Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=DBUCHANON101;591138]The whole "past QB's from UF didnt do well so that means other wont" arguement is pretty stupid to me. Joe Montana came from ND, does this mean that ND churns out top NFL QB's every few yrs? NO.
I agree that UF hasnt put a great QB in the NFL to this point but it doesnt mean that all future UF QB's are destined to bust in the pros. I like Tebow, i think he is a great player. Im not saying he will come in and be the next Marino but i think he can be a solid player.[/quote]

I think what he was saying with the past QB's from UF flopping implies a trend of something in their system that creates a propensity for failure at the NFL level...to add to his list, Rex Grossman, Chris Leak...

By arguing the negative as a counterpoint (i.e. Notre Dame + Joe Montana = QB factory) you are committing a logical fallacy. Just b/c one implies the other doesn't mean the opposite is true.

Look, I think a much more sound way of debunking that past UF QB's theory is by arguing that the success rate of ANY college QB is low and since UF players have that much more national exposure and hype coming into the draft, the failures of their QB's tend to be magnified. However, it is somewhat telling that there is a pretty long line of failures with very few success stories to balance the equation. Compound that with the fact that they get some real quality guys coming out of high school and, statistically speaking, one would figure at least one of those guys would be a real hit. Thus far it hasn't happened, IMO, but that's not to say it won't ever happen. Who knows maybe over the next decade they could churn out QB's like USC did in the last decade?

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Rajmahal33;591172]I think what he was saying with the past QB's from UF flopping implies a trend of something in their system that creates a propensity for failure at the NFL level...to add to his list, Rex Grossman, Chris Leak...

By arguing the negative as a counterpoint (i.e. Notre Dame + Joe Montana = QB factory) you are committing a logical fallacy. Just b/c one implies the other doesn't mean the opposite is true.

Look, I think a much more sound way of debunking that past UF QB's theory is by arguing that the success rate of ANY college QB is low and since UF players have that much more national exposure and hype coming into the draft, the failures of their QB's tend to be magnified. However, it is somewhat telling that there is a pretty long line of failures with very few success stories to balance the equation. Compound that with the fact that they get some real quality guys coming out of high school and, statistically speaking, one would figure at least one of those guys would be a real hit. Thus far it hasn't happened, IMO, but that's not to say it won't ever happen. Who knows maybe over the next decade they could churn out QB's like USC did in the last decade?[/quote]

That was an excellent demonstration of critical thinking - (that is a good thing!)

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Rajmahal33;591172]I think what he was saying with the past QB's from UF flopping implies a trend of something in their system that creates a propensity for failure at the NFL level...to add to his list, Rex Grossman, Chris Leak...

By arguing the negative as a counterpoint (i.e. Notre Dame + Joe Montana = QB factory) you are committing a logical fallacy. Just b/c one implies the other doesn't mean the opposite is true.

Look, I think a much more sound way of debunking that past UF QB's theory is by arguing that the success rate of ANY college QB is low and since UF players have that much more national exposure and hype coming into the draft, the failures of their QB's tend to be magnified. However, it is somewhat telling that there is a pretty long line of failures with very few success stories to balance the equation. Compound that with the fact that they get some real quality guys coming out of high school and, statistically speaking, one would figure at least one of those guys would be a real hit. Thus far it hasn't happened, IMO, but that's not to say it won't ever happen. Who knows maybe over the next decade they could churn out QB's like USC did in the last decade?[/quote]Excellent argument, Rajmahal.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Kalisto2010;591168]They came from the U, I'm talking about Gator QB's.[/quote]
just.......testing

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

I'm starting to believe Tebow is the real deal. This kid has a TON of skills...sure he's not "NFL ready", but seriously...who is in terms of QB's leaving college?

Let me point out some stats:
14 tds, 12 ints, 2971 passing yards, 60% comp, 80.3 qb rating in 16 games started...
13 tds, 6 ints, 3245 passing yards, 62.3% comp, 84.3 qb rating in 16 games started...
16 tds, 11 ints, 3440 passing yards, 61.1% comp, 87.7 qb rating in 16 games started...

