Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;826444]So from a saftey prespective yes
Fan's no
Player's no
Coach's no

If the play is deemed so dangerous they need to effectively render it useless why not just remove it and get rid of kickoffs? Why risk a players safety some of the time?

I guess i dont understand the purpose of changing the rules before making safety strides in other areas. I mean for God’s sake mouth guards are not mandatory. If you wear the wrong socks you get fined, if you don’t wear a mouth guard its okay???? Im sure some mouth guards are much better than others. A lot of concussions come from knees hitting the helmet, force players to wear knee pads and elbow pads, hip and thigh pads. Force players to wear certain helmets that are proven less risky. Force players to wear neck braces like Chris Samuels. Have a R&D department study safety gear. But making significant changes to the sport before doing any of these things seems completely backwards and ridiculous to me.[/quote]

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/23/league-tables-plan-for-mandatory-knee-thigh-pads/]League tables plan for mandatory knee, thigh pads | ProFootballTalk[/url]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;826434][B]Of course I don't have data. It's common sense. [/B]All I'm saying is putting the kick offs back to the 35 was just awful, and like I said I haven't heard one former player or coach that likes the rul.e.[/quote]

Well then, might as well just end the thread there

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=Paintrain;826449]Overall I think he's good for the league but he's a bit heavy handed and not a great communicator. He can do a better job at explaining his reasoning behind rule changes and desiring changes to the game (18 games, plans for LA market, etc) but he's a little stiff.[B] Some of his decisions on fines and discipline seem to be excessive also and he alienates players by those decisions[/B].[/quote]


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Thats one of the main issue i have with him. If he wants to come down hard on players for hard hitting or getting in trouble off the field thats fine, but he doesnt seem to ahve any real consistency. Why not spell out what the fine/suspension is going to be beforehand. Theres no clarity or consistency in his discipline process. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

He evaluates each fine on an individual basis, that's why there doesn't appear to be consistency, but I think to be fair you can't just hand out mandatory infractions.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;826454]Well then, might as well just end the thread there[/quote]

lol brilliant stuff eh?

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=Mattyk;826452][URL="http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/23/league-tables-plan-for-mandatory-knee-thigh-pads/"]League tables plan for mandatory knee, thigh pads | ProFootballTalk[/URL][/quote]


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Exactly. Why table this and make the wedge illegal 2 years ago, dramatically change the enforcement of hard hits last year, and then render the kickoff useless this year? He’s got things completely backwards[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;826460][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Exactly. Why table this and make the wedge illegal 2 years ago, dramatically change the enforcement of hard hits last year, and then render the kickoff useless this year? He’s got things completely backwards[/FONT][/COLOR]

[/quote]

So I guess you think more padding = more safety?

Not sure there's any real basis for that, but ok.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=Mattyk;826461]So I guess you think more padding = more safety?

Not sure there's any real basis for that, but ok.[/quote]


[FONT=Calibri]Would you advocate differently? [/FONT]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;826460][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Exactly. Why table this and make the wedge illegal 2 years ago, dramatically change the enforcement of hard hits last year, and then render the kickoff useless this year? [B]He’s got things completely backwards[/B][/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]

Yet - - he manages to keep his job...


How can he possibly do that? Does he have some mass hypnotic powers over all of the owners and the players union and only you are immune to them?

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;826477][FONT=Calibri]Would you advocate differently? [/FONT][/quote]

Personally I think more padding is just window dressing and doesn't do much to prevent head injuries. You could wrap guys in bubble wrap, but if they crash into each other with enough force the brain is going to get jarred no matter what you do. So the most logical thing to do is reduce (or eventually eliminate) some of the plays where the highest speed collisions take place.

I am surprised they don't make mouth guards mandatory though. I know in high school we had to wear them. I'm not sure what research says about them reducing head injuries though. I think I remember reading the conclusions are mixed.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=Mattyk;826481]Personally I think more padding is just window dressing and doesn't do much to prevent head injuries. You could wrap guys in bubble wrap, but if they crash into each other with enough force the brain is going to get jarred no matter what you do. So the most logical thing to do is reduce (or eventually eliminate) some of the plays where the highest speed collisions take place.

