Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Another big difference between the McNabb trade and the Palmer trade: The Eagles knew McNabb was done and they wanted to get rid of him. Palmer wanted out of a dysfunctional organization.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Ok, who killed the real Mike Brown? I thought he was a man of principle. A man who never caved. XD

Oh, and fellas, if Carson "I'm almost dead" Palmer costs 2 1sts, Lucky Luck Luck is going to cost EVEN MORE. ;)

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

wins, division titles, post. season success albeit no rings..

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Ruhskins;849129]Another big difference between the McNabb trade and the Palmer trade: The Eagles knew McNabb was done and they wanted to get rid of him. Palmer wanted out of a dysfunctional organization.[/quote]

Palmer hasnt been good for awhile. Hopefully he can get be in form. Im pulling for the Raiders in the West

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Chico23231;849134][B]Palmer hasnt been good for awhile[/B]. Hopefully he can get be in form. Im pulling for the Raiders in the West[/quote]

Yet still Mike Brown refused to trade him.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Meks;849133]wins, division titles, post. season success albeit no rings..[/quote]Are you counting McNabb's accomplishments before 2005, because since 2005, the Bengals won more division titles under Palmer than McNabb won.

But you're being silly. You asked me to reconsider/retract a statement that Palmer in his prime was much better than McNabb in his prime. Then you're talking about how many wins and playoff wins they have.

Regular season, Palmer's been better by every measure except longevity. Playoffs, we'll see. But it's not relevant to this argument or the trade.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Ruhskins;849135]Yet still Mike Brown refused to trade him.[/quote]

Mike Brown is a proven idiot. Glad he gave in when he did. The guy made bank this time. If it wasnt for JC going down, trade wouldnt happened. Palmer still would be retired.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=hooskins;849128]With this deal, Oakland doesn't have a draft pick until the 5th round next year.[/quote]

They are the anti-Patriots. LOL. But yeah, this is terrible. They better filled their holes through free agency and get lucky with low-round picks.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Palmer 04-07 w-L.. 32-29 .... 08-10 , 14-22

don't have bum in front of me but I know its better than that. especially the 04-07

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

and u said PRIME VS PRIME ... not 05-07

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Meks;849143]Palmer 04-07 w-L.. 32-29 .... 08-10 , 14-22

don't have bum in front of me but I know its better than that. especially the 04-07[/quote]

Before you continue this, you may want to wait and see what happens to Palmer this season and next season. Regardless of what the argument is between you and Gtripp, McNabb has gone to two teams and taken a big dump on them. To me it seems obvious that McNabb was washed up and both the Redskins and the Vikings were stupid enough to give up any draft picks for him. Palmer may very well end up like that, but it hasn't happen so it seems pointless to argue that he will or will not stink it up.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

I've already stated id like to see how he plays

and we are speaking about the past either way ..

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=GTripp0012;849093]You're right that they don't compare:

[URL="http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PalmCa00.htm"]Carson Palmer NFL & AFL Football Statistics - Pro-Football-Reference.com[/URL]

[URL="http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/McNaDo00.htm"]Donovan McNabb NFL & AFL Football Statistics - Pro-Football-Reference.com[/URL]

McNabb's done it for a long time. But Palmer 2005-2007 was one of the three best quarterbacks in football. Clearly. Something that McNabb never was. If Palmer had great receivers, why has no Palmer receiver ever done anything outside of Cincinnati? Are the Bengals that great of an organization that puts it's great players in positions to succeed?[/quote]

Hell McNabb never had a WR that another team was interested in other then TO. I think your also forgetting that TO has 3000 more rushing years then Palmer.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=firstdown;849152]Hell McNabb never had a WR that another team was interested in other then TO.[/quote]Miami has never had a QB another team coveted other than Dan Marino. He was really good though.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Raiders should get compensatory picks for Nnamdi, Gallery and others but still seems like a lot to give up for Palmer. Curious to see what happens in the offseason

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=firstdown;849152]I think your also forgetting that McNabb has 3000 more rushing yards then Palmer.[/quote]If this is what you're trying to say, 1) no i didn't forget that, and 2) yes, that's an important point. I definitely considered that when deciding whether McNabb was ever a top three QB in his prime. I really don't think he got that close.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

When we bury the 2010 trade for Donovan McNabb and write his headstone, it will have to include the fact that on the day he gets benched as an NFL starting QB for the final time, the big NFL story on the day is that Jason Campbell is a tragic character in the NFL.

So I think we can finally put this trade to rest now. Redskins screwed. Rest of NFL is smart. 1999 forever.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=GTripp0012;849158]When we bury the 2010 trade for Donovan McNabb and write his headstone, it will have to include the fact that on the day he gets benched as an NFL starting QB for the final time, the big NFL story on the day is that [B]Jason Campbell is a tragic character [/B]in the NFL.

So I think we can finally put this trade to rest now. Redskins screwed. Rest of NFL is smart. 1999 forever.[/quote]

ha, your hilarious Gtripp. Tragic by his own doing.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Not sure if this was posted, but pretty much sums it up.

