Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=NC_Skins;899464]Like has nothing to do with it. LL has the physical ability to be the best safety have ever played this game. What did Ed Reed do when he first came into the league? He spent a many of nights over at Ray Lewis house watching film and learning. Have we heard anything of the sort from LL? All we hear from LL is how he's getting his swole on at the gym. He plays the position with no discipline (much like Meriweather) and fancies the big hits instead of the sound tackling. [B]It doesn't help when you get up and start flexing after you just gave up a 25 yard first down either.[/B] /facepalm

Like has nothing to do with it.[/quote]That is a problem of 'liking' him though. And I make fun of him as much as anyone for those antics. But I also agree with analysis like [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/football-insider/post/what-is-laron-landry-worth-to-the-redskins/2011/12/22/gIQAdsTXBP_blog.html"]this one that suggests he's underrated[/URL] by Redskins fans. And I think the Steeler fans who mocked the MNF crew in 2010 for comparing him to Polamalu were being far too arrogant about the differences.

Ultimately, the reason they're letting him go elsewhere isn't because he's not important, but because they tired of his injuries and antics. I would argue that they're paid as coaches and front office guys and trainers to manage prima dona athletes, but maybe they're just collecting a paycheck.

Either way, we're apparently going to try to outscore teams next year, so this discussion is probably all moot.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899462]Well, here's the thing: there IS a pretty nice safety pool out there, especially since the Redskins' standards are merely someone who can play the position.

But the Redskins have focused their free agent efforts on:

1) Players 28 years old and younger
2) Not having to deal with Landry's sh-t anymore.

And that closes the market considerably, to the point where you could entertain the notion that the Redskins beat themselves before it opened. I get why Meriweather: physically superior to other guys on the market and replaces what they thought they had in Landry. But it's a significant down grade, and the $2.5 million of cap room it will take to add him limits what other moves the team can make.

So while it's cheap, it also forces their hand.[/quote]

While I don't like Meriweather personally, you aren't going to tell me that resigning LaRon would be any cheaper, and at least he will be on the field for a chance to compete. How is that a down grade? LaRon refuses surgery, and I am quite confident, that because of that he will have another injury plagued season this year. So for those two reasons alone you argument is invalid.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

Morris had to OK this so I'm in.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=mredskins;899468]Exactly well put. It is not just GTripp I am frustrated with. I don't know what else folks want from this team; they seem to be doing everything they can to field a winner.[/quote]But until they consistently target a higher grade of player either in talent or character in free agency, I don't understand how you can say this.

I realize it's much easier to get angry at me than to get angry at the team, but they are simply NOT doing everything they can to field a winner.

That's the big point here. They're playing hardball on contracts with Fletcher and giving last chances to Brandon Meriweather.

At the end of the day, I think the Redskins, like 31 other teams are just a bunch of guys trying to do their jobs. But I would disagree that all teams do their jobs equally well. And too often, I think they lose sight of the ultimate goal of winning and get caught in petty battles with veteran players.

You're free to totally disregard that opinion as useless, I could care less.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

Safety in 2012 probably will be like WR in 2011...we'll have little choice but to bring in a bunch of just-a-guys hoping that something sticks...and then struggle all year at the position.

Hopefully Gomes proves me wrong.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;899477]Morris had to OK this so I'm in.[/quote]

Claiborne? ;)

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;899477]Morris had to OK this so I'm in.[/quote]

I doubt that very much. I'm sure he gave input, but in the end, he has to work with the pieces given to him.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=SkinzWin;899475]While I don't like Meriweather personally, [B]you aren't going to tell me that resigning LaRon would be any cheaper, and at least he will be on the field for a chance to compete.[/B] How is that a down grade? LaRon refuses surgery, and I am quite confident, that because of that he will have another injury plagued season this year. So for those two reasons alone you argument is invalid.[/quote]No, I would not try to tell you LaRon would be cheaper.

The big question is: what is he competing with? Who are the Redskins bringing in to make Meriweather earn his way onto the field?

To react to this signing before we have those important details is difficult.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

Other than the pleasure of arguing with Tripp, what's the worry here? That the skins are done with improving their secondary? Really? Why think that?

As for Laron, it's not just the injuries, I'm afraid. He's a quirky dude, no doubt--great when on the field, but odd off of it. The issue here is about the proper treatment for his Achilles--he went with a "holistic" non-surgery option. I think the skins decided that wasn't worth the risk, at least at the outset. I'd like to have him back, but not at big money, given the risks. It sucks. But I don't think the skins FO is out to lunch here.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899479]But until they consistently target a higher grade of player either in talent or character in free agency, I don't understand how you can say this.

