Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1235531]What really bothered me was there was a shot on the sidelines after a offensive series and Ko is sitting down w/ Case, there's Colt also in street clothes and those three were going over stuff. Where was Haskins? He wasn't in on the conversation at all. He's the backup, not Colt. Then I went back to what Lombardi was saying about him and that goes back to the culture thing. Then he goes out there and takes a terrible sack, has a terrible int and could have had another one.[/quote]

He also seemed aloof in the presser after last night's game. The one thing I'm waiting for from Haskins is that one "Wow! That was nice!" play from him. I've yet to see that type of play from him in his limited time.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Still too early to call him a bust but what my eyes and gut tells me isn't right.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=PorkSkins;1235540]He also seemed aloof in the presser after last night's game. The one thing I'm waiting for from Haskins is that one "Wow! That was nice!" play from him. I've yet to see that type of play from him in his limited time.[/QUOTE]The pass to AP and one bomb in preseason both highlighted his arm skill and the AP pass particularly was a tight on the line high speed pass.

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Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235521]The thought of calling a guy a bust after limited action in two relief appearances is just absurd.[/quote]

I cant speak for everyone, but I'm not calling him a bust after limited action in two relief appearances. I thought he would be a bust before the draft. The most concerning thing is, not his play on the field, but his poor demeanor, attitude, and seeming disinterest over the course of the season. He's a bust until he proves otherwise. Those are not qualities you want to see in someone Allen (foolishly) invested the 15th overall pick in.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1235543]The pass to AP and one bomb in preseason both highlighted his arm skill and the AP pass particularly was a tight on the line high speed pass.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk[/quote]

I've mentioned his arm talent before, and spoke on it again after last night's game. But I haven't really been "Wow'ed" in his limited action, so far, this season.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1235542]Still too early to call him a bust but what my eyes and gut tells me isn't right.[/quote]

This is somewhat where I am at the moment. Another thing is he seems to lack poise. I'm big on a QB possessing poise.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Of course he doesn't look right. We knew from day 1 he was going to be a project. Until just recently he wasn't getting any practice snaps and the limited time we've seen him has been coming off the bench.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;1235544]I cant speak for everyone, but I'm not calling him a bust after limited action in two relief appearances. I thought he would be a bust before the draft. The most concerning thing is, not his play on the field, [B]but his poor demeanor, attitude, and seeming disinterest over the course of the season[/B]. He's a bust until he proves otherwise. Those are not qualities you want to see in someone Allen (foolishly) invested the 15th overall pick in.[/quote]

I'm just not seeing the same thing.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I swear to the high heavens, these mutherfuckers need to have Haskins ready to play in Buffalo. The rest of year means nothing. Get Haskins in there now

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=Chico23231;1235552]I swear to the high heavens, these mutherfuckers need to have Haskins ready to play in Buffalo. The rest of year means nothing. Get Haskins in there now[/quote]

Seriously, they've got 11 days to get a game plan installed for him. Give him a limited package of things he's comfortable with. Screens, quick slants, one read stuff, no audibles just let him throw hot. Why can every other team with a rookie QB get them up to speed and we have to keep hearing how our guy isn't ready?

You know who's laughing over this not ready crap? The Shanahans. They took Griffin and molded an entire offense around him and he won ROY. I'm done with this not ready BS. Get him ready.

Re: The Haskins Thread
 

I know Haskins has many issues and he may end up being a first round bust. BUT YOU’VE GOT TO KEEP PLAYING HIM - NOW. He may or may not be able to correct his happy feet and his other significant problems. But the longer he DOESN’T play the longer it takes for us to find out if he has the innate and trainable aspects to being an elite QB. I’ve seen draft bust QB for the Redskins from Heath Shuler, to Jason Campbell to RG3 to Cousins and now to Haskins. He will need to play probably 20-30 games before he can be officially a bust. That’s what happened to all these others. In Jason Campbell’s case he sat for 1.5 seasons before he played and the result was the same. So let the training and evaluation process begin NOW. We may win one more game with Case in there. It’s not worth it.

