Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;603652]Well you are going to have to blow up the team if you want all the pieces on offense to fit right. Like other guys have said perviously, you have a team that until draft '08 was centered around Gibbs' offense. The switch to the WCO hasn't been all that great thus far, in fact we regressed tremendously after the '08 Lions game. Sherm Lewis might be able to help some, but he can't help all that much with a banged up line and a WR corp that is weak other than Santana. I like Sherm and think he can only do good for us, but this was an act of depseration or Dan is already getting the wheels greased up for Sherm or Holmgren to take over next season. Maybe we can get both of them together again!!!!! Either way you are going to have to do some dismantling of the offensive personnel. Holmgren/Lewis will have to get the right personnel in there to successfully run the WCO or you if you land a yet to be named guy, he might not run a WCO and we are back to where we were when Spurrier quit. A major rebuilding effort might be unavoidable, as we have both a systemic and personnel problem.[/quote]

Your right. But they are never going into rebuild mode. That's all I am saying. If we bring in a GM maybe. But what are the odds of that happening?

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;603637]Why can't this "smell" of trying to give Zorn every chance to succeed. If you want to prep for another coach, then you probably bring (my first thought) Holmgren in. And he starts making plans. You want to give Zorn a shot, you bring in a well respected, but out of the business name.
Maybe it's no more than an experienced advisor to guide Zorn in the transition to a SB caliber HC.[/quote]

That could be the case. Good point.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;603653]Lewis is in there to grease the wheels for Holmgren I bet. He is going to get a first hand look at what the problem is with execution, etc and if Mike does indeed et the call at the end of the season, Sherm will have a plan in place or at least a proper diagnosis of how to fix the offense. I can't see how Sherm can really help us all that much right now since a lot of the problem is lack of execution with our WR corp and a banged up line. Play calling is a big part of the problem, but ARE, and the newbies have been non existent the past few games.[/quote]

Well he coached Hall of Famers like Rice Moss and others. So I think he might just have a little knowledge or advice for our WRs. And as far as play calling I am sure he can consult Zorn on what he is doing wrong. This man has won everywhere he has been and helped produce Hall of Famers. I am sure as an assistant coach he can give advice on proper execution of the WCO.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=skins89moss;603654]So maybe J.Campbell is not the problem with the offense its Zorn.[/quote]

Well that would make it much clearer if JC had the same issues or improved aspects of his game.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=skins89moss;603655]I like the move to but do we have a Montana, Rice and Taylor on the offense?[/quote]

Of course we don't. But he knows how the system should be run and he coached those guys. So I would hope he would do a better job at putting these young guys in a successful position. They might not become hall of famers but they still can be advised on proper technique and what it takes to get to that level and be productive at least. Ultimately it's on our players if they want to learn from him and then apply it on the field.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=44Deezel;603643]Because we don't live in the Matrix.[/quote]

Maybe Lewis is the Morpheus to Zorn's Neo..lol

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=PennSkinsFan;603498]Redskins hire Sherman Lewis as OC

[url=http://twitter.com/DCPSR]DC Pro Sports Report (DCPSR) on Twitter[/url][url=http://twitter.com/DCPSR]DC Pro Sports Report (DCPSR) on Twitter[/url][/quote]

Sherman Smith is probably more qualified then Zorn to be the HC/OC.

But, i digress.

I think Sherman Lewis could help, i hope that the 1st 15 plays and the RZ goal-yo-goal play primary are his main areas of fous.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Can he run block or protect JC?

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

the rumors focusing on Jim Zorn's job security (ESPN's Adam Schefter said Sunday it was not a matter of if Zorn would be fired, but when)? At the very least, would it really hurt to give Zorn the dreaded vote of confidence with a statement that says "this man is my coach for the rest of the season, and hopefully longer," even if you probably don't mean it.

[B]Charley Casserly, the Redskins' former general manager, said during an appearance Tuesday on Comcast SportsNet's "Washington Post Live," that the move did not bode well for Zorn's future, calling the addition of Lewis a "kiss of death." [/B]

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

I just don't see this as the end of Zorn. Despite appearances, we have had no comment from Snyder one way or the other. Casserly, Shefter, etc. are just guessing AND guessing based on their perception of Snyder as a impatient fantasy type owner. To me, to see this as anything more than the owner trying to help out the coach is buying into the talking heads whom we so regularly bash.