I realize it's much easier to get angry at me than to get angry at the team, but they are simply NOT doing everything they can to field a winner.

That's the big point here. They're playing hardball on contracts with Fletcher and giving last chances to Brandon Meriweather.

At the end of the day, I think the Redskins, like 31 other teams are just a bunch of guys trying to do their jobs. But I would disagree that all teams do their jobs equally well. And too often, I think they lose sight of the ultimate goal of winning and get caught in petty battles with veteran players.

You're free to totally disregard that opinion as useless, I could care less.[/quote]

Then why stay a fan? Go find another team. You live in fawking MI what does it matter.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899486]No, I would not try to tell you LaRon would be cheaper.

The big question is: what is he competing with? Who are the Redskins bringing in to make Meriweather earn his way onto the field?

[B]To react to this signing before we have those important details is difficult.[/B][/quote]

And yet you have already claimed it is a downgrade. He will be competing with whoever we draft this year. I have no doubt in my mind that we will spend at least 1 if not 2 picks on safety in the draft this year.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=mredskins;899491]Then why stay a fan? Go find another team. You live in fawking MI what does it matter.[/quote]Does it frustrate you that I'm not going to take that advice?

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=mredskins;899491]Then why stay a fan? Go find another team. You live in fawking MI what does it matter.[/quote]

What difference does it make where he lives?

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=SkinzWin;899492]And yet you have already claimed it is a downgrade. He will be competing with whoever we draft this year. I have no doubt in my mind that we will spend at least 1 if not 2 picks on safety in the draft this year.[/quote]On Landry, sure is. We already know that.

I hope they're going harder on the free agent market than simply waiting around for the draft, but I suppose that's better than no plan at all.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=mredskins;899491]Then why stay a fan? Go find another team. You live in fawking MI what does it matter.[/quote]

I have to side with GTripp for once on this. What difference does it make where he lives? You telling me someone can't be a fan just because they don't live in the greater DC area?

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

Wonder if the Skins put Meriweather at FS (where he excelled in NE) or SS (where he failed at in NE)?

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

Brandon Meriweather signed, 2 yrs 6 million, per Schefter.


A lot cheaper than LL.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899495]On Landry, sure is. We already know that.

I hope they're going harder on the free agent market than simply waiting around for the draft, but I suppose that's better than no plan at all.[/quote]

But you just said this, "But until they consistently target a higher grade of player either in talent or character in free agency, I don't understand how you can say this."

How can they target a higher grade of player if no such player is there in FA? You can't fix everything in one year, especially if the players to do it are not there. How can you fault the team for not going hard enough to win, when there isn't anything there to win with in the first place? Your points seem contradictory to me IMO.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=Lotus;899480]Safety in 2012 probably will be like WR in 2011...we'll have little choice but to bring in a bunch of just-a-guys hoping that something sticks...and then struggle all year at the position.[/quote]I think if the Redskins had flipped their FA plan for safety and WR (being really aggressive and throwing money at safety, while being more selective at WR) I think it really would have worked out a lot better for them.

After Landry and Dwight Lowery though, there wasn't much there by way of quality starters, and I think that if they had got those two signed quickly, it would have turned a weakness into a strength at S, and we wouldn't be measurably worse off at WR.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

I hear this guy is a liability in coverage.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

You don't have to be from the DMV to be a fan of the redskins...

[B]Question:
Is Meriweather a FS or SS? Or will/does it matter? [/B]

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899503]I think if the Redskins had flipped their FA plan for safety and WR (being really aggressive and throwing money at safety, while being more selective at WR) I think it really would have worked out a lot better for them.

After Landry and Dwight Lowery though, there wasn't much there by way of quality starters, and I think that if they had got those two signed quickly, it would have turned a weakness into a strength at S, and we wouldn't be measurably worse off at WR.[/quote]

But just because those guys are available doesn't mean we have the means to make them come here. They could A) not want to come here, or B) not be willing to accept the offer we make them (and perhaps we didn't have enough caps space to make them the offer that would have ensured they came here).

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=SkinzWin;899502]But you just said this, "But until they consistently target a higher grade of player either in talent or character in free agency, I don't understand how you can say this."

