]Unavailable. Too embarrassed to comment.[/I]

[B]McCain:[/B] "I'll give you change! How does a 44-year old woman as VP sound?!"

[B]Obama:[/B] "Um...well, we don't really want THAT kind of change."

[B]General Audience:[/B] "So what kind of change is good?"

[B]Obama:[/B] "Don't know, but we know it's not that kind of change. It's change, just different."

[B]Liberals:[/B] "Woohoo! Change! And hope!"

[B]Conservatives:[/B] "Yowza! She's hot AND she's got a gun!"

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=hesscl34;469295]Next thing you know they'll be reports about them knocking boots ....

I'm telling ya, we are not ready...[/quote]

I hear what you are saying but I don't think the fact that we tend to sexualize relationships between men and woman needlessly in our society presents an issue. To me the poster that Buster ( ithink) made doesn't prove to me in any way that we aren't ready. Maybe it is just that she's good lookin' and people notice. Woamn supposedly swooned over Bill Clinton and we didn't question it.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=SmootSmack;469298]That's why he could never make it as an NFL receiver, he just wasn't committed to the job.[/quote]
But he fought his guts out!!

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=FRPLG;469309]I hear what you are saying but I don't think the fact that we tend to sexualize relationships between men and woman needlessly in our society presents an issue. To me the poster that Buster ( ithink) made doesn't prove to me in any way that we aren't ready. Maybe it is just that she's good lookin' and people notice. Woamn supposedly swooned over Bill Clinton and we didn't question it.[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Women swooning over a male in power makes men feel even more powerful because in a way it gives them more control. Men swooning over a woman of power is considered degrading and disrespectful.... not fair.. but true.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Bill cheating on his wife however, did him no good - a lot of conservative women and men hated him for the lying and cheating. I wonder how men would feel if Sarah was bent over her oval office desk by some very hot young male yummy intern. Would it make her even more powerful? ....hmmmmm. Makes me think...[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=hesscl34;469319][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Women swooning over a male in power makes men feel even more powerful because in a way it gives them more control. Men swooning over a woman of power is considered degrading and disrespectful.... not fair.. but true.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]

I'll buy that. Maybe what we need is a good strong woman every one can like respect to start shifting those societal norms. Or maybe the sexual playoff between men and women is human nature and will never change. Either way I am at this point to give her a chance and have no problem personally with a qualified woman with whom I share beliefs.

I can say this. Ths choice does make it MORE likely that I will vote for McCain whereas a pick like Romeny or some other retread did not.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=FRPLG;469328]I can say this. Ths choice does make it MORE likely that I will vote for McCain whereas a pick like Romeny or some other retread did not.[/quote]

The most interesting post so far in this thread. Does anybody feel the opposite with this? In other words, is anyone less likely to vote for McCain now?

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

Why is [COLOR=black][COLOR=black]Tina[/COLOR][/COLOR] [COLOR=black][COLOR=black]Fey[/COLOR][/COLOR] running for VP?

[IMG]http://stuffpatrickshouldsee.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/153138__tinafey_l1.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://livingalaska.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/sarah_palin2.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=724Skinsfan;469355]The most interesting post so far in this thread. Does anybody feel the opposite with this? In other words, is anyone less likely to vote for McCain now?[/quote]

.. I can't see myself voting for Oblahblah ... but this does change my feelings about voting for McCain now.. The move politically was brilliant, but I don't think the choice was made in the best interest of the country as a whole.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Buster;469265]She just gave an incredible speech and even gave credit to Ms. Clinton for furthering the progress of women. She told about her accomplishments of holding people accountable in government, her great experience and qualifications, and how her son joined the army.

She is infinitely more qualified than Obama with all of her executive experience and she has a strong set of morals on top of that. She;s a great speaker too and did nothing to trash her opponents.

McCain looks like a genius now.[/quote]

She did indeed give credit to Senator Clinton, with the reason being obvious, and the irony delicious. Since 1992, continuously topping the conservatives' hate list has been Hillary. Hillary is their undisputed "we hate" champion. And yet, what has become abundantly clear to Republicans is that their success in this year's general election is hinged on their ability to persuade those people who wanted HILLARY TO BE PRESIDENT (!!!) to vote for their ticket. Indeed, this makes McCain's choice of Palin a very smart one, with the "straight talk" philosophy he championed eight years ago being at the heart of this choice--"I'm not making any bones about this; I want Hillary's voters." Yup, for lovers of irony, this is a very good day.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

Come on though, people. I know this announcement, and the Biden announcement are both hot off the presses, so it gives people something to talk about.

But in the end, does anybody really vote based on who the VP is? I know I don't. Even when a candidate is 72 years old, I still don't. The probability of McCain dying in office is not that high (ask me again if he's running at age 76, I might feel differently).

