Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1095890]Im not saying that Griff wouldnt or wont benefit from being benched. Im saying that it worked for Rodgers and Young because they were mentored by hall of famers and not Colt Mccoy. Im really just picking on the first paragraph of your post because .... Well... We arent in that situation. At all.
The rest of your post I totally agree with. I didnt want Griff playing until after the Bucs game and that was only if we were out of the playoff hunt at that point. I was never in the "gotta let him play to learn camp". I think that was and is a stupid way of going about things.


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Farve didn't mentor anyone and didn't play the big brother role. Neither did Montana. I think those guys sat, watched and learned and took it upon themselves to be successful. Plus Rodgers has elite skills. If Rodgers was in this offense, all the Wr's would be happy and this would be a top 3 offense.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;1095891]Farve didn't mentor anyone and didn't play the big brother role. Neither did Montana. I think those guys sat, watched and learned and took it upon themselves to be successful. Plus Rodgers has elite skills. If Rodgers was in this offense, all the Wr's would be happy and this would be a top 3 offense.[/QUOTE]


I agree 100 %. Mentor is a bad word. I thought about that but My point was there isnt anyone there to learn from. No qb ever wants to be a mentor, they want to continue to be a starter.
Rodgers and young both had elite skills, and I alluded to that in my previous post.


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1095892]I agree 100 %. Mentor is a bad word. I thought about that but My point was there isnt anyone there to learn from. No qb ever wants to be a mentor, they want to continue to be a starter.
Rodgers and young both had elite skills, and I alluded to that in my previous post.


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So what you are saying is your posts are all about you and you thinking you are always right....right?

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=Defensewins;1095888]You are missing the point....Give him time to learn. Don't throw him to the wolves.[/quote]

Give him time to learn? Why? He jumps in the air when he throws the ball. He pats and double clutches constantly. He's still back peddling. He's taking very high number of sacks. He still never throws the ball on time or on his 5th step. All this after 34 starts. He's not learned anything, he's getting worse. Garçon, Jackson and the o-line probably want to kill the guy by now. He's just not a very good QB and he handcuffs the offense. 100 passing yards with our wr's is laughable. Gruden knows he sucks. He sees him everyday. Only reason he starts against Indy is cause of Napoleon.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=Defensewins;1095893]So what you are saying is your posts are all about you and you thinking you are always right....right?[/QUOTE]


Lol....remind me to add you to my "to angry to talk to list". Actually my posts were about Steve Young, Aaron Rodgers, and RG-3. You have every right to disagree. Lol.


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;1095894]Give him time to learn? Why? He jumps in the air when he throws the ball. He pats and double clutches constantly. He's still back peddling. He's taking very high number of sacks. He still never throws the ball on time or on his 5th step. All this after 34 starts. He's not learned anything, he's getting worse. Garçon, Jackson and the o-line probably want to kill the guy by now. He's just not a very good QB and he handcuffs the offense. 100 passing yards with our wr's is laughable. Gruden knows he sucks. He sees him everyday. Only reason he starts against Indy is cause of Napoleon.[/QUOTE]


So you are saying you are better than me?!??????
Lmao


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Think how hard it is in today's NFL to pass for 100 yards.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;1095898]Think how hard it is in today's NFL to pass for 100 yards.[/QUOTE]


Yeah and I know our wr's and rb are not the problem. Our oline might be pretty terrible but yeah man....100 yards. That is tough to do. I do not watch or study these play breakdown sites, but Griff had to have missed a handful of wide open wr's.


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

I always felt that Rex was kept for the 2012 and 2013 seasons as a mentor. IMO the game has changed. The expectations is that a QB will learn through a few growing pains while starting this is not a Snyder issue it is the NFL norm. Also it is not to much to expect the 2nd overall pick to be playing like a perennial all pro.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1095751]Need a new coach? Unreal.




Here is something to note. It's not the offensive line.


