Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

To kind of move away from that a bit, it looks like if anything we have two receivers that, even if they don't catch the ball, are sure to cause pass interference.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Schneed10;239987]It's very possible for people to enjoy the win and at the same time be realistic about isolating Brunell's performance within a great win, and calling a spade a spade. He did just enough for us to win today, with some help from some Cowboy defenders who dropped some INTs.

But if I can comment, it will be a sad day when the Warpath stifles the opinions of others because they choose to examine Brunell in a manner that is not entirely positive in spite of a victory.[/quote]

Agreed. The only thing I noticed yesterday that was different from Brunell all season, was that he didn't thow it away as much. That's all fine and good, but had he played that way in the previous five losses, maybe Washington wouldn't be sitting at 3-5.

And on another note, if Brunell is deserving of a thread dedicated soley to giving him props, then so is Portis. While Brunell threw for two yards less than Dallas' average passing yards allowed per game, Portis actually ran for four yards more than what Dallas gives up. Where are his props?

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Mattyk72;239997]I think you're confusing rational criticism, which is fine, with idiotic criticism which is just that, idiotic.

Brunell didn't play great yesterday, but I thought he played well enough and we saw him go down the middle of the field which we've all wanted all season.

If someone wants to pick apart his performance in a rational manner that's perfectly fine with me. But for example when people are bashing him for the way he took a sack, that's just ridiculous to me.

Or the botched shotgun snap which could have easily been a premature snap and not his fault.

There are a few people right now that just have it out for him no matter what he does, and that's what I have a problem with. If someone hates the guy fine, but if someone can't get on board for one afternoon with a win like that, I'm sorry but their personal bias is clouding their vision as a Redskins fan and that's a shame.

You win as a team and lose as one, I've never seen so much attention paid to one player before.[/quote]

I'll give you that, I haven't read the entire thread so I wasn't aware of meaningless bashing. It bothers me most when people come along and just write something like "Brunell sucked today."

If it doesn't have substance, then it's a meaningless post, and that's just dumb.

But might I say that RedskinRat was the first person to post negatively in this thread. He said he disagreed, and that Brunell threw too many passes that were close to being picked off. And then people jumped on him.

That to me isn't meaningless posting. It was a short post, but he's absolutely right, Brunell gave the game away on a couple of those throws, but the Cowboys just didn't catch the ball. I'm always harping on turnovers, and Brunell was dangerously close on a couple of throws.

Anyway, I'm on cloud nine that we won that game yesterday. Brunell made some bad plays, but he also made some good ones. We got the win, that's what matters. Hopefully Brunell will step it up against the Eagles next week, and we'll really get on a roll.

Hey, we were 0-5 under Marty once and came back to 5-5. It can be done!

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=TAFKAS;239852]It'd be nice to come on to this site every now and then and just feel good with some fellow fans. But I guess that's just not possible[/quote]

I could not agree with you more. I was wondering how many............fans really are disapponted the we won? Disappointed they can't hack Gibbs, Brunell, Williams, Joan of Ark, the Muffin Man for one more week? How many look forward to a loss this week for more of the same. If I was inclinded to cry baby, persecute, prosecute, and spread misery to the degree I read in this site EVERY week, I would find something else that made me feel good, not miserable!!!!!!!!

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

good morning malcolm, and its good to see our receivers get seperation( taylor jacobs, are you listening?)

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

Good morning dmek. And yeah, we all KNEW Moss was fast, but apparently DBs have some SERIOUS trouble covering Lloyd and Randle El.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Hog1;240005]I could not agree with you more. I was wondering how many............fans really are disapponted the we won? Disappointed they can't hack Gibbs, Brunell, Williams, Joan of Ark, the Muffin Man for one more week? How many look forward to a loss this week for more of the same. If I was inclinded to cry baby, persecute, prosecute, and spread misery to the degree I read in this site EVERY week, I would find something else that made me feel good, not miserable!!!!!!!![/quote]

If you want to read a bunch of threads saying "YEEEEAHHHH!!!! ThE ReDsKiNs WoNNN!!!, go to Extreme.

Here people post honest opinions.

The posts where people say things like "yay we won" are just as asinine as the posts where people say things like "Brunell sucks."

