Re: Palin to resign
 

I just love how every international and domestic crisis is a reflection of President Obama's perceived strength or weakness and requires immediate U.S. intervention. Take for instance the North Korean vessel recently suspected of carrying small arms and other illicit weapons. That same ship, Kang Nam, has now returned to North Korea without docking or unloading it's materials in a foreign port. Yet that developement has flown under the radar and those same critics, who blasted the president for not being "tougher", are nowhere to be heard from now that it appears that the U.N. Resolution had more bite than some had originally thought.

My point is this, if we're going to critique the president [I]or [/I]Sarah Palin for that matter, afterall this is a Palin to resign thread, let's be fair and balanced, as one of my favorite networks likes to say. Where the president is wrong, he should be held accountable and taken to task. And where he's shown sound judgement early on, there's no crime in acknowledging that.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567088]You're back to ideology and we done beat that horse to death. One would hope you realize however that you're evaluating Reagan not at a specific time frame (i.e. 1981) but for the entire duration of his presidency (see usage of 80s in your numbers) and that you would offer the same courtesy to this new administration. It is not gentlemanly to label him a failure this early.[/quote]You are absolutely correct about labeling the Obama Admin. We will not know if it's a success or failure until it's complete and we have a chance to review. However, the policies he's currently pursuing have historically been negative on an economy. I don't have time right now to post multiple links supporting this.

[quote]It would be interesting to compare job creation over the entire period of Clinton's presidency to that of Reagan.[/quote]This isn't a Reagan vs. Clinton issue. You were challenging Reagan's deficit spending and essentially his economic policies. IMO it isn't a point for debate that Reagan's policies resulted in helping the economy along to a great period of prosperity after the failed Carter Admin.

[quote]It's kinda sad though you don't give him any flack for signing the [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algiers_Accords"]Algiers Accords[/URL] and "capitulating" and "weakening the U.S."[/quote]Reagan had a great deal of time to evaluate and put his stamp on this agreement??? His inauguration was on Jan. 20, 1981. This agreement was primarily brokered by Warren Christopher, Deputy Sec of State under Carter.

[quote]Your boy RR helped create Osama Bin Laden but I don't see you mention this information anywhere when you blame Clinton.[/quote]funding Bin Laden and other rebel groups fighting the Soviets was part of the strategy that defeated the Soviet Union. (My enemy's enemy is my friend). Once any of these groups turned to terrorism against the U.S. they become our enemy and must be eliminated, Clinton didn't do that.

[quote]You're still on that cold war shit, people done moved on brother.[/quote]Putin hasn't.

[quote]That war has been won long ago and you don't need to be spending 50% of your budget on your military (see F-22 Wasteful).[/quote]I've worked in DoD contracting for several years and agree our defense budget can be reduced. However, slashing advanced weapons systems development is a mistake, it is our technology that make us the strongest military the world has ever seen and I go to sleep at night with no fear from invasion or attack by a foreign nation because we have by far the biggest stick.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hopNAI8Pefg"]YouTube - Famous Speeches: A Few Good Men[/ame]

1:14 - 1:25 LOL

[quote]I'm no Zelaya fan but the entire world can't be wrong.[/quote]The OAS can be, it's currently a puppet organization controlled by Hugo Chavez.

[quote]My father always told me to be honest in my workmanship because not doing so tends yields doggy results.[/quote]Your father is a wise man.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=12thMan;567151]I just love how every international and domestic crisis is a reflection of President Obama's perceived strength or weakness and requires immediate U.S. intervention. Take for instance the North Korean vessel recently suspected of carrying small arms and other illicit weapons. That same ship, Kang Nam, has now returned to North Korea without docking or unloading it's materials in a foreign port. Yet that developement has flown under the radar and those same critics, who blasted the president for not being "tougher", are nowhere to be heard from now that it appears that the U.N. Resolution had more bite than some had originally thought.

