Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Mattyk;771183]Not saying it's wrong or right, but it happens all the time. There's not a coach in the league that doesn't think they can turn someone else's garbage into a gem. Shanahan did a heck of a job with Plummer, probably figured he could do it with DM. Some guys are just more coachable than others, DM obviously wasn't receptive to it for whatever reason.[/quote]

The Shanahan/Plummer years were not exactly draped in glory. And after a time with Shanahan, Plummer just quit playing football. He said he would rather find other things to do with his life than continue to play football with Shanahan whom he described as a "perfectionist" who was looking for the next John Elway.

I doubt if Mike Shanahan is on Jake Plummer's Christmas card list...

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;771215]The Shanahan/Plummer years were not exactly draped in glory. And after a time with Shanahan, Plummer just quit playing football. He said he would rather find other things to do with his life than continue to play football with Shanahan whom he described as a "perfectionist" who was looking for the next John Elway.

I doubt if Mike Shanahan is on Jake Plummer's Christmas card list...[/quote]

He played the best football of his career in Denver, so he obviously responded to something that Shanahan did with him there.

Something tells me it's a simple case of sour grapes for Plummer. He was irked when they drafted Cutler and when things didn't go well for him that year and he got pulled, that was the end.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;771205]I do too. Prior to yesterday Grossman was pretty much an after thought. It's amazing how a little success can totally change perspective.[/quote]

I'm still not feelin like jumpin on the Sexy Rexy bandwagon. Early on it really looked like the rex we all know & love to make fun of. He was lucky that scandrick wasn't lookin at the one that hit him in the arm. In the 2nd half he missed a wide open Moss in the end zone because he did some crazy hop in his dropback & overthrew him by a mile.

Sure he put up some #s, also had 3 turnovers, and in the end we lost by 3. It actually looks like to me that Rex or McNabb at Qb is 6 & 1/2 dozen of the other at this point. Yesterday's results looked much like games McNabb has had this year. I'll have an open mind & I know it was his first game back, but it still looks like to me that Rex is not very good under an avg. amount or more of pressure.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=freddyg12;771218]I'm still not feelin like jumpin on the Sexy Rexy bandwagon. Early on it really looked like the rex we all know & love to make fun of. He was lucky that scandrick wasn't lookin at the one that hit him in the arm. In the 2nd half he missed a wide open Moss in the end zone [B]because he did some crazy hop in his dropback & overthrew him by a mile.[/B]

Sure he put up some #s, also had 3 turnovers, and in the end we lost by 3. It actually looks like to me that Rex or McNabb at Qb is 6 & 1/2 dozen of the other at this point. Yesterday's results looked much like games McNabb has had this year. I'll have an open mind & I know it was his first game back, but it still looks like to me that Rex is not very good under an avg. amount or more of pressure.[/quote]

I don't think he could see, so he tried a jump pass. Moss was wide open too.

He was shaky at times, but given the fact that was his first start in years I think he played well. Outside of the Texans game, that was better than DM has played all year.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=freddyg12;771218]I'm still not feelin like jumpin on the Sexy Rexy bandwagon. Early on it really looked like the rex we all know & love to make fun of. He was lucky that scandrick wasn't lookin at the one that hit him in the arm. In the 2nd half he missed a wide open Moss in the end zone because he did some crazy hop in his dropback & overthrew him by a mile.

Sure he put up some #s, also had 3 turnovers, and in the end we lost by 3. It actually looks like to me that Rex or McNabb at Qb is 6 & 1/2 dozen of the other at this point. Yesterday's results looked much like games McNabb has had this year. I'll have an open mind & I know it was his first game back, but it still looks like to me that Rex is not very good under an avg. amount or more of pressure.[/quote]

Yeah!! I pretty much agree. The first half yesterday he was simply the Grossman we've all grown accustomed to seeing, the second half was sort of what you wish you could get from the guy all the time, minus the Int's. I'll just hold serve on him until.....

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Mattyk;771220]I don't think he could see, so he tried a jump pass. Moss was wide open too.