The guy is in great shape.

In the end, you all know you're going to vote based on Obama vs McCain. If you're an Obama fan, the biggest reason to vote for him is not going to be "because McCain might die and leave a 44 year old with little experience in charge." You're going to vote for Obama because you want us out of Iraq, or you want tax changes, or you want changes in foreign policy.

Palin and Biden don't change much. This is still about McCain vs Obama. I don't think either VP pick is going to significantly sway the vote.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=BringBackJoeT;469360]She did indeed give credit to Senator Clinton, with the reason being obvious, and the irony delicious. Since 1992, continuously topping the conservatives' hate list has been Hillary. Hillary is their undisputed "we hate" champion. And yet, what has become abundantly clear to Republicans is that their success in this year's general election is hinged on their ability to persuade those people who wanted HILLARY TO BE PRESIDENT (!!!) to vote for their ticket. Indeed, this makes McCain's choice of Palin a very smart one, with the "straight talk" philosophy he championed eight years ago being at the heart of this choice--"I'm not making any bones about this; I want Hillary's voters." Yup, for lovers of irony, this is a very good day.[/quote]

As politically brilliant as I think the selection is, I'm not buying the whole "it will sway Hillary voters" bit.

Anyone who was a Hillary supporter is going to have so many problems with Palin that the only thing Hillary and Palin will have in common is that they're both women.

If that fact alone is enough to completely ignore differences with respect to EVERY other area of policy and approach, then those voters could have been swayed with the promise of cupcakes and the Palin selection was unnecessary.

What I find funny is the reaction to this. Does anyone really expect die-hard Obama fans to suddenly change their position with the Palin selection? Please.

The selection really just fortifies his voting base and is a really good grab at a lot of the independent swing voters. Anyone expecting massive upheaval or for lifetime Democrats to suddenly vote Republican are sorely mistaken.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Schneed10;469372]Come on though, people. I know this announcement, and the Biden announcement are both hot off the presses, so it gives people something to talk about.

But in the end, does anybody really vote based on who the VP is? I know I don't. Even when a candidate is 72 years old, I still don't. The probability of McCain dying in office is not that high (ask me again if he's running at age 76, I might feel differently).

The guy is in great shape.

In the end, you all know you're going to vote based on Obama vs McCain. If you're an Obama fan, the biggest reason to vote for him is not going to be "because McCain might die and leave a 44 year old with little experience in charge." You're going to vote for Obama because you want us out of Iraq, or you want tax changes, or you want changes in foreign policy.

Palin and Biden don't change much. This is still about McCain vs Obama. I don't think either VP pick is going to significantly sway the vote.[/quote]

Pretty much sums it up right here.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Schneed10;469372]Come on though, people. I know this announcement, and the Biden announcement are both hot off the presses, so it gives people something to talk about.

But in the end, does anybody really vote based on who the VP is? I know I don't. Even when a candidate is 72 years old, I still don't. The probability of McCain dying in office is not that high (ask me again if he's running at age 76, I might feel differently).

The guy is in great shape.

In the end, you all know you're going to vote based on Obama vs McCain. If you're an Obama fan, the biggest reason to vote for him is not going to be "because McCain might die and leave a 44 year old with little experience in charge." You're going to vote for Obama because you want us out of Iraq, or you want tax changes, or you want changes in foreign policy.

Palin and Biden don't change much. This is still about McCain vs Obama. I don't think either VP pick is going to significantly sway the vote.[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I disagree. I think this is the one time in history the VP is the most important choice for the campaigns. I pray Obama isn't assassinated, and I also pray McCain doesn't expire.. but I think both could very well happen, making the VP VERY important.[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=hesscl34;469381][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I disagree. I think this is the one time in history the VP is the most important choice for the campaigns. I pray Obama isn't assassinated, and I also pray McCain doesn't expire.. but I think both could very well happen, making the VP VERY important.[/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]

Those are both emotional/superficial thought reactions though, there's not a whole lot of thought behind it.

The probability of a successful assassination attempt on Obama is so small. I get that he's black and there are crazies out there who may try it, but it's insanely hard to get it done. The secret service is incredibly good at their jobs; and they do an awful lot more than just jump in front of bullets.

As for McCain, check his health records. He's in tremendous shape, despite the previous bouts with melanoma. While melanoma can be deadly, and you'll hear about that in the media, it is easily treatable and near harmless if detected in time. Given that he sees a dermatologist regularly, the chances are nil that skin cancer will be his downfall. There's no sign of heart trouble, no sign of orthopedic, nervous system, or muscular problems. The guy's in great shape and can easily handle four years.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

I think after Cheney a lot of people are more interested now in who the next VP might be. For me, I've always found it intriguing since Mondale chose Ferraro.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Schneed10;469387]As for McCain, check his health records. He's in tremendous shape, despite the previous bouts with melanoma. While melanoma can be deadly, and you'll hear about that in the media, it is easily treatable and near harmless if detected in time. Given that he sees a dermatologist regularly, the chances are nil that skin cancer will be his downfall. There's no sign of heart trouble, no sign of orthopedic, nervous system, or muscular problems. The guy's in great shape and can easily handle four years.[/quote]

Strangely, this feels like I'm making the case for trading for Jason Taylor.