My point is this, if we're going to critique the president [I]or [/I]Sarah Palin for that matter, afterall this is a Palin to resign thread, let's be fair and balanced, as one of my favorite networks likes to say. Where the president is wrong, he should be held accountable and taken to task. And where he's shown sound judgement early on, there's no crime in acknowledging that.[/quote]The thread has veered off a bit, sorry about that. But to your point, while I disagree with VP Biden on most things he was correct in his assessment prior to the election that there would be a foreign policy crisis early on that would be a challenge to Obama. The N. Korean situation is most certainly either a test to Obama or a display for potential arms buyers.

I hadn't researched the UN Resolution on N. Korean arms shipments thoroughly. The resolution states that the ship must be docked before it can be boarded and inspected, stopping the ship on the high seas is not in the resolution. So the Obama Admin did the correct thing in shadowing the ship and not stopping the ship while at sea. However, I stand by my position on the missle tests.

Another point I forgot to credit the Obama Admin on was the handling of the Somali pirate situation. Well done.

To be fair and balanced, the Bush Admin got crapped on by N. Korea also. And while N. Korea is near Russia, it's probably not within Palin's foreign policy grasp because it's not right across the Bering Strait and can't be seen from her back porch.

Re: Palin to resign
 

I'll take this a little further off course.

Biden was in my area yesterday speaking. I got caught up in his motorcade taking him back to the airport. I was heading north, they had the entire southbound side of the highway closed off, choppers in the air, cops everywhere, and every overpass closed off. I thought there was some sort of mega accident going on until I saw the motorcade racing down the highway. I waved but I guess he didn't see me. :)

Pretty cool, not something you see around here every day.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567153]You are absolutely correct about labeling the Obama Admin. We will not know if it's a success or failure until it's complete and we have a chance to review. However, the policies he's currently pursuing have historically been negative on an economy. I don't have time right now to post multiple links supporting this.
This isn't a Reagan vs. Clinton issue. You were challenging Reagan's deficit spending and essentially his economic policies. IMO it isn't a point for debate that Reagan's policies resulted in helping the economy along to a great period of prosperity after the failed Carter Admin.

Reagan had a great deal of time to evaluate and put his stamp on this agreement??? His inauguration was on Jan. 20, 1981. This agreement was primarily brokered by Warren Christopher, Deputy Sec of State under Carter.

funding Bin Laden and other rebel groups fighting the Soviets was part of the strategy that defeated the Soviet Union. (My enemy's enemy is my friend). Once any of these groups turned to terrorism against the U.S. they become our enemy and must be eliminated, Clinton didn't do that.

Putin hasn't.

I've worked in DoD contracting for several years and agree our defense budget can be reduced. However, slashing advanced weapons systems development is a mistake, it is our technology that make us the strongest military the world has ever seen and I go to sleep at night with no fear from invasion or attack by a foreign nation because we have by far the biggest stick.

[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hopNAI8Pefg"]YouTube - Famous Speeches: A Few Good Men[/URL]

1:14 - 1:25 LOL

The OAS can be, it's currently a puppet organization controlled by Hugo Chavez.

Your father is a wise man.[/quote]

[LIST=1][*] And you're post made several comparison to other administration and on top of that you knocked Obama's deficit spending in another post. I just want some fair and balance (not the Fox kind of course) .[*] If RR didn't have time to evaluate and put his stamp of approval on Algiers Accords why the hell does he get credit form you for freeing the hostages? Gotchya!!![*]I see that you don't want to give your boy RR any Osama credit but deep down we all know he done f'ed up too. You can't cover shit with chocolate and call it chocolate fondue.[*] What has Putin done to demonstrate his cold war stripes?[*]Sleep tight my friend...1 trillion dollars in military spending does warm the cockles of a man's heart. I wonder how the Swedes sleep.[*][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organization_of_American_States"]OAS[/URL] is the new ACORN? Come on, Chavez might be the most vocal member the right wing knows about but the member with the biggest pull is us. We don't fund it and host host it for altruistic reasons.[/LIST]

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567170]The thread has veered off a bit, sorry about that. But to your point, while I disagree with VP Biden on most things he was correct in his assessment prior to the election that there would be a foreign policy crisis early on that would be a challenge to Obama. The N. Korean situation is most certainly either a test to Obama or a display for potential arms buyers.