How can they target a higher grade of player if no such player is there in FA? You can't fix everything in one year, especially if the players to do it are not there. How can you fault the team for not going hard enough to win, when there isn't anything there to win with in the first place? Your points seem contradictory to me IMO.[/quote]Maybe I'm guilty of not thinking this one out (so let me take responsibility for any inconsistencies first), but if they were willing to be creative (expand and look at all DBs), I do think they could have significantly upgraded a secondary that has been a weakness since 2009.

It just seems like they concluded that "the problems were our safeties, not our corners" which 1) ignores all the problems at corner, and 2) resulted in their first move being a tear down at the safety level before maybe they considered your point: that they were responsible for putting 2 of the best 5 safeties on the market.

And so after that, maybe Brandon Meriweather looks like a solution instead of another problem.

My impression is that the market isn't all that weak at safety, but assuming that bringing Atogwe and Landry back are non-starters, then we're best off finding value in the bargain bin.

I think the Redskins sometimes mischaracterize the problem (we haven't been able to cover the pass since before we got here), opting instead to find scapegoats (Landry and Atogwe, in this case). And I think we could all agree that given that premise, finding good solutions is much more difficult.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

Not impressed with this one. Just another body that will probably be a one year signing.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=vallin21;899505]You don't have to be from the DMV to be a fan of the redskins...

[B]Question:
Is Meriweather a FS or SS? Or will/does it matter? [/B][/quote]

im thinking SS. i want a true ballhawk back there at free. i think nelson could be that or look in the draft

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=SkinzWin;899507]But just because those guys are available doesn't mean we have the means to make them come here. They could A) not want to come here, or B) not be willing to accept the offer we make them (and perhaps we didn't have enough caps space to make them the offer that would have ensured they came here).[/quote]I think:

1) You're right

2) You have to account for that in your pre-FA plan, or you just might someday end up with DeJon Gomes and Brandon Meriweather as your starting safeties. But like I said, maybe this is the first domino.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=milellie111;899504]I hear this guy is a liability in coverage.[/quote]
That's an understatement. I thought he was the most overrated player in the league back when he'd make pro bowls with New England.

He has ZERO football IQ. Doughty will play over him.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899508]Maybe I'm guilty of not thinking this one out (so let me take responsibility for any inconsistencies first), but if they were willing to be creative (expand and look at all DBs), I do think they could have significantly upgraded a secondary that has been a weakness since 2009.

It just seems like they concluded that "the problems were our safeties, not our corners" which 1) ignores all the problems at corner, and 2) resulted in their first move being a tear down at the safety level before maybe they considered your point: that they were responsible for putting 2 of the best 5 safeties on the market.

And so after that, maybe Brandon Meriweather looks like a solution instead of another problem.

[B]My impression is that the market isn't all that weak at safety[/B], but assuming that bringing Atogwe and Landry back are non-starters, then we're best off finding value in the bargain bin.

I think the Redskins sometimes mischaracterize the problem (we haven't been able to cover the pass since before we got here), opting instead to find scapegoats (Landry and Atogwe, in this case). And I think we could all agree that given that premise, finding good solutions is much more difficult.[/quote]

Then name for me all of the FA talent that is unsigned that makes the group not weak.

I don't see how Landry and Atogwe are scapgoats. They didn't perform well. This is a performance league. You don't play well, someone else will take your job. Is it the Redskins organization's fault that those two players did not play well/could not stay on the field?

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=milellie111;899504]I hear this guy is a liability in coverage.[/quote]

Much like our last safety? (LL)




Weren't you the guy that tried to spam 10 posts in a row to be able to create a thread to show your photoshop skillz? Seems I recall a user ID like yours, but I could be horribly mistaken. If not, welcome to the board.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

I like the contract, but I'm iffy on the player. Pretty fair gamble, though.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=SkinzWin;899517]Then name for me all of the FA talent that is unsigned that makes the group not weak.

I don't see how Landry and Atogwe are scapgoats. They didn't perform well. This is a performance league. You don't play well, someone else will take your job. Is it the Redskins organization's fault that those two players did not play well/could not stay on the field?[/quote]After Atogwe, Landry, then Leonhard, Abdullah (MIN), Mike Adams (CLE), Chris Hope, Zbikowski, Chris Harris (of Detroit, Chicago).

Mostly league average guys. Nothing special. Although I thought we should have acted quicker on guys like Lowery and Pool, who would have been potential upgrades on Atogwe.

