Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;677878]Never. If Russell Okung, OT, Oklahoma St is not available at #4 then I would go with the next best left tackle. Other excellent candidates are Bruce Campbell, OT, Maryland, Trent Williams, OT, Oklahoma, Bryan Bulaga, OT, Iowa, Anthony Davis, OT, Rutgers, and Vladimir Ducasse, OT, Massachesetts. The Redskins offensive line is in shambles. The offense will never get off the ground floor, if the Redskins do not address the line.[/quote]

Trent Williams is a right tackle, not a left like many assume. And I think that makes him a bit of a wild card. On one hand, many feel HE is the better tackle between him and Okung. But since Okung plays left tackle, he's expected to go first in the draft. For all the obvious reasons.

I've stated previously that I'm okay drafting any of the above.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;677933]You didn't answer the question though. Why would you want to trade up to No. 1 for a guy who would, in your hypothetical, be available at No. 4?

Pure and simple, if you're trying to buy Bradford from the Rams, it's going to cost you a Jay Cutler type package. [B]Next year's first and probably third, as well as this year's fourth and the fourth overall pick.[/B] That's a lot different from Campbell and Carter, two players who don't have long term value to us. You're going from giving up about three marginal wins in players, 2 of which come from Campbell this season (projected...by me, sorry) to giving up multiple first round picks and future considerations. And you get...well, Sam Bradford.

Or, if the Rams were going to pass on him, you just take him at No. 4 for no additional cost.[/quote]

i think you greatly greatly overexagerating if you think it will take:

skins 4th overall + 4th rounder + 2011 1st rounder + 3rd rounder just to move up 3 spots to no. 1.

do you seriously think it would take all that to move up 3 spots? thats seems absurd. (dikta doesnt count).

if they like him, we will draft him at 4. if they dont, we wont.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=over the mountain;678819]i think you greatly greatly overexagerating if you think it will take:

skins 4th overall + 4th rounder + 2011 1st rounder + 3rd rounder just to move up 3 spots to no. 1.

do you seriously think it would take all that to move up 3 spots? thats seems absurd. (dikta doesnt count).

if they like him, we will draft him at 4. if they dont, we wont.[/quote]
I think GTripp is basing his assumption on the draft value chart. Using that, he's about right on what it would take to move up to #1. The pick value for #1 overall is 3000, the picks GTripp mentioned come out to about 3150 (estimating the Skins to be at about pick 15 in 2011).

But to your point, no way I move up to get Bradford. I wouldn't take him at #4 either (it's pretty well documented who I'd take :))

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

Before the skins go after any QBs in a draft I would like to see them give the last one they drafted a chance. I think Brennan could be decent, and hey can't get much worse than 4-12.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=flaskinsfan8;678839]Before the skins go after any QBs in a draft I would like to see them give the last one they drafted a chance. I think Brennan could be decent, and hey can't get much worse than 4-12.[/quote]Brennan had two years of a chance and was outplayed by a 5'10" UDFA last pre-season. Watch as Timmy Cha.....oops, Colt Brennan plays himself off the roster this pre-season.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=warpaint;677617]I seen McCoy throughout his college career since I live in The Big 12 Country. McCoy throws a better pass than Clausen. He hits his WR in stride more often the Clausen. I was watching some of Jimmys highlights. The passes he completes makes his WR stop and comeback. The others would get picked by any starting secondary in the league and just cuase he plays from under center more often than most makes him ready to start, doesn't sell me on him. On Tebow I feel they way he changed his delivery in such a short time and WOWED all the scouts shows his commitment to being the best, and with his body of work proves he will bust his but off to acheiving excellence. Hell even Shanny and Allen had to go take a look at him to see what the hype was about.