[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B3LsCxZIMAALzfq.png:large[/IMG][/quote]

Sorry but that is one stat list that depending on circumstance can be 100% meaningless or misleading. Look at the top of that list most of those guys are
known as running QBs or highly mobile they are known for holding the ball longer than average believing they can extend plays, those same guys get sacked at a high rate. Look at who is at the bottom, human statue Peyton Manning who drops back to point X and either throws to the open man, throws a receiver open, or the ball away quickly as he knows his immobility gives him limited time. That list pretty much reflects the tendency of those on it not how good or bad the teams pass blocking is. Would you look at that list and say Denver's O-line should get an F grade in pass blocking? I would think not, it of course is the result of a stationary quick thinking quarterback.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1095906]Sorry but that is one stat list that depending on circumstance can be 100% meaningless or misleading. Look at the top of that list most of those guys are
known as running QBs or highly mobile they are known for holding the ball longer than average believing they can extend plays, those same guys get sacked at a high rate. Look at who is at the bottom, human statue Peyton Manning who drops back to point X and either throws to the open man, throws a receiver open, or the ball away quickly as he knows his immobility gives him limited time. That list pretty much reflects the tendency of those on it not how good or bad the teams pass blocking is. Would you look at that list and say Denver's O-line should get an F grade in pass blocking? I would think not, it of course is the result of a stationary quick thinking quarterback.[/quote]

Good post, agree

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=Buffalo Bob;1095906]Sorry but that is one stat list that depending on circumstance can be 100% meaningless or misleading. Look at the top of that list most of those guys are

known as running QBs or highly mobile they are known for holding the ball longer than average believing they can extend plays, those same guys get sacked at a high rate. Look at who is at the bottom, human statue Peyton Manning who drops back to point X and either throws to the open man, throws a receiver open, or the ball away quickly as he knows his immobility gives him limited time. That list pretty much reflects the tendency of those on it not how good or bad the teams pass blocking is. Would you look at that list and say Denver's O-line should get an F grade in pass blocking? I would think not, it of course is the result of a stationary quick thinking quarterback.[/QUOTE]


Kirk is also on that list at 33 with the same Oline. I'm with the same thinking as you, that list shows how fast the QB decides on the play, more so than how much time the line is supplying the QB.

And with that line of thinking Kirk is in the top of the list as far as assessing the play and making a quick decision. Really kind of makes me wonder what he still may be able to do in this offense. If Robert shows no progress for the next 2-3 games I say go back to Kirk. I'd rather him out there than Colt. If they can help him with the turnovers he could be a very serviceable QB for a few years.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=mlmdub130;1095918]Kirk is also on that list at 33 with the same Oline. I'm with the same thinking as you, that list shows how fast the QB decides on the play, more so than how much time the line is supplying the QB.

And with that line of thinking Kirk is in the top of the list as far as assessing the play and making a quick decision. Really kind of makes me wonder what he still may be able to do in this offense. If Robert shows no progress for the next 2-3 games I say go back to Kirk. I'd rather him out there than Colt. If they can help him with the turnovers he could be a very serviceable QB for a few years.[/QUOTE]


I think the int's and throws that should have been int's probably have something to do with that. After all both he and Griff have far less of a sample size to draw these numbers from.
Colt Mccoy is 2-0 and to me has been by far the most effective qb. None of them are probably the long term answer but we should have stuck with the winning hand after the Dallas game. This season might not be over.


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Go ahead and put Kirk back in. He throws picks before he is hit.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Who is calling for Kirk? Anyone?

I am just pointing out that the same criteria you used for Cousins to judge his success: Wins.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Give RG3 one more year, use every means possible to get 2 better starting guards and Right Tackle (high draft picks/free agents), draft/sign a couple secondary players, and lets see how it pans out.

RG3 has so much talent, just seems crazy they he can't improve, even though it kinda looks that way right now.

We're not winning the super bowl next year anyways, have a few holes that need to be filled.

There are a lot of bad teams in the NFL this year, we would probably have to trade up again to get Marriota/Winston.

Would any other qb be anywhere near worth picking in the top 10?

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=KI Skins Fan;1095879]Of course not. I just tried to make a joke about being a Redskins fan. If you're going to get kicked in the balls each week then you might as well learn to like it. Bad attempt on my part.[/QUOTE]


I was kidding too and I figured no one on this site would wish this on anyone other than a Cowboys fan.


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=Gary84Clark;1095920]Go ahead and put Kirk back in. He throws picks before he is hit.[/QUOTE]


He also throws for 300 yards and around 21 points. I'm not calling for him to come in and save anything, but IF RG is pulled in the next few games I would much rather see Cousins out there not McCoy. And that's based solely on the unknown of Cousins ability to learn from his mistakes. Maybe this benching opened his eyes to something. And yes I'm clearly grasping here, not much else to do these day.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=mlmdub130;1095966]He also throws for 300 yards and around 21 points. I'm not calling for him to come in and save anything, but IF RG is pulled in the next few games I would much rather see Cousins out there not McCoy. And that's based solely on the unknown of Cousins ability to learn from his mistakes. Maybe this benching opened his eyes to something. And yes I'm clearly grasping here, not much else to do these day.[/quote]

Interesting stats. What I find interesting is that KC throws for those yards with the same O-Line that RG cant get get the ball out with. I know its not all one or the other but somehow KC got the ball out while RG cant.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Got play RGIII out this year. We have to due our complete due diligence on him. Then in the off season decide what to do at QB.

