Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[QUOTE=Chico23231;1230893]Well Alex Smith trade was a poor choice to begin with, he wasn’t a good fit for Jays system and was knee jerk. Plus, we didn’t need to give the extension right away either until we saw how he played in it.



Multiple mistakes by Bruce and his band of idiots[/QUOTE]



Bruce has been one mistake and blunder after the other since arriving in Washington. He said it himself...,”you’re judged by your record”.

Well, Bruce, what’s your record since arriving here???


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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

For all I complain about BA and Snyder, there are stills rays of hope after the upcoming bad season.

1. Gruden and Manusky will be gone. Problem is with Snyder and his lackey, BA - what talented HC candidates would come to this franchise, with it’s meddling and poor leadership and continuing issues of this losing franchise? My guess is they’ll go for an internal candidate like O’Connell and hope he can be another Sean McVay.

2. Haskins will eventually be allowed to play and gain experience. He may be a future franchise QB the fans can get behind.

3. McLaurin and the rest of the young WR’s are the bright spot in the team. If McLaurin stays on track he could be a Rookie-of-the-Year candidate. But he’s going to need help from the other WR’s because teams will just double team him.

4. New HC could mean a cleaning out of the Redskin’s deadwood FA’s. Norman, Richardson and others will be gone, opening up cap room. Unfortunately, most likely, TW and Scherff will be gone too. Although they may franchise tag Scherff.

5. 2020 draft will be heavily concentrated on the OL. Everything else is rubbish. TW, Scherff and thankfully Moses will need to be replaced. If they draft well the team could have a young, solid OL.





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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[QUOTE=5superbowls3wins;1230869]At what point do we find CONTINUITY? Has anyone pondered where’d the Redskins be today if they had just paid Cousins early on, and kept DeSean and Garçon around in Gruden’s system? Years later, we’re all left with this mess, no continuity, or stability.



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Your CONTINUITY argument is spot on. When TW is gone, Kerrigan will be the only player who has more than 7 years on this team. NO ONE wants to stay here - the quality players and coaches go to more stable and better run franchises. The only players who are interested in the Redskins are those FA that want to CASH IN NOW

Until Snyder brings in a HC or GM and really gives them the reins to truly make the team a winner - nothing will change. Dan Snyder wants to personally direct the team using his front man Bruce Allen to run interference and take the blame. Unfortunately, neither Snyder or Allen understands how to win in the NFL.

As long as the team win 5,6,7 games, Snyder can rationalize that the team is just a key player or another year’s draft away from moving to the next level. The team’s personnel decisions are often short-sighted. Win NOW, instead of rebuilding and cleaning house in off seasons. This keeps the team universally mediocre but never really bad.

Perhaps the team needs a really, really BAD season to get Snyder to wake up and give up controls to a true NFL professional. This might be the year.




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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[url]https://m.sfgate.com/49ers/article/Jalen-Ramsey-trade-Trent-Williams-John-Lynch-49ers-14473830.php[/url]

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;1231915][url]https://m.sfgate.com/49ers/article/Jalen-Ramsey-trade-Trent-Williams-John-Lynch-49ers-14473830.php[/url][/quote]

Do the 49ers have much draft capital? Didn't they trade their 2nd to the Chiefs? I can't see them giving up a 1st for TW unless they are desperate, given his age. If they give up a1st for Ramsey (worth it) then they have little to offer us except 2021 picks, which wouldn't itself be so bad.

Given BA's stance I find it hard to believe he'll trade TW for peanuts, and I can't see who gives up anything better than a 2nd and 3rd. Maybe with a decent player thrown in, that would be palatable.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

Part of me wants them to refuse to trade TW. Make him come back or forfeit a season of salary. Then extend him and do the same. He cannot play for another team for 2 years if we want to see to it, and by then he will be 33 and 2 years removed from football. His market goes down a lot at that point.

He’s been awesome for us and I would love to have seen him retire as a Redskin. But sitting and watching his team flounder without him is bullshit.

I half suspect Jay’s antagonism to AP is because he assumes he can influence what his friend does. It can’t be the man’s contributions.

The whole thing is such a farce. But with each passing week, I find myself getting more pissed at a player I really used to love, and I am sure I am not alone.


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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

I have no ill will towards TW he is taking his stand and paying the price. I also don’t see the point in the FO handling it poorly to make a point. Players see that and they talk they want to work with a FO that is fair and not vindictive.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[QUOTE=Warthog;1231016]Your CONTINUITY argument is spot on. When TW is gone, Kerrigan will be the only player who has more than 7 years on this team. NO ONE wants to stay here - the quality players and coaches go to more stable and better run franchises. The only players who are interested in the Redskins are those FA that want to CASH IN NOW

Until Snyder brings in a HC or GM and really gives them the reins to truly make the team a winner - nothing will change. Dan Snyder wants to personally direct the team using his front man Bruce Allen to run interference and take the blame. Unfortunately, neither Snyder or Allen understands how to win in the NFL.

As long as the team win 5,6,7 games, Snyder can rationalize that the team is just a key player or another year’s draft away from moving to the next level. The team’s personnel decisions are often short-sighted. Win NOW, instead of rebuilding and cleaning house in off seasons. This keeps the team universally mediocre but never really bad.

Perhaps the team needs a really, really BAD season to get Snyder to wake up and give up controls to a true NFL professional. This might be the year.




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Exactly. Tired of starting over every 4-5 years. New coaches, new system, new QB, yawn, yawn, yawn. The Skins have been “rebuilding” for 20 years. Everyone is always begging for changes. I’ve done the same thing.

At what point do we see continuity with a head coach, a system and a quarterback. Why do you think Bellecheck and Brady have had so much success?


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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

Maybe they’re holding onto TW, because they know he’ll show once Bruce Allen is gone and Allen’s day are numbered?


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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

I used like TW but not now. Has no honor.. you signed a contract. honor it low life. Id trade him to some crappy team...

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

The problem with BA playing tough and sending a “message”, is that it hurts the team in 2 ways:

1. The team needs either TW playing at LT or they need a First round draft pick to replace him. Right now the OL is a disaster and barely holding together. Since TW has proved that he will not play here, they need to trade him.

2. What message is BA sending other players on the Redskins, FA and their agents by playing tough with Allen? BA basic message is: “If he won’t play for us, he won’t play anywhere!!” This just confirms what the USA TODAY study on NFL GM’s said last year. Bruce Allen was voted LAST of the NFL’s GM’s for trustworthiness and preparation. Why come to a team where you can’t trust the GM? Why come to a team that would rather hold a petty grudge against a player than do what’s BEST for BOTH sides?

This holdout confirms what the NFL thinks of BA , Snyder and the Redskins franchise. Poorly run, chaotic, untrustworthy and a team that holds personal grudges. Why would a responsible FA come here? why would a homegrown player at the pro bowl level stay here? The answer is - they don’t. Scherff will leave. The only FA players that want to play for the Redskins is doing so in order to CASH IN on their previous playing ability. Most don’t play anywhere near their ability or hype. Mostly because BA and Snyder are poor judges of talent. Also, because this is just a way station in their FA career.

Let TW go while we can still get a very good draft pick for him!


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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

Didn't want a new thread and I picked his replacement 1st, so figured I would post it here:

3: R1P3 - OT ANDREW THOMAS - GEORGIA
67: R3P3 - TE JARED PINKNEY - VANDERBILT
109: R4P3 - LB JACOB PHILLIPS - LSU
142: R4P36 - OT YASIR DURANT - MISSOURI
149: R5P3 - CB TROY PRIDE JR. - NOTRE DAME
218: R7P3 - G DONELL STANLEY - SOUTH CAROLINA
219: R7P4 - S BRIAN COLE - MISSISSIPPI STATE

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

We could really use a 1st round draft pick for a TW trade..


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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1232630]Didn't want a new thread and I picked his replacement 1st, so figured I would post it here:

3: R1P3 - OT ANDREW THOMAS - GEORGIA
67: R3P3 - TE JARED PINKNEY - VANDERBILT
109: R4P3 - LB JACOB PHILLIPS - LSU
142: R4P36 - OT YASIR DURANT - MISSOURI
149: R5P3 - CB TROY PRIDE JR. - NOTRE DAME
218: R7P3 - G DONELL STANLEY - SOUTH CAROLINA
219: R7P4 - S BRIAN COLE - MISSISSIPPI STATE[/quote]

I think the Redskins will end up at #2. I don't see them out finishing anybody but Miami. If there are lots of quarterbacks in the draft teams are high on I think I would trade down for multiple picks.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=Warthog;1230906]For all I complain about BA and Snyder, there are stills rays of hope after the upcoming bad season.

1. Gruden and Manusky will be gone. Problem is with Snyder and his lackey, BA - what talented HC candidates would come to this franchise, with it’s meddling and poor leadership and continuing issues of this losing franchise? My guess is they’ll go for an internal candidate like O’Connell and hope he can be another Sean McVay.

2. Haskins will eventually be allowed to play and gain experience. He may be a future franchise QB the fans can get behind.

3. McLaurin and the rest of the young WR’s are the bright spot in the team. If McLaurin stays on track he could be a Rookie-of-the-Year candidate. But he’s going to need help from the other WR’s because teams will just double team him.

4. New HC could mean a cleaning out of the Redskin’s deadwood FA’s. Norman, Richardson and others will be gone, opening up cap room. Unfortunately, most likely, TW and Scherff will be gone too. Although they may franchise tag Scherff.

5. 2020 draft will be heavily concentrated on the OL. Everything else is rubbish. TW, Scherff and thankfully Moses will need to be replaced. If they draft well the team could have a young, solid OL.





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As long as Snyder continues to hire people from GM all the way down to toilet cleaner, whose primary responsibility is to kiss his ass, all we are ever doing is rearranging the furniture on the Titanic.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1232751]I think the Redskins will end up at #2. I don't see them out finishing anybody but Miami. If there are lots of quarterbacks in the draft teams are high on I think I would trade down for multiple picks.[/quote]

I say we get #1 at 1-15. We lose to Miami and then Jay goes home

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1232751]I think the Redskins will end up at #2. I don't see them out finishing anybody but Miami. If there are lots of quarterbacks in the draft teams are high on I think I would trade down for multiple picks.[/quote]

Good idea, they will need help almost everywhere. If they cannot get a first for Trent, then take a few high picks.

It is going to be a major rebuilding for a few years. Probably gone Norman, Reed, Davis, Keenum, McCoy, Peterson, Trent, Scherff, Kerrigan and more.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

With Diggs possibly unhappy in Minn. does anyone see a TW for Diggs swap possible?

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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1232792]With Diggs possibly unhappy in Minn. does anyone see a TW for Diggs swap possible?

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I'd be on the phone right now for it

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

I will admit I was wrong about Flowers, he's been really good so far... Who would have thought that Flowers would be out playing Scherff?? Unreal

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

This was a good read from an agent who dealt with BA in a previous holdout down in TB

[url]https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/agents-take-a-first-hand-look-at-redskins-gm-bruce-allen-handling-a-holdout-as-trent-williams-continues-to-sit/amp/?__twitter_impression=true[/url]

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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

I wouldn't mind trading down a couple spots but I want Andrew Thomas. I want to continue the stud streak at LT. Especially with young QB. Any other elite LTs out there this year?

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1232792]With Diggs possibly unhappy in Minn. does anyone see a TW for Diggs swap possible?

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According to an article I read in Hogshaven Trent Williams has an estimated wins added of less than 1. I imagine Diggs would be higer than that.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

The worst part of this ordeal is using another top 5 pick on a LT.
I would be great to use a top 5 pick on another bluechip skill position player like Sean Taylor or Champ Bailey.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

If we land where I think we'll land, you take Jeudy (OR Young) and call it a day. I'm fine with taking a later round tackle in a loaded OT draft. I know we're missing that second rounder, and it especially stings since it'll likely be a high pick, but man Jeudy or Young are generational talents.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=jamf;1232801]The worst part of this ordeal is using another top 5 pick on a LT.
I would be great to use a top 5 pick on another bluechip skill position player like Sean Taylor or Champ Bailey.[/quote]

One step forward two steps back

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

If we get a top 3 pick I'm taking Chase Young from OHST, He's a freak. Trade Kerrigan for a 3rd rounder

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[QUOTE=BaltimoreSkins;1232800]According to an article I read in Hogshaven Trent Williams has an estimated wins added of less than 1. I imagine Diggs would be higer than that.[/QUOTE]



Lunacy. Keeping your quarterbacks upright and healthy is worth more than one win.

Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[QUOTE=skinsfaninok;1232804]If we get a top 3 pick I'm taking Chase Young from OHST, He's a freak. Trade Kerrigan for a 3rd rounder[/QUOTE]



Andrew Thomas. But yeah Young is a freak. I think a change at DC is going to help our D tremendously. Manusky literally turns what should be a top 15 D into one of the worst. Just getting rid of that slob is going to help tremendously. We need to address O line big time. Draft a TE who loves to block. Also if Guice and Love are made of glass we need a solid RB. WR should be good. QB is obviously set although up in the air, but we made that bed so.....
There are ways out of this shit storm, and I mean in a year or two BUT not with BA at the helm. He needs to gtfo. That is the starting point for all things good to happen.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=punch it in;1232834]Lunacy. Keeping your quarterbacks upright and healthy is worth more than one win.[/quote]

I was surprised by the claim. I cannot find a nfl analytics similar to war in baseball. I imagine it exists. I will confess my research was somewhat limited. My internal dialogue went something like this “do I want to research nfl wins above replacement or visit the boobs thread?”

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1232800]According to an article I read in Hogshaven [B]Trent Williams has an estimated wins added of less than 1[/B]. I imagine Diggs would be higer than that.[/quote]

That is probably because the Redskins have so many weaknesses. If you are headed for 1-15 replacing a scrub with a stud isn't going to do much unless that position is QB.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

Trent doesn't solve the horrid defense. And Penn hasn't been bad at all.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

I remember someone, I think it was Cred, posting statistics and the drop off from Trent to penn was palatable.

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

When do les he have to show up before he forfeits the year?

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[QUOTE=OmahaRedskins;1232926]When do les he have to show up before he forfeits the year?[/QUOTE]Week 10.

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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1232751]I think the Redskins will end up at #2. I don't see them out finishing anybody but Miami. If there are lots of quarterbacks in the draft teams are high on I think I would trade down for multiple picks.[/quote]

I don't see what difference it makes with our FO, they could screw up a wet dream!

Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

Oct 25 is the last day for trading players. BA and Snyder are AGAIN showing their incompetence AND pettiness by not trading TW for much needed draft picks next year. If the Redskins don’t trade TW ASAP, his value will be less next season and he will STILL need to be replaced! Penn is just a bandaid and will be one year older. Scherff will also be gone as he has a gown NO INTEREST in getting a new contract here. Time to make a move - the clock is running.


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Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

Per JLC today:

"Washington has refused to trade holdout star left tackle Trent Williams to this point, baffling rival GMs who used adjectives like 'ridiculous', 'unbelievable' and 'backwards' to describe the team's approach to that situation. Still, some believe owner Dan Snyder will relent at some point this month with his franchise spiraling. Could that prompt him to deal stalwart end Ryan Kerrigan as well? If so, there would be serious interest."

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

They should look to move all the vets for picks

Re: Trent Williams holding out for new deal
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1233298]Per JLC today:

"Washington has refused to trade holdout star left tackle Trent Williams to this point, baffling rival GMs who used adjectives like 'ridiculous', 'unbelievable' and 'backwards' to describe the team's approach to that situation. Still, some believe owner Dan Snyder will relent at some point this month with his franchise spiraling. Could that prompt him to deal stalwart end Ryan Kerrigan as well? If so, there would be serious interest."[/quote]

Trade them both, add Norman and Moses while they are it. Fuck TW, he didn’t give a shit about the fans.