I am surprised they don't make mouth guards mandatory though. I know in high school we had to wear them. I'm not sure what research says about them reducing head injuries though. I think I remember reading the conclusions are mixed.[/quote]

Studies I read regarding mouthguards about ten years ago were inconclusive with regard to their ability to mitigate concussions. However, there were no data to suggest that using a mouthguard increased the likelihood of a concussion. So, high schools in most places mandated their use.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=NC_Skins;826430]From safety perspective: Yes

From fan perspective: No


We as fans don't care about the players safety. We just want to be entertained.[/quote]

Eh, I care about players safety and agree with say the horsecollar rule. But the kickoff rule is flat out horrible because your messing with the strategy of the game way too much. Kickoffs help a team get back in the game and give advantages to the dynamic of how certain teams are built. U have essentially killed a dynamic of the game you cant make up for. Guys are going to get hurt period in this game.

Something else i care about when in regards to fan safety is:

a) Im not trying to get shot in a parking lot of a stadium

b) Im not trying to test the law of Darwin survival of the fittest while attending a game in reference to the fights

Where the f*ck is the Commish on this?

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;826480]Yet - - he manages to keep his job...


How can he possibly do that? Does he have some mass hypnotic powers over all of the owners and the players union and only you are immune to them?[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Again I believe the question posed by the op and what I am answering to (and what most besides you are answering to) is “is roger goodell for the nfl…. the sport” [I]not[/I] is he good for the business. Roger was elected by the owners, his interests are intrinsically in line with the owners. Theres very little players or the players union, or as smootsmack pointed out the fans can do, to remove him from power. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]
So again sure he may be fabulous for the business side of the NFL but in my opinion, humble and somehow immune and irrelevant to his power, think hes bad for the nfl…. the sport. I would also go as far to say that most players, formers players, coaches and fans also think his modifying of the game is also bad for the sport. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;826492][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Again I believe the question posed by the op and what I am answering to (and what most besides you are answering to) is “is roger goodell for the nfl…. the sport” [I]not[/I] is he good for the business. Roger was elected by the owners, his interests are intrinsically in line with the owners. Theres very little players or the players union, or as smootsmack pointed out the fans can do, to remove him from power. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]
So again sure he may be fabulous for the business side of the NFL but in my opinion, humble and somehow immune and irrelevant to his power, think hes bad for the nfl…. the sport. I would also go as far to say that most players, formers players, coaches and fans also think his modifying of the game is also bad for the sport. [/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]

You do understand that Roger Goodell does not - - and cannot - - change any NFL game rules by himself. Not a single one...

Any and all chages to the rules come from a process that includes the Rules Committee (made up of owners, coaches and - - at least in the past - - former players too), followed by approvals of 3/4 of the owners [B]and a concurrence by the NFLPA[/B]. There is probably some input here from game officials too regarding the ability to enforce any proposed rule change but I honestly do not know if that is a formal part of the process or just some kind of advisory note from the officials.

So, with regard to his "modifying the game" (your words) by changing the rules of the game to the detriment of the game - - - he didn't do it because he couldn't do it even if he wanted to.

As to how badly most of the players and former players hate him, the current players had their chance to show that about a month ago. They had to vote on the new CBA and in that CBA they would have to live with Roger Goodell as the arbiter of their behavior for the next ten years. Yet the current players voted [B]OVERWHELMINGLY[/B] in favor of the CBA - - keeping this guy you assert they hate in charge of them. Or maybe you think that the players were too focused on the "business matters" to worry about how much they dislike the Commish in that vote... If that is the case, then maybe the emphasis that the owners and players have put on "business matters" might convince you as a fan that the "business matters" are pretty damned important...

As to how much the coaches hate him for meddling with the game, it is a highly prized and prestigious assignment for a coach to named to the Rules Committee - - where that coach gets to work with folks in the NFL Front Office including the Commish. I do not know of a single coach in the history of the Rules Committee who has begged off because the Commish was a hateful figure.