Somewhere in the 2020 draft the Redskins will need to pick a QB project player (like Cousins). But the draft must concentrate on the OL. TW and Moses must be replaced. Maybe even Scherff. The new HC will come here with the assignment to maximize Haskins and then see if he’s the future.

Finally, there is not much of a fan base left for the Redskins. Every “home game” has far more opposing team supporters than ours. EVERY game is an away game. Ppl will support Haskins for a year or two. Then he’s either there or not. Play him now, warts and all!


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Re: The Haskins Threat
 

The new head coach will want to be able to say who the QB is on this team .. if they don’t believe in Haskins then they should not be forced to play him .. if he plays the rest of season at least we will know what his ability is .. I don’t think we win another game and should have top 3 pick in draft .. we do have options ..

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235553]Seriously, they've got 11 days to get a game plan installed for him. Give him a limited package of things he's comfortable with. Screens, quick slants, one read stuff, no audibles just let him throw hot. Why can every other team with a rookie QB get them up to speed and we have to keep hearing how our guy isn't ready?

You know who's laughing over this not ready crap? The Shanahans. They took Griffin and molded an entire offense around him and he won ROY. I'm done with this not ready BS. Get him ready.[/quote]

I agree but much easier to mold an offense around a guy who can run for a 1,000 yards.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

The most telling thing to me, beyond what we've seen on the field which has been bad enough, is the fact that his teammates are saying he's not ready. Does that change after ONE full week of practice/reps with the 1s...I don't see it, but maybe he'll get that chance and prove me wrong.

I'm not a fan of him starting mostly because this team is still fighting their asses off. There's obvious holes, and the offense hasn't been good, but they are still fighting. I think they are fighting because they still believe they have a chance to win these games. Does that continue if the coach decides to trot out a kid who gives them ZERO chance to compete? No, I don't think it does. Seriously, the players on that team want to win, and they rightfully expect the coaching staff to put in the players that give them the best shot at doing that.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I'm just going to be completely honest with you guys. I was very excited when we drafted Haskins. I understand that there will be growing pains. However, this guy doesn't even look functional at this point. He can't even run a vanilla offense. We made a mistake. This guy doesn't have it. I hope I am wrong.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=MTK;1235553]Seriously, they've got 11 days to get a game plan installed for him. Give him a limited package of things he's comfortable with. Screens, quick slants, one read stuff, no audibles just let him throw hot. Why can every other team with a rookie QB get them up to speed and we have to keep hearing how our guy isn't ready?

You know who's laughing over this not ready crap? The Shanahans. They took Griffin and molded an entire offense around him and he won ROY. I'm done with this not ready BS. Get him ready.[/quote]

He’s not ready because he has 15 collegiate starts and should have stayed at OSU. Division I football, even at the highest level, is still not the NFL. This dude is raw as a fresh tuna catch as it comes in the boat.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

That has nothing to do with it. Kyler Murray had almost the same amount of starts as Dwayne

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1235573]That has nothing to do with it. Kyler Murray had almost the same amount of starts as Dwayne[/quote]

they are different though, Kyler is a freak athlete so that helps. He's also in a Offense that he used in college (Air Raid) which is very QB friendly.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1235573]That has nothing to do with it. Kyler Murray had almost the same amount of starts as Dwayne[/quote]

Yes, and Kyler Murray is exactly the same type of qb, a pocket passer with a big arm. There's no learning curve for that style qb either, he should be plug'n'play.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

After seeing the interview I'm 75% that he's a bust and 25% that it's too early.

I'm reminded of the joke where a woman was in a big flood and asked God to help her. Later 3 different boats came by and asked if they could help and she said "No, God will help." After she drowned she saw God and asked why he hadn't helped. And he asked "And the 3 boats...?"

I'm just left with the feeling that he thinks that in time, "God will provide" and that he doesn't need to do that much to help.