Do you know who belongs to those numbers?
1- Flacco
2- Campbell
3- Ryan

Ryan was the best of the bunch by most accounts, Campbell not that far behind, and Flacco pulling up the rear. Yet most would regard Campbell as a bust, or nothing special. Fact is, Ryan had one of the most prolific running games in the NFL, and Flacco had a great defense, and good overall team around him. They both had 11 wins so they got a ton of publicity...same with campbell if he had 11 wins. Point is, everyone talks about flacco and ryan like they are the second coming of well, peyton manning...they are not. Flacco is not going to be a super special qb...ryan is more like a hasselbeck type qb, which is good. Players like Ryan don't come around all the time. Players like Tebow don't either. He has the entire package including amazing elusive skills. He is a GREAT leader as well. With a little NFL coaching, Tebow could be the next Steve Young.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

Let me point out, I am NOT ready to trade in Campbell for Tebow right now...but I certainly reserve that right come season's end. Either Campbell produces THIS year, or it's time for him to go. He still has a leash in my mind, but a short one.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=SouperMeister;590599]The Danny already tried a hotshot Gators coach with a spread offense run by his college QBs. Run away from that notion. Far, far away.[/quote]

Does the Danny learn from his mistakes? I have seen no evidence of this.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

Watching Florida play right now. Tebow has 94 yards passing against the unranked Vols. He's choosing to run the ball instead of finding an open receiver on most plays. Colt McCoy's game is better suited for the NFL. He can make all of the throws and he has excellent mobility.

This morning I heard Colt on ESPN talk about how it's his dream to play for the Dallas Cowboys. And I said to myself "To bad MF your going to the Skins b*tch, how's that for a dream".

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=jsarno;591223]Let me point out, I am NOT ready to trade in Campbell for Tebow right now...but I certainly reserve that right come season's end. Either Campbell produces THIS year, or it's time for him to go. He still has a leash in my mind, but a short one.[/quote]

These next few weeks are going to be dangerous as it relates to fans perception of Campbell as I think he's going to do good very good the next few weeks, and as a result people will start talking about Campbell as the next franchise QB. His only early test will be Carolina and then his first definite test will be against the Eagles on the 26th of October and the Falcons the following week (though that might be more of a test for defense). How he ends the season against the Giants, Cowboys, and Chargers will really determine what we have in Campbell.

These next three weeks on the other hand should serve as more of a field sobriety test in that he better have a rating over 90 with at least 6 TD passes and 600 yards. Of course more importantly we should win thanks to him not in spite of him.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

Tebow in the NFL will be like a bad relationship.

You know the story. The woman looks really good, she performs well, and there is so much promise that you hook up.

Later, your heart is broken, the promise turned out to be empty, and you can barely look at her anymore.

Just say no to Tebow.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;591245]These next few weeks are going to be dangerous as it relates to fans perception of Campbell as I think he's going to do good very good the next few weeks, and as a result people will start talking about Campbell as the next franchise QB. His only early test will be Carolina and then his first definite test will be against the Eagles on the 26th of October and the Falcons the following week (though that might be more of a test for defense). How he ends the season against the Giants, Cowboys, and Chargers will really determine what we have in Campbell.

These next three weeks on the other hand should serve as more of a field sobriety test in that he better have a rating over 90 with at least 6 TD passes and 600 yards. Of course more importantly we should win thanks to him not in spite of him.[/quote]Even if Campbell does all of those things, if Portis just happens to go for 120, 89, and 107 yards in the next three weeks, people will just credit Portis for all of Campbell's success.

That's what happened last year.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;591262]Even if Campbell does all of those things, if Portis just happens to go for 120, 89, and 107 yards in the next three weeks, people will just credit Portis for all of Campbell's success.

That's what happened last year.[/quote]
GTripp how bout those Wolverines? But you're totally right that's exactly what would happen CP26 would get all the credit...

