Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235270]Yeah and some ex-players like Portis worry the fans would turn on Haskins if he struggled. This franchise is such a mess in so many ways. No plan and scared to act.[/quote]

You think this fanbase wouldn't turn on Haskins if he struggled this year?

It is absolutely true, we have no plan beyond "fire Gruden if he gets off to a bad start."

What is Dan and Bruce's plan, beyond making Gruden the scapegoat for all the team failures?

Next offseason they will hire another HC, most likely from a weak group of candidates because no sane man will want to work for Dan and Bruce.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=mooby;1235272]You think this fanbase wouldn't turn on Haskins if he struggled this year?

It is absolutely true, we have no plan beyond "fire Gruden if he gets off to a bad start."

What is Dan and Bruce's plan, beyond making Gruden the scapegoat for all the team failures?

Next offseason they will hire another HC, most likely from a weak group of candidates because no sane man will want to work for Dan and Bruce.[/quote]

I think most reasonable fans understand a rookie QB is going to struggle especially on a bad team.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Who cares if the fans turn on him? If he's mentally weak then he's not franchise material anyway. But I highly doubt that. His make up seems to let things roll off his back and get on w/the next play. I don't see someone that's mentally weak at all.

Look at Daniel Jones? He sure has cooled off. But at least the Giants are all in. And they benched a 2 time SB winner, yet we won't bench Keenum. What a joke.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1235280]Who cares if the fans turn on him? If he's mentally weak then he's not franchise material anyway. But I highly doubt that. His make up seems to let things roll off his back and get on w/the next play. I don't see someone that's mentally weak at all.

Look at Daniel Jones? He sure has cooled off. But at least the Giants are all in. And they benched a 2 time SB winner, yet we won't bench Keenum. What a joke.[/quote]

The Giants aren't lying to themselves like the Skins are. That's why they are all in with DJ.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235275]I think most reasonable fans understand a rookie QB is going to struggle especially on a bad team.[/quote]

Id like to think most reasonable fans would understand a rookie is going to struggle and its more about the process than results .... but how many fans are reasonable?

A percent of fans wanted him to start week 1, no matter what. Now a portion of fans think he is a bust because its being leaked hes not ready and its week 7.

We HAVE to play the rookie at least 5-7 games to see what we have. If they dont start him against the Bills or Jets ... it would sadly continue a long line of indefensible illogical decisions.

I think (and kinda hope) the Vikes roast us and the noise to not start Haskins is to loud to ignore.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235275]I think most reasonable fans understand a rookie QB is going to struggle especially on a bad team.[/quote]

I expect him to struggle.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1235269]Not if Bruce is still in charge, but as I was saying the other day from what I heard the FO is scared to play him because there is fear that if he looks bad the media will pressure the team to draft another QB and [B]that would cripple their reputation even more[/B][/quote]

I don't see how it can get any worse.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235270]Yeah and some ex-players like Portis worry the fans would turn on Haskins if he struggled. This franchise is such a mess in so many ways. No plan and scared to act.[/quote]

The organization is at the bottom of the league and it doesn't look good anytime soon. I hope we get a good coach that has control

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235270]Yeah and some ex-players like Portis worry the fans would turn on Haskins if he struggled. This franchise is such a mess in so many ways. No plan and scared to act.[/quote]

I am all for starting him against the Jets. I could care how many turnovers he has. I just want to see improved footwork and learning how to protect himself better. I can't see the fans turning on him after what we have seen from Case and Colt. This team is headed for 1-15 with either of those two, so what do we have to lose?

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1235305]I am all for starting him against the Jets. I could care how many turnovers he has. I just want to see improved footwork and learning how to protect himself better. I can't see the fans turning on him after what we have seen from Case and Colt. This team is headed for 1-15 with either of those two, so what do we have to lose?[/quote]

If he's not starting against NYJ coming out of the bye something is seriously not right with this situation.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235306]If he's not starting against NYJ coming out of the bye something is seriously not right with this situation.[/quote]

yeah because we should be 1-8 so there is no reason to hold him out after that bye

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

So we got to see the rookie tonight. Forget all the rumors and reports. I'm going by what my eyes tell me. And what they tell me is he is a mess. He can't even set his feet the right way when he throws the ball. He easily could have had another pick on the throw to AP. And of course the INT itself was just atrocious as Aikman pointed out his throwing mechanics are off. This was one of the things that was being reported, that he keeps throwing high. He has a real long way to go.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Haskins looked like complete shit. He can't even complete basic passes to open targets.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1235470]Haskins looked like complete shit. He can't even complete basic passes to open targets.[/quote]

As, I said in the game thread: He has poor mechanics and game seems to move too fast for him.