It's not all about cheerleading. There are cheerleading threads on this site. But this one is about critiquing Brunell's performance.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Hog1;240005]I could not agree with you more. I was wondering how many............fans really are disapponted the we won? Disappointed they can't hack Gibbs, Brunell, Williams, Joan of Ark, the Muffin Man for one more week? How many look forward to a loss this week for more of the same. If I was inclinded to cry baby, persecute, prosecute, and spread misery to the degree I read in this site EVERY week, I would find something else that made me feel good, not miserable!!!!!!!![/quote]

This kind of comment is thrown around far too much. How is not liking Brunell the same thing as wanting the Redskins to lose to the Cowboys? That's just ridiculous. I can promise you that no true Redskin fan was unhappy with the win yesterday.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

I'm just happy he threw the ball downfield! That's always been my biggest complaint!

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Crat92;240019]I'm just happy he threw the ball downfield! That's always been my biggest complaint![/quote]

That's true. He deserves credit for attempting to stretch the defense (and doing it successfully a couple times).

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[QUOTE=Crat92;240019]I'm just happy he threw the ball downfield! That's always been my biggest complaint![/QUOTE]

same here. and unfortunately, that means risking INTs, or near INTs. Brunell is so INT averse, he hasn't thrown over the middle regularly in a game all year. with our defense no longer shutting heads down, i'm glad he finally took those risks. it's what it took to win a game.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;240004]I'll give you that, I haven't read the entire thread so I wasn't aware of meaningless bashing. It bothers me most when people come along and just write something like "Brunell sucked today."

If it doesn't have substance, then it's a meaningless post, and that's just dumb.

But might I say that RedskinRat was the first person to post negatively in this thread. He said he disagreed, and that Brunell threw too many passes that were close to being picked off. And then people jumped on him.

That to me isn't meaningless posting. It was a short post, but he's absolutely right, Brunell gave the game away on a couple of those throws, but the Cowboys just didn't catch the ball. I'm always harping on turnovers, and Brunell was dangerously close on a couple of throws.

Anyway, I'm on cloud nine that we won that game yesterday. Brunell made some bad plays, but he also made some good ones. We got the win, that's what matters. Hopefully Brunell will step it up against the Eagles next week, and we'll really get on a roll.

Hey, we were 0-5 under Marty once and came back to 5-5. It can be done![/QUOTE]

I think Matty was more specifically referring to posts in other threads, particularly the game thread. All I know is that there are many many people here, yourself not included Schneed, who see one side only. They'll see the dropped INT by Roy Williams but they'll look the other way when it's a dropped completion by Cooley or Portis or whoever in other games.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=illdefined;240022]same here. and unfortunately, that means risking INTs, or near INTs. Brunell is so INT averse, he hasn't thrown over the middle regularly in a game all year. with our defense no longer shutting heads down, it's what it took to win a game.[/quote]

Exactly.

We wanted him to take chances and go down the field more, well guess what? When you do that your chances of throwing a pick is going to increase. That's why it's called taking a chance.

Brunell took some chances yesterday, more than we've seen him take in recent memory, and now people want to blast him for doing exactly what we've wanted. That's being a hypocrite. And that's showing your true colors if you are a Brunell hater.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Mattyk72;240024]Brunell took some chances yesterday, more than we've seen him take in recent memory, and now people want to blast him for doing exactly what we've wanted. That's being a hypocrite. And that's showing your true colors if you are a Brunell hater.[/quote]

I'm actually quite happy with the chances Brunell took yesterday. My only beef with it is if he could do it yesterday, he could have down it all season, instead of waiting until the season is all but over to turn it on...

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Schneed10;240015]If you want to read a bunch of threads saying "YEEEEAHHHH!!!! ThE ReDsKiNs WoNNN!!!, go to Extreme.

Here people post honest opinions.

The posts where people say things like "yay we won" are just as asinine as the posts where people say things like "Brunell sucks."

It's not all about cheerleading. There are cheerleading threads on this site. But this one is about critiquing Brunell's performance.[/quote]

Maybe you can point out the part of my post that suggests YYEEEEEahhhhh (what you said)????? I would agree with you that bunell sucks is equally as useless. The thrust of the statement is, there is way to much useless, baseless anti-skin misery types around this site MUCH of the time. If that's who you are, it's your right!

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

My old soccer coach had a saying: "Lose, analyze; win, criticize." (CRT knowswhat I'm talking about!) Criticizing after a win is a way to get better, instead of just letting the fact that we won wash away a mulitude of sins. If Troy Vincent doesn't get the block, if Sean doesn't put on his supernman cape, if Nick doesn't wait for the perfect gust of wind, would that make MBs play aby better or worse? It wouldn't. We need to think about this rationally, as Matty said.