He was shaky at times, but given the fact that was his first start in years I think he played well. Outside of the Texans game, that was better than DM has played all year.[/quote]

Yeah definitely. I had been of the mind that right now DM is the least of the problems with this teams. But it was nice to not see three or four "shuffle shuffle bounce pass" sequences yesterday and in all honestly Grossman played clearly better than DM has all year. I don't know if it was just mindset or what but the offense looked different yesterday in it's construction. It didn't look better, but different. What did look markedly better was execution. Perhaps DM was a bigger culprit than I thought.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;771215]The Shanahan/Plummer years were not exactly draped in glory. And after a time with Shanahan, Plummer just quit playing football. He said he would rather find other things to do with his life than continue to play football with Shanahan whom he described as a "perfectionist" who was looking for the next John Elway.

I doubt if Mike Shanahan is on Jake Plummer's Christmas card list...[/quote]

Shanahan made Plummer a quality QB bordering on a star.. Plummer didn't quit on the Broncos, he quit after he was traded to the Bucs.. I'm sure they don't exchange holiday greetings but they went to the playoffs 3 of the 4 years he started at QB including a trip to the AFC Championship Game. Even in the 4th year he was 7-4 when he was benched for Cutler.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Mattyk;771168]Shanny is also the team president, of course he can fire him if he wants.

Allen wasn't in Tampa when AH was on the move.[/quote]

My bad - I thought Allen wasnt fired until after the draft. Still, my point remains that Allen shouldnt have anything to do with personnel moves.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Grossman starts the season as our QB but Matt Leinart ends it...

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

With both Jacksonville and New York knowing well in advance that Grossman will be our projected starter, I expect a different approach from a defensive standpoint. Both teams [especially NY] with their ability to bring the heat and adequate time to game-plans his weaknesses will be a good test.

[url=http://dc.sbnation.com/washington-redskins/2010/12/17/1883153/nfl-playoff-picture-donovan-mcnabb-benching-could-help-giants-jaguars]NFL Playoff Picture: Donovan McNabb Benching Could Help Giants, Jaguars - SB Nation DC[/url]

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

i am willing to bet shanny has his eye on a qb in the draft that he wants to be his robot

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

ESPN just updated their prospect ratings today. Blaine Gabbert is looking like he could be the first QB selected this year. Of course I base this on the fact that Luck would rather get his architectural design degree from Stanford and compete for a national championship rather then rush to play for a crappy team for significantly less money then his predecessors. However if the NFL keeps the current rookie pay system for one more year before changing it then Luck will have no choice but to come out.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;771101]Redskins Opening Day 2011 Starter-Alex Smith. There I just gave you the scoop of the year. You're welcome[/quote]

Not a chance, the 49ers will want at-least a 1st and a 3rd:cheeky-sm

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=NYCSkin;771227]Grossman starts the season as our QB but Matt Leinart ends it...[/quote]

Good old Matt Leinart. Another name that has been attached to the Redskins. Talked about it last year. Mike Shanahan likes (liked?) him when he was drafted. Many people believe he was the guy Shanny was really targeting, not Cutler.

But anyhow, I believe the Leinart ship has sailed...and I don't think Kyle has any interest in him

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;771236]Good old Matt Leinart. Another name that has been attached to the Redskins. Talked about it last year. Mike Shanahan likes (liked?) him when he was drafted. Many people believe he was the guy Shanny was really targeting, not Cutler.

But anyhow, I believe the Leinart ship has sailed...and I don't think Kyle has any interest in him[/quote]

I'd stop rooting for Wsh if leinart is out QB, grossman is better than smith, leinart, and bulger

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Has anyone mentioned Vick? He's a free agent at the end of the season, and it's not a big secret that the Skins pay more than any other team. I know that the smart money is on Vick returning to Philly, but it's worth mentioning. That being said, he's not a proven fit for Shanny's offense (though many prognosticators were saying that McNabb would be more suited to Shanny's West Coast offense than what he came from in Philly).

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;771240]I'd stop rooting for Wsh if leinart is out QB, grossman is better than smith, leinart, and bulger[/quote]

Smith and Leinart, yes, are worse. Bulger probably has happy feet, doesn't have the strongest arm, and is old, but if he were a little younger, I'd definitely have him compete with Grossman.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=tc2deuce;771230]i am willing to bet shanny has his eye on a qb in the draft that he wants to be his robot[/quote]

Would that be a bad thing? Would you prefer someone who's completely opposite so they butt heads, don't get along, won't develop chemistry, and can't agree on anything?