Scapegoat doesn't mean they performed well. It means that: we're keeping other parts who did not perform well, but we're getting rid of you because we determined you're the big problem.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899472]Ultimately, the reason they're letting him go elsewhere isn't because he's not important, but because they tired of his injuries and antics. I would argue that they're paid as coaches and front office guys and trainers to manage prima dona athletes, but maybe they're just collecting a paycheck.[/quote]

I don't like the "antics" but I suppose that part of the equation is not why the coaches gave up on him. I would suggest it was the constant injuries coupled with the refusal to seek reasonable treatment. Managing a prima dona is all well and good, but, when a player can't get on the field due to injuries and refuses to take the steps necessary to [I]get[/I] on the field, there are limits to what even the best coaches can do with prima donas.

I would suggest that there may be one or two prima donas left on the team (perhaps even in the defensive secondary - <cough> D. Hall <cough>) who are being "managed" by the coaches as well as could be expected.

I liked LL a lot for a lot of different reasons. At the same time, the man just didn't seem to be able to get and stay on the field. Frustrating as that is for me as a fan, I can only imagine that it must have been infuriating to the coaches.

Finally, in defense of GTripp (not that he needs it). The man (1) knows his sh**; and (2) doesn't sugar coat it. Deal. He may sometimes take the doom and gloom approach but he is never baseless in his opinions and is carefully accurate with his analysis. Something a lot of posters - whether they are wearing burgundy colored glasses or predicting the end of Skins' football as we know it - could learn from.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

He is only 5-11 and 200lb... it is no way he can FS. My question is why are people saying that signing marks the end of Landry...not that I want him back either.... at least until he is healthy to play a full season.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=GTripp0012;899525]After Atogwe, Landry, then Leonhard, Abdullah (MIN), Mike Adams (CLE), Chris Hope, Zbikowski, Chris Harris (of Detroit, Chicago).

Mostly league average guys. Nothing special. Although I thought we should have acted quicker on guys like Lowery and Pool, who would have been potential upgrades on Atogwe.

Scapegoat doesn't mean they performed well. It means that: we're keeping other parts who did not perform well, but we're getting rid of you because we determined you're the big problem.[/quote]

I agree that we could have moved more quickly on Lowery and/or Pool but I don't question the FO for not retaining Landry or Atogwe. Landry has missed far more games than he's played the past two seasons and has bucked team medical advice. Right or wrong, that would raise questions of loyalty and responsibility to me, not to mention long term durability.

For Atogwe, he was rarely healthy, coming off of a couple of seasons where he was less than 100% healthy as well. Also, when he played his performance was subpar.

If we were responsible for '2 of the 5 best safeties on the market' as you stated, that has a lot to say about the quality of the market and not much bad to say about us.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

hard to get excited about this signing, maybe the dude can rejuvinate his career, but the odds are that he's not much if anything better than Atogwe. I know he's more versatile.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

Come on guys, let's make merry and enjoy the merry weather.

/bad puns

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=bigdaddy2348;899533]He is only 5-11 and 200lb... it is no way he can FS. My question is why are people saying that signing marks the end of Landry...not that I want him back either.... at least until he is healthy to play a full season.[/quote]

if anything, SS are bigger than FS

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

We don't have many options and I'm glad there's a body at safety. A healthy Laron would be great, but he's not healthy and I don't blame the team or him for moving on. Maybe the market for him won't be great and he decides to come back.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

[quote=mredskins;899468][B]Exactly well put. It is not just GTripp I am frustrated with. I don't know what else folks want from this team; they seem to be doing everything they can to field a winner. [/B]

[B]They are just complaining to to complain. [/B]

When they go to heaven they will probably complain the clouds are to fluffy.[/quote]

Terrible post. What frustrates people like myself (who saw the glory days of this franchise) is this team just doesn't seem to have a plan or direction. The team has NO IDENTITY. Anyone can sit in the front office and bring in free agents. The winning organizations don't do it this way. Look at the Eagles last year? 8-8. Gibbs 2? ...all we did was bring in free agents and it got us 1 playoff win. Meanwhile teams like Baltimore, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Giants...they DRAFT and mold their players in THEIR systems. They add a piece here and there, not multiple pieces every year and hope something sticks. If they happen to let a guy go then guess what? Someone like Mike Wallace steps in and is on the verge of becoming a great player. Meanwhile, when our 36 year old LB or our often injured safety aren't being resigned and there's NO ONE ready to step in to take their spots. It's go out and overpay for Josh Morgan or bring in a below average player like Merriweather. That's pathetic IMO.

Re: Redskins Sign S Brandon Meriweather
 

We could still offer Laron. If he is healthy, him and Brandon wouldnt be a bad duo. Laron problem is he wants to get paid, even though he hasnt performed and thats a problem.