Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

The results will tell the story but this is not what i hoped for. It seems more like Rons fiefdom than creating a sustainable front office. If it works BEST THING EVER

but my spidey sense is tingling a bit.

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Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;1274976]Given that they were both hired at the same time and both report to Ron, I think they all know going into this exactly who is responsible for doing what. Hurney is 65 years old and likely wants to "stay in the game" without necessarily having a 60-80hr/week job that dominates his life.

As awkward as the arrangement seems, I think it can work fine as long as Hurney "stays in his lane" (whatever that lane is).

Some have said this is too many cooks in the kitchen, but given that Kyle Smith is reportedly not part of the go-forward plan, this is really just a net addition of one person. And given Ron was stretched very thin last year, we definitely needed to add atleast one person.[/quote]

Agree on the number of hands. But the rationalization over the structure seems like... well, rationalization.

It's not a smart organizational structure. Organizational structure exists because human nature is what it is. Mayhew and Hurney will no doubt start out with the best of intentions but if they begin to disagree, or the stress begins to accumulate, I don't like the setup.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;1274976]Given that they were both hired at the same time and both report to Ron, I think they all know going into this exactly who is responsible for doing what. Hurney is 65 years old and likely wants to "stay in the game" without necessarily having a 60-80hr/week job that dominates his life.

As awkward as the arrangement seems, I think it can work fine as long as Hurney "stays in his lane" (whatever that lane is).

Some have said this is too many cooks in the kitchen, but given that Kyle Smith is reportedly not part of the go-forward plan, this is really just a net addition of one person. And given Ron was stretched very thin last year, we definitely needed to add atleast one person.[/quote]

Looks like there may be one less cook in the kitchen soon. Kyle isn’t long for the WFT.

“Update from @Russellmania621: #Rams, #49ers, #Packers, #Raiders have all shown interest in Kyle Smith.

Regarding San Francisco (which would be a lateral move): "I've heard Washington would not stand in their way."

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=Schneed10;1274981]Agree on the number of hands. But the rationalization over the structure seems like... well, rationalization.

It's not a smart organizational structure. Organizational structure exists because human nature is what it is. Mayhew and Hurney will no doubt start out with the best of intentions but if they begin to disagree, or the stress begins to accumulate, I don't like the setup.[/quote]

Fucking stupid to let your best talent evaluator be replaced for mediocre ones. All Ron had to is bring in either Hurney or Mayhew and teach Smith, but no, instead we let talent walk out the door.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

This is a steaming pile of dogshit. Where does this team get off reinventing the wheel? Where in recent history has this team demonstrated they should think outside of the box? Learn how to operate in the box 1st.

This franchise can't handle simple arithmetic but have jumped straight to advanced calculus.

Rivera being in charge the 1st year was likely needed, but there has been more than enough time to get a tried and true system in place.

Is Hurney taking a Bruce Allen type position? Gonna lose Kyle Smith to bring in Hurney. Don't like that trade.

Would much rather have:

GM: Mayhew
Assistant GM: Smith
HC: Rivera

Even if Mayhew still reported to Rivera, this would be preferred.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

I guess since it's the offseason for us there's not much else to get fired up about, but I really don't get being upset about what's going on. Adding competent football people to the org is a bad thing? Ron doesn't know what he's doing apparently? Ok.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=MTK;1274994]I guess since it's the offseason for us there's not much else to get fired up about, but I really don't get being upset about what's going on. Adding competent football people to the org is a bad thing? Ron doesn't know what he's doing apparently? Ok.[/quote]

You can love the coach and still question certain decisions. I'm just not a fan or the HC being the de-facto GM in general. I'm old school I guess.

I like the Mayhew hire.

To me this is basically trading out Smith for Hurney. I'd rather have a young accomplished talent evaluator than an old retread. Mayhew could handle things Hurney will do, or hire guy(s) under him to handle the smaller duties outside of scouting, which Smith could lead.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=MTK;1274994]I guess since it's the offseason for us there's not much else to get fired up about, but I really don't get being upset about what's going on. Adding competent football people to the org is a bad thing? Ron doesn't know what he's doing apparently? Ok.[/quote]

Yeah I don't want to get it twisted, overall what happened here is still a good thing.

1) Ron is still in charge and I like him having full control, beats Bruce Allen any day, and Ron has demonstrated that he will do things Snyder may not love (cut Haskins)

2) He's hiring experienced football people to take stuff off his plate and help him with strategy and day to day

Overall this is good. I don't like the structure, I think it could result in some problems. But overall, the problems that may come from that sure beat the problems that could come with continuing to go along with just Ron and Kyle and calling that an adequate front office.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=Schneed10;1274975]Just saw it and you're right. Chief I owe you an apology, WFT really is dumb enough to structure it this way.

It's a bad idea, I think Ron's inviting trouble. Mayhew and Hurney need to be adults who don't stab each other in the back or Ron won't be well supported. Maybe they are, but a better structure would mitigate it.[/quote]

It's all good man. It's all a bit unconventional I suppose, but I think the most important takeaway here is there are three very competent football minds, who are all on the same page, with the same vision for the future of the team, with one goal in mind, and one man in charge - RR.

Five years from now we can all judge how great or stupid these decisions were, but not today.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

I'd much rather be wrong and look stupid in a few years than be right and starting over again. I'll start slow roasting that crow now.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

Keep in mind,

Hurney brought Newton to Carolina

Mayhew brought Stafford to Detroit.

That's probably a good sign that they understand about the importance of the qb position.

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Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

Stafford Stafford Stafford!!