I hadn't researched the UN Resolution on N. Korean arms shipments thoroughly. The resolution states that the ship must be docked before it can be boarded and inspected, stopping the ship on the high seas is not in the resolution. So the Obama Admin did the correct thing in shadowing the ship and not stopping the ship while at sea. However, I stand by my position on the missle tests.

Another point I forgot to credit the Obama Admin on was the handling of the Somali pirate situation. Well done.

To be fair and balanced, the Bush Admin got crapped on by N. Korea also. And while N. Korea is near Russia, it's probably not within Palin's foreign policy grasp because it's not right across the Bering Strait and can't be seen from her back porch.[/quote]

I can live with that assessment.

As far as the resolution goes, Japan is trying to authorize its coastguard to inspect North Korean ships in line with a UN resolution. Basically, they could inspect ships both on the high seas and in Japanese waters. However, inspectors would first be required to get approval from the captain of any ship targeted and from its country of origin.

As far as the missle launches go, what else can we do. Put Kim Jong in timeout? Unless we actually shoot down one of their missles, which is highly unlikely, I don't see what other viable options are on the table.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567172]If RR didn't have time to evaluate and put his stamp of approval on Algiers Accords why the hell does he get credit form you for freeing the hostages? Gotchya!!![/quote]

Wrong - The Iranians knew Reagan would bring the full military might of the U.S. to bear to secure the release of the hostages, that's why they completed the deal with the Carter Admin.

from wiki: However, special ops personnel involved in the preparations for the second rescue attempt believed that incoming President Ronald Reagan was involved in the planning and timing of the second rescue attempt, and that these intentions were either implied or made known to the de facto Iranian government, leading to the hostages' release just minutes after Reagan's inauguration, and it is widely believed that Reagan capitalized on the "trigger happy" reputation he had been lambasted with during the 1980 campaign and used it to lead the Iranian leadership to believe that if they didn't release the hostages immediately upon his inauguration, Reagan's first act as President would be to bomb Iran's oil facilities, the main source of their nation's revenue, out of existence. [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_hostage_crisis#cite_note-71"][COLOR=#0000ff][72][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_hostage_crisis#cite_note-72"][COLOR=#0000ff][73][/COLOR][/URL]

[quote]- I see that you don't want to give your boy RR any Osama credit but deep down we all know he done f'ed up too.[/quote]
Wrong again - I did state that Reagan provided funding for Bin Laden and other rebels/terrorist organizations and the reasons for that funding. We just disagree on whether it was a mistake or not.

[quote]- What has Putin done to demonstrate his cold war stripes?[/quote]
You may want to read this, particularly the Presidency - Second Term section. You don't change a leopard's spots.

[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Putin"]Vladimir Putin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/URL]

[quote]- Sleep tight my friend...1 trillion dollars in military spending does warm the cockles of a man's heart. I wonder how the Swedes sleep.[/quote]

The actual DOD Budget is below: $653B, much of it for paying our soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines and Operations / Maintenance. I know where you're coming up with the additional 300+B, but securing our nuclear arsenal and providing medical care to our veterans sure isn't on the same lines as "more bombs" and F-22s (which I agree is a waste with the F-35 on the horizon).

[URL]http://www.gpoaccess.gov/usbudget/fy09/pdf/budget/defense.pdf[/URL]

And I'm sure the Swedes sleeep pretty damn good knowing we are spending $ 653B and will come to save their hind-quarters if the Soviets or some other world power decides to get stupid.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Mattyk72;567171]I'll take this a little further off course.

[B]Biden was in my area yesterday speaking[/B]. I got caught up in his motorcade taking him back to the airport. I was heading north, they had the entire southbound side of the highway closed off, choppers in the air, cops everywhere, and every overpass closed off. I thought there was some sort of mega accident going on until I saw the motorcade racing down the highway. I waved but I guess he didn't see me. :)

Pretty cool, not something you see around here every day.[/quote]

I grew up just outside of that area, and Shenandoah High (where Biden spoke) was in the high school athletic conference my high school was in. At least in the 1980's, Shenandoah was the beast of the conference. During my senior year, they beat us 40-0 in football. Of course, we only won 1 single game that year, so the score said as much about us as it did about them.