My feeling is that MB made some big throws on some key 3rd downs, and for that he deserves our praise. But he is still very late on his reads--that's why you get the "almost Ints." The plays come open, he sees them late, and he doesn't have the arm to force it in. Hence, the D can recover. It happened a bunch of times, and even on the good long throws, if he sees them quick, they are seriously wide open. Look at the tape. Also, he didn't rush for a first down on two occasions when it sure looked like he could have. He threw one on a thrid and 2-3, and he ran out of bounds on another. He is worried about being hit. (I would worry too, no doubt!!!), and it is affecting his play.

I am convinced, like John Madden, that MB is not the right QB for our system. He didn't lose us the game, and he did make some clutch plays. But he (and the offense) dissapeared for mcuh of the second half, as they have all year. Compare his play to Tony Romo (NOT Peyton. Come on!). Honestly, who was the better QB? Brunnell was part of the win, so he gets props (I suppose Arch does too, by that logic--he tackled Whitten before he got a TD, at least). But he was just average, IMHO, and ARE threw the biggest pass of the day for the skins. See what happens when you pressure a D deep? Good things.

MB won a repreieve for now (by "fighting his guts out," no doubt). But that's it. And he won the repreieve becuase Troy Vincent blocked his first kick, and the best TO returner in the league picked up the ball, not becuase of his great QB play.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Southpaw;240017]This kind of comment is thrown around far too much. How is not liking Brunell the same thing as wanting the Redskins to lose to the Cowboys? That's just ridiculous. I can promise you that no true Redskin fan was unhappy with the win yesterday.[/quote]

True Redskins fan would be the operative phrase. To continually bash the coaching staff, players, ownership, front office..................Camera guy, key grip, best boy???????????? miss anybody???? Is this what you endorse?

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[QUOTE=Southpaw;240028]I'm actually quite happy with the chances Brunell took yesterday. My only beef with it is if he could do it yesterday, he could have down it all season, instead of waiting until the season is all but over to turn it on...[/QUOTE]

One thing we don't really know the answer to though is whose decision was that? Has it been Brunell? Did Gibbs and Saunders sit down during the bye week and say here's what we need to do? Did Moss' absence force a change in the game plan?

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

He played well enough this week. We didnt' give him a chance to make the big play on 3rd and two on the dallas 30, instead we handed off the ball which was fine. However, if we decided to throw or qb sneak on that big 3rd down, we would be able to analyze his performance in more detail. If he plays well next week, than he has proven his stay at QB, if not, then his inconsistancy has become a major issue. For now, start brunell, we are still alive.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=JWsleep;240035]My old soccer coach had a saying: "Lose, analyze; win, criticize."[/quote]

I like that but with some people it's win, lose, or tie... criticize.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

MB actually made some great throws down the middle of the field yesterday which was great. I think that is the first time i've seen it this year. So, for that i give him and the team credit.

What a great game and i loved it. A classic finish. I'm going to enjoy this one all week.

Brunell kept us in the game, made a couple plays, made a few mistakes (should've been int's). So he is what he is. Not going to lose the game for you, probably won't win it for you. I thought Romo looked really good and outplayed Brunell.

Just b/c i'm critical, doesn't mean i doesn't mean i'm not going to enjoy this W.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=mooby;239853]Okay, for the record, I thought Brunell played a good game today from what I saw. I'll finalize my statement after watching the rerun that should definitely be on NFLN. But one thing i noticed, was even with Moss out, he still didn't look Randle El's or Lloyd's way a lot. Lloyd only caught two passes for 22 yards and Randle El didn't even have a catch.[/quote]

I thought he threw to lloyd a good amount today. He would've caught a 40-50yarder but it was called back. I guess the pass interference was from ARE. When we throw it to Lloyd he catches it. He played a good game today.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

I am definitely a Brunell basher. He did have a good game. He finally did some of the things I've bashed him about. He finally challenged the Cowboys deep. He completed one, which was called back because of a penalty and one other caused a pass interference call. Most importantly, by throwing deep a few times, it made the safeties respect the deep ball and opened up the middle where he had his most success. I've been crying all year that he can't keep throwing short passes and be successful. Brunell is still not completely out of my doghouse. His ability is limited and I will just have to live with the fact that he is just going to manage the game and hopefully that will be good enough to win. The Skins just can't get into a situation where they need him to win a game. I don't see that happening.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

The pass protection was terrific, that was one of the major factors considering how easy it is to get to brunell and knock him down.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

He played good today. I'm not sure if the coaches told him to take a few more chances with the ball but he did make a few questionable throws.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Mattyk72;239304]The bashers are NOT going to take over this thread. We won, so please shut up for 1 week.[/quote]