He could be fine in the end, but he only started for one season and he used his arm talent (which he definitely has) and the wildly, elite personnel around him at Ohio State. He's gonna need time in the NFL.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Obviously he needs a lot of work.

At this point it seems inevitable he will be starting at some point whether by injury or poor performance, so we might as well call Keenum's concussion a long term one and let Haskins take his lumps. Because it should be obvious to anyone with two eyes Haskins is going to take a lot of lumps as he is nowhere near ready.

My only concern at this point is what is surely going to amount to a terrible rookie season for Haskins translating into a poor career for him. But hey, if it happens it's because he's a bust, not because he never got time to learn (because he's clearly starting from square one as a pro qb).

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=PorkSkins;1235472]As, I said in the game thread: He has poor mechanics and game seems to move too fast for him.

He could be fine in the end, but he only started for one season and he used his arm talent (which he definitely has) and the wildly, elite personnel around him at Ohio State. [B]He's gonna need time in the NFL[/B].[/quote]

This should be obvious. I got 10 bucks that says if he plays like this for the rest of the year, we'll be drafting a qb next offseason and selling Haskins Josh Rosen style.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Yeah, can we put to bed once and for all that Haskins should be starting? He doesn't give this team a chance at all right now. If you want to lose the locker room, put him out there as the starter looking like he has the last two times he's played in a real game.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=mooby;1235477]This should be obvious. I got 10 bucks that says if he plays like this for the rest of the year, we'll be drafting a qb next offseason and selling Haskins Josh Rosen style.[/quote]

I'll add another 5 bucks to your 10 bucks, as I agree.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=mooby;1235477]This should be obvious. I got 10 bucks that says if he plays like this for the rest of the year, we'll be drafting a qb next offseason and [B]selling Haskins Josh Rosen style[/B].[/quote]

I don't see that happening. Rosen was light years ahead of where Haskins is right now.

Re: The Haskins Thread
 

In the full games’ worth of time he has played, he is 12-22 for 140 yards, 0 TD and 4 INT. Yeah, he didn’t get first team reps, but this was against the Giants pretty bad D and the Vikings very good D.

He’s nowhere near ready. I just hope this experience isn’t so searing that he can’t recover from it. I think he has some bad outings in his near future - and clearly needs an offseason of doing a lot of hard work to become an NFL QB.


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Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=Chief X_Phackter;1235481]I don't see that happening. Rosen was light years ahead of where Haskins is right now.[/QUOTE]



Right. What would we get for him? Who would give up as much as a 4th rounder?


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Re: The Haskins Threat
 

And Keenum was 12/16 for 130 yards in one half against that "very good D".

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=Chief X_Phackter;1235485]And Keenum was 12/16 for 130 yards in one half against that "very good D".[/QUOTE]



Agreed.


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Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235275]I think most reasonable fans understand a rookie QB is going to struggle especially on a bad team.[/quote]

You know Matty, normally I agree with you on most things but if this thread (before tonight's game) is evidence of anything it's that it doesn't matter how many reasonable fans are willing to stick by Haskins, there are already people here ready to declare Haskins a bust because he clearly needs serious development.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=Chief X_Phackter;1235479]Yeah, can we put to bed once and for all that Haskins should be starting? He doesn't give this team a chance at all right now. If you want to lose the locker room, put him out there as the starter looking like he has the last two times he's played in a real game.[/QUOTE]



A chance to what? Win and go 2-7? For what? Those players know he is (should be) the future. We have to see what he is or isn’t. He has to keep playing.

Re: The Haskins Thread
 

Did he play for OSU?

JUST CHECKING!

Dude was a bust from jump and we all knew that, we just wanted a little hope. Haskins wont be in the league in 3 years.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I don't know where the improvement is the coaches keep talking about. He looked worse than preseason by a country mile. His mechanics even seemed to get worse. Obviously the quicker speed and more confusing defenses of games that count caused the regression.

Don't know where I saw it but back when he was still playing there was a long piece on the development of Steve Young and how Bill Walsh coached him up. He said a QB relies on instincts when they are under pressure. One of Young's biggest faults was to take off running if his first read wasn't open and he saw a running lane. He said he would practice making all his reads, and was getting better at not taking off running too soon, yet when the pressure was on like being down late in a game, he would revert back to quickly looking to run.

Young said not until he practiced good habits over and over and over again to the point of exhaustion did the good habits become his instincts. The amount of repetitions that Walsh made him go through bordered on insanity.