Roger Goodell is NOT the person to blame for changing any rule in the NFL just as he is NOT the person to blame for the collapse of Lehman Brothers in 2008. If you want to blame him for taking a hard line on enforcing rules that have been on the books for a long time and exacting more stern punishments for such violations, you can do that if you want. But that is a far more narrow set of indictments than you have been handing out here.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

I think sportscurmudgeon [B]is[/B] Roger Goodell. Haha, just kidding -- I don't think I've seen such a dogged defense of any player, coach, owner etc. on this board.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=rbanerjee23;826559]I think sportscurmudgeon [B]is[/B] Roger Goodell. Haha, just kidding -- I don't think I've seen such a dogged defense of any player, coach, owner etc. on this board.[/quote]

Trust me. I could only wish that for one year of my life that I would have made the salary that Roger Goodell makes each and every year.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;826562]Trust me. I could only wish that for one year of my life that I would have made the salary that Roger Goodell makes each and every year.[/quote]

I wish, in the course of my life, I made as much as Goodell makes in a year

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

THey shoulda tabled that KO rule until im dead.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;826558]You do understand that Roger Goodell does not - - and cannot - - change any NFL game rules by himself. Not a single one...

Any and all chages to the rules come from a process that includes the Rules Committee (made up of owners, coaches and - - at least in the past - - former players too), followed by approvals of 3/4 of the owners [B]and a concurrence by the NFLPA[/B]. There is probably some input here from game officials too regarding the ability to enforce any proposed rule change but I honestly do not know if that is a formal part of the process or just some kind of advisory note from the officials.

So, with regard to his "modifying the game" (your words) by changing the rules of the game to the detriment of the game - - - he didn't do it because he couldn't do it even if he wanted to.

As to how badly most of the players and former players hate him, the current players had their chance to show that about a month ago. They had to vote on the new CBA and in that CBA they would have to live with Roger Goodell as the arbiter of their behavior for the next ten years. Yet the current players voted [B]OVERWHELMINGLY[/B] in favor of the CBA - - keeping this guy you assert they hate in charge of them. Or maybe you think that the players were too focused on the "business matters" to worry about how much they dislike the Commish in that vote... If that is the case, then maybe the emphasis that the owners and players have put on "business matters" might convince you as a fan that the "business matters" are pretty damned important...

As to how much the coaches hate him for meddling with the game, it is a highly prized and prestigious assignment for a coach to named to the Rules Committee - - where that coach gets to work with folks in the NFL Front Office including the Commish. I do not know of a single coach in the history of the Rules Committee who has begged off because the Commish was a hateful figure.

Roger Goodell is NOT the person to blame for changing any rule in the NFL just as he is NOT the person to blame for the collapse of Lehman Brothers in 2008. If you want to blame him for taking a hard line on enforcing rules that have been on the books for a long time and exacting more stern punishments for such violations, you can do that if you want. But that is a far more narrow set of indictments than you have been handing out here.[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Honestly I don’t believe you when you say the NFLPA has to issue a concurrence to “all changes to the rules”. So the NFLPA effectively has presidential veto powers for any and all rule changes? Do you have anything to back that up? But regardless if they do or not as a union the NFLPA’s entertainment/profit seeking goals should be in concert with the NFL’s. A unions job is to protect its constituents not protect the integrity of the game, that job falls on the commissioner of the sport. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Whats up with all this hating (or hatting) Goodell stuff?. I don’t hate anyone, brah. Hate him or love him Goodell is still the one to blame for rule changes in my opinion. Hes the commissioner of the sport. The Rules Committee is making policies through his direction. Goodell has championed all these player safety rules, they are coming from him. If youre saying the disconnect of Roger Goodell and rules in the NFL is comparable to the disconnect to the Lehman collapse then you’ve gone full retard. I don’t know how else to put it. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]All im saying is that Roger has, imho, been bad for the NFL as the clear representative of professional football. I think protecting players is just as important as protecting the integrity of the game. I don’t hate Rog or anyone else. I think seeking changes in the protection of players through better safety gear and requirements should be paramount to modifying rules of the game. I think Tagliabue was a better commissioner then Roger and prefer the way he left the game to the changes made since. I guess I just really like the sport of football, but don’t get me wrong I also love entertainment….[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/06/goodell-i-dont-want-to-take-away-the-toughness-of-the-game/]Goodell: I don’t want to take away the toughness of the game | ProFootballTalk[/url]

Huh?