He played average. Yes he made some good passes over the middle. But he also should have two or three picked off. Minus the pass to Cooley at the end of the half he only threw for about 160 yards. That is still not enough and plus the 2ndary are not respecting his arm or the passing game and it's hurting Portis. Too many people lurking around the line of scrimmage. Bottom line they should have lost the game. Dallas handed it to them. Won't be the case next week in Philly.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;240088]I am definitely a Brunell basher. He did have a good game. He finally did some of the things I've bashed him about. He finally challenged the Cowboys deep. He completed one, which was called back because of a penalty and one other caused a pass interference call. Most importantly, by throwing deep a few times, it made the safeties respect the deep ball and opened up the middle where he had his most success. I've been crying all year that he can't keep throwing short passes and be successful. Brunell is still not completely out of my doghouse. His ability is limited and I will just have to live with the fact that he is just going to manage the game and hopefully that will be good enough to win. The Skins just can't get into a situation where they need him to win a game. I don't see that happening.[/quote]


Great point. There comes a time in every season where you need your QB to win a game or two for you. Defense is playing bad. The running game isn't working and your behind. Brunell simply can't do this. He can only manage the game. He can't take it over. Campbell at least has the skills to do this. Some QB's can do it from the pocket. Some can do it running and passing like McNabb.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=firstdown;240099]He played good today. I'm not sure if the coaches told him to take a few more chances with the ball but he did make a few questionable throws.[/quote]

[FONT=Arial]I would say that brunell looked good in the first half, distributing the ball well, stretching the field etc. But I would say his second half effectiveness was less impressive. Even on a GREAT DAY (I’m still smiling), his stats were only 14/23 for 192 yards and one score. I think we all can say, that brunell played ok/well (ie, giving him props) but honestly, those stats aren’t’ getting us to the playoffs or superbowl- sans a Raveneque D. Not to mention- in the 4th quarter he tossed 2 balls that should have been picked off. I don’t mean to be a downer, but lets be honest…while brunell was better- he’s not winning many games for you (for those of you who will say- he “won” this- that is true, but we are still 3-5).[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial] [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial]Great to have springs back…rogers got burned again…gave up 1 td, should have been 2. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial] [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial]No matter, Vincent and Taylor followed by Novack pulled out the game from us….Loving it…[/FONT]

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

He made some questionable throws but he made plays when we needed them most. Big TEAM win yesterday. Everybody had a part in this one. Offense , defense and ST.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Schneed10;240004]I'll give you that, I haven't read the entire thread so I wasn't aware of meaningless bashing. It bothers me most when people come along and just write something like "Brunell sucked today."

If it doesn't have substance, then it's a meaningless post, and that's just dumb.

But might I say that RedskinRat was the first person to post negatively in this thread. He said he disagreed, and that Brunell threw too many passes that were close to being picked off. And then people jumped on him.

That to me isn't meaningless posting. It was a short post, but he's absolutely right, Brunell gave the game away on a couple of those throws, but the Cowboys just didn't catch the ball. I'm always harping on turnovers, and Brunell was dangerously close on a couple of throws.

Anyway, I'm on cloud nine that we won that game yesterday. Brunell made some bad plays, but he also made some good ones. We got the win, that's what matters. Hopefully Brunell will step it up against the Eagles next week, and we'll really get on a roll.

Hey, we were 0-5 under Marty once and came back to 5-5. It can be done![/quote]

Schneed, thanks. I'm heartened by the fact that some people have bothered to read and understand what I posted.

We beat Dallarse and that is always awesome.

I just can't have the kind of blind loyalty that by inference is required to post here.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

A couple honest observances of Brunell:

The completion to Lloyd for like 50 yards or whatever was a potential big play that got called back for holding. But don't be quick to praise Brunell for it. He underthrew it, and Lloyd made a great play to come back and jump in front of the CB. But at least he tried to go deep.

Brunell threw a ball to the sidelines (I can't remember the intended receiver) that went right off the hands of a Cowboys defender. Our receiver was bracketed by Cowboys, and that throw could only be described as ill-advised.

Brunell made a great throw on the ball to Thrash down the seam. He threaded it over the LB and in front of the safety.

The throw on the run to Cooley in the end zone was very impressive.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Schneed10;240139]A couple honest observances of Brunell:

The completion to Lloyd for like 50 yards or whatever was a potential big play that got called back for holding. But don't be quick to praise Brunell for it. He underthrew it, and Lloyd made a great play to come back and jump in front of the CB. But at least he tried to go deep.

Brunell threw a ball to the sidelines (I can't remember the intended receiver) that went right off the hands of a Cowboys defender. Our receiver was bracketed by Cowboys, and that throw could only be described as ill-advised.