Re: Palin to resign
 

Damn, I thought I was brutal but Peggy Noonan [URL="http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124716984620819351.html"]done murked her[/URL].

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=BringBackJoeT;567188]I grew up just outside of that area, and Shenandoah High (where Biden spoke) was in the high school athletic conference my high school was in. At least in the 1980's, Shenandoah was the beast of the conference. During my senior year, they beat us 40-0 in football. Of course, we only won 1 single game that year, so the score said as much about us as it did about them.[/quote]

What HS did you go to?

Shen usually fields very good football teams. Their school history is pretty impressive

[B]288 Wins 71 Losses 4 Ties[/B]

24 League Championships

10 Super Bowl Championships

8 Undefeated Seasons

Ranked # 1 in New York State 3 Times

Ranked in the Top Ten of New York State 17 Times

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567226]Damn, I thought I was brutal but Peggy Noonan [URL="http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124716984620819351.html"]done murked her[/URL].[/quote]
A very good opinion article. We should all take note of these words:

"Here are a few examples of what we may face in the next 10 years: a profound and prolonged American crash, with the admission of bankruptcy and the spread of deep social unrest; one or more American cities getting hit with weapons of mass destruction from an unknown source; faint glimmers of actual secessionist movements as Americans for various reasons and in various areas decide the burdens and assumptions of the federal government are no longer attractive or legitimate.
The era we face, that is soon upon us, will require a great deal from our leaders. They had better be sturdy. They will have to be gifted. There will be many who cannot, and should not, make the cut. Now is the time to look for those who can. And so the Republican Party should get serious, as serious as the age, because that is what a grown-up, responsible party—a party that deserves to lead—would do."

Re: Palin to resign
 

Excellent posts slingin sammy!

Back on track, here seems to be more evidence as to why Palin resigned:
[url=http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090710/ap_on_re_us/us_palin_resignation]Levi Johnston: Palin resigned to cash in on fame - Yahoo! News[/url]

I'm still scratching my head as to how this kid is 19 (looks a lot older) and why in the world he has been offered a movie deal! he seems to be trying to cash in now, but I do think he's telling the truth about Palin.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567179]Wrong - The Iranians knew Reagan would bring the full military might of the U.S. to bear to secure the release of the hostages, that's why they completed the deal with the Carter Admin.

from wiki: However, special ops personnel involved in the preparations for the second rescue attempt believed that incoming President Ronald Reagan was involved in the planning and timing of the second rescue attempt, and that these intentions were either implied or made known to the de facto Iranian government, leading to the hostages' release just minutes after Reagan's inauguration, and it is widely believed that Reagan capitalized on the "trigger happy" reputation he had been lambasted with during the 1980 campaign and used it to lead the Iranian leadership to believe that if they didn't release the hostages immediately upon his inauguration, Reagan's first act as President would be to bomb Iran's oil facilities, the main source of their nation's revenue, out of existence. [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_hostage_crisis#cite_note-71"][COLOR=#0000ff][72][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_hostage_crisis#cite_note-72"][COLOR=#0000ff][73][/COLOR][/URL]


Wrong again - I did state that Reagan provided funding for Bin Laden and other rebels/terrorist organizations and the reasons for that funding. We just disagree on whether it was a mistake or not.


You may want to read this, particularly the Presidency - Second Term section. You don't change a leopard's spots.

[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Putin"]Vladimir Putin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/URL]



The actual DOD Budget is below: $653B, much of it for paying our soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines and Operations / Maintenance. I know where you're coming up with the additional 300+B, but securing our nuclear arsenal and providing medical care to our veterans sure isn't on the same lines as "more bombs" and F-22s (which I agree is a waste with the F-35 on the horizon).

