Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1054891]That is not really out of the box at all, I am fine with Thomas starting at SS next year, but what about FS? And CB? We need both of those positions. And whose to say this "quality" DB/S will be any good and where are you gonna draft him at? This draft isn't as deep with secondary talent as last year.[/quote]

They don't need to fix all those problems immediately. I do not see this team becoming a super bowl contender overnight, no matter what they do this offseason. Seahawks drafted Thurmound (4th round), Chancellor (5th round), then the next year drafted Sherman (5th round) and Maxwell (5th round). And now the Seahawks are favorites to make the Super Bowl. It can be done with proper scouting and development. But most of all patience.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=donofriose;1054893][B]They don't need to fix all those problems immediately. I do not see this team becoming a super bowl contender overnight, no matter what they do this offseason. Seahawks drafted Thurmound (4th round), Chancellor (5th round), then the next year drafted Sherman (5th round) and Maxwell (5th round).[/B] And now the Seahawks are favorites to make the Super Bowl. It can be done with proper scouting and development. But most of all patience.[/quote]


How often does that happen? What I am saying is that a blend of FA and the draft is a good thing. No one is saying go pay Jairus Byrd 13 million a year, but if we can get him and not blow too much to do so, why not?

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

We drafted Crawford, who I felt would work his way into the starting lineup this year before he got hurt, with him and Thomas coming back I think it gives our secondary a boost, but we still need a FS, we don't have one on the roster. Whether it be Byrd or Ward or whomever, we will have to add one this off-season. You can't expect to strike god with every draft pick. Seattle spent this last off season signing a good bit of DL and it has helped them.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1054898]How often does that happen? What I am saying is that a blend of FA and the draft is a good thing. No one is saying go pay Jairus Byrd 13 million a year, but if we can get him and not blow too much to do so, why not?[/quote]

It seems to happen to a lot of good teams. If Byrd wants to come at a reasonable price, I have no problem with it.

The problem is he stated last summer he wants to be the highest paid NFL safety. That would be around 10 million. He isn't worth that much.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=donofriose;1054900]It seems to happen to a lot of good teams. If Byrd wants to come at a reasonable price, I have no problem with it.

The problem is he stated last summer he wants to be the highest paid NFL safety. That would be around 10 million. He isn't worth that much.[/quote]


How is he not? He is the 2nd best FS in the league. Every good team still makes key FA signings that help them out.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1054899]We drafted Crawford, who I felt would work his way into the starting lineup this year before he got hurt, with him and Thomas coming back I think it gives our secondary a boost, but we still need a FS, we don't have one on the roster. [B]Whether it be Byrd or Ward or whomever, we will have to add one this off-season.[/B] You can't expect to strike god with every draft pick. Seattle spent this last off season signing a good bit of DL and it has helped them.[/quote]

I agree with this. The thing about FAs is: you know they can play professionally. Drafting is such a gamble because you don't know how their skills will translate to the NFL, but adding Ward or Byrd would immediately improve our secondary. If we spend a pick on a safety, we don't know how he'll turn out, and we might have blown a pick we could have used for OL, when we could have clearly upgraded our safety corps by turning to FA.

But if those two are asking for much more than 10 million, we need to find a cheaper option. We shouldn't spend a lot of money upgrading just because we can.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1054903]How is he not? He is the 2nd best FS in the league. Every good team still makes key FA signings that help them out.[/quote]

Yea but they sign players to low risk deals. I agree you need to sign players. But what great teams do is get value out of free agency. You rarely ever see those teams go for a 5 year 60 million dollar contract, which is what Byrd might get. Cliff Avril got a 2 year deal, 13 million dollar contract. That is a team friendly deal especially with the way his contract was structured. Those are the contracts the Skins need to go for. Team friendly deals, that if they do not turn out well, they can cut ties pretty easily.