Re: The Haskins Thread
 

Play Haskins for the rest of the season and see how he progresses (or not). Use a third or fourth draft pick to get a project QB. Use the majority of the 2020 draft, to build a solid OL. Trade to get any extras draft picks for the following players:

Norman
Richardson
TW
Kerrigan
Moses (May get a ham sandwich for him)
Scherff
Etc.

We may be using a top draft for a QB IN 2021, after seeing Haskins on his second season if he fails to progress.






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Re: The Haskins Threat
 

It is not about bust or not.
Even before the draft I did not think Haskins was a franchise QB ready to be a high draft pick,much less ready to play in the NFL. Physically he is talented. Preparation and fundamentals he is at least a year or two away.
It is not that it take so long to learn. It takes a long time to break bad habits that he has developed over the course of his entire plying career because he was always one of the best players on his high school and college field. Now in NFL he is not the best and his bad footwork and undisciplined play is magnified. It’s a lot like trying to change your golf swing you have had your entire life or learning to write with your left hand. It does not happen after one training camp. Sometimes (see RGIii) it never happens.
It is so easy for a top athlete QB in high school and college to be exceptional and not learn the fundamentals. This is what we have.

Re: The Haskins Thread
 

I’m starting to see statements come out of Redskins camp: “Haskins may need to sit out this year OR MAYBE ANOTHER SEASON or more. Only a draft pick by the idiot twins Allen / Snyder could pick a QB who is a freakin’ MULTI-YEAR project. I am now of the opinion that the Redskins need to draft a QB with their top five 2020 draft pick. Whichever QB can develop faster stays on the team and the other is trade bait.

This really is a disaster. Bruce Allen is officially the worst GM in the NFL. But what is worse is that he so smug and stupid that he doesn’t even KNOW IT.


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Re: The Haskins Threat
 

Too early to tell is Haskins is a bust but it would be wise to play him after the bye to see what we got so we can plan the upcoming draft accordingly. He hasn't looked good but o-line hasn't been that good either. A great o-line can make a average qb look great....

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=Chief X_Phackter;1235523]A chance to win. Isn't that what they go out to do? This whole notion that they have to find out what we have for next year is a bunch of BS. I think they already know what they have, and that's why he's not starting.[/QUOTE]



No way. He isn’t/wasn’t starting because they don’t think he is ready and he obviously isn’t. But what should they do? They need to use the rest of the season to see if quarterback is a need in the off season. If he plays 8 more games and shows no improvement than we have to seriously consider drafting quarterback.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=punch it in;1235595]No way. He isn’t/wasn’t starting because they don’t think he is ready and he obviously isn’t. But what should they do? They need to use the rest of the season to see if quarterback is a need in the off season. If he plays 8 more games and shows no improvement than we have to seriously consider drafting quarterback.[/quote]

Your need to determine whether a rookie qb is a bust in the span of a year is wrong IMO. We knew he wasn't pro-ready when we got him, projects take more than a year to develop.

If it were up to me I'd spend the rest of this year prepping him to start for the next coach in 2020. He's not going to be ready in a week, and I wouldn't even put him in a game until he shows that he can run the offense with a base set of plays in practice. If that doesn't happen this year so be it. But we have to give him at least 2 years before we give up on him. This team already has enough holes without adding qb to the list.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

One year starter on a powerhouse college team that has far superior talent to most of there opponents is not a true indicator of there success in the NFL.. Haskins just did not develop bad habits overnight.. did they not see the flaws? The redskins went in the draft QB blind .. they were taking a QB regardless .. looking back I liked the pick however I know nothing but apparently I know as much as Bruce and Dan ..nobody can feel good about where we are at concerning the QB ..I fear we panic and pick another QB with top pick in draft and who is to say that works ... How about the guy in Jax.. when Foles comes back would they move him ? McCoy should be gone.. Keenum is the best we got.. Smith is done .. haskins at best is a 1-2 year project that should have been a 3rd -4th rnd pick .. The last two games were winnable with average QB play .. 10 points wins the 49er game and we were in it late at Vikings.. Is there a vet QB out there that would come here on the cheap that would be upgrade over this mess we got?