[URL]http://www.gpoaccess.gov/usbudget/fy09/pdf/budget/defense.pdf[/URL]

And I'm sure the Swedes sleeep pretty damn good knowing we are spending $ 653B and will come to save their hind-quarters if the Soviets or some other world power decides to get stupid.[/quote]


[LIST=1][*]Carter gets all the blame and Reagan gets all the glory, dot it.[*]Oh, Putin was such a bad man, as if our own country lacked leadership crisis and controversy. As if we are somehow superior in our methods of governance during Mr. Bush's reign. Even worse you imply that Russia use to be free (thanks to RR) and now it is not. You have excused your account at Bank Morally Superior.[*]Sweden does sleep better, they did just fine during the Nazi descent on Europe and I'm not convinced we would or could stop a Russian invasion of Sweden. There is a reason why "peak softly" comes before "carry a big stick" and sadly Obama gets flack for speaking softly from you lot.[/LIST]

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567237]A very good opinion article. We should all take note of these words:

"[B]Here are a few examples of what we may face in the next 10 years: a profound and prolonged American crash, with the admission of bankruptcy and the spread of deep social unrest; one or more American cities getting hit with weapons of mass destruction from an unknown source; faint glimmers of actual secessionist movements as Americans for various reasons and in various areas decide the burdens and assumptions of the federal government are no longer attractive or legitimate.[/B]
The era we face, that is soon upon us, will require a great deal from our leaders. They had better be sturdy. They will have to be gifted. There will be many who cannot, and should not, make the cut. Now is the time to look for those who can. And so the Republican Party should get serious, as serious as the age, because that is what a grown-up, responsible party—a party that deserves to lead—would do."[/quote]

She paints a very good worst case scenario. Fortunately some of us were smart enough to elected Obama to help us navigate these troubling times. It's a shame you guys don't have a capable leader.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567251]She paints a very good worst case scenario. Fortunately some of us were smart enough to elected Obama to help us navigate these troubling times. It's a shame you guys don't have a capable leader.[/quote]

LOL...Obama has done nothing to make this country better at this point. You need to tread carefully cause there are a ton of opinions out there that Obama is failing miserably. I will take slinging sammy's advice and wait til his term is over.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567248][LIST=1][*]Carter gets all the blame and Reagan gets all the glory, dot it.[/LIST][/quote]What's not to like there. And you need to get on-board before the train leaves the station, President Obama is already aboard and I'm holding a seat for you.

[URL="http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2009/06/president-signs-ronald-reagan-centennial-commission-act-alongside-mrs-reagan.html"]President Signs Ronald Reagan Centennial Commission Act Alongside Mrs. Reagan - Political Punch[/URL]


[quote]- Oh, Putin was such a bad man, as if our own country lacked leadership crisis and controversy. As if we are somehow superior in our methods of governance during Mr. Bush's reign. Even worse you imply that Russia use to be free (thanks to RR) and now it is not. You have excused your account at Bank Morally Superior.
[/quote]As long as the U.S. remains the greatest agent for freedom and democracy for all peoples that the world has ever seen, I'll keep the account open, thank you.

[quote]Sweden does sleep better, they did just fine during the Nazi descent on Europe and I'm not convinced we would or could stop a Russian invasion of Sweden. There is a reason why "peak softly" comes before "carry a big stick" and sadly Obama gets flack for speaking softly from you lot.
[/quote]I'll bet that $ 653B we would have no problem decimating any Russian invasion of Sweden with minimal U.S. casualties, without going nuclear, as long as the politicans stayed out of the way and let the military do its job.

I've got no problem with Obama speaking softly as long as other nations believe he'll use the stick when necessary. But there is no need to not negotiate from a position of strength when you have the biggest stick, by far.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=jsarno;567255]LOL...Obama has done nothing to make this country better at this point. You need to tread carefully cause there are a ton of opinions out there that Obama is failing miserably. I will take slinging sammy's advice and wait til his term is over.[/quote]

What do I need to tread carefully on? I'm not a big opinions guy, I mean like assholes they're dime a dozen. You know what's funny? You say "Obama has done nothing to make this country better at this point" and then proceed to tell me to "wait 'til his term is over."