Unless the player is a QB, no one player has enough game changing players to warrant 10 million plus dollars. The only time you spend that is if it is your guy, he is essential to your locker room, and you know he was successful in your system. Byrd is successful in the Bills system, with their coaches, with his teammates. You can't just plug him in. It is not like basketball where you can plug in a certain player and automatically get better.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

Ward might be a better choice than Byrd, as he can ball and his price tag should be smaller.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=Lotus;1054909]Ward might be a better choice than Byrd, as he can ball and his price tag should be smaller.[/quote]

I am fine with either one.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;1052435]ILB Shayne Skov, can't miss pick, just as good as Kiko Alonso or even better.[/quote]

I agree. I've seen highlights of this kid.....I don't think the defensive coaches can count on Keenan Robinson remaining healthy. If Robinson wasn't injured this year he would have gotten substituted reps for Fletcher.....Skov would be a great pick at 34th overall for us.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=donofriose;1054893]They don't need to fix all those problems immediately. I do not see this team becoming a super bowl contender overnight, no matter what they do this offseason. Seahawks drafted Thurmound (4th round), Chancellor (5th round), then the next year drafted Sherman (5th round) and Maxwell (5th round). And now the Seahawks are favorites to make the Super Bowl. It can be done with proper scouting and development. But most of all patience.[/quote]

Our team was one non-knee injury from making a good run into the playoffs last year (2012 season). You make it sound like our team is full of aging veterans and that we are starting from scratch.

While I don't expect a SB run next season, I think with the development of the young guys we've drafted and the young vets we have in place, a few key free agent acquisition and draft picks this offseason, can make us a playoff team sooner rather than later.

I don't want to see us break the bank on one player, but you can't expect to get every free agent signing cheap. Some people thought we overpaid for Gracon, but in the end he has been worth it.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

You can't expect low draft picks to come in and immediately make an impact. We struck gold with Alfmo, but how often does it happen you get a 6th or 7th round pick to come in and immediately be a starter? After a few years? Definitely a possibility, but you can't expect to sign everyone to itty bitty contracts and then hope your late round picks come through.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=DynamiteRave;1055829]You can't expect low draft picks to come in and immediately make an impact. We struck gold with Alfmo, but how often does it happen you get a 6th or 7th round pick to come in and immediately be a starter? After a few years? Definitely a possibility, but you can't expect to sign everyone to itty bitty contracts and then hope your late round picks come through.[/quote]

It happens.....just look at Donald Driver and Shannon Sharpe......

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=REDSKINS4ever;1055911]It happens.....just look at Donald Driver and Shannon Sharpe......[/quote]

It does, but players like those are the exception, not the rule.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=REDSKINS4ever;1055911]It happens.....just look at Donald Driver and Shannon Sharpe......[/quote]

It could happen, its just more probable that it won't. I'm also not a huge fan of the "if it worked for so and so then there's no reason we can't be able to do it" mindset.

It's just smarter and less risky to do as even of a 50/50 split between drafted players and FAs. It's not a bad thing to lean more towards drafted players, but I don't know how some people think you can build a strong team almost 100% through drafted players. And lets face it, the Redskins don't exactly pick the best project players in the later rounds.

All the, draft draft draft people realize that from the 2009 and 2010 drafts, we only have 3 people still on this team from those drafts, Orakpo and Trent Williams and Perry Riley. Out of 12 picks... 3 people. Only in the last 3 drafts have we started holding onto our draft picks, even the ones that probably need to be cut (I'm looking at you, Niles Paul and Evan Royster).

What I'm getting at is if you want to draft, draft, draft, there's going to be a lot of players that don't stick and a few that do and if you're willing to wait 3-5 years then maybe you can blare "started from the bottom now we're here", otherwise I think you do have to supplement in free agency as well. Nobody said you need to sign an Eric Decker type to a 4 year 50 million dollar deal. But if you can find a splashy sign for a steal, definitely do it.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

I remember when people said that Pierre Garçon was overpaid at 5 years 42 million, now that looks like a steal.

