Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

im going to a lesbian wedding in NYC at the end of this month. It was originally planned for vancouver but was changed to NYC.

gay/lesbian people cant get married in maryland? kinda of a pain in the ass to have to go up to NYC and rooms at alil over 200 bucks which really isnt bad for time square weekend but its still going to be a 500 weekend with all costs included.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

Thats kind of a turn on if they are hot. Any pics?

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=over the mountain;845508]gay/lesbian people cant get married in maryland? [b]kinda of a pain in the ass[/b] .[/quote]

[b]boom![/b]

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

Unt now you all hav vergotten that das achternate lifenstile jokes are verbotten!

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

A interesting story considering the repeal of Dont Ask Dont Tell and same-sex marriage being illegal at the Federal level:

[url=http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/10/three-marine-corporals-have-been-given-bad-conduct-dischargesafter-pleading-guilty-to-sham-marriages-meant-to-allow-a-lesbian.html]Three Marines in San Diego ousted for sham marriages - latimes.com[/url]

You know, the only reason the Federal government cares about marriage, gay marriage, or no marriage is tax related..... If everyone were taxed the same, say at 9% income rate and a 9% consumption rate, it wouldnt matter if people were married or not, or who they were or wernt married to. How crazy would that be???

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=over the mountain;845508]im going to a lesbian wedding in NYC at the end of this month. It was originally planned for vancouver but was changed to NYC.

gay/lesbian people cant get married in maryland? kinda of a pain in the ass to have to go up to NYC and rooms at alil over 200 bucks which really isnt bad for time square weekend but its still going to be a 500 weekend with all costs included.[/quote]

rooms actually at 309. thinking of either getting a cheaper hotel room in princeton or just limiting the alcohol consumption and driving back home. sleeping in the car is out since the ladys pregers, doubt she would crash in the car anyway . .freakin spoiled princess. \

maryland ban = more drunk drivers on the road. way to go ultra conservative weirdos. ironically i went to a wedding in amish country this past weekend.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

^ I went to a wedding in Princeton less than a month ago and stayed at the Westin. It was the nicest hotel ive ever been in. I lied and said it was just me and the total came to $100 give or take a dollar. It was like 15 dollars more for a second person and you get a free breakfast for each person in your room, which would be the primary incentive to say 2 people. BUT the free breakfast was a complete scam. It was sit down only with about 15 tables and the wait was like an hour and a half, people were going NUTS in the lobby.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=mlmpetert;849232]A interesting story considering the repeal of Dont Ask Dont Tell and same-sex marriage being illegal at the Federal level:

[URL="http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/10/three-marine-corporals-have-been-given-bad-conduct-dischargesafter-pleading-guilty-to-sham-marriages-meant-to-allow-a-lesbian.html"]Three Marines in San Diego ousted for sham marriages - latimes.com[/URL]

You know, the only reason the Federal government cares about marriage, gay marriage, or no marriage is tax related..... If everyone were taxed the same, say at 9% income rate and a 9% consumption rate, it wouldnt matter if people were married or not, or who they were or wernt married to. How crazy would that be???[/quote]

What they did was illegal and was fraud.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

i almost mistakenly created a new thread. this is a major issue to me:
all americans need to have equal rights. that's the biggest fish that needs to be fried. i didn't chose to be heterosexual, yet i can marry my girlfriend. why can't everyone have that right? that's like saying a black man can't marry his girlfriend. it's insane that we talk about other issues while this is still unresolved.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

I got no problem with it. Except: It shouldn't be called "marriage" not for hetero or homo sexuals. It's a contract pure and simple. Although originally called a marriage contract that term is outdated and has created an unneccesary blurring of the lines between church and state (for example: when he performs a marriage, completes and signs the marriage license, my priest signs as an officer of the State of Maryland).

Constitutional equal protection, to me, requires that anyone entering into the same promises and obligations associated with two people entering into a permanent shared living arrangement and that have been traditionally known as a "marriage contract" should receive the same benefits, under the law, as anyone else. You make the same legally binding promises, accept the same legally binding obligations, you get the same benefits and penalties as everyone else. Rename it a civil union contract, have the legal obligations set out (i.e. Party A promises to do x, y & z, Party B promises likewise) and have it properly witnessed and notorized by a court official.