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[URL="http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/13/danieal-manning-avoids-defenseless-receiver-draws-flag-anyway/"]Danieal Manning avoids defenseless receiver, draws flag anyway | ProFootballTalk[/URL]

I dont want to keep this thread going unnecessarily but this article is pretty good and represents how so many of us feel about the leagues hard hitting rules.

I think this hard hit penalty was just a mistake by the ref however the NFL needs to come out and say why it is or isnt allowed. In addition i think they need to allow helmet to helmet hits if it seems accidental or incidental or if the receiver is at any fault (maybe use a contributory or comparative negligence type thing).

Also the legal hit on [URL="http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/12/stevie-johnson-says-block-that-tore-eric-berrys-acl-wasnt-a-cheap-shot/"]Eric Berry [/URL]that blew his acl should be illegal. If the nfl is talking about reducing injury prone plays eliminate the cut block. Theres no need for it and its rarely used. I would make the argument that cut blocks result in significantly more injuries and significantly more severe injuries than any other hit in football.


Video of the defenseless receiver hit:

[URL="http://blog.chron.com/texanschick/2011/09/danieal-manning-defenseless-receiver-penalty-you-make-the-call/"]Danieal Manning defenseless receiver penalty? You make the call. | TexansChick | a Chron.com blog[/URL]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

I too would like to see cut blocks eliminated from the game, even though that's a staple of Shanny's offensive line. Anytime I see great players get torn ACL's as a result of a cut block, I can't help but think that could be one of our guys in the future. Like has been said, if Goodell was serious about reducing injuries, he'd outlaw cut blocks.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

Its ridiculous the cut block is allowed when defenseless receiver, helmet to helmet and pretty much any QB hit is not.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

I used to like Goodell and the direction he was taking the NFL. No more. The whole fining these defensive players crazy amounts for hits, and now suspending a player for actions (not even illegal ones) before he's even in the NFL has pretty much left me disliking the guy big time.


What the hell is this shit?

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/06/goodell-if-colts-hadnt-suspended-tressel-i-would-have/]Goodell: If Colts hadn’t suspended Tressel, I would have | ProFootballTalk[/url]


[quote]Appearing on ESPN Radio today, Goodell said that if the Colts didn’t sit Tressel down at the start of the season, Goodell would have done it himself.
[/quote]

Really? Really? Just ****ing go away Roger. Please.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;835438]Its ridiculous the cut block is allowed when defenseless receiver, helmet to helmet and pretty much any QB hit is not.[/quote]

Good call, I have always thought the cut block was BS

[QUOTE=mlmpetert;835438]Its ridiculous the cut block is allowed when defenseless receiver, helmet to helmet and pretty much any QB hit is not.[/QUOTE]

Isn't the cut a staple of our running game?

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=hooskins;835578]Isn't the cut a staple of our running game?[/quote]

Yes it is, but if it needs to be eliminated for safety reasons, so be it. I guess someone need to analyze the benefits of it in the run game vs. when someone does it to one of our players and costs them the rest of their season or even career possibly.

It's unfortunate but come on, if the league was serious about safety the cut block would be eliminated.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

Apparently Darrell Young got a 15k fine for a hit he had on special teams.... Does anyone have any idea what play it was?? Maybe it was during one of those kick-offs their trying to eliminate.

Does anyone know his salary, it be nice to know what percentage 15k works out to be.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

Overall I think Goodell has done a good job. He is in a tough position and he will either be damned if he does or damned if he doesn't.
In regards to the NFL expanding to Europe, I am with many of you that it is just best to play a game abroad not set up a team. Having friends and family in England, Ireland, and Germany they like American Football to a degree but think there is too much stopping and the game does not have the flow they would like. Let the NFL stay in the NFL and lets be okay with that.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=TheSmurfs22;836385]Overall I think Goodell has done a good job. He is in a tough position and he will either be damned if he does or damned if he doesn't.
In regards to the NFL expanding to Europe, I am with many of you that it is just best to play a game abroad not set up a team. Having friends and family in England, Ireland, and Germany they like American Football to a degree but think there is too much stopping and the game does not have the flow they would like. Let the NFL stay in the NFL and lets be okay with that.[/quote]