For example Eric Weddle signed a 5 year 40 million dollar contract, if you think Byrd isnt Worth that then I cant help you, but unless you are the OKC Thunder you aren't gonna build an entire team through the draft only. Gotta sprinkle some FA in there with some key players.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=DynamiteRave;1055829]You can't expect low draft picks to come in and immediately make an impact. We struck gold with Alfmo, but how often does it happen you get a 6th or 7th round pick to come in and immediately be a starter? After a few years? Definitely a possibility, but you can't expect to sign everyone to itty bitty contracts and then hope your late round picks come through.[/quote]

Not only that, but injuries played a huge part in that. Wasn't Helu/Royster supposed to start? Both got hurt in camp and the rest is history.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

QUAKE, I would have been in the same boat when that deal was made. I was like, "Oh yay, another Peyton Manning product." but straight up, the dude can ball.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;1055955]QUAKE, I would have been in the same boat when that deal was made. I was like, "Oh yay, another Peyton Manning product." but straight up, the dude can ball.[/quote]

Yeah he definitely is no Jabar Gaffney.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1055943]I remember when people said that Pierre Garçon was overpaid at 5 years 42 million, now that looks like a steal.

For example Eric Weddle signed a 5 year 40 million dollar contract, if you think Byrd isnt Worth that then I cant help you, but unless you are the OKC Thunder you aren't gonna build an entire team through the draft only. Gotta sprinkle some FA in there with some key players.[/quote]

You can use free agency, in fact I think you have to.
You just don't have to break the bank.
Good teams get the bargains and deals, like the Seahawks with Avril or Michael Bennett. Hell I would rather the Skins go the extreme route and only build through the draft like the Packers or Steelers, than break the bank on a single player.
Garcon isn't a steal at 42 million. He is getting paid exactly the amount he should be, if not being overpaid just due to position. Receivers are constantly overpaid anyway. Just my personal opinion.

Byrd is going to get Polamalu money. He just got paid around 10 mil this past year I believe. That is how much Byrd's annual salary will be. He's a great player, but in my opinion, he isn't worth that much.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=donofriose;1056046]You can use free agency, in fact I think you have to.
You just don't have to break the bank.
Good teams get the bargains and deals, like the Seahawks with Avril or Michael Bennett. Hell I would rather the Skins go the extreme route and only build through the draft like the Packers or Steelers, than break the bank on a single player.
Garcon isn't a steal at 42 million. He is getting paid exactly the amount he should be, if not being overpaid just due to position. Receivers are constantly overpaid anyway. Just my personal opinion.

Byrd is going to get Polamalu money. He just got paid around 10 mil this past year I believe. That is how much Byrd's annual salary will be. He's a great player, but in my opinion, he isn't worth that much.[/quote]

How long has it been since we "broke the bank?" And you really dont think Byrd is Worth 5 years 40-45 million or so?

[QUOTE=EARTHQUAKE2689;1056052]How long has it been since we "broke the bank?" And you really dont think Byrd is Worth 5 years 40-45 million or so?[/QUOTE]

Is Byrd better than ward? I haven't seen enough of ward yet but after spending time in buffalo over the last month bills fans really aren't too high on him.

Ok after looking at stats yes Byrd is better and they are the same age and I believe both played at Oregon? That's pretty cool if so.. overall I go with Byrd he's a playmaker

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

They both played at Oregon. Byrd is the better player, he plays FS and Ward plays SS perdominately.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

Just one thing to point out with all the FA talk. The new TV contracts go into affect this year. So next year, we will see the cap start rising due to those. These new TV contracts are a fair amount bigger than the last ones, so its not going to be a small rise. Granted, some of that money was pulled forward to keep the cap from going down the last couple of years, but its still expected to be a decent rise on the cap.

Every FA signed now, even if overpaid, has a very good chance of being on a "cheap" contract in 2 or 3 years due to the cap going up. Even the Mike Wallace deal might look ok in a few years instead of how horrible it looks now.

Salaries of players are about to jump. And it may be a pretty significant jump with the expected rise of the cap each year.