If your church doesn't want to perform the sacrament of marriage, fine. The state shouldn't have any say in that. It is then up to you whether to belong to that religious institution or not. Further, I would have no problem with the State saying "if, as part of a religious ceremony, the parties agree to x, y, & z, and proof of that is provided to the appropriate State official, then no separate civil form is required to evidence the civil union contract". Church's would then be free to incorporate the State legal requirements into their sacramental services. If they chose not to do so, then participants simply have to fill out the forms at city hall.

Give unto Ceasar that which is Ceasar's, give unto God that which is God's.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;885695]I got no problem with it. Except: It shouldn't be called "marriage" not for hetero or homo sexuals. It's a contract pure and simple. Although originally called a marriage contract that term is outdated and has created an unneccesary blurring of the lines between church and state (for example: when he performs a marriage, completes and signs the marriage license, my priest signs as an officer of the State of Maryland).

Constitutional equal protection, to me, requires that anyone entering into the same promises and obligations associated with two people entering into a permanent shared living arrangement and that have been traditionally known as a "marriage contract" should receive the same benefits, under the law, as anyone else. You make the same legally binding promises, accept the same legally binding obligations, you get the same benefits and penalties as everyone else. Rename it a civil union contract, have the legal obligations set out (i.e. Party A promises to do x, y & z, Party B promises likewise) and have it properly witnessed and notorized by a court official.

If your church doesn't want to perform the sacrament of marriage, fine. The state shouldn't have any say in that. It is then up to you whether to belong to that religious institution or not. Further, I would have no problem with the State saying "if, as part of a religious ceremony, the parties agree to x, y, & z, and proof of that is provided to the appropriate State official, then no separate civil form is required to evidence the civil union contract". Church's would then be free to incorporate the State legal requirements into their sacramental services. If they chose not to do so, then participants simply have to fill out the forms at city hall.

Give unto Ceasar that which is Ceasar's, give unto God that which is God's.[/quote]

You're just playing word games. Over time, the roles of men and women within marriage have changed. Social views on multiple wives, interracial relations, and divorce have changed. Legal rules regulating everything from the treatment of children and division of property to the grounds for divorce have changed. If you want to qualify and classify what marriage is that is your prerogative, just don't expect us not to keep evolving and keep it moving.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=saden1;885705]You're just playing word games. Over time, the roles of men and women within marriage have changed. Social views on [B]multiple wives[/B], interracial relations, and divorce have changed. Legal rules regulating everything from the treatment of children and division of property to the grounds for divorce have changed. If you want to qualify and classify what marriage is that is your prerogative, just don't expect us not to keep evolving and keep it moving.[/quote]

So if we allow same sex marriage we can also have multiple wifes? Hell yea!! I'll sign that petition.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=firstdown;885731]So if we allow same sex marriage we can also have multiple wifes? Hell yea!! I'll sign that petition.[/quote]

The idea of having multiple wives isn't absurd...it use to go on, it still goes on around the world. Maybe if men could have multiple wives the divorce rate in this country would be so high?

And no, the idea of marrying your dog is idiotic and absurd.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=saden1;885705]You're just playing word games. Over time, the roles of men and women within marriage have changed. Social views on multiple wives, interracial relations, and divorce have changed. Legal rules regulating everything from the treatment of children and division of property to the grounds for divorce have changed. If you want to qualify and classify what marriage is that is your prerogative, just don't expect us not to keep evolving and keep it moving.[/quote]



/thread


Hammer meet nail head.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=saden1;885705]You're just playing word games. Over time, the roles of men and women within marriage have changed. Social views on multiple wives, interracial relations, and divorce have changed. Legal rules regulating everything from the treatment of children and division of property to the grounds for divorce have changed. If you want to qualify and classify what marriage is that is your prerogative, [B]just don't expect us not to keep evolving and keep it moving.[/B][/quote]

I guess. I thought my "word games" were doing just that. Separating the religion from the secular. Ultimately, you're right - civil union, marriage, title it what you wish - as far as the state is concerned it's still a legally binding contract. My only thought was to clarify the distinction between church and state in this particular contract and the role each played in it.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=firstdown;885731]So if we allow same sex marriage we can also have multiple wifes? Hell yea!! I'll sign that petition.[/quote]

Goodness no...for those with troublesome wives, why multiply the trouble?