I know there are hundreds of guys here who can disect this apart and make a case for me being wrong. But this is just my opinion.[/quote]

Look man, here is the deal. Clausen throws his passes, so his receivers can catch the ball. It's all about knowing your receivers and them knowing their QB. McCoy has a weak arm even before the injury, will probably be worse now. Tebow was a winner in College (so was Charlie Ward and a cast of others), but he just isn't an NFL QB. All of the experts say if you draft him you shouldn't expect him to even attempt to start for 2-3 yrs. If he was there in say the 6th, I would say we should take a chance, but honestly he's not a pro QB. He's a great guy, good athlete, just not an NFL QB.
I'm glad Tebow has changed his delivery and worked on his game, but it's much easier to change your delivery without a 300 lb guys running full speed trying to kill you. When panic sets in, he will revert back to his old bad habits.
Clausen is the most NFL ready QB that has come out of college since Peyton Manning. I think it will be a huge mistake if we pass this guy up at #4 and I will be EXTREMELY pissed if we fucking draft Tebow with our 2nd round pick!!! The opportunity to draft a franchise QB rarely comes around, I hope we don't screw this up!!

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

I wouldn't feel comfortable using any of our draft picks on Clausen, let alone trading up for him. I don't feel like any of the QBs in this draft class will end up being a franchise QB, Bradford might be the exception, but I still don't feel like any of the Quarterbacks coming out this year will be an upgrade over Jason Campbell, which is saying something.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;677933]You didn't answer the question though. Why would you want to trade up to No. 1 for a guy who would, in your hypothetical, be available at No. 4?

Pure and simple, if you're trying to buy Bradford from the Rams, it's going to cost you a Jay Cutler type package. [B]Next year's first and probably third, as well as this year's fourth and the fourth overall pick[/B]. That's a lot different from Campbell and Carter, two players who don't have long term value to us. You're going from giving up about three marginal wins in players, 2 of which come from Campbell this season (projected...by me, sorry) to giving up multiple first round picks and future considerations. And you get...well, Sam Bradford.

Or, if the Rams were going to pass on him, you just take him at No. 4 for no additional cost.[/quote]


Huh? "Cocaine is a powerful drug..."

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;678824]I think GTripp is basing his assumption on the draft value chart. Using that, he's about right on what it would take to move up to #1. The pick value for #1 overall is 3000, the picks GTripp mentioned come out to about 3150 (estimating the Skins to be at about pick 15 in 2011).

But to your point, no way I move up to get Bradford. I wouldn't take him at #4 either (it's pretty well documented who I'd take :))[/quote]


The guy looking for his baseball in "There's something about Mary" wouldn't sign off on that trade.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

I am late to this thread but never.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

I wouldn't trade anyway to move up to get him. I just dont think he is that good of a QB. I watched him several times and just didn't see the NFL QB that Kiper sees. i see him squeezing balls in against college competition, those windows are twice as small in the NFL. I see those being pick sixes. He is a guy that goes out if he struggles and misses some passes early, then forget it he is done the rest of the game. I just dont see it..plus i dont think his arm strength is all that great for the NFL. I take another QB in the 2nd. Pike comes to mind from Cincy, LeFever may be another option, McCoy may be there too. I just dont like Clausen AT ALL if you can't tell.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;678846]Brennan had two years of a chance and was outplayed by a 5'10" UDFA last pre-season. Watch as Timmy Cha.....oops, Colt Brennan plays himself off the roster this pre-season.[/quote]

To be fair i believe that UDFA outplayed the starter as well but hey, that's just me.

As far as the threads actual subject goes. There is no one that I would trade up for this year period. There really isn't anyone that I want at 4 but if you can't trade down take who you think is going to be most benificial to your team long term.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;679025]The guy looking for his baseball in "There's something about Mary" wouldn't sign off on that trade.[/quote]

WHO WARREN !?!?!?!?!?

HA !

That movie is so hilarious !

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=#56fanatic;679044]I wouldn't trade anyway to move up to get him. I just dont think he is that good of a QB. I watched him several times and just didn't see the NFL QB that Kiper sees. i see him squeezing balls in against college competition, those windows are twice as small in the NFL. I see those being pick sixes. He is a guy that goes out if he struggles and misses some passes early, then forget it he is done the rest of the game. I just dont see it..plus i dont think his arm strength is all that great for the NFL. I take another QB in the 2nd. Pike comes to mind from Cincy, LeFever may be another option, McCoy may be there too. I just dont like Clausen AT ALL if you can't tell.[/quote]

I'd trade out of the draft to avoid taking Pike or Lefevour

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

There's really only one QB worth taking in the first round this year IMO and that's Bradford.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;679060]I'd trade out of the draft to avoid taking Pike or Lefevour[/quote]

Has there been any indication of the Skins being interested in LeFevour?