I am adopting a wait and see attitude and not assuming the move means anything other than an attempt by the FO to provide Zorn more resources to do his job well.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Zorn hopefully will improve with an offensive consultant, but what does that mean that Sherman Smith has been doing? I agree Zorn has too much on his plate, but he's managing a struggling 2-2 record still... Zorn is not a bad guy or necessarily bad coach. Players like him, people like him. He is inexperienced as a play caller, OC, HC. Even if Holmgren comes to DC (and I'd still rather have Shanahan) I would think Jim Zorn would still have a job. We need a GM. Things that bother me about Holmgren are facts such as Hasselbeck being his QB. To blame Zorn is too easy at this point. Danny needs to let someone with football knowledge run this team as a GM. No more Cerrato and no more Snyder rich kid in a candy store crap. Deion and Bruce don't get ya Superbowls. It's people like Art Monk, Darrell Green, Clint Didier, Doug Williams, John Riggins, Geris White, Gary Clark, Virgil Seay, etc, etc, etc.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

I just read the text from Cerrato words via press conference yesterday. Either he's socially inept or I hate him.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Business people often bring in consultants. Snyder is a businessman and Vinny has been involved in bringing in consultants before, they did it in SF while Vinny was there. Lewis is an expert on the WCO and nobody else on Zorns staff is as far as I know. Gibbs didn't lose his job when they brought Saunders in. I don't think there is any subtraction in this addition, at least not for Zorn, unless we fail to progress on offense.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=Luxorreb;603704]Zorn hopefully will improve with an offensive consultant, but what does that mean that Sherman Smith has been doing? I agree Zorn has too much on his plate, but he's managing a struggling 2-2 record still... Zorn is not a bad guy or necessarily bad coach. Players like him, people like him. He is inexperienced as a play caller, OC, HC. Even if Holmgren comes to DC (and I'd still rather have Shanahan) I would think Jim Zorn would still have a job. We need a GM. Things that bother me about Holmgren are facts such as Hasselbeck being his QB. To blame Zorn is too easy at this point. Danny needs to let someone with football knowledge run this team as a GM. No more Cerrato and no more Snyder rich kid in a candy store crap. Deion and Bruce don't get ya Superbowls. It's people like Art Monk, Darrell Green, Clint Didier, Doug Williams, John Riggins, Geris White, Gary Clark, Virgil Seay, etc, etc, etc."


Good post, and as you say the Dan needs to grow up on the quick trigger....
Maybe this is an indication of [B]that[/B] coming to fruition? I cannot imagine that the entire staff will remain intact or that it should as the team obviously is.....challenged in all area's. Perhaps changing the structure to some degree, and adding some support will serve better than blowing it up?
HTTR

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

I'm glad to see that the front office is taking steps to help improve the offense by bringing in a coach like Sherman Lewis with his west coast back ground. This move means we need help to get the offense more production which could help both Zorn and our young WR corp. I respect Zorn more for being open to this idea to bring in a coach with so much experience that it can only improve our team. Lets hope Lewis can design some plays to get our WR open.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

I think its a good move. Zorn needs help with playcalling. So he can stop calling that same running play ever 1st down. I think if Sherman Lewis helps the O, Zorn will be fired.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=skins89moss;603713]I'm glad to see that the front office is taking steps to help improve the offense by bringing in a coach like Sherman Lewis with his west coast back ground. This move means we need help to get the offense more production which could help both Zorn and our young WR corp. I respect Zorn more for being open to this idea to bring in a coach with so much experience that it can only improve our team. Lets hope Lewis can design some plays to get our WR open.[/quote]

The core of the problem is that the Skins just dont have the talent. This addition wont hurt but I dont look for much difference since its still the same players that have proven over and over that they just dont have it.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Lets be honest, Cerrato is doing everything possible save his job. If this team doesnt turn around or doesnt establish itself for the upcoming years. He will be joining Jim Zorn in the unemployment line.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Bottom line is toooooooo late. What are the chances we are running the same offense next year with the same head coach and quarterback? I would think relatively low...Now it would be a great story if he comes in and waves a magical wand and everything is good and we make the playoffs, but midseason? Too little, too late. Maybe he can line up at RT or replace Reinhart at guard...but I think a little too late to address O-Line issues as well.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=skins89moss;603658]Hold your horses Skinsfan69. Who hired Zorn? All the football critics thought that was a very disfunctional move to hire Zorn to be the QB coach and then make him the HC. If Zorn is fired during or after the season this will only further prove to all the football critics that Synder stills has no clue how :)to run a NFL Team. I think we need to be fair and see how Zorn finishes out the season to judge him. I do like this move to bring in Sherm Lewis who has a ton of WC offense experience.[/quote]