The comedy writes itself.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567251]She paints a very good worst case scenario. [B]Fortunately some of us were smart enough to elected Obama to help us navigate these troubling times.[/B] It's a shame you guys don't have a capable leader.[/quote]If only Reagan could channel himself into Obama I'd feel a great deal better about your statement. LOL

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567259]What do I need to tread carefully on? I'm not a big opinions guy, I mean like assholes they're dime a dozen. You know what's funny? You say "Obama has done nothing to make this country better at this point" and then proceed to tell me to "wait 'til his term is over."

The comedy writes itself.[/quote]

Figured you wouldn't get it, so I'll dull it down for you. While he has done nothing to this point, it doesn't mean he wont, so we should wait til the end of his term. But you are acting like Obama is the second coming of say Reagan. What has obama done to deserve such high praise? Your welcome for connecting the dots.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567258]What's not to like there. And you need to get on-board before the train leaves the station, President Obama is already aboard and I'm holding a seat for you.

[URL="http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2009/06/president-signs-ronald-reagan-centennial-commission-act-alongside-mrs-reagan.html"]President Signs Ronald Reagan Centennial Commission Act Alongside Mrs. Reagan - Political Punch[/URL]


As long as the U.S. remains the greatest agent for freedom and democracy for all peoples that the world has ever seen, I'll keep the account open, thank you.

I'll bet that $ 653B we would have no problem decimating any Russian invasion of Sweden with minimal U.S. casualties, without going nuclear, as long as the politicans stayed out of the way and let the military do its job.

I've got no problem with Obama speaking softly as long as other nations believe he'll use the stick when necessary. But there is no need to not negotiate from a position of strength when you have the biggest stick, by far.[/quote]

[LIST=1][*]I'm talking Carter as it relates to releasing the hostages. Even I know RR was a better president than Carter.[*]You can't keep your account open when you detain people indefinitely and torture them. You just don't have enough [URL="http://thinkprogress.org/2009/07/09/torture-hypocrisy/"]chips to keep it open[/URL].[*]Ah, but they have nukes, that's the point. We walked into Iraq and if they wanted to they could walk into Sweden.[*]If you have the biggest stick and in a position of strength you're of the opinion that you need not speak softly? What a shame...stick diplomacy is an oxymoron.[/LIST]

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567265]- You can't keep your account open when you detain people indefinitely and torture them. You just don't have enough [URL="http://thinkprogress.org/2009/07/09/torture-hypocrisy/"]chips to keep it open[/URL].[/quote]We've been down this road several times, but I am amazed that you are equating the waterboarding of three dangerous terrorists to the Mexican torture: The techniques included beatings, suffocation with plastic bags, electric shocks, the insertion of needles under suspects’ finger nails, water torture, and other abuses.

I guess the millions of lives we've saved and the demcracies we've helped foster go by the wayside.

[quote]Ah, but they have nukes, that's the point. We walked into Iraq and if they wanted to they could walk into Sweden.[/quote]That's why we continue to develop the missle defense shield and why the Russians are so against/afraid of it. And they would be walking into a massacre if they tried to walk into Sweden.

[quote]If you have the biggest stick and in a position of strength you're of the opinion that you need not speak softly? [/quote]Speaking softly IMO is not imposing our will by military might on other countries....unless absolutely necessary (see LeMay doctrine). Speaking softly is giving diplomacy a chance, but understanding that diplomacy doesn't work when dealing with dictators/thugs/inherently evil people.

Re: Palin to resign
 

You know, I just realized, we need to make Afghanistan the second Switzerland! Somehow, get them to avow neutrality (minus the Taliban). Establish world class banking and resorts, and then all our problems will be solved. Man life is easy!