I think the logistics of having a team overseas would be too much to bear. There'd be alignment issues, plus the fact that whoever plays them would have to fly overseas, and if the team was on the road they'd have to fly overseas to play whomever as well. A game or two overseas isn't bad considering both teams have to fly overseas, but the reality of a team being over there probably won't happen any time soon.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

Goodell said that he wants 2 Lodon games next year:

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/28/two-london-games-could-be-coming-for-2012/]Two London games could be coming for 2012 | ProFootballTalk[/url]

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=NC_Skins;835522]I used to like Goodell and the direction he was taking the NFL. No more. The whole fining these defensive players crazy amounts for hits, and now suspending a player for actions (not even illegal ones) before he's even in the NFL has pretty much left me disliking the guy big time.


What the hell is this shit?

[URL="http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/06/goodell-if-colts-hadnt-suspended-tressel-i-would-have/"]Goodell: If Colts hadn’t suspended Tressel, I would have | ProFootballTalk[/URL]




Really? Really? Just ****ing go away Roger. Please.[/quote]

I wish he'd get lost too. He sucks so bad for the NFL. How in the hell do you suspend a guy for what he did when he wasn't emplyed by the NFL? Someone needs to take some of his power away asap.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

The answer to this thread is no, too many reasons to list and im still in the dumps over the Dallas game so whatever. He Smack if your listening what about clearing all threads and start fresh. I asked an old boss one time why he fired some employees that have been at a place for a long time and he said son, sometimes you gotta purge the system. JK.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;841974]Goodell said that he wants 2 Lodon games next year:

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/28/two-london-games-could-be-coming-for-2012/]Two London games could be coming for 2012 | ProFootballTalk[/url][/quote]

eff that...the owners hate this stuff

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=Chico23231;841977]eff that...the owners hate this stuff[/quote]

And myself as a by God full blown FN American dont like it neither.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

The whole London thing rubs me the wrong way. This is our sport. American football is meant to be played here. They've got their Soccer and Rugby and they love it. We've got football and we love it.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

Yeah i hate it too. If a team wants to play somewhere else that’s close by, like the Bills w Taranto, I think that’s a great idea but to try and play random teams in London again and again is just horrible. If Goodell is gonna force this on us at least pick other countries and places…. And give any player involved a bonus check for having to fly overseas and back a day or 2 apart.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;836372]Apparently Darrell Young got a 15k fine for a hit he had on special teams.... Does anyone have any idea what play it was?? Maybe it was during one of those kick-offs their trying to eliminate.

Does anyone know his salary, it be nice to know what percentage 15k works out to be.[/quote]

This is all I could find:

[URL="http://www.rotoinfo.com/comments-2011_09_06_04_10_pm__Darrel_Young_FB-95814.html"]Washington Redskins - Darrel Young-FB - Fantasy football - Rotoinfo.com[/URL]

[URL="http://twitter.com/#%21/Rich_Campbell/status/114794045011795968"]Twitter[/URL]

[quote]The NFL confirms that Redskins FB Darrel Young was fined $15,000 for an illegal blindside block against the Giants. [/quote]

$15K is insane.

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[URL="http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2011/10/03/madonna-to-perform-at-super-bowl-halftime-show-report-says/"]Madonna To Perform At Super Bowl Halftime Show, Report Says | Fox News[/URL]

Well at least your girlfriends are gonna be happy. Maybe next year Roger can get the backstreet boys for us?

Re: Is Roger Goodell Good For the NFL?
 

[quote=mlmpetert;844414][URL="http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2011/10/03/madonna-to-perform-at-super-bowl-halftime-show-report-says/"]Madonna To Perform At Super Bowl Halftime Show, Report Says | Fox News[/URL]

Well at least your girlfriends are gonna be happy. Maybe next year Roger can get the backstreet boys for us?[/quote]

You think he hand picks the SB halftime act?

I know you don't like the guy but this is a bit of a reach