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=Lotus;885769]Goodness no...for those with troublesome wives, why multiply the trouble?[/quote]

And in fairness what about all those progressive wimmin what want more than one husbind, we'd have to accomodate them 'un's too....

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

let's make sure everyone has the right to be married before we start nitpicking. that's the big picture

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=los panda;885802]let's make sure everyone has the right to be married before we start nitpicking. that's the big picture[/quote]

I couldn't agree more with the point that you are making in this thread.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

I say give gays the right to be as miserable as the rest of us.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=Lotus;885818]I couldn't agree more with the point that you are making in this thread.[/quote]amen brother

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

Actually I am more concerned with our QB situation at this time.......

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=Hog1;887109]Actually I am more concerned with our QB situation at this time.......[/quote]

Once that is solved, then will you allow the gays to marry?

I'll go tell Jerry and Phil there marriage is illegitimate pending a resolution to the redskins QB situation lol.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

Lets be honest this is not about gays having the right to marry because they can do that now when ever they want. Its about the states recognizing the marriage is what this is about.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=firstdown;887202]Lets be honest this is not about gays having the right to marry because they can do that now when ever they want. Its about the states recognizing the marriage is what this is about.[/quote]it is about equal rights

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

The fact that this is even an issue shows how far we haven't come as a nation as we like to think. Everyone against homosexual marriage needs to shut the **** up, get your head out of your ass, and acknowledge that equality should apply to all.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;887597]The fact that this is even an issue shows how far we haven't come as a nation as we like to think. Everyone against homosexual marriage needs to shut the **** up, get your head out of your ass, and acknowledge that equality should apply to all.[/quote]bravo, young man

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

but, apparently some men were created more equal than others

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

Does anyone else think within 20 years our country will be far more progressive than it is now. It seems like the people in power are still stuck in the 50's. It seems like my generation has a lot of political ideals in common. Most everyone I know is socially very liberal and fiscally wants to be very responsible.

That doesn't mean there aren't core differences. But all of us want to spend the money in a responsible manner. Especially the majority of people (granted a small sample) that I know all being socially liberal will get rid of a lot of the silly hangups that happen now in the political process.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;887597]The fact that this is even an issue shows how far we haven't come as a nation as we like to think. Everyone against homosexual marriage needs to shut the **** up, get your head out of your ass, and acknowledge that equality should apply to all.[/quote]

Yep. Also agree with Daseal it just seems like this is a generational issue. Younger gen doesn't care what they do, older generation is all "sanctity of marriage" etc.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=Daseal;887624]Does anyone else think within 20 years our country will be far more progressive than it is now. It seems like the people in power are still stuck in the 50's. It seems like my generation has a lot of political ideals in common. Most everyone I know is socially very liberal and fiscally wants to be very responsible.

That doesn't mean there aren't core differences. But all of us want to spend the money in a responsible manner. Especially the majority of people (granted a small sample) that I know all being socially liberal will get rid of a lot of the silly hangups that happen now in the political process.[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I dont know, i agree with far more socially liberal but not sure about progressive in general. We are part of the same generation and everyone I know is also pretty social liberal, I don’t think I have any friends that oppose same sex marriage. I too think most are also very fiscally conservative. It seems the core of our politics are libertarian leaning, perhaps because weve grown up with the most unrestricted thing in decades, the internet. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]But it seems like people become more socially conservative with age, so perhaps many of us are destined to become less tolerant to same sex marriage as time goes on. Also Hispanics are the fastest growing minority in the US, most are Catholic and I believe in general they often carry very conservative social views. And the older population is living longer. Political interest is controlled by those who are organized and regular voting participants. Religious organizations, old people, minorities and other voting blocs can make their voices heard much easier then say your average 40 year old that isn’t part of any special interest group and only votes during presidential elections.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I don’t think the Federal Marriage Amendment has a chance, even if say Rick Santorum won and republicans attempted to forced it through like democrats with obamacare. I said a while back in this thread the primary reason the federal government has a say in marriage is tax code related. Less and less people are getting married now a days and less are having kids or at least as many kids as they have before. The tax code is outdated for these 2 issues, in addition to many others. At some point its going to get massively reformed, and I bet when it does provisions for taxation and entitlements for married couples and parents will be part of the reform. Once the federal government is taken out of the issue states will be allowed to determining the full scope of marriage law and I think nearly all will allow for same sex marriage.[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=mooby;887672]Yep. Also agree with Daseal it just seems like this is a generational issue. Younger gen doesn't care what they do, older generation is all "sanctity of marriage" etc.[/quote]