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567237]A very good opinion article. We should all take note of these words:

"Here are a few examples of what we may face in the next 10 years: a profound and prolonged American crash, with the admission of bankruptcy and the spread of deep social unrest; one or more American cities getting hit with weapons of mass destruction from an unknown source; [B]faint glimmers of actual secessionist movements as Americans for various reasons [/B]and in various areas decide the burdens and assumptions of the federal government are no longer attractive or legitimate.
The era we face, that is soon upon us, will require a great deal from our leaders. They had better be sturdy. They will have to be gifted. There will be many who cannot, and should not, make the cut. Now is the time to look for those who can. And so the Republican Party should get serious, as serious as the age, because that is what a grown-up, responsible party—a party that deserves to lead—would do."[/quote]

I'm starting to wonder why that would be such a bad idea...

Re: Palin to resign
 

Speaking of those inept, bumbling fools, -- you know, the Republicans, -- here's [URL="http://www.forbes.com/2009/05/19/republicans-choose-liberty-opinions-columnists-gop-conservative.html"]another take[/URL] on where the GOP should go from here.

[quote][George W. Bush] remarkably enough, managed to combine every anti-individual liberty idea from the right with every pro-big government policy from the left. From the right, Bush acquired: a super-hawkish foreign policy; contempt for civil liberties; and religiously informed positions on gay marriage, abortion and end-of-life issues. And from the left he got: high-spending ways, including the massive drug entitlement for seniors; expansive ideas about the federal government's role in education policy; and the chutzpah, just before leaving, to engineer a massive government bailout of banks and auto companies.[/quote]

Re: Palin to resign
 

Funny how people think that Bush imposed on their liberties but have no problem with what OBama has done taking over the private market.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=firstdown;567428]Funny how people think that Bush imposed on their liberties but have no problem with what OBama has done taking over the private market.[/quote]

Well, you won't here that from me. Politicians on both sides of the ideological spectrum want more power and will infringe on our liberty in one form or another. Democrats want what's in your wallet, Republicans want to control your bedroom and your body.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=jsarno;567255]LOL...Obama has done nothing to make this country better at this point. You need to tread carefully cause there are a ton of opinions out there that Obama is failing miserably. [B]I will take slinging sammy's advice and wait til his term is over.[/B][/quote]

As someone who votes Dem, I agree. Let's give the man his four years. There isn't gonna be a drastic improvement over a year. I would give McCain the same time as well.

And all you Obama bashers, you really think McCain-Palin would be doing a dandy job right now? Come on, Bush Jr.'s terms and the economic downturn are huge potholes to get out of. Rather than trying to insult Obama, I think the Republicans should spend time trying to re-tailor their image and try to get back to restricted fiscal spending, not the hypocrisy that was Bush.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=hooskins;567451]...Rather than trying to insult Obama, I think the Republicans should spend time trying to re-tailor their image and try to get back to restricted fiscal spending, not the hypocrisy that was Bush.[/quote]

Fiscally speaking, I second that. I sure wish one of the parties would argue for (and back it up with actions) a more sane level of national debt.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=hooskins;567451]As someone who votes Dem, I agree. Let's give the man his four years. There isn't gonna be a drastic improvement over a year. I would give McCain the same time as well.

And all you Obama bashers, you really think McCain-Palin would be doing a dandy job right now? Come on, Bush Jr.'s terms and the economic downturn are huge potholes to get out of. Rather than trying to insult Obama, I think the [B]Republicans should spend time trying to re-tailor their image and try to get back to restricted fiscal spending, not the hypocrisy that was Bush.[/B][/quote]



I believe they've been trying to do that, the problem is that they don't know how on the image and fiscal front. They're good for shits and giggles and that's about it.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=hooskins;567451]As someone who votes Dem, I agree. Let's give the man his four years. There isn't gonna be a drastic improvement over a year. I would give McCain the same time as well.