We're going on 12 games of almost unwatchable offense. Someone is going to take the fall.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Now can we bring in a consultant to look over the front office??? lol.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=skinsfan69;603759]Now can we bring in a consultant to look over the front office??? lol.[/quote]

That would make way too much sense.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=REDSKINS1980;603752]Lets be honest, Cerrato is doing everything possible save his job. If this team doesnt turn around or doesnt establish itself for the upcoming years. He will be joining Jim Zorn in the unemployment line.[/quote]

Vinny's not going anywhere no matter what happens.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=Luxorreb;603704]Zorn hopefully will improve with an offensive consultant, but what does that mean that Sherman Smith has been doing? I agree Zorn has too much on his plate, but he's managing a struggling 2-2 record still... Zorn is not a bad guy or necessarily bad coach. Players like him, people like him. He is inexperienced as a play caller, OC, HC. Even if Holmgren comes to DC (and I'd still rather have Shanahan) I would think Jim Zorn would still have a job. We need a GM. [B]Things that bother me about Holmgren are facts such as Hasselbeck being his QB. To blame Zorn is too easy at this point. Danny needs to let someone with football knowledge run this team as a GM. No more Cerrato and no more Snyder rich kid in a candy store crap. Deion and Bruce don't get ya Superbowls. It's people like Art Monk, Darrell Green, Clint Didier, Doug Williams, John Riggins, Geris White, Gary Clark, Virgil Seay, etc, etc, etc.[/B][/quote]

How does having Hasselback as his QB bother you? Deion, a two-time SB winner, and Bruce Smith who has been to four himself was 9 years ago. We can't let that go?

As for guys like Art Monk, Darrell Green, Clint Didier etc. getting us Superbowls. Before they won a Superbowl they were Santana Moss, Carlos Rogers, Chris Cooley. I guess my point is I don't understand what your point is to ramble off those names from the past.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=irish;603763]Vinny's not going anywhere no matter what happens.[/quote]

I really think the Lions lost was a bottom for this team and the way fans and media have jumped all over this coaching staff and the players was a real wake up call to Snyder. I think he has really heard the displeasure with fans booing at the stadium, Sonny going after Zorn, the National media criticizing Snyder, and the play, lets face it, it has been poor, especially on the offense. I really believe Vinny could be gone if we dont make the playoffs...which I wanted him gone for years, so Im pretty excited this could finally happen.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=SmootSmack;603774]How does having Hasselback as his QB bother you? Deion, a two-time SB winner, and Bruce Smith who has been to four himself was 9 years ago. We can't let that go?

As for guys like Art Monk, Darrell Green, Clint Didier etc. getting us Superbowls. Before they won a Superbowl they were Santana Moss, Carlos Rogers, Chris Cooley. I guess my point is I don't understand what your point is to ramble off those names from the past.[/quote]
Its called cherry picking to try and make a point we could also make a list of palyers we had back then that where a bust but I guess that would not fit nice into whatever point he was trying to make. The nice thing about a bust back then there was no cap so you could just get rid of a player without worring about cap space.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=irish;603763]Vinny's not going anywhere no matter what happens.[/quote]

When Zorn was hired, Vinny told reporters that he had 2 years to succeed or he would be fired.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=70Chip;603620][B]I really wish we could go 5 minutes without Snyderatto trying to "fix" things. [/B]The Redskins are composed completely now of all their various "fixes". How many times have they gone fishing for a RB after the season is underway? It' absurd. I know it's hard to accept when you have control issues, but there's nothing you can do about it now. So stifle yourselves.

Also remember, The Two Bobs came to the conclusion that MANAGEMENT was the real problem. I just wish the Redskins had TPS reports to tie down Vinny so he couldn't engage in these monkeyshines.[/quote]

Ok, now I'm confused? People complain that the offense is horrible and needs to be fixed. Snyder gives Zorn what...19 games to fix the issues and we are not getting any better. He calls in a consultant to look at maybe the playcalls, when there being called, maybe the look at the WR and see if he can't get anything out of Kelly/Thomas/and maybe Mitchell.

and now we are going to complain that Snyder is meddling again? Help me out here, I would assume the Zorn experement is just about over and Snyder is trying one last thing to spark this so called " Scoring Machine" that Zorn was going to bring to the table. This guys has been in San Fran at the beginning of the WCO. He practically bailed out Holmgren in GB when he was brought in. He's helped out Shanahan and I thought I heard on the radio he helped out Dennis Green. This guy is the Zampese of the WCO and now we want to get upset. OK. :)