KC and Colt are not the long term and at this point probably not RGIII either but he does have the talent to turn it around.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1095926]have a few holes that need to be filled.

[/quote]

Giggity

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=mredskins;1095969]Got play RGIII out this year. We have to due our complete due diligence on him. Then in the off season decide what to do at QB.

KC and Colt are not the long term and at this point probably not RGIII either but he does have the talent to turn it around.[/quote]

Yeah. I agree. It's not conceding a loss, it's giving him an in-game chance under the new regime. I understand guys may be upset, but, ultimately, the team needs to know if this guy can step up.

We know what KC is right now, we know what Colt was, is, and is likely to be. Griffin needs to play, Gruden needs to let him, and the FO needs to not hold it against Gruden if Griffin fails.

Grit your teeth, hope for the best, and grind it out.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

I much rather see Cousins throw for 300+ yards and 3 picks than the shit show I have watched the last 2 weeks. There are plenty of great QB's that started there careers off throwing alot of picks. At least he can read a defense, and knows the difference between a 3 and 5 step drop.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=Brody81;1096012]I much rather see Cousins throw for 300+ yards and 3 picks than the shit show I have watched the last 2 weeks. There are plenty of great QB's that started there careers off throwing alot of picks. At least he can read a defense, and knows the difference between a 3 and 5 step drop.[/quote]

Charlie Casserly was on Doc Walkers show yesterday saying that you cant hold all picks against the QB because we dont know what the coach has told him. CC said some coaches tell their QB to throw it and not worry about picks because if you throw it we might get a pass interference of some other call. The really sad part is that that CC said RG was worse last week than vs Tampa.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

due dilligence on RGIII has been done. 30 games with no adaptation. Looking at the team as a whole - start McCoy for the rest of the year unless he shits the bed. Let Colt and Kirk battle it out in camp next year with another prospect.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=OnceWeWereKings;1096002]Giggity[/quote]

top notch! top notch!

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Season is over and a team should never try to lose but it does not benefit the team to put in a guy who has no future with the team and win 2 or 3 games.

RG3 Needs snaps. Let him play and see if he can mature.
If he does not show any signs of improvement or maturity then we have to look at other options at QB via the draft and having a top 5 pick will help.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

I say keep griff in for the simple, selfish reason of a few more games of value on the jersey I bought in '12. No more current players jerseys for this guy, though. Next I'm gonna get a Charles Mann Jersey.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Due diligence has ran its course with III... How long do we have to wait to see him develop into just a normal QB, 2 more years? Sorry, the NFL doesn't work that way... Jay and company have games to win now, they can't and shouldn't be expected to wait for something years down the road if it even comes at all... This is a win now league and you can't win in this league as long as RGIII is your starting QB... I loved the guy, had all the confidence in him in the world, but that ship has sailed... I still wish him luck, just not here... Time to move on...

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

I can't seem to accept that RGIII is done here -- not yet, at least. To be clear, nothing of the last few weeks has me thinking that he's going to be successful through the rest of this season -- the guy seems fractured to me. But I marvel at his athletic ability, he's an intelligent guy, and has the capacity to work hard (whether he does in the ways that count -- per the Steve Young interview -- I cannot say). These three traits ought to be a recipie for success although it is never guaranteed.

I am in the camp that you see how this plays out for at least the next game or so. If it appears that he's just been ruined mentally and he makes the kinds of mistakes that have plagued him the last two games, then I think you probably have to sit him (if only for his own good -- he's going to have a career-ending injury at this rate), and then see what you have in our backups. I really hope it doesn't come to that. I would be thrilled to see RGIII make a comeback this season and put up some good numbers from here on out. And I hope he is given that chance.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=OnceWeWereKings;1096027]I say keep griff in for the simple, selfish reason of a few more games of value on the jersey I bought in '12. No more current players jerseys for this guy, though. Next I'm gonna get a Charles Mann Jersey.[/QUOTE]


Yup my 21 jersey and 44 jersey transcend time. My 10 jersey...not so much...


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Now, about my Orakpo jersey.