I wouldn't mind him in the 3rd, too bad we don't have one of course.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

I haven't heard of any interest

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

The only QB worth trading up for in the first round is Bradford IMO. I think he's head and shoulders above the rest. Though if someone wanted to trade up with us for Clausen...that would be great.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;679068]I haven't heard of any interest[/quote]

So I guess that means he's not one of the 4 or 5 QB's Shanahan plans on scouting in person.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=#56fanatic;679044]I wouldn't trade anyway to move up to get him. I just dont think he is that good of a QB. I watched him several times and just didn't see the NFL QB that Kiper sees. i see him squeezing balls in against college competition, those windows are twice as small in the NFL. I see those being pick sixes. He is a guy that goes out if he struggles and misses some passes early, then forget it he is done the rest of the game. I just dont see it..plus i dont think his arm strength is all that great for the NFL. I take another QB in the 2nd. Pike comes to mind from Cincy, LeFever may be another option, McCoy may be there too. I just dont like Clausen AT ALL if you can't tell.[/quote]Pike, LeFevour, McCoy in the 2nd???? And you're knocking Clausen?

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;679091]So I guess that means he's not one of the 4 or 5 QB's Shanahan plans on scouting in person.[/quote]

Well he could be, not sure

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

what Clausen were you watching? my goodness..the kid has a rocket, and he didn't have crap for an O Line...remind you of a certain line in the NFL? It should. He played through injury so the toughness is there...I only wish his wonderlic test scores were higher...

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

I'm telling you guys....look no further...

[url=http://www.walterfootball.com]WalterFootball.com[/url]

it explains it all. Better prospect...durable and can make all the throws. You guys are just biased towards your college teams. I'm a florida fan but do I want us to take tebow? heck no. I promise you if we get clausen we are SET! But people will just call me an idiot till he blows it up for us...

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

per walterfootball.com

MARCH 23 UPDATE: If you haven't seen it yet, here's our exclusive Jimmy Clausen interview and an article called Jimmy Clausen is an Alien Wizard, which discusses why the hatred and bias against Clausen is completely unfounded.

MARCH 16 UPDATE: Ever since the Colts had the league change the contact rules, the NFL has become a pass-first, quarterback-driven league. Nine of the 12 quarterbacks who made the playoffs were chosen with the No. 33 overall pick or earlier, and the three exceptions were Kurt Warner, Tom Brady and Tony Romo. To win consistently in the NFL, you need a franchise quarterback.

This is why the New Regimes Mean New Quarterbacks belief is more paramount than ever. Does Mike Shanahan see Jason Campbell as his quarterback of the future? I don't think so; though Campbell hasn't had much help in Washington, he's been inconsistent and pretty mediocre. He's also a poor fit for Shanahan's offense. Even if the Redskins tender Campbell and keep him for a year - which will probably happen - there's a good chance this selection will be used on a signal-caller.

Unlike Campbell, Jimmy Clausen is a good fit in Shanahan's offense. Clausen has been accused by biased media members of being arrogant. Jay Cutler was another arrogant quarterback, and that didn't stop Shanahan from drafting him back in 2006. Meanwhile, Daniel Snyder loves big names, and would undoubtedly sign off on Clausen.

For more, Matt listed five reasons why the Redskins won't pass on Jimmy Clausen.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=tootergray34;679128]per walterfootball.com

MARCH 23 UPDATE: If you haven't seen it yet, here's our exclusive Jimmy Clausen interview and an article called Jimmy Clausen is an Alien Wizard, which discusses why the hatred and bias against Clausen is completely unfounded.