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Yeah whatever! This reminds me of when they brought in Al Saunders. When they start winning games with authority I'll drink the Kool Aid. Until then I'm going unleaded.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=SBXVII;603791]Ok, now I'm confused? People complain that the offense is horrible and needs to be fixed. Snyder gives Zorn what...19 games to fix the issues and we are not getting any better. He calls in a consultant to look at maybe the playcalls, when there being called, maybe the look at the WR and see if he can't get anything out of Kelly/Thomas/and maybe Mitchell.

and now we are going to complain that Snyder is meddling again? Help me out here, I would assume the Zorn experement is just about over and Snyder is trying one last thing to spark this so called " Scoring Machine" that Zorn was going to bring to the table. This guys has been in San Fran at the beginning of the WCO. He practically bailed out Holmgren in GB when he was brought in. He's helped out Shanahan and I thought I heard on the radio he helped out Dennis Green. This guy is the Zampese of the WCO and now we want to get upset. OK. :)[/quote]

I think think in the big picture, this is a decent move. If nothing else, it officially puts Zorn on notice that he needs to get his act together, now, the team can afford to replace him. The ONLY chance Zorn has of saving his job (until the end of the year at least) is to win the next 3 games with solid offensive performances, no dumb play calls, and overall improvement shown each week. Anything less (and that includes a close loss to the panthers [90% certainty], a win over the chiefs [also a 90% certainty], and an impressive win over the eagles on MNF [i'd say 80% certainty given the fact Zorns job will be on the line]), and Zorn is out.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

I like the move. Sherman has experience with the West Coast Offense. The offense is moving the ball but not scoring. Maybe what is need is subtle changes.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;603790]When Zorn was hired, Vinny told reporters that he had 2 years to succeed or he would be fired.[/quote]

That Zorn had two years to succeed?

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

lol SS

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;603811]I think think in the big picture, this is a decent move. If nothing else, it officially puts Zorn on notice that he needs to get his act together, now, the team can afford to replace him. The ONLY chance Zorn has of saving his job (until the end of the year at least) i[B]s to win the next 3 games with solid offensive performances,[/B] no dumb play calls, and overall improvement shown each week. Anything less (and that includes a close loss to the panthers [90% certainty], a win over the chiefs [also a 90% certainty], and an impressive win over the eagles on MNF [i'd say 80% certainty given the fact Zorns job will be on the line]), and Zorn is out.[/quote]
I doubt that Lewis will contribute much over the next 3 weeks. The goal, I think, would be to let him evaluate up until the bye week, then help implement any changes he suggests, (including firing Hixon, as sad and tragic as that would be)

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=hooskins;603825]lol SS[/quote]

What? You think I'm funny? How am I funny? Do I amuse you...like a clown?

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=irish;603749]The core of the problem is that the Skins just dont have the talent. This addition wont hurt but I dont look for much difference since its still the same players that have proven over and over that they just dont have it.[/quote]

You know, I've heard the 'talent' excuse a bunch and I know we don't have top notch players on the OL or at WR but that's where I expect a coach to excel. Ok, you've given me this, now I have to make the best of it. I refuse to believe that 14 points per game is the absolute BEST that can be coaxed out of our offensive talent. That's where Zorn continues to fall short IMO and hopefully Lewis can help him past it.

Unfortunately, the pessimist in me thinks that Zorn will listen to what Lewis says but do what he wants to anyways because he's stubborn. I don't get the sense that he's willing to alter what he believes despite overwhelming evidence in his face to dispute it. Before this week, all I heard from him was 'my play calls were good, the execution lacked' so now we think that an outside source is going to come in and tell him his calls were hot garbage and he's gonna agree and change?

I hope to be proven wrong, I truly do, but I realistically think Shanahan's got his bags packed and his staff already in mind. Conspiracy theory of the day, Zorn is fired at the bye week, Blache (who I think is in his last year of his contract) is named HC, Lewis OC, both are 'interviewed/Rooney'd' before the holidays, Shanahan is named the new HC the Monday following the season finale.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;603816]I like the move. Sherman has experience with the West Coast Offense.[B] The offense is moving the ball but not scoring. [/B]Maybe what is need is subtle changes.[/quote]

Only in the 3rd quarter.

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Agree with much of what you say there Pain.

Blache's impassioned speech the other night almost seems now like it was as much about telling VC and Snyder "put it on me. I'll take over this team for the second half of the season."

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

[quote=SmootSmack;603824]That Zorn had two years to succeed?[/quote]

No, that Cerrato did. Cerrato said Snyder was giving him two years in his current role. After that, he'd be removed from his current position (and in my opinion, move to some other, non-operational aspect of the franchise).

Re: Redskins hire offensive consultant
 

Long overdue.