And all you Obama bashers, you really think McCain-Palin would be doing a dandy job right now? Come on, Bush Jr.'s terms and the economic downturn are huge potholes to get out of. Rather than trying to insult Obama, [B]I think the Republicans should spend time trying to re-tailor their image and try to get back to restricted fiscal spending, not the hypocrisy that was Bush[/B].[/quote]

But who is going to do that? Whose going to lead them down that road? Boss Limbaugh? Michael Steele? Sarah Palin? Mark Sanford? John Ensign?......................Newt Gingrich? :laughing2

That should be all of their leaders and they all make me laugh! :rofl:

Until they get a leader they're nothing more then the party of 'NO', the party of filibustering, and the party of hypocrites.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Miller101;567623]But who is going to do that? Whose going to lead them down that road? Boss Limbaugh? Michael Steele? Sarah Palin? Mark Sanford? John Ensign?......................Newt Gingrich? :laughing2

That should be all of their leaders and they all make me laugh! :rofl:

Until they get a leader they're nothing more then the party of 'NO', the party of filibustering, and the party of hypocrites.[/quote]
If the economy is still struggling Mitt Romney with his extensive business experience will pose a threat to an Obama re-election.

As far as the name-calling, the exact same can be said of the Dems when they were the minority. And neither party has an exclusivity on the hypocrite label.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567639]If the economy is still struggling [B]Mitt Romney with his extensive business experience will pose a threat to an Obama re-election.[/B]

As far as the name-calling, the exact same can be said of the Dems when they were the minority. And neither party has an exclusivity on the hypocrite label.[/quote]


You can't seriously believe that. I hope to god he runs against Obama. Tell you what, if he wins the nomination and isn't beaten by the same margins as McCain was I'll send you $100 dollars. I just put it into my calendar. Good luck.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567640]You can't seriously believe that.[B] I hope to god he runs against Obama.[/B] Tell you what, if he wins the nomination and isn't beaten by the same margins as McCain was I'll send you $100 dollars. I just put it into my calendar. Good luck.[/quote]

If Obama keeps it up, he won't be hard to beat in 2012.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=GMScud;567643]If Obama keeps it up, he won't be hard to beat in 2012.[/quote]


LOL....funny...I'm not entirely convinced the GOP will be up to the task. You kinda have to have an attractive platform and ideas to get to people to vote for you. I know you guys loath Obama but don't let all the hate cloud your judgment, he's a f'ing jugernuat and jugernauts never lose the second time around. Like the Emperor said, "search your feelings, Lord GMScud. You will know it to be true. He could destroy [you]."

If I was a rich man I would send you a $100 too but I'm not. Good luck.

Re: Palin to resign
 

Obama's a juggernaut? In what way?

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;567639]If the economy is still struggling Mitt Romney with his extensive business experience will pose a threat to an Obama re-election.

As far as the name-calling, the exact same can be said of the Dems when they were the minority. And neither party has an exclusivity on the hypocrite label.[/quote]

I'm on the fence with Romney. He strikes me as potentially a strong VP, but at the same time I don't think his ego would allow that. But I absolutely would agree that he could pose a strong threat to Obama in 2012.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=GMScud;567643]If Obama keeps it up, he won't be hard to beat in 2012.[/quote]

:lol:

You Republicans crack me up! How the heck are you going to defeat him? With Taxes? With Healthcare? With family values? :rofl: Okay, forget I said that.....................With religion? :rofl:.............I didn't mean to say that. You know.............I don't even want to keep going. I'm laughing to hard right now and I'm at work.

Re: Palin to resign
 

The election is 3 yrs away.

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=Miller101;567672]:lol:

You Republicans crack me up! How the heck are you going to defeat him? With Taxes? With Healthcare? With family values? :rofl: Okay, forget I said that.....................With religion? :rofl:.............I didn't mean to say that. You know.............I don't even want to keep going. I'm laughing to hard right now and I'm at work.[/quote]

Someone actually employs you? Remarkable

You actually think he can't be defeated in 2012? History means nothing to you does it?

Re: Palin to resign
 

[quote=saden1;567640]You can't seriously believe that. I hope to god he runs against Obama. Tell you what, if he wins the nomination and isn't beaten by the same margins as McCain was I'll send you $100 dollars. I just put it into my calendar. Good luck.[/quote]Sweet. Free money, no risk, so this is what it's like to be a Democrat. :woot: