Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1058928]Cousins is certainly replaceable. He would probably be replaced by a veteran journeyman. But you still don't give him away because, unlike the player that is likely to replace him, Cousins has upside and that upside has value.

You either get the deal you want for him or you keep him.[/quote]

Well put KI!

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

Hey Kirk, you like purple?

[url=http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/40429/Norv-Turner-says-Vikings-will-add-a-young-quarterback/Default.aspx]Norv Turner says Vikings will add a young quarterback[/url]

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1058882]I wasn't being serious about Campbell, but based on the Kirk Cousins performance scale JC looks pretty darn average. Extra medium, the Kirk Cousins craze.[/quote]Jason Campbell got outplayed here by Todd Collins. Who later looked horrible in Chicago with a shaky offensive line. Not long after that Jason Campbell looked pretty bad in Chicago even though the line had gotten better.

It'lll be interesting to see who ends up being better Cousins or Campbell, but Campbell for first round pick was a bust.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;1058973]Hey Kirk, you like purple?

[url=http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/40429/Norv-Turner-says-Vikings-will-add-a-young-quarterback/Default.aspx]Norv Turner says Vikings will add a young quarterback[/url][/quote]

I think the Vikings will probably turn to the draft, because with the 8th overall pick there's going to be some good QBs still available.

While we're discussing the Vikings; I think they're going to be a rebound team this year. Mike Zimmer will undoubtedly help their defense, and Norv Turner has shown he is a good OC. With Peterson, Patterson, and a new QB(possibly Manziel), they'll have a potentially explosive offense. Also, the NFC North isn't exactly stacked with good teams. I think Minnesota will finish with 9-10 wins next season.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

What if we were to trade Kirk to Kyle in Cleveland since he loves him so much, throw in a pick here and there and nab watkins for our reciever we need.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1058928]Cousins is certainly replaceable. He would probably be replaced by a veteran journeyman. But you still don't give him away because, unlike the player that is likely to replace him, Cousins has upside and that upside has value.

You either get the deal you want for him or you keep him.[/quote]

This.

Anybody who thinks differently than this should reevaluate their conclusions. Thankfully I [I]believe[/I] our front office is on the same page... Seeing Cousins go without due compensation is something i'd be furious about.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/news/washington-redskins-could-kirk-cousins-traded-minnesota-vikings-192400090--nfl.html]Washington Redskins: Could Kirk Cousins Get Traded to the Minnesota Vikings?[/url]

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=HailGreen28;1058975]Jason Campbell got outplayed here by Todd Collins. Who later looked horrible in Chicago with a shaky offensive line. Not long after that Jason Campbell looked pretty bad in Chicago even though the line had gotten better.

It'lll be interesting to see who ends up being better Cousins or Campbell, but Campbell for first round pick was a bust.[/quote]

No comparisons IMO between Campbell and Cousins. I'd have to say that Cousins is the better QB.

All i remember from JC's time here is that he sucked....was never a guy who could win games for you...they constantly tried to replace him and failed....first with Mark Sanchez, then with Jay Cutler. They finally settled to keep him as starter because there was nobody else. Maybe thats another case of Snyder telling the coaches "JC Starts no matter what". Because it sure seemed like that.

I'd be surprised if he is in the NFL beyond next year....

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1058928]Cousins is certainly replaceable. He would probably be replaced by a veteran journeyman. But you still don't give him away because, unlike the player that is likely to replace him, Cousins has upside and that upside has value.

You either get the deal you want for him or you keep him.[/quote]booya!

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

Campbell has proven to be a good backup. Cousins has barely proved that yet.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=CrazyCanuck;1058991][url=http://sports.yahoo.com/news/washington-redskins-could-kirk-cousins-traded-minnesota-vikings-192400090--nfl.html]Washington Redskins: Could Kirk Cousins Get Traded to the Minnesota Vikings?[/url][/quote]

This article presents a reasonable scenario, IMO. I'm wondering if Kirk Cousins will be traded on draft day. A team that misses out on its 1st round target(s) might agree to trade a 2nd or 3rd round pick for Kirk.

Kirk could do a lot worse than working and developing under Norv Turner.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1059014]This article presents a reasonable scenario, IMO. I'm wondering if Kirk Cousins will be traded on draft day. A team that misses out on its 1st round target(s) might agree to trade a 2nd or 3rd round pick for Kirk.

Kirk could do a lot worse than working and developing under Norv Turner.[/quote]

There aren't any hot quarterbacks to miss on in this draft though. I have to assume he'd be traded before the draft.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1059014]This article presents a reasonable scenario, IMO. I'm wondering if Kirk Cousins will be traded on draft day. A team that misses out on its 1st round target(s) might agree to trade a 2nd or 3rd round pick for Kirk.

Kirk could do a lot worse than working and developing under Norv Turner.[/quote]

If they part with Cousins does that mean Rex Grossman comes back. I already saw one article where a few teams were interested in Grossman as a temporary starter / veteran presence...

To me it doesn't make sense that Grossman comes back since both Shanahans are gone. They will need a veteran backup or project QB type player.

Laugh at me but i still think it would be crazy for this team to not have a capable No. 2 QB. Lots of unanswered questions about RG3 between his health, performance, etc......

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

We need to keep 3 QBs on the roster. Especially if we trade Cousins.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;1059019]If they part with Cousins does that mean Rex Grossman comes back. I already saw one article where a few teams were interested in Grossman as a temporary starter / veteran presence...

To me it doesn't make sense that Grossman comes back since both Shanahans are gone. They will need a veteran backup or project QB type player.

Laugh at me but i still think it would be crazy for this team to not have a capable No. 2 QB. Lots of unanswered questions about RG3 between his health, performance, etc......[/quote]
If Griffin gets hurt again, does it really matter if the team is losing with Cousins or someone like Christian Ponder? Losing is losing.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=GTripp0012;1059034]If Griffin gets hurt again, does it really matter if the team is losing with Cousins or someone like Christian Ponder? Losing is losing.[/quote]It mattered in 2012, when Griffin was hurt and we were fighting for the NFCE.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

We went decades without a qb. Now we have two that i would feel comfortable with starting. Why not keep them both? It took both of them to win the East two years ago. Jmho.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=HailGreen28;1059038]It mattered in 2012, when Griffin was hurt and we were fighting for the NFCE.[/quote]

Too fans fans around here act like starters don't get hurt or assume they'll play well. The best teams in the NFL have depth.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=HailGreen28;1059038]It mattered in 2012, when Griffin was hurt and we were fighting for the NFCE.[/quote]You don't think Christian Ponder could beat that Cleveland team?

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=GTripp0012;1059047]You don't think Christian Ponder could beat that Cleveland team?[/quote]Do you think Ponder would rack up 26-of-37 for 329 yards and two TDs that game?

Cousins is better than ponder no doubt

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=HailGreen28;1059048]Do you think Ponder would rack up 26-of-37 for 329 yards and two TDs that game?[/quote]He could.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

Ponder career QBR: 77.3
Cousins career QBR: 68.6

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

The Redskins do not need to keep two quarterbacks in order to be super bowl contenders. They need as many picks as they can get in order to build up the team, and if Cousins can be dealt for a top 100 pick, I would jump on that trade immediately.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1059049]Cousins is better than ponder no doubt[/quote]

Cousins is not good, at all. Look at the numbers.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1059091]Cousins is not good, at all. Look at the numbers.[/quote]

The team was in disarray at the end of the season, in fact I think it's safe to say any qb not named PManning/TBrady would have had terrible numbers.

I think the book is still to be written on Cousins, but I would be fine if it's written somewhere else if we get a 2nd or high 3rd in exchange for publishing rights.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1059099]The team was in disarray at the end of the season, in fact I think it's safe to say any qb not named PManning/TBrady would have had terrible numbers.

I think the book is still to be written on Cousins, but I would be fine if it's written somewhere else if we get a 2nd or high 3rd in exchange for publishing rights.[/quote]

I would take a 4th, 5th, 6th or 7th.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1059102]I would take a 4th, 5th, 6th or 7th.[/quote]

I'd just hold on to him if we're talking those kind of picks.

I know you're not a fan of him, but just like some here seriously overvalue him, I think you're undervaluing him a bit by suggesting giving him away for next to nothing.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

Cousins is very replaceable. We need to take what we can get for him now (I think Bruce could steal a 2nd), and sign a backup in FA or draft one in the mid rounds.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Mattyk;1059117]I'd just hold on to him if we're talking those kind of picks.

I know you're not a fan of him, but [B]just like some here seriously overvalue him, I think you're undervaluing him a bit by suggesting giving him away for next to nothing.[/B][/quote]

IMO you are correct. There is a lot of overvaluing and some undervaluing of Cousins on the Warpath.

He has value because of youth and because of starter experience, some of which was successful. Therefore we should get good value in a trade, not a 7th rounder.