Brunell made a great throw on the ball to Thrash down the seam. He threaded it over the LB and in front of the safety.

The throw on the run to Cooley in the end zone was very impressive.[/quote]

I just want to add the great throw over the middle to Cooley which he dropped. That would have been a nice gain.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

Here's where I can acknowledge I'm biased: I thought the throw to Cooley for the TD was a heart-stopper. It should have been deeper to make it impossible for the ball to be picked.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=skinsfan69;240102]He played average. Yes he made some good passes over the middle. But he also should have two or three picked off. Minus the pass to Cooley at the end of the half he only threw for about 160 yards. That is still not enough and plus the 2ndary are not respecting his arm or the passing game and it's hurting Portis. Too many people lurking around the line of scrimmage. Bottom line they should have lost the game. Dallas handed it to them. Won't be the case next week in Philly.[/quote]

Why minus the throw to Cooley? Did that not count or something? How about adding the potential yardage he lost when Cooley dropped that ball?

I don't understand why people always want to subtract plays out, I read an article this morning about how Portis ran 22 times for 46 yards (minus the 38 yard TD run). Why is it ok to analyze a performance by subtracting out big plays?? Why do they count any less?

Rant over.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=RedskinRat;240146]Here's where I can acknowledge I'm biased: I thought the throw to Cooley for the TD was a heart-stopper. It should have been deeper to make it impossible for the ball to be picked.[/quote]

The end result was 6.

That's all we should care about. Even the best QBs don't make perfect throws all the time. He threw it up there and gave Cooley a chance to make a play. That's what we've all wanted this season, right? For him to take more shots?

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Mattyk72;240147]Why minus the throw to Cooley? Did that not count or something? How about adding the potential yardage he lost when Cooley dropped that ball?

I don't understand why people always want to subtract plays out, I read an article this morning about how Portis ran 22 times for 46 yards (minus the 38 yard TD run). Why is it ok to analyze a performance by subtracting out big plays?? Why do they count any less?

Rant over.[/quote]

Agreed. It's like "Apart from the win we lost" which never makes sense to me. That run is part of what Portis does. He may run 10 times for short gains but he always seems to bust a biggie to move up the average.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[quote=Mattyk72;240150]The end result was 6.

That's all we should care about. Even the best QBs don't make perfect throws all the time. He threw it up there and gave Cooley a chance to make a play. That's what we've all wanted this season, right? For him to take more shots?[/quote]

Matty, that's why I I stated my bias first. I'd still want the ball better delivered.

I'm currently listening to 980 B-Mitch to get his take. He's listing what's still wrong. Ripping Arch a new one. Niiiiiiiiice.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[QUOTE=Southpaw;240028]I'm actually quite happy with the chances Brunell took yesterday. My only beef with it is if he could do it yesterday, he could have down it all season, instead of waiting until the season is all but over to turn it on...[/QUOTE]

yeah that's pretty much my beef too. 'better late than never' may not apply for our season.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;240139]Brunell threw a ball to the sidelines (I can't remember the intended receiver) that went right off the hands of a Cowboys defender. Our receiver was bracketed by Cowboys, and that throw could only be described as ill-advised.[/QUOTE]

it WAS "ill-advised" hehe. ideally, we want a QB who can squeeze the ball into tight spaces, and Brunell has been avoiding those types of passes all year. while it's obvious Brunell isn't remotely the gunslinger best suited to this (not by a longshot), it was good to see him try these and take the chances we need to win the game with our busted defense.

more passes in the middle, more passes downfield = greater INT risk. that's just the game.

if you don't want INTs, then you want Brunell's regular checkdowns, dinks, dunks, and short yardage sideline darts.

Re: Give Props to Brunell
 

[QUOTE=Hail2theskins;239339]Im not bashing Brunell, i think he had a good game today and came up with an extremely good win but in all honesty, brunell doesnt play well for a couple games then comes out with a big one, which seems to be a trend do you think the orginization sees this or does this only further the love joe gibbs has for mark brunell after today?[/QUOTE]




It was important for Brunell that the team came away with a win today. He did make some throws that have been absent in previous games, and for the most part he performed decently. Had the team not won the game, many would still have been calling for his job, and I think he was aware of that going in, so in essence the team saved his job for another week, and he dosen't have to hear his critics. If we don't play well and loose in Philadelphia on Sunday, you can believe before the sun sets they'll be calling for his head again. I'm sure he's grown acustomed to it by now, when we're winning we're grinning and all is well with the world, when we loose.......Fire Brunell!!!