So hopefully Haskins just needs time and obviously lots of it. Nobody thought the dumpster fire that was Steve Young early in his career would end up in the Hall of Fame. I am kind of amazed and how bad Haskins mechanics are.
You can get away with a lot as a college QB when you are lining up with guys who are far superior than the guys on the other side of the ball. Now Haskins is lining up with guys inferior to those defending them and it definitely shows.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I’ve seen enough .. if rumors are true and the Haskins pick was Snyder’s idea this may be what it takes for him to step aside hire a real football person to run this team .. I’m sorry I know some are hoping it will work out for the kid but for me I don’t think there is any chance he will succeed in this league.. we will have to wait and see if I am right but it does not look good ... and this is not after 1 game. He has been in the building for 6 months .. As bad as keenum is he is by far the best QB on roster .The entertainment value of this team is all the drama and the storylines not the on field performances.. it is what it is...

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Way too early to write him off. He's barely played.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Give the kid a chance for Pete's sake. He was able to get away with poor mechanics and a few other things at OSU because of a strong arm and superior teammates. It does appear college coaches don't stress mechanics and techniques these days if players are good enough in other areas to compensate.
It blows my mind when I see guys get to the pros with poor techniques that you would not have seen back in the day.

I kind of look at Haskins as the kid who got straight A's in High School without studying thinking he could do the same in College. When he found out otherwise it took him a while to adapt. I think he will be ok. I base my opinion on he isn't showing the traits that a lot of high draft pick bust QBs have.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1235512]
I kind of look at Haskins as the kid who got straight A's in High School without studying thinking he could do the same in College. When he found out otherwise it took him a while to adapt. I think he will be ok. I base my opinion on he isn't showing the traits that a lot of high draft pick bust QBs have.[/quote]

You started off right, but i have a completely different take on that analogy:

Haskins is like a kid who got straight A's in High School without studying thinking he could do the same in College. But when he found out otherwise, he realized he was in way over his head and questioned whether he made a mistake in going to College in the first place.

I do not think he will be ok. I base my opinion on the fact that he isn't showing a single one of the crucial traits that even mediocre high draft pick QBs have - confidence, leadership, effort, and a burning desire to improve.

Its not his performance on the field that makes me feel he is a bust. That can all be corrected with coaching. Its his actions and demeanor off the field. No coach can change that. He's got to want to do it himself, and he clearly doesn't.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I am not sure where you are getting that all the local guys say he is working his tail off in practice. That sounds like a guy who wants to improve to me and is the off the field demeanor I am looking for in an athlete.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

The thought of calling a guy a bust after limited action in two relief appearances is just absurd.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=punch it in;1235492]A chance to what? Win and go 2-7? For what? Those players know he is (should be) the future. We have to see what he is or isn’t. He has to keep playing.[/quote]

A chance to win. Isn't that what they go out to do? This whole notion that they have to find out what we have for next year is a bunch of BS. I think they already know what they have, and that's why he's not starting.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

We aren't winning with Keenum either. We are the Dolphins trying a real 2 point conversion play away from being 0-8. I'd rather lose watching Haskins.

My favorite play last night was win Keenum had a guy in the front of the endzone only 5 yards from him and he threw a 90 MPH spitball 2 yards into the ground. There was a penalty so it wouldn't have mattered, but that was terrible.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

And that doesn't mean he won't start eventually, he just isn't close to being ready right now.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Haskins needs to play period. Get him ready after the bye put in package that will accommodate his strength...it’s absolutely bullshit he can’t run a basic package.

Because BHA is right about the upcoming draft, if there is a can’t miss QB available...you should take him if Haskins just doesn’t have what it takes to be successful. In order to see “it”, Haskins has to play now.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

What really bothered me was there was a shot on the sidelines after a offensive series and Ko is sitting down w/ Case, there's Colt also in street clothes and those three were going over stuff. Where was Haskins? He wasn't in on the conversation at all. He's the backup, not Colt. Then I went back to what Lombardi was saying about him and that goes back to the culture thing. Then he goes out there and takes a terrible sack, has a terrible int and could have had another one.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=Chico23231;1235529][B]Haskins needs to play period. Get him ready after the bye put in package that will accommodate his strength...it’s absolutely bullshit he can’t run a basic package.[/B]

Because BHA is right about the upcoming draft, if there is a can’t miss QB available...you should take him if Haskins just doesn’t have what it takes to be successful. In order to see “it”, Haskins has to play now.[/quote]

I'm not so sure about that anymore. It's not even fair to the other players if he can't make the right calls that will keep him from getting sacked, or can't get his feet set to make simple throws.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1235525]We aren't winning with Keenum either. We are the Dolphins trying a real 2 point conversion play away from being 0-8. I'd rather lose watching Haskins.

My favorite play last night was win Keenum had a guy in the front of the endzone only 5 yards from him and he threw a 90 MPH spitball 2 yards into the ground. There was a penalty so it wouldn't have mattered, but that was terrible.[/quote]

Case is at least a functioning NFL QB. He isn't a very good one but he can at least do the basic shit and hit open wr's if he has a clean pocket. I almost see why the coaches just don't want Haskins out there. It's just not fair to the other 10 guys.