MARCH 16 UPDATE: Ever since the Colts had the league change the contact rules, the NFL has become a pass-first, quarterback-driven league. Nine of the 12 quarterbacks who made the playoffs were chosen with the No. 33 overall pick or earlier, and the three exceptions were Kurt Warner, Tom Brady and Tony Romo. To win consistently in the NFL, you need a franchise quarterback.

This is why the New Regimes Mean New Quarterbacks belief is more paramount than ever. Does Mike Shanahan see Jason Campbell as his quarterback of the future? I don't think so; though Campbell hasn't had much help in Washington, he's been inconsistent and pretty mediocre. He's also a poor fit for Shanahan's offense. Even if the Redskins tender Campbell and keep him for a year - which will probably happen - there's a good chance this selection will be used on a signal-caller.

Unlike Campbell, Jimmy Clausen is a good fit in Shanahan's offense. Clausen has been accused by biased media members of being arrogant. Jay Cutler was another arrogant quarterback, and that didn't stop Shanahan from drafting him back in 2006. Meanwhile, [B]Daniel Snyder loves big names, and would undoubtedly sign off on Clausen. [/B]

For more, Matt listed five reasons why the Redskins won't pass on Jimmy Clausen.[/quote]

Why is it that the media keeps making it sound like Snyder has to sign off on football related decisions? I mean short of Allen and Shanahan telling Dan that they're going to use the 4th overall pick to select Tony Pike, Jason Fox, or trade for Antrell Rolle then I doubt we see Snyder needing to sign off on anything.

I know that it's difficult to follow all 32 teams and know the ins and outs of every team but the media should know by now that the one football decision Snyder ever needed to sign off on was the hiring of Allen. After that everything else virtually fell into place.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;679129]Why is it that the media keeps making it sound like Snyder has to sign off on football related decisions? I mean short of Allen and Shanahan telling Dan that they're going to use the 4th overall pick to select Tony Pike, Jason Fox, or trade for Antrell Rolle then I doubt we see Snyder needing to sign off on anything.

I know that it's difficult to follow all 32 teams and know the ins and outs of every team but the media should know by now that the one football decision Snyder ever needed to sign off on was the hiring of Allen. After that everything else virtually fell into place.[/quote]


Honestly, I am in the camp that Snyder's activities were diminishing before this year. Right now, I don't think he is involved in any football related decision.

If Bradford, Clausen or Tebow are taken in the draft, I don't think he had any input on it.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

"The media" is such a vague, general term....that said I'm not sure I would consider Walter of Walterfootball.com fame "the media". He's a dude with a mock draft

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;679137]Honestly, I am in the camp that Snyder's activities were diminishing before this year. Right now, I don't think he is involved in any football related decision.

If Bradford, Clausen or Tebow are taken in the draft, I don't think he had any input on it.[/quote]

Agreed. I'm pretty sure Allen and Shanahan wouldn't have accepted their positions without some sort of firm assurance of autonomy. I have no idea what the legalese looks like in the contracts of GM's and HC's in the NFL, but I'm hoping they both have some sort of "back the eff off" clause with regard to Snyder.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

We have 5 picks in the entire draft this year. This puts us behind the 8 ball. We have no business trying to move up to aquire any player due to our lack of picks. Oh what you want to give up a pick for next years draft, why do this. We have needs at OL, LB, RB, QB. If I had to pick any of the QB's to take with our 4th pick I would not take any QB. I would take 1.Okung 2.Suh 3. Trent Williams 4. try to trade down for more picks. Im not sure we should even take a QB with the 2nd pick due to not having a 3rd pick. If we can trade a veteran player on our roster for a 3rd rd pick then I could see us using a pick on the best available QB in the 2nd round. We are up a creek with only 5 picks people, we must stop throwing our draft picks away.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;679129][B]Why is it that the media keeps making it sound like Snyder has to sign off on football related decisions? I mean short of Allen and Shanahan telling Dan that they're going to use the 4th overall pick to select Tony Pike, Jason Fox, or trade for Antrell Rolle then I doubt we see Snyder needing to sign off on anything. [/B]

I know that it's difficult to follow all 32 teams and know the ins and outs of every team but the media should know by now that the one football decision Snyder ever needed to sign off on was the hiring of Allen. After that everything else virtually fell into place.[/quote]

I am annoyed by the same thing. That said, I think Snyder needs to develop a long and clear track record of not being involved for such talk to go away. Given that it is difficult to establish a track record of not doing such things, I think we sadly will read comments like this for some time.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

I found this to be pretty intersting especially for those wanting a QB in the second round or beyond......