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=mooby;1235600]Your need to determine whether a rookie qb is a bust in the span of a year is wrong IMO. We knew he wasn't pro-ready when we got him, projects take more than a year to develop.

If it were up to me I'd spend the rest of this year prepping him to start for the next coach in 2020. He's not going to be ready in a week, and I wouldn't even put him in a game until he shows that he can run the offense with a base set of plays in practice. If that doesn't happen this year so be it. But we have to give him at least 2 years before we give up on him. This team already has enough holes without adding qb to the list.[/quote]

I totally understand your point. But I'll add when the new coach comes in then he should have the power to draft another QB early if he feels it's warranted.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=Defensewins;1235587].
It is so easy for a top athlete QB in high school and college to be exceptional and not learn the fundamentals. This is what we have.[/quote]

Why? As someone pushing 60 who competed in quite a diverse range of sports and took lessons in others just for leisure as a youth I cannot name one where fundamentals weren't pounded into everyone's head from the get go. Now we see NFL quarterbacks with bad footwork and defenders using poor tackling techniques that would have earned an ass chewing from a Pop Warner coach.

I am just going to assume these days if you are strong, fast, and or talented enough to be an impact player in spite of poor fundamentals and mental mistakes coaches don't bother forcing you to improve.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=rocnrik;1235604] [B]The last two games were winnable with average QB play ..[/B] 10 points wins the 49er game and we were in it late at Vikings.. Is there a vet QB out there that would come here on the cheap that would be upgrade over this mess we got?[/quote]

I am not so sure about that I think both those teams kept in vanilla on offense and didn't take any risks knowing their opponent would gain around 200 yards and score in single digits.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1235600]Your need to determine whether a rookie qb is a bust in the span of a year is wrong IMO. We knew he wasn't pro-ready when we got him, projects take more than a year to develop.



If it were up to me I'd spend the rest of this year prepping him to start for the next coach in 2020. He's not going to be ready in a week, and I wouldn't even put him in a game until he shows that he can run the offense with a base set of plays in practice. If that doesn't happen this year so be it. But we have to give him at least 2 years before we give up on him. This team already has enough holes without adding qb to the list.[/QUOTE]



I am not looking for the kid to be a finished project by years end though. I think 8 games is ample time to see “improvement”. Because if he plays like he has - over the course of the next 8 weeks- without signs of improvement than you can develop him until the cows come home and it won’t matter.
Again, not looking for perfection and there is absolutely no pressure on him at this point to win. Just go show us what you are capable of. If we see “enough” of it we run with him. If we see zero of it we have to consider drafting another guy like the Arizona Cardinals.
I am not giving Haskins three years to blossom into a “decent “ starter while I watch McCoy or Keenum or any other has been/never was flounder around.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I'm going to say what I know most of us already know. We made a big mistake by drafting Haskins. He is nowhere close to being able to run an NFL offense. In this up and coming draft we are going to be in position to draft a young qb who can. I understand that we need to be sure about Haskins. Therefore, we should put him out there to see can we mold him into something. But I think I've seen enough of this guy to know that he can't play in this league.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=punch it in;1235595]No way. He isn’t/wasn’t starting because they don’t think he is ready and he obviously isn’t. But what should they do? They need to use the rest of the season to see if quarterback is a need in the off season. If he plays 8 more games and shows no improvement than we have to seriously consider drafting quarterback.[/quote]

You can really only do that if he gives the team as good a chance to win as Case, and right now he doesn't if Case is healthy. The coaching staff has the responsibility to play the best players. You can say that you don't care about the wins, but I assure you, the players and coaches do. They aren't thinking about next year's draft. I think they ultimately believe Haskins will be fine, but remember, there was never any intent for him to start this year. No sense in deviating from that plan until he gives the team a better chance to win. Maybe that time comes sometime this year...maybe not.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I didn't like the pick at 15 I thought we could have used a different piece of the puzzle but we've got who we got. Time to see if he's gonna be the guy or not. It's senseless to start keenum or colt, flat out senseless.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

A lot of pre draft guys were comparing Minshaw of Jax to Case keenum .. both played in air raid type of offense.. Minshaw looks good to me for a rookie! I know that minshaw had a lot of experience in the college ranks .. Why do we always seem to screw up our top picks ? And is Bruce Allen really calling the draft picks ...