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Coff;771242]Has anyone mentioned Vick? He's a free agent at the end of the season, and it's not a big secret that the Skins pay more than any other team. I know that the smart money is on Vick returning to Philly, but it's worth mentioning. That being said, he's not a proven fit for Shanny's offense (though many prognosticators were saying that McNabb would be more suited to Shanny's West Coast offense than what he came from in Philly).[/quote]

No way Philly lets him hit the open market

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;771226]My bad - I thought Allen wasnt fired until after the draft. Still, my point remains that Allen shouldnt have anything to do with personnel moves.[/quote]

Well, whatever input BA has, Shanahan still has the final say over all football decisions. So ultimately you have to blame Mike.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Coff;771242]Has anyone mentioned Vick? He's a free agent at the end of the season, and it's not a big secret that the Skins pay more than any other team. I know that the smart money is on Vick returning to Philly, but it's worth mentioning. That being said, he's not a proven fit for Shanny's offense (though many prognosticators were saying that McNabb would be more suited to Shanny's West Coast offense than what he came from in Philly).[/quote]

A few things. For starters if you were the Eagles how can you even think of letting him go? On top of that if you're Vick why would you want to go anywhere else? You finally have a coach that has turned you into a top passer and a supporting cast that has allowed you to flourish.

So long as the Eagles pay market value, which they will, Vick will stay. The only conceivable way that Vick leaves Philly is if someone gives him a significantly higher contract that allows him to get out of debt but I doubt after this season that the Eagles would low ball him enough to force Vick to make that decision. At the very least they will franchise him.

Now the thing is with the recent failures of Donovan McNabb odds are that Vick wouldn't fair much better as a passer in this system. Word from McNabb's camp is that Shanahan's system is so rigid that it causes problems for a QB like McNabb who likes to improvise. Personally I don't know what that means granted that he's not much of a scrambler anymore but thats what McNabb's camp continues to stress.

This leads me to assume that part of the reason Vick has been so successful in Philly is because Vick is given a little bit more freedom to let the play come to him without having to worry to much about precise reads. This also leads me to believe that hypothetically if a guy like Big Ben were to become available (which he won't) then we would have similar problems.

From the recent Sally Jenkins Article:
[quote]The word from inside Redskins Park was that the Shanahans have been frustrated for weeks by the fact that McNabb either couldn't or wouldn't absorb Kyle Shanahan's offense and make the correct reads, and that he only wanted to do the things that made him comfortable. His inflexibility limited the play-calling options, and his inconsistency too often put them in difficult long-yardage situations. Hence, he never improved in 13 games. Those judgments now seem correct.

The word from the McNabb side is that the Shanahans didn't do enough to accommodate his improvisational talents, that Kyle Shanahan still has a lot to learn that he didn't do enough to make the freelance-happy McNabb more effective, and also protect him from sacks behind a vulnerable line. Perhaps a valid point, given that Grossman was sacked five times.
[/quote]

Apparently the key to being successful in this system is staying within the system. Something that McNabb doesn't do.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

The beat reporter from ESPN 980, Chris Russell, got word from some within the organization who said that there was a world of difference with Grossman at the helm. There was so much better execution of the offense, a smoother calling of the plays from Kyle Shanahan to the QB -- and the efficiency with which they were communicated in the huddle, to the grasp of the plays, not having to have the play repeated from Shanahan, no awkward delays; all thanks to Grossman's superior knowledge of the offense. All luxuries that they haven't been able to enjoy all season.

Here's this from Chris Cooley:

"Rex is so fast getting in and out of the huddle," tight end Chris Cooley said. "He is so intense. There is nothing laid back. He has a quick tempo and he gets us to the ball as fast as he can get us to the ball. He called a lot of plays on first down; he called a lot of plays quick. He got to the ball when they were moving around on defense and they weren't able to make adjustments. When he finally got into a rhythm, we got into a good rhythm."