Yeah he's old, but check his health records, he's fine! LOL

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=SmootSmack;469389]I think after Cheney a lot of people are more interested now in who the next VP might be. For me, I've always found it intriguing since Mondale chose Ferraro.[/quote]

Does it prominently factor in deciding your vote?

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

If Obama is inexperienced, Palin is woefully inexperienced. How is McCain going to play the experience and national security card? Seriously, at 72 he has one foot in the grave and his VP was nothing more than a mayor of a small town one and half years ago. Palin is also batshit crazy...no abortion in case of rape and incest! She'll get the Hillary vote alright.



I'm looking forward to the VP debate.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

I don't think the pick was brilliant at all. Interesting, yes. Brilliant,that remains to be seen. One thing is for sure, we still haven't seen how this woman responds to the national spot light. The other three candidates have been vetted and then some for the past nineteen months. She'll get her's condensed over the next two. I have no doubt that she's smart and a solid politician, but she'll have to flesh that out for all to see.

Also, I feel there's far more downside than upside to this pick. For one, if McCain somehow thinks this will sow up the disaffected Hillary supporters, I think that's a serious miscalculation on his part and could have a serious backlash. In other words, this pick somehow suggests that these women were in it because of gender and not passionate about issues like a woman's right to choose. Speaking of which, she's a staunch conservative on most major issues that matter to women of Hillary's ilk and that of the Dem. party.

So on paper this pick looks interesting, but let's see how she performs in the ring of battle and on the stump day in and day out.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Schneed10;469392]Does it prominently factor in deciding your vote?[/quote]

Prominently? No. A little? Sure

I wasn't, for example, thrilled with the idea of Romney. Though I wouldn't have had as big a problem with him as President ironically. Something about him tells me he can't be a #2 guy

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=saden1;469393]If Obama is inexperienced, Palin is woefully inexperienced. How is McCain going to play the experience and national security card? Seriously, at 72 he has one foot in the grave and his VP was nothing more than a mayor of a small town one and half years ago. Palin is also batshit crazy...no abortion in case of rape and incest! She'll get the Hillary vote alright.



I'm looking forward to the VP debate.[/quote]

You're right, if people think that because she was/is a governor that somehow translates to executive experience, they are mistaken. She's a first term governor and was previously the mayor of a city the size of Mayberry. McCain has effectively, if not taken the experience argument off the table, at least undermined it.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Schneed10;469392]Does it prominently factor in deciding your vote?[/quote]

I will take this as a question to all.

No and yes. I won't for someone because of the VEEP but it is an interesting development always and in some cases it does offer insight into the main candidates. I think in this case McCain's choice is more important ultimately than Obama's. Looking at both candidates it strikes me that while Biden doesn't offer much to Obama other than "he is safe" Palin offers McCain's is a homerun swing. It is either going to go foul or be a grandslam.

She seems like a doer. Somone who actually achieves things. It is hard for long time Senators to come across like that. Or Senators in general I guess. Put it this way. Knowing very little about her admittedly; if i had to chose, from the four main people right, now someone to run my city or be a principal at my child's school, I'd choose her over all the others. Not nearly comparable responsibilties I know but it reflects how apathetic I am towards the three Senators running for the biggest jobs in our country. I guess I don't like Senators all that much. They just seem like do nothings to me.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=saden1;469393]If Obama is inexperienced, Palin is woefully inexperienced. How is McCain going to play the experience and national security card? Seriously, at 72 he has one foot in the grave and his VP was nothing more than a mayor of a small town one and half years ago. Palin is also batshit crazy...no abortion in case of rape and incest! She'll get the Hillary vote alright.



I'm looking forward to the VP debate.[/quote]

Woefully? She is the only one who has actual experience running a government.


"batshit crazy" there you go sounding completely sane a reasonable again. I know you disagree but I think you could state your arguments more eloquently sometimes and probably be much more persuasive man.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=12thMan;469396]I don't think the pick was brilliant at all. Interesting, yes. Brilliant,that remains to be seen. One thing is for sure, we still haven't seen how this woman responds to the national spot light. The other three candidates have been vetted and then some for the past nineteen months. She'll get her's condensed over the next two. I have no doubt that she's smart and a solid politician, but she'll have to flesh that out for all to see.