Sadly, down here deep in the Bible Belt, even many of the younger generation oppose equal marriage due to religious reasons.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[IMG]http://baselinescenario.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/age1.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

Yeah I think it is dangerous to project the leanings of your own community of friends and associates out into the general public. I believe it is a main reason that such divisiveness exists. I think there are about as many people opposed to same-sex marriage as are for it. It is definitely a younger crowd that favors it but one thing to remember is that as you age your values adjust. Just because you believe it now doesn't mean that will be so in 20 or 30 years.

I don't like the concept of state-sponsored same-sex marriage. I don't like the concept of state-sponsored marriage in general. If we allow the state to sponsor "traditional" marriage then we should let the state sponsor just "marriage" meaning any two humans can marry. But why stop there? Why can only two people get married? Why not 3 or 4 or 50? I just have a fundamental problem with the state endorsing and granting rights for life-style choices. The government has no business doing that. Marriage should be a religious/societal thing only. The question is how do we extricate the concept of legal marriage from our society?

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Completely agree FPRLG. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]
[FONT=Verdana][COLOR=black][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I think a likely outcome to this debate is that we get rid of state sponsored marriage altogether and let it become purely a ceremonial title (as it should be imo). The only thing state sponsored should be a contract that grants certain rights from one person to another/others.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]It would be interesting to know when and why marriage law first came to be in the US. My guess would be state sponsored marriage is purely tax code related.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[/COLOR][/FONT]
[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=Lotus;887709]Sadly, down here deep in the Bible Belt, even many of the younger generation oppose equal marriage due to religious reasons.[/quote]

I can believe that. I would think the more religious minority of my younger generation still thinks like that due to their upbringing. But that's dumb, at least in my opinion. My mom tried to force me into a Scientologist upbringing, but I'm not having any of that. They should be able to think for themselves.

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=FRPLG;887724]Yeah I think it is dangerous to project the leanings of your own community of friends and associates out into the general public. I believe it is a main reason that such divisiveness exists. I think there are about as many people opposed to same-sex marriage as are for it. It is definitely a younger crowd that favors it but one thing to remember is that as you age your values adjust. Just because you believe it now doesn't mean that will be so in 20 or 30 years.

I don't like the concept of state-sponsored same-sex marriage. I don't like the concept of state-sponsored marriage in general. If we allow the state to sponsor "traditional" marriage then we should let the state sponsor just "marriage" meaning any two humans can marry. But why stop there? Why can only two people get married? Why not 3 or 4 or 50? I just have a fundamental problem with the state endorsing and granting rights for life-style choices. The government has no business doing that. Marriage should be a religious/societal thing only. The question is how do we extricate the concept of legal marriage from our society?[/quote]some good points made here. but, i can honestly state that i will always believe in equal rights. as for the 3 or 4 or 50, i don't think that should even be addressed until we all have equal rights

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=los panda;887796]some good points made here. but, i can honestly state that [B]i will always believe in equal rights. as for the 3 or 4 or 50, i don't think that should even be addressed until we all have equal rights[/B][/quote]


Well i guess equal rights for hetros and homos. But screw the polygamists, who cares about their rights..... Filthy poly with their no morals. They have no place in our society!!! What they do is disgusting!!!!

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

[quote=mlmpetert;888612]Well i guess equal rights for hetros and homos. But screw the polygamists, who cares about their rights..... Filthy poly with their no morals. They have no place in our society!!! What they do is disgusting!!!![/quote]until everyone has the right to have one marriage, we shouldn't worry about giving everyone the right to multiple marriages. i'm not a mathematician, but i don't believe 3 = 0, 4 = 0, or 50 = 0. i believe that 1 = 1, 3 = 3, 4 = 4, and 50 = 50. please correct my math if i'm mistaken

Re: Same-Sex Marriage!! Your Thoughts
 

I am politically pretty conservative on most issues like economics, the size of government, protection our national security, but when it comes to SSM I honestly could care less. I have several friends who are gay and I say more power to them. It is just not something that concerns me. Lots of other things to be worked up over in my humble opinion.