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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=Defensewins;1095886]What happened to the good old days when a young QB that is not ready mentally to run a pro system sat on the bench and took the time to learn? Mentored by his coaches and other Qb's on the roster. It worked for Aaron Rodgers, it worked for Steve Young, it worked for our Joe Theismann and Mark Rypien and countless others.

For an NFL that profits $9 billion a year and for our team that is (what?) the second most profitable team team in the NFL; we can not wait? Why?
I guess Snyder has his panty's is a bunch?
I feel if RGIII had been given the time to sit after his ACL injury and allowed to start when he good physically and mentally ready we would most likely not be in the predicament. When I say mentally ready that means breaking him of all of his old bad habits and teaching him to run a pro system. Instead he was rushed back in.
Even now when it is clear RGIII is not mentally ready to run a Pro offense, we can not sit him because DS feels we have to WIN THE FUCKING RAMS TRADE!
Impatient little minds made this problem. Impatient little minds make it continue to happen.
RGIII is not going to play his way out to this. It takes coaching and breaking a ton of old bad habits he has had since his early playing days where he was always by far the best player on the field. Now that he is not the best player on the field and he can not win with just his athleticism he has hit a wall. NFL defenses will eat him up and spit him out until he learns to be a pro QB. .[/quote]

I agree about taking time to develop a guy, but these days he has to learn on the job. He needs actual playing time to improve, not practice reps at 3/4 speed with no real threat of contact.

I wouldn't toss in the towel on Griffin yet. At this time next year if he's still a mess fine, time to start moving on.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Robert Griffin may have to fail badly before he succeeds. If so, he's not done yet...he's just in a dark place.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[quote=Mattyk;1096036]I agree about taking time to develop a guy, but these days he has to learn on the job. He needs actual playing time to improve, not practice reps at 3/4 speed with no real threat of contact.

I wouldn't toss in the towel on Griffin yet. At this time next year if he's still a mess fine, time to start moving on.[/quote]

another whole year?!!

I'm a long suffering fan and hope the kid can turn it around, but there has to be a limit to continual ineptitude.

There are 52 other guys laying it on the line week in and week out.

Gruden will soon lose the entire team if the experiment doesn't start to show fruit soon.

I'd say he gets another half before the Hook comes out.

The next great loss we will have is that we won't be able to recruit any free agent worth their weight, if he's still playing this bad to end the year.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=JoeRedskin;1096035]Now, about my Orakpo jersey.

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Ill trade you two Haynesworth's and an autographed Polumbus playing card,.....


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk;1096036]I agree about taking time to develop a guy, but these days he has to learn on the job. He needs actual playing time to improve, not practice reps at 3/4 speed with no real threat of contact.



I wouldn't toss in the towel on Griffin yet. At this time next year if he's still a mess fine, time to start moving on.[/QUOTE]


This year next time? If he does stick around how about we at least cut ties before next season is a wash too if he is a mess. I mean that would be two full off seasons and what, almost 20 games? Eff that I want it to work but Im getting old and I want the Redskins to be relevant again before I want one player to be relevant again.


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Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

Wouldn't mind seeing Griffin back in 2015, but he should and probably will have to compete for the job. Problem is it seems everything always revolves around him. I'm sure everyone is just tired of As RG3 Turns. It's a distraction. He's not a bad guy, but not the kind of QB that can lead a franchise. He's just not good enough.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

People acting like RG3 is the only issue here, like if we solve the QB spot all our problems are solved? Get real folks we've got deep seeded issues. RG3 is just the face of it all, and partly the convenient scapegoat.

Re: 49ers Postgame Thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk;1096072]People acting like RG3 is the only issue here, like if we solve the QB spot all our problems are solved? Get real folks we've got deep seeded issues. RG3 is just the face of it all, and partly the convenient scapegoat.[/QUOTE]


Maybe, or maybe he is the one that nobody wants to believe is the problem. Think about it Matty - 2012 isnt that long ago. Everyone of us thought we had finally hit the jackpot. This is a hell of a pill to swallow. I really believe with every ounce of my being that Colt would have made the difference (notice I didnt say won, because it is not just about one guy), in each of the last three games. As piss poor as Griff was against San Fran - Colt puts this team over the hump. He puts us over the hump against Minny too imo. Also the Bucs. If Griff cannot keep the offense on the field that is trouble for our D. Maybe a decent QB doesnt make us world beaters, but we wouldnt be bottom feeders either. I dont know man, Im just trying to believe we arent as far away from competing as it seems.


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