[url=http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=319933]OK those that feel like we should draft an OL over a QB at #4 - interesting stuff regarding QBs and the Draft - EXTREMESKINS.com[/url]

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

No, Walter doesn't just run a football site, he also go's to the combine, he go's to the senior bowl pracitces and games. He talks and interviews with the players...he's got a lot more insight than you think. And when he say's somebody is a can't miss prosepect...he's usually spot on.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=tootergray34;679221]No, Walter doesn't just run a football site, he also go's to the combine, he go's to the senior bowl pracitces and games. He talks and interviews with the players...he's got a lot more insight than you think. And when he say's somebody is a can't miss prosepect...he's usually spot on.[/quote]

Toot there is no such thing as a cant miss prospect. And if it were possible to identify one then there would never be any busts in the 1st round of the draft. However, if walter is the one person that posseses this crystal ball then his talents are being wasted on that website.

That is not to say that i would be unhappy if we end up with Clausen.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=SBXVII;679213]I found this to be pretty intersting especially for those wanting a QB in the second round or beyond......

[URL="http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=319933"]OK those that feel like we should draft an OL over a QB at #4 - interesting stuff regarding QBs and the Draft - EXTREMESKINS.com[/URL][/quote]I liked [URL="http://www.extremeskins.com/showpost.php?p=7397004&postcount=47"]this[/URL] tongue in cheek summation:

[quote=Gibby]The solution is simple draft Tebow with the #4 pick that way he can't be a second round bust and will be a super bowl champion! [IMG]http://www.the-scream.co.uk/forums/images/smilies/silly.gif[/IMG][/quote]

Which is really the point. If high draft position is what makes the player, and not the other way around, then why the heck would anyone pass on Tebow in the top five?

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=tootergray34;679221]No, Walter doesn't just run a football site, he also go's to the combine, he go's to the senior bowl pracitces and games. He talks and interviews with the players...he's got a lot more insight than you think. And when he say's somebody is a can't miss prosepect...he's usually spot on.[/quote]

Maybe the Skins FO should fire the scouting department and just read his stuff.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

hell if we did that the past few drafts...other than last years where Brian Orakpo was a gem where we got him, we'd no doubt be better off!

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

Not sure of the numbers, but haven't we only drafted 2 pro bowl players in the draft in the past 8 years? Orakpo, and Cooley? That'd be a nice way to evaluate draft success....which teams have drafted the most pro bowl caliber players in the past so and so years.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=tootergray34;679236]Not sure of the numbers, but haven't we only drafted 2 pro bowl players in the draft in the past 8 years? Orakpo, and Cooley? That'd be a nice way to evaluate draft success....which teams have drafted the most pro bowl caliber players in the past so and so years.[/quote]Sean Taylor also made two Pro Bowls, RIP.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

[quote=tootergray34;679236]Not sure of the numbers, but haven't we only drafted 2 pro bowl players in the draft in the past 8 years? Orakpo, and Cooley? That'd be a nice way to evaluate draft success....which teams have drafted the most pro bowl caliber players in the past so and so years.[/quote]

How far back do you want to go? Go back to 2002 (8 years) and there are only three or four NE Patriots drafted since then that have made the Pro Bowl.

Anyway, I know all about Walter. I think he's done a great job with his website. I don't think he's any sort of Nostradamus with his picks, but then...who is.

Re: At what point would you Trade Up to get Jimmy Clausen?
 

^ I love Walter's site for its wealth of information. Sometimes Walter has some very intelligent analysis, too. However, sometimes things he says just make me scratch my head.