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Rajmahal33;591172]I think what he was saying with the past QB's from UF flopping implies a trend of something in their system that creates a propensity for failure at the NFL level...to add to his list, Rex Grossman, Chris Leak...

By arguing the negative as a counterpoint (i.e. Notre Dame + Joe Montana = QB factory) you are committing a logical fallacy. Just b/c one implies the other doesn't mean the opposite is true.

Look, I think a much more sound way of debunking that past UF QB's theory is by arguing that the success rate of ANY college QB is low and since UF players have that much more national exposure and hype coming into the draft, the failures of their QB's tend to be magnified. However, it is somewhat telling that there is a pretty long line of failures with very few success stories to balance the equation. Compound that with the fact that they get some real quality guys coming out of high school and, statistically speaking, one would figure at least one of those guys would be a real hit. Thus far it hasn't happened, IMO, but that's not to say it won't ever happen. Who knows maybe over the next decade they could churn out QB's like USC did in the last decade?[/quote]

I think the Florida QB "curse" is legitimate. Why? Simple, in college, the offense still has a bigger edge than in the pros. The fun n gun and its variants can make even an average to above average QB look great. Florida was becoming a power before Spurrier under Galen Hall, Spurrier was the one who got the over the "hump" in becoming a true national power. None of Hall's or Spurrier's QBs really did anything in the pros. Tebow is more athletic than any other Florida QB in recent memory, but the guy is way overhyped. As for USC and their QB's? That is a mixed bag. Yeah you have Leinhart and Palmer, but that is it. Remember Sean Salisbury? Rodney Pete was OK for awhile, but was a bench warmer for the most part. Palmer is an injury waiting to happen and Leinhart had an old geezer beat him out!!!!

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

Ok fellow Skins fans, we are all guilty of this. I am old enough to have been alive for the last Skins Super Bowl (albeit 5 years) but we have to have some PATIENCE. That is the key word. I know that Jason has been under the magnifying glass for just over four years, but let Coach Zorn earn his paycheck. Last week was sobering, (I nearly broke the family's big screen with my Sperry boat shoe) but we have to take a deep breath and just move on. He may no be the "franchise" quaterback we had hoped when Ole Ball coach Gibbs drafted him, but he is our best shot this year and he is still a good QB. He might not be a Tom Brady, but he is still above marginal. That being said, before we crucify him and run him out of town...let's let him do his business against the teams we should (and NEED to beat over the next 3-4 weeks) and then go from there. Although it may not be against NFC East teams, 4-1 after 5 weeks in the NFL is still 4-1. We will be just fine. Let's not be doomsdayers. I will bleed burgundy and gold until the day I die. Keep the faith fellow Americans. God Bless.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Lotus;591253]Tebow in the NFL will be like a bad relationship.

You know the story. The woman looks really good, she performs well, and there is so much promise that you hook up.

Later, your heart is broken, the promise turned out to be empty, and you can barely look at her anymore.

Just say no to Tebow.[/quote]

Don't be bitter bro. Just move on to the next one.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Lotus;591253]Tebow in the NFL will be like a bad relationship.

You know the story. The woman looks really good, she performs well, and there is so much promise that you hook up.

Later, your heart is broken, the promise turned out to be empty, and you can barely look at her anymore.

Just say no to Tebow.[/quote]

Sounds like the relationship that we are in now with Jason. Just that you stick with the broad (excuse me ladies) because shes cool, but in reality you hate her because she does nothing to keep you around. You've been with her this long so you might as well stick through it only to break up with her one year too late.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

tebow = intensity.
redskins need intensity!

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=tootergray34;591290]tebow = intensity.
redskins need intensity![/quote]

Please, by that logic we could use Joakim Noah. Though I do admit I do like the kind of passion that Tebow brings to the table.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;591291]Please, by that logic we could use Joakim Noah. Though I do admit I do like the kind of passion that Tebow brings to the table.[/quote]

Seriously? You could use someone that is averaging 10.6ppg and 10.6rpg per 36 minutes only going into his 3rd season that has intensity. Just in case you didn't notice, and judging by your comment, you likely haven't, you had 19 wins last year. 19 WINS!!! You could use all the help you can get! Which we will need if Campbell doesn't produce.