But his career numbers are not just below, but far below, some of the other folks who can hold a backup job for us. Interestingly, someone close to him in career numbers is Rex Grossman:
Cousins 68.6 QBR, 56.2 comp.%, 6.5 YPA, 8 TD, 10 INT
Grossman 71.4 QBR, 55.2 comp.%, 6.6 YPA, 56 TD, 60 INT

Thus Cousins COULD be the next Rex Grossman in terms of having a few bright moments in an otherwise mediocre track record. His stock is good but not sky high.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

I don't under value him, I jsut don't think what he can do on the field is worth the nuisance he causes off the field. Cousins brings media baggage. Shanny did that on purpose, cut bait. Just like Haynesworth we should have just admitted it as a loss and moved on. That 4th round pick for Cousins is a loss. Let's move on.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1059160]I don't under value him, I jsut don't think what he can do on the field is worth the nuisance he causes off the field. Cousins brings media baggage. Shanny did that on purpose, cut bait. Just like Haynesworth we should have just admitted it as a loss and moved on. That 4th round pick for Cousins is a loss. Let's move on.[/quote]

That statement by definition os undervaluing. What media baggage does Cousins really bring? That whole start Cousins thing was more dumbass fans then it was media. Saying you would take a 7th round pick for him is undervaluing him.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Mattyk;1059117]I'd just hold on to him if we're talking those kind of picks.

I know you're not a fan of him, but just like some here seriously overvalue him, I think you're undervaluing him a bit by suggesting giving him away for next to nothing.[/quote]

I'm with Matty on this. If we can't get a 2nd or higher for KC, I'd just hold onto him.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

Since everyone here seems to be obsessed with stats, I would look at it like a general manager would. Probably wouldn't judge him too much on mop up duty, pre season, nor the rainstorm against the Giants. I'm looking closely at his 3 starts against Cleveland, Atlanta and Dallas. What do you see there? A lot of accurate balls that come out quick, good mobility, sees the field pretty good. The weakness I see is he throws late and behind guys. That's where he's got in trouble a bit. Pretty common for a young guy. That's correctable. I see a lot more good than bad in those starts.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

My point is media baggage like Tebow, articles about what he wants and what ex-coaches think. Matt Schaub is way better, for a back up Schaub is pretty young. Cousins wants to start and RG3 is the Redskins starting QB. Let him go find a starting spot. Maybe he could back up Lorenzen? We might get a 4th for him, what we spent. Let's not get caugt up in trying to redeem another wasted Shannhan pick. He think he is supposed to compete for a starting job, then let him go compete. So I can laugh.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1059180]My point is media baggage like Tebow, articles about what he wants and what ex-coaches think. Matt Schaub is way better, for a back up Schaub is pretty young. Cousins wants to start and RG3 is the Redskins starting QB. Let him go find a starting spot. Maybe he could back up Lorenzen? We might get a 4th for him, what we spent. Let's not get caugt up in trying to redeem another wasted Shannhan pick. He think he is supposed to compete for a starting job, then let him go compete. So I can laugh.[/quote]

Are you actually comparing the media circus around Tebow to what the media does around Kirk Cousins? They arent even close. Not even remotely close. We had as many articles about Grossman when he was the primary backup, which to say wasnt much. You have taken one article and claimed it to be what goes on around Tebow, which is a ridiculous overstatement.

Matt Schaub is also 32, will be 33 before the season starts, thats not exactly young by NFL standards. He also hasnt been released by the Texans. Its assumed he will be, but no guarantees. The fact is, any young QB that has potential has value in todays NFL.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

Please allow me to spit the words you put in my mouth back out. I am not comparing Cousins media irritations to Tebow's. Tebow's baggage is more but Cousins carries baggage none the less. It' an implied QB controversy and we don't need that. It's a Shanny created mess and we should move on from that. You want a younng QB with potential, there are others without the history aka baggage of Cousins. I said Schaub was young for a back up QB. You normally have older vets as back up QBs, not a young starter playing behind another young starter (for those who think Cousins is a starter).

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1059186]Please allow me to spit the words you put in my mouth back out. I am not comparing Cousins media irritations to Tebow's. Tebow's baggage is more but Cousins carries baggage none the less. [B]It' an implied QB controversy and we don't need that. [/B]It's a Shanny created mess and we should move on from that. You want a younng QB with potential, there are others without the history aka baggage of Cousins. I said Schaub was young for a back up QB. You normally have older vets as back up QBs, not a young starter playing behind another young starter (for those who think Cousins is a starter).[/quote]

Really? I don't see any QB controversy at all. RGIII is the starter, period, and everyone knows that.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

[quote=Lotus;1059188]Really? I don't see any QB controversy at all. RGIII is the starter, period, and everyone knows that.[/quote]

Everybody except Cousins.

Re: Cousins Open to Trade.
 

This thread is all kinds of stupid