It could hurt this year, but be a bargain contract by year 3 or 4. This is what is so odd about this FA and the next few coming up. Dont be surprised to see a team throw 12-15 mil per year at Byrd hoping its not a bad contract down the road.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1056057]They both played at Oregon. Byrd is the better player, he plays FS and Ward plays SS perdominately.[/quote]

Just sign them both then and be done with the back end of the D.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;1056082]Just sign them both then and be done with the back end of the D.[/quote]

lol now that'd be awesome.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;1056082]Just sign them both then and be done with the back end of the D.[/quote]

Of course the $$$ would have to be right but that is what I've been thinking. Instant makeover at safety. Position of weakness ever since #21 passed instantly turned into a position of strength.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

What about this? Move Amerson to FS and sign Mike Mitchell from Carolina to play SS. Back them up with Thomas and Gumbs( Rambo can compete but i just don't see much talent there). Thats a young and talented group that is also cheap enough to allow us cap space to address CB

When we drafted Amerson i was hoping it was to play FS. He has the size and ball skills to make the switch and he was a safety coming out of high school but switch to CB in college. When asked about playing FS in the NFL he said he was open to it and that safety was his " first love".

As for the 34th pick i'm hoping we land Zack Martin. He is a OT but has a better build for G in the NFL. He reminds me of Andy Levitre. Slide him in at LG ,move Lich to C to compete with Monty to start or be quality interior depth. Sign Jon Asamoah to start at RG and either Eric Winston or Anthony Collins to play RT (whom ever offers us the best bang for our buck). I think that would upgrade the unit quit a bit without breaking the bank

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

What about this? Move Amerson to FS and sign Mike Mitchell from Carolina to play SS. Back them up with Thomas and Gumbs( Rambo can compete but i just don't see much talent there). Thats a young and talented group that is also cheap enough to allow us cap space to address CB

When we drafted Amerson i was hoping it was to play FS. He has the size and ball skills to make the switch and he was a safety coming out of high school but switch to CB in college. When asked about playing FS in the NFL he said he was open to it and that safety was his " first love".

As for the 34th pick i'm hoping we land Zack Martin. He is a OT but has a better build for G in the NFL. He reminds me of Andy Levitre. Slide him in at LG ,move Lich to C to compete with Monty to start or be quality interior depth. Sign Jon Asamoah to start at RG and either Eric Winston or Anthony Collins to play RT (whom ever offers us the best bang for our buck). I think that would upgrade the unit quit a bit without breaking the bank

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

Not a fan of moving Amerson to FS.

Amerson may be our number 1 CB next yr

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

I think he will be.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

I still feel that if Shayne Skov is available when the Redskins draft that he should be the pick. The defense needs a leader now that Fletcher is gone, Skov has proven to be a leader and he could be our Willis/Bowman with Riley. OT help can be filled in FA.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

If Cyril Richardson or Cedric Ogbuehi is available, we need to take them. Otherwise, I think I agree with you.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=SirLK26;1056490]If Cyril Richardson or Cedric Ogbuehi is available, we need to take them. Otherwise, I think I agree with you.[/quote]

[url=http://collegesportsblog.dallasnews.com/2014/01/texas-am-ol-cedric-ogbuehi-will-return-for-senior-season.html/]Texas A&M OL Cedric Ogbuehi will return for senior season | Dallas Morning News[/url]

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1056479]Amerson may be our number 1 CB next yr[/quote]

I hope not. We need to resign Hall and sign a starting caliber corner in FA, because Amerson isn't ready to start.

[quote=SFREDSKIN;1056491][url=http://collegesportsblog.dallasnews.com/2014/01/texas-am-ol-cedric-ogbuehi-will-return-for-senior-season.html/]Texas A&M OL Cedric Ogbuehi will return for senior season | Dallas Morning News[/url][/quote]

Well, then, that's not good news. But Richardson is the guy I wanted more anyway. So if he or one of the first-round rated O-linemen like Kouandijo, Lewan, or Su'a-Filo aren't available, then Skov is the best option. I think he'll be a fine NFL player; I just think finding long-term protection for RG3 is the most important task this offseason.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

It's one thing if you think Amerson just can't cut it at this level, but you can't draft a guy, retain his coordinator and position coach, give him significant playing time a rookie, and then not put him in the starting lineup in year two if he's still in your plans. If Amerson can play, he needs to start. If he can't...then that was a really costly pick.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

I mean Amerson played well in spurts. He looked like a talented guy who needs some experience and focus. I think he can play in this league.

Re: 34th Overall Pick
 

Amerson was pretty gud for a rookie. He wasn't Claiborne bad for sure.