Also, I feel there's far more downside than upside to this pick. For one, if McCain somehow thinks this will sow up the disaffected Hillary supporters, I think that's a serious miscalculation on his part and could have a serious backlash. In other words, this pick somehow suggests that these women were in it because of gender and not passionate about issues like a woman's right to choose. Speaking of which, she's a staunch conservative on most major issues that matter to women of Hillary's ilk and that of the Dem. party.

So on paper this pick looks interesting, but let's see how she performs in the ring of battle and on the stump day in and day out.[/quote]

The Palin move wasn't meant to go after Hillary supporters as much as it was to energize the conservative base. Conservatives have been very concerned about McCain's committment to conservative social values, and they vowed to give him a hard time if he selected Joe Lieberman as his running mate.

When it comes to Hillary supporters, 75% of them said they supported Obama before he picked Biden. When he picked Biden and passed over Hillary, only 66% of Hillary supporters said they would support Obama.

The act of passing over Hillary for VP appeared to alienate some of her supporters, and McCain sensed that he could appeal to them. But he's not doing that through Palin, Palin is there to pander to the conservatives. He's going to appeal to Hillary's supporters through his own centrist tendencies.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=saden1;469393][B]If Obama is inexperienced, Palin is woefully inexperienced.[/B] How is McCain going to play the experience and national security card? Seriously, at 72 he has one foot in the grave and his VP was nothing more than a mayor of a small town one and half years ago.[/quote]

Really?

Obama is 47 and has been in the U.S. Senate for about three years. Palin is 44 and has been governor of Alaska for about three years.

Obama spent a decade or so in the Illinois state senate. Palin spent a decade or so on the city council and as a mayor.

Sure, I'll grant the edge in experience to Obama vs Palin, but trying to contrast them as night and day or super-experienced vs. childlike is a gross overstatement.

[quote=saden1;469393]Palin is also batshit crazy...no abortion in case of rape and incest! She'll get the Hillary vote alright.[/quote]

Nothing furthers productive political discourse like declaring a party "batshit crazy."

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=Schneed10;469410]The Palin move wasn't meant to go after Hillary supporters as much as it was to energize the conservative base. Conservatives have been very concerned about McCain's committment to conservative social values, and they vowed to give him a hard time if he selected Joe Lieberman as his running mate.

When it comes to Hillary supporters, 75% of them said they supported Obama before he picked Biden. When he picked Biden and passed over Hillary, only 66% of Hillary supporters said they would support Obama.

The act of passing over Hillary for VP appeared to alienate some of her supporters, and McCain sensed that he could appeal to them. But he's not doing that through Palin, Palin is there to pander to the conservatives. He's going to appeal to Hillary's supporters through his own centrist tendencies.[/quote]

I disagree, I think in large part McCain took keen note of the trouble Barack was having with some Hill supporters and saw this as an opening and a potential game changer. Yes, he may rally the conservative base but at what cost? What do Indie voters think about this pick? Are they as conservative on many of the social issues that Palin has and does stand for? In the end, this election is coming down to that slice of the electorate. Obama is trying to rally his base and so is McCain. If both are successful, then it comes down to the independent voter. Another thing, McCain needs that vote more than Obama. This woman adds maybe two things to McCain's ticket. She's an energy buff, coming from the state of Alaska, and she's a woman. And to the extent he can capitilize on the latter will determine how good a pick this was. Now whether or not this was truly McCain's motive, no one knows. But I can tell you first hand, many of my Hillary friends see this as an insult.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=FRPLG;469409]Woefully? She is the only one who has actual experience running a government.


"batshit crazy" there you go sounding completely sane a reasonable again. I know you disagree but I think you could state your arguments more eloquently sometimes and probably be much more persuasive man.[/quote]

Come now, you're saying she's more qualified/experienced than McCain or Obama to be president/vp?

What does it mean to be anti-abortion in the case of rape or incest? It's the most cruel thing I can imagine you can do to a woman after suffering a traumatic event. Oh "I know you have been raped/molest but you got to carry that child to term because [insert crazy religious reason]."

I was correct in my assessment but gentleman as I am I'll just say she is highly disagreeable.

Re: Update: McCain Selects Gov. Sarah Palin as Running Mate
 

[quote=mheisig;469415]Really?

Obama is 47 and has been in the U.S. Senate for about three years. Palin is 44 and has been governor of Alaska for about three years.

Obama spent a decade or so in the Illinois state senate. Palin spent a decade or so on the city council and as a mayor.

Sure, I'll grant the edge in experience to Obama vs Palin, but trying to contrast them as night and day or super-experienced vs. childlike is a gross overstatement.



Nothing furthers productive political discourse like declaring a party "batshit crazy."[/quote]

Palin took office in December 2006. Not even two years to date.