[url=http://espn980.stats.com/fb/story.asp?i=20101220191338833573008&ref=rec&tm=28&src=NFL]AP: Grossman gives Redskins offense a better rhythm[/url]

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Beemnseven;771260]The beat reporter from ESPN 980, Chris Russell, got word from some within the organization who said that there was a world of difference with Grossman at the helm. There was so much better execution of the offense, a smoother calling of the plays from Kyle Shanahan to the QB -- and the efficiency with which they were communicated in the huddle, to the grasp of the plays, not having to have the play repeated from Shanahan, no awkward delays; all thanks to Grossman's superior knowledge of the offense. All luxuries that they haven't been able to enjoy all season.[/quote]

This all goes back to my own VIP experience at this years OTA's. Rex looked sharp and finely tuned like he had a year or ever more under his belt of this system.

Dmac looked lost for the most part of practice. Did I think this would carry over, of course not but clearly dmac didn't get it as the whole world could see from week to week the inconsistency and the inability to grasp the Offense.

As to your post that was pretty obvious to most during the second half, thats what the team has been looking for all season. If Tana makes the catch (That he has to make) in the 4th w/5 mins to go HIGH PROBILITY we come home with a W.

Or if our Defense/Special Teams could have just played a middle of the road game w/the same 2nd half Offense output.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Beemnseven;771260]The beat reporter from ESPN 980, Chris Russell, got word from some within the organization who said that there was a world of difference with Grossman at the helm. There was so much better execution of the offense, a smoother calling of the plays from Kyle Shanahan to the QB -- and the efficiency with which they were communicated in the huddle, to the grasp of the plays, not having to have the play repeated from Shanahan, no awkward delays; all thanks to Grossman's superior knowledge of the offense. All luxuries that they haven't been able to enjoy all season.[/quote]

That all sounds nice, but what is a bit disconcerting is that the Shanahans are unyielding in how they want their players to walk, talk, eat, sleep, drink, etc. And at what cost? The two most talented players on the team have been marginalized. When one creates a system in which Rex Grossman is more productive than Donavan McNabb, one has to question the system.

That being said, if the Skins can groom a young QB in that system from day one, they won't have to face many of these issues. Jake Locker could be a good fit; he's a better athlete than he is a quarterback, and a player like that benefits from a structure heavy, scripted offense.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Coff;771263]That all sounds nice, but what is a bit disconcerting is that the Shanahans are unyielding in how they want their players to walk, talk, eat, sleep, drink, etc. And at what cost? The two most talented players on the team have been marginalized. [B]When one creates a system in which Rex Grossman is more productive than Donavan McNabb, one has to question the system. [/B]

That being said, if the Skins can groom a young QB in that system from day one, they won't have to face many of these issues. Jake Locker could be a good fit; he's a better athlete than he is a quarterback, and a player like that benefits from a structure heavy, scripted offense.[/quote]

Really? One can't possibly question the player?

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Rex simply knows the offense better, and is perhaps more coachable than DM.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Mattyk;771089]Grossman will be going into year 3 in this offense, I think he can get us by in the short run until a rook is ready. Beck will be back as the #2.[/quote]

Mike Vick.......... I bet it all on him! Unless we can draft Cam Newton!

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Mike Shanahan said (and most people know) that an offense takes more then a 13 games or a year to master.
Other QBs like Culter and Cassel stuggled in their 1st years of a new system.
Grossman himself has said that it gets easier the in year 2.
Oh wait McNabb won't get a year 2.

Something w/ this whole situation ain't kosher.
After furhter review I want to change my vote to: Rex Grossman will be the starter next year

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

I think Shanahan wants to pick his own QB and at some point next year Mallett starts.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

The Miami and S FLorida stations are buzzing with the possibility of getting a vet QB in the off-season. McNabb has been bandied about.......often

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;771245]Smith and Leinart, yes, are worse. Bulger probably has happy feet, doesn't have the strongest arm, and is old, but if he were a little younger, I'd definitely have him compete with Grossman.[/quote]