I am really curious as to what exactly it is that makes Tebow NOT nfl ready, but other college qb's NFL ready...in particular McCoy.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=number21isabadman;590473]Tebow wont make it past the jaguars, they are in love with him. As for bradford and mccoy they are not the anwser either, what we need is ol, pure and simple ol and lots of it.[/quote]

That's the truth right there, and the best reason to kill off this thread. I've never seen a team drool so openly over a guy who is three games into his senior season. I'm gonna keep an eye on the Jags down the stretch to see if they intentionally tank their season to get in a better draft position. Tebow is a Jacksonville local, so it is part talent, BIG part ticket sales.

You guys can spend all day talking about whether or not Tebow will be a QB in the NFL. His skills really don't matter in this case . . . the Jaguars will draft him and start him as QB.

Keep an eye on the Jags late in the season. We may have a whole new definition of the "Florida Flop."

FULL DISCLOSURE: I am a Gator alum.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

Be interesting to see if the mock drafts change this week. WASH QB Locker may move into top 15. Watch for an update later this week to the [B][URL="http://dcprosportsreport.com/mockdraftdatabase/nfl.html"]NFL Mock Draft Database[/URL][/B]. Since theWarpath is the home for DCPSR, updates will come here first.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=PennSkinsFan;592376]Be interesting to see if the mock drafts change this week. WASH QB Locker may move into top 15. Watch for an update later this week to the [B][URL="http://dcprosportsreport.com/mockdraftdatabase/nfl.html"]NFL Mock Draft Database[/URL][/B]. Since theWarpath is the home for DCPSR, updates will come here first.[/quote]

Wouldn't mind seeing CJ Spiller here.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Kalisto2010;591242]Watching Florida play right now. Tebow has 94 yards passing against the unranked Vols. He's choosing to run the ball instead of finding an open receiver on most plays. Colt McCoy's game is better suited for the NFL. He can make all of the throws and he has excellent mobility.

This morning I heard Colt on ESPN talk about how it's his dream to play for the Dallas Cowboys. And I said to myself "To bad MF your going to the Skins b*tch, how's that for a dream".[/quote]

How about the fact that Tebow was without his two best recievers for most of the game, and the starting TE and RB both had the flu, coupled with Tennessee having the #3 defense in the country for the second straight year? He chose to run the ball because they can't stop it. Take what they give you.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=skinsfan_nn;590365]Who exactly was on that jury....? I had no idea there was even a trial..?

Dude the thread and post are not well thought out, to say the very least. :doh:[/quote]

This is an interesting discussion. thank you for sharing :D :D :D
Many thanks to ur post. I love it.
Hi guys, Im a newbie. Nice to join this forum.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=closowri;603702]This is an interesting discussion. thank you for sharing :D :D :D
Many thanks to ur post. I love it.
Hi guys, Im a newbie. Nice to join this forum.[/quote]
Welcome Closowri.....
The membership at the WP is like a marriage....sometimes gold...other times, what the hell?

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

Tebow=Heath Shuler 2.0

Don't get me wrong, he is a PHENOMENAL college player, possibly one of the Top 10 greatest college players ever, BUT, I don't see him as a 16 game starting QB in the NFL.

His main weapon in college is his body. He's as big as linebackers, as strong as linemen and as fast as a tight end. In the league, he'll be as big as safeties, as strong as corners and as fast as linemen. In other words, his advantages will be neutralized. He doesn't have the pure QB skills to run an NFL offense.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

I too am a huge florida gators fan, and have been watching Tebow since he was a freshman, and can say that for how much I like him as a player and leader, he isn't an NFL QB.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

How tall is Tebow? Not what he's listed at, but in reality? That's one of those things that is exposed in the combine, so many schools have guys that are 6'3 w/4.3 speed, which in the combine is revealed as 6'0 ,4.55.