[url=http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/tag/_/name/palmer-to-raiders]Palmer to Raiders - NFL Nation Blog - ESPN[/url]

[QUOTE]"I think the Raiders vastly overspent," Matt Williamson of Scouts Inc. said when I spoke with him Tuesday. "Palmer hasn't been good for three years. A change of scenery could help, but a first-round pick for him? I wouldn't give up a second or maybe even a third." [/QUOTE]

This isn't like Jay Cutler who was 25-26 when he was traded. This is a 32 year old QB that hasn't seen a pro-bowl season since 2006. Jesus christ this was stupid as ****. I'd rather tank the season and get a high pick for a QB than to blow the future on a guy who's already got one foot out the retirement door. Morons.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Chico23231;849161]ha, your hilarious Gtripp. Tragic by his own doing.[/quote]I don't agree that he conspired with the Browns to break his own collarbone.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=GTripp0012;849198]I don't agree that he conspired with the Browns to break his own collarbone.[/quote]

lol well yes i agree with that in spite of his immaculate pocket awareness. I didnt see the play, but he probably wasnt holding on to the ball that longer than he should...again. hey i want to see the Raiders win, Palmer, JC or KB.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Chico23231;849201]lol well yes i agree with that in spite of his immaculate pocket awareness. [B]I didnt see the play[/B], but he probably wasnt holding on to the ball that longer than he should...again. hey i want to see the Raiders win, Palmer, JC or KB.[/quote]Well, okay then.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=GTripp0012;849202]Well, okay then.[/quote]

that list of tragic figures due to injury, pretty long list i imagine.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Can you say Stupid?

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Me: I didn't know you worked for the Raiders now!

Matt Millen: I thought I was also getting Houshmanzadeh...championship!

...nice to know he can laugh about it

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=SmootSmack;849154]Raiders should get compensatory picks for Nnamdi, Gallery and others but still seems like a lot to give up for Palmer. Curious to see what happens in the offseason[/quote] Smoot , do you have any idea if we will receive a comp pick C. Rogers ?

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=budw38;849216]Smoot , do you have any idea if we will receive a comp pick C. Rogers ?[/quote]

We should

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Ruhskins;849025]Mike Brown is still a dumba$$. He got lucky that a major injury gave him this opportunity. If Campbell doesn't get hurt, Palmer sits for a whole season and loses any trade value. Hopefully they won't F things up and build a solid team around Dalton.[/quote]

MIke Brown is still a dumbass; no argument there.

Please explain how Palmer sitting for a whole season makes him lose trade value. It's not like he's 40 years old...

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Meks;849121]I just perfer results over numbers .. unless its wins and division titles super bowls in this case zero etc etc[/quote]

So, taking any QB in the draft is a bad idea because he has no results - - zero etc etc. Right?

At the moment, the QBs with Super Bowl rings and division titles who are not under contract somewhere are - - purely from memory so I may have missed some:
[INDENT]Trent Dilfer
Brad Johnson
John Elway
Brett Favre.[/INDENT]By your logic, those guys are better than Carson Palmer. Say what?

Look, I think Palmer is only an above average QB and the Raiders paid a lot for him, but it is ridiculous to say that he is a turkey because he hasn't won a Super Bowl.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;849223]MIke Brown is still a dumbass; no argument there.

Please explain how Palmer sitting for a whole season makes him lose trade value. It's not like he's 40 years old...[/quote]

Taking this Raiders trade out of the equation, I would imagine that trading Carson Palmer in the 2011 offseason would have resulted in better value for Cincy than trading him in the 2012 offseason. Of course this argument is moot given that the Raiders have overpaid for Palmer.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Ruhskins;849230]Taking this Raiders trade out of the equation, I would imagine that trading Carson Palmer in the 2011 offseason would have resulted in better value for Cincy than trading him in the 2012 offseason. Of course this argument is moot given that the Raiders have overpaid for Palmer.[/quote]

Don't understand why that is the case.

Only a team who really needs a QB is going to try to make an offer to the Bengals for a guy like Palmer because it is clear that Mike Brown won't release him for a conditional 5th round pick or anything like that. So, why would there be no "QB desperate teams" in the 2012 offseason just as there were ones who wanted Palmer in the 2011 offseason and now one team who needed him in the middle of the 2011 season.

Mike Brown won the lottery. He held on to Carson Palmer and found a team willing to pay a huge price for him. Had Jason Campbell broken his collar bone next weekend instead of last weekend, the Raiders could not have traded for him; the deadline would have passed. The Bengals got lucky; it happens sometimes...

But Carson Palmer would have been worth about the same in the 2012 off-season that he was worth in the 2011 off-season had this bit of luck not fallen in the Bengals' lap.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Did Dan Snyder just buy the Raiders?

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

I think Palmer's best days are behind him. I just don't think Oakland is going to get Carson Palmer of 05 to 07. Since the knee and elbow injuries the guy just hasn't been the same.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=GTripp0012;849021]A couple things:

Carson Palmer is still really, really good. [/quote]
Based on?

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=tryfuhl;849252]Based on?[/quote]History. The knock against Palmer is that he's injury prone, elbow didn't heal quickly, and that knee injury from 2005. But he's always been one of the league's best quarterbacks when playing, and he improved immensely from his first year back from injury (2009) to his second year.

Why wasn't he in the pro bowl in 2010 if he's so great? That's entirely on the Bengals for building the way they did.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

What a terrible trade. I know I've been critical of JC but at this point he is a much better QB then Palmer. Plus you don't just trade for a QB unless you're running a system they've spent plenty of time in.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Terrible trade.

How many Playoff games has Palmer won?

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;849262]What a terrible trade. I know I've been critical of JC but at this point he is a much better QB then Palmer. Plus you don't just trade for a QB unless you're running a system they've spent plenty of time in.[/quote]

Jackson and Palmer go way back. I don't think the system will be a big adjustment.

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

Imagine what is going through JC's mind?
WOW, what a deal........

Re: Carson Palmer to Oakland Raiders for 1st/2012
 

[quote=Hog1;849291][B]Imagine what is going through JC's mind?[/B]
WOW, what a deal........[/quote]

"It's like playing in DC all over again!" Campbell is like the new Ramsey. :D