I'm no psychologist but I'll play one on the warpath. I have a theory that Shanahan wants to prove he can turn QB disappointments around, and distance himself from the Elway connection. That's why he went after Plummer and his losing record and poor TD-INT ratio and turn him into the leader of a winning team, why he approved of getting McNbb who's never won a SB despite coming close so many times. And why a guy like Alex Smith seems to fall into that "reclamation project" category

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;771274]I'm no psychologist but I'll play one on the warpath. I have a theory that Shanahan wants to prove he can turn QB disappointments around, and distance himself from the Elway connection. That's why he went after Plummer and his losing record and poor TD-INT ratio and turn him into the leader of a winning team, why he approved of getting McNbb who's never won a SB despite coming close so many times. And why a guy like Alex Smith seems to fall into that "reclamation project" category[/quote]

If that's the case don't we already have the perfect project in Rex? Plus he's already got 2 years in this offense under his belt satisfying Shanahan's take that it takes 2-3 years to master this offense.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Mattyk;771278]If that's the case don't we already have the perfect project in Rex? Plus he's already got 2 years in this offense under his belt satisfying Shanahan's take that it takes 2-3 years to master this offense.[/quote]

Yeah but Smith is arguably more of a bust being the first overall pick, and potentially higher upside being younger.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Beemnseven;771264]Really? One can't possibly question the player?[/quote]

I'm not suggesting you can't; the point I'm making is that the system stands out as questionable. Fault is never 100% for one party and 0% for the other. But if you have one of the most talented QBs in the league standing on the sideline, and a back-up quarterback taking the snaps, there's a problem.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Trade down and get Locker.

It is amazing what this kid did with the Washington Huskies. I have noticed good QB's on crappy college teams tend to do better in the NFL.

This kid is good.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zjEaRPphQOE]YouTube - Jake Locker - College Highlights[/ame]

Grossman to start season, then Locker starts when Rex is benched for too many INT's.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Well hope McNabb is brought on back. But think that Rex could be the new Redskins QB. If all is said and done. And if Rex is signed next year.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Why the crush on Locker? He never really has impressed me that much, especially this season. Rex wil be the starter come week one no matter what happens or if we draft a QB. We have a firstand second round pick in 2011, I say give Trent Williams some help, and make the scout team work overtime to earn their inflated paychecks. Whoever these guys are, they have been epic failures overall in terms of talent evaluation. I like Trent Williams a lot, but he isn't going to last long or be worth a damn if he keeps having to line up next to a bunch of bums for the next several seasons. Draft some damn guards with the first two picks then go for the best available tackle in the latter rounds. If Mallet is available for our #1, I admit I would be tempted to go for him, but I wouldn't pull the trigger. No matter who our guy is, our line sucks so much that he would be ineffective. Both lines need to be addressed in the offseason, and I would look at a CB and LB. Fletch can't be the man forever.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

[quote=Coff;771282]I'm not suggesting you can't; the point I'm making is that the system stands out as questionable. Fault is never 100% for one party and 0% for the other. But if you have one of the most talented QBs in the league standing on the sideline, and a back-up quarterback taking the snaps, there's a problem.[/quote]

Well, there's a problem here because we don't have playmakers offensively. And it's pretty clear Donovan McNabb was at one time among the most talented QBs in the league, but not anymore.

The system seemed to work well in Houston.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

I think that people believe unless Rex morph's into a Pro Bowl QB he has no chance of starting next year. I just don't see it that way. He will be intensely competitive, regardless of whom the Skins bring in, and out to prove he still has NFL starting bonafides. He doesn't have to be the best or most talented QB on the roster, just the one who has mastered the system. Considering he's been sitting for nearly two years, he a pretty solid game. Yes, turnovers included.

That said, outside of my wild Luck prediction the Skins could wheel and deal with the Eagles for Mr. Kolb's services. Because we know for sure they aint keeping both QB's and Vick would be a fool to leave Philly, even if the Skins throw the bank at him.

Re: Who Will Be The Redskins 2011 Opening Day Starting QB?
 

Kolb would make more sense than Locker, but that would cost us precious picks. Look for us to keep Rex and MR. Beck and maybe draft a QB in the 5th round or get a scrub FA for QB #3. Is it certain Mallet is coming out this season?