If Tebow is under 6' he's gonna have an even harder time getting a team to play him at qb. His mechanics don't look smooth for an nfl qb, but I don't know if that's enough to say he can't play qb. In recent years I think nfl coaches are more open to unconventional styles at the position. The ideal scenario for Tebow might be to play wildcat or h-back & be a 3rd string qb. Then he might eventually be a regular qb.

To answer the question of this thread, NO, he's not the solution, at least not anytime soon. But, if we draft Tebow I hope it's no earlier than in the 4th, and I think he can contribute to a team in some form. Maybe fullback is his natural position in the nfl.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;590282]Considering we still have 15 games to go, this thread is pretty pointless.[/quote]
All depends

We could've and tried to replace Campbell this year.. I'd say the inability to said that we were "stuck" with him for another year more than anything else, from an FO standpoint

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Paintrain;603884]Tebow=Heath Shuler 2.0

Don't get me wrong, he is a PHENOMENAL college player, possibly one of the Top 10 greatest college players ever, BUT, I don't see him as a 16 game starting QB in the NFL.

His main weapon in college is his body. He's as big as linebackers, as strong as linemen and as fast as a tight end. In the league, he'll be as big as safeties, as strong as corners and as fast as linemen. In other words, his advantages will be neutralized. He doesn't have the pure QB skills to run an NFL offense.[/quote]

I think that sums it up nicely. I mean, the bottom line here is that "guts" and "intensity" and "IT" and even the ability to run (and I do not even see Tebow as an elite runner in the NFL) do not win games in the NFL. You have to be able to drop back, process information, and make NFL throws. Otherwise you are a back-up or, at best, some guy who can get your team by until they can find a legitimate NFL quarterback. Certainly not someone to build a franchise around.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

But we take snaps under center a lot here in Washington..

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[U]Tebow could be the key because Campbell is definitely a huge problem. Check out my draft rankings 646-205-4328[/U]

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=mtaylor8909;604154][U]Tebow could be the key because Campbell is definitely a huge problem. Check out my draft rankings 646-205-4328[/U][/quote]

Spam much?

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;604158]Spam much?[/quote]


Yeah that couldnt be anymore blatant (sp?)

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;604158]Spam much?[/quote]

But I was gonna call him for all my football needs???? should I? or shouldn't I? I am so confused!

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

Yes this is pointless but we gotta talk about something. I wouldn't mind getting McCoy, Spiller, but I think we may need to end up drafting some good offensive lineman. Multiple, more than one prior to getting the sexy picks. That being said if a QB is there that we feel has the "it" then we may want to take him.

With that being said JC may not be done here. He may be the best guy available. We could sign him to a moderate deal and draft a Qb in 2010 or 2011.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

F Tim Tebow.

He has the words "NFL Bust" written all over him.

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;590294]I do not know about Tebow and the NFL.

Most draft gurus I read , like Kiper and Scouts.com, all say that Tebow is a great college player, one of the greates ever but his game will not transcend to the NFL.

I think Kipers mock has Tebow going on the second day of the draft.[/quote]
What does that say for us when the guy with the star on his helmet is making sense...

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=JGisLordOfTheRings;604249]F Tim Tebow.

He has the words "NFL Bust" written all over him.[/quote]
Thank You, now if we van move on..J C is our QB, and if we make a chance it better be a real QB like a Colt Mccoy or my favorite Jimmy Clausen, also like Ryan Mallett ut he's a soph..

Re: Tebow: Is he the Redskins solution?
 

[quote=Eknox;604261]Thank You, now if we van move on..J C is our QB, and if we make a chance it better be a real QB like a Colt Mccoy or my favorite Jimmy Clausen, also like Ryan Mallett ut he's a soph..[/quote]

I like JC, dont get me wrong, but McCoy and Clausen appear to be pretty good. Clausen has improved alot from last year imo but i'm not totally sold on him yet. He seems to get alot of lucky breaks but, whatever wins I guess.