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

I am guessing Bruce has more input on the first 1st and 2nd round, maybe the 3rd round. After that, it is probably the draft team.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1235606]Why? As someone pushing 60 who competed in quite a diverse range of sports and took lessons in others just for leisure as a youth I cannot name one where fundamentals weren't pounded into everyone's head from the get go. Now we see NFL quarterbacks with bad footwork and defenders using poor tackling techniques that would have earned an ass chewing from a Pop Warner coach.

I am just going to assume these days if you are strong, fast, and or talented enough to be an impact player in spite of poor fundamentals and mental mistakes coaches don't bother forcing you to improve.[/quote]

Your quote is 100% spot on. Pure athletic ability and Raw talent can sometimes overcome poor basics / mechanics. Coaches know that and you like you say, if their ability is just so supreme, they don't spend a lot of time trying to correct anything, if it is "working"

The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=Chief X_Phackter;1235610]You can really only do that if he gives the team as good a chance to win as Case, and right now he doesn't if Case is healthy. The coaching staff has the responsibility to play the best players. You can say that you don't care about the wins, but I assure you, the players and coaches do. They aren't thinking about next year's draft. I think they ultimately believe Haskins will be fine, but remember, there was never any intent for him to start this year. No sense in deviating from that plan until he gives the team a better chance to win. Maybe that time comes sometime this year...maybe not.[/QUOTE]



Case doesn’t give us a chance to win. He gives us a chance to lose by less. That is why we are 1-7. I understand that winning is a good thing, but there comes a point that you need to play for the future of the franchise and not the current weeks absolutely meaningless game. We do not even have a HC, he got fired. Most of this staff will most likely be gone next year too. So not to seem heartless but who gives a fuck what Manusky thinks. I also do not think leaving Haskins on the sidelines to learn a scheme that will in all likelihood be extinct come the end of the season is helpful. What is helpful is giving him game experience which he so lacks. Sometimes you have to see the forest through the trees. The forest being the future, and the trees being the remaining games of 2019.
Best case scenario leaving Keenum in is we finish with 2 or 3 wins, and have no idea what Haskins has and go through another year without a quarterback. Best case scenario putting Haskins in is we find out what he is and address it before next year.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[quote=punch it in;1235621][B]Case doesn’t give us a chance to win. He gives us a chance to lose by less.[/B] That is why we are 1-7. I understand that winning is a good thing, but there comes a point that you need to play for the future of the franchise and not the current weeks absolutely meaningless game. We do not even have a HC, he got fired. Most of this staff will most likely be gone next year too. So not to seem heartless but who gives a fuck what Manusky thinks. I also do not think leaving Haskins on the sidelines to learn a scheme that will in all likelihood be extinct come the end of the season is helpful. What is helpful is giving him game experience which he so lacks. Sometimes you have to see the forest through the trees. The forest being the future, and the trees being the remaining games of 2019.
Best case scenario leaving Keenum in is we finish with 2 or 3 wins, and have no idea what Haskins has and go through another year without a quarterback. Best case scenario putting Haskins in is we find out what he is and address it before next year.[/quote]

That is important if you are betting the Redskins and taking the points, as ugly as that 200 yard per game, single digit scoring offense was, they covered the spread the last two games.

Re: The Haskins Threat
 

[QUOTE=Buffalo Bob;1235623]That is important if you are betting the Redskins and taking the points, as ugly as that 200 yard per game, single digit scoring offense was, they covered the spread the last two games.[/QUOTE]



They will adjust the points for Haskins. It is a win win!