Stafford drops back, he surveys the field, he fires long, McLaurin has step, he has it, 70 yard TD for McLaurin.

This could be a legit thing for 4+ years (this is based on Stafford, I think he has at least 4 good years left). Extending McLaurin day 1 he can be extended, for the whole cookie jar isn't even a question. Get him a stud QB and let him eat.

A Stafford/McLaurin/Thomas/McKissic and Gibson offense is looking real nice. Not even including adding a weapon from Curtis Samuel on up.

If I'm over selling Stafford others are under selling him. If Detroit didn't have him they'd be a 4 or less win team annually.

Marty Hurney Thread
 

Stafford is the bomb, but will they trade for him? It’s going to take a RG3 monster-type trade to get him out of Detroit. Giving up two-three first round draft picks and a very good player like Allen of Payne is a huge price for Stafford. Worth it? I think so. But that’s the MINIMUM it will take to get him.

Except for the Cooper attempt, the WFT did not really go for any major players in FA. They went for medium players on 1-year cheap contracts. Some worked out and some did not. It was an OUTSTANDIBG strategy. Now they have to bid and go for the ones who worked out, like Thomas. I even think it’s POSSIBLE that Rivera just bid up Cooper, just so Dallas would overpay for him. It worked.


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Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

I refuse to believe it will take two-three first round draft picks and a very good player like Allen of Payne to get Stafford. If that is the case, it's a hard pass for me.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;1275076]I refuse to believe it will take two-three first round draft picks and a very good player like Allen of Payne to get Stafford. If that is the case, it's a hard pass for me.[/quote]

As much as I'd love to have him, definitely agree. Our 1st and one of our 3rds would be the max imo. Hopefully you can hold out where it would only take the 1st. Then build out the roster with all the other picks.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=Warthog;1275075]Stafford is the bomb, but will they trade for him? It’s going to take a RG3 monster-type trade to get him out of Detroit. Giving up two-three first round draft picks and a very good player like Allen of Payne is a huge price for Stafford. Worth it? I think so. But that’s the MINIMUM it will take to get him.

Except for the Cooper attempt, the WFT did not really go for any major players in FA. They went for medium players on 1-year cheap contracts. Some worked out and some did not. It was an OUTSTANDIBG strategy. Now they have to bid and go for the ones who worked out, like Thomas. I even think it’s POSSIBLE that Rivera just bid up Cooper, just so Dallas would overpay for him. It worked.


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I just commented in the other thread on your post there with this price for Stafford. I really believe that you are overestimating what it would take to get Stafford by a lot. Out of curiosity, where are you getting the idea that it would cost so much? I'm not seeing that kind of price estimate for Stafford anywhere. If the Lions are saying that's what it would take, I'm pretty sure that Stafford will just stay in Detroit.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

Reading articles and the Lions fan forum ... expectation is it will take a 1st plus something else. Colts, 9ers are the most talked about likely partners.

Our 1st plus a 3rd or so might do it.

im fine either way. But I would like to know what the Watson demand is so we could compare.

Stafford - 1st and 3rd?
Watson - two 1sts and a 3rd?

I think Watson fits our scheme more than Stafford. Plus age. Plus ability to extend broken plays.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=SunnySide;1275284]Reading articles and the Lions fan forum ... expectation is it will take a 1st plus something else. Colts, 9ers are the most talked about likely partners.

Our 1st plus a 3rd or so might do it.

im fine either way. But I would like to know what the Watson demand is so we could compare.

Stafford - 1st and 3rd?
Watson - two 1sts and a 3rd?

I think Watson fits our scheme more than Stafford. Plus age. Plus ability to extend broken plays.[/quote]

Keim said 19 and Payne or Allen would do it

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=SunnySide;1275284]Reading articles and the Lions fan forum ... expectation is it will take a 1st plus something else. Colts, 9ers are the most talked about likely partners.

Our 1st plus a 3rd or so might do it.

im fine either way. But I would like to know what the Watson demand is so we could compare.

Stafford - 1st and 3rd?
[B]Watson - two 1sts and a 3rd? [/B]

I think Watson fits our scheme more than Stafford. Plus age. Plus ability to extend broken plays.[/quote]

I would totally do this. But I think this will take more ammo to get Watson. I also hope we are considered a target team for Watson, because if he doesn't want to come to our team, we're not getting him.

Aside from the Colts, I think we are probably the 2nd best team option for a QB.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1275293]Keim said 19 and Payne or Allen would do it[/quote]

For Watson? Id consider that but honestly I havent watched a lot of Watson (or Stafford). but 5k yards on that team this past year is impressive.

no. 19 and payne/allen for Stafford? - thats a no from me. 1st and 3rd is my fan arm chair GM limit.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1275303]I would totally do this. But I think this will take more ammo to get Watson. [B]I also hope we are considered a target team for Watson, because if he doesn't want to come to our team, we're not getting him.[/B]

Aside from the Colts, I think we are probably the 2nd best team option for a QB.[/quote]

Well, he wants to leave his current team because the organization is screwed up and the WFT is the nadir of screwed up organizations, so I doubt we're on his favorites list.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1275293]Keim said 19 and Payne or Allen would do it[/quote]

No way! That's the equivalent of two #1's, plus we lose a key player. Maybe we'd stretch a little by offering #19, one of our 3rd rounders, and a 4th or 5th round pick next year.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1275308]Well, he wants to leave his current team because the organization is screwed up and the WFT is the nadir of screwed up organizations, so I doubt we're on his favorites list.[/quote]

Why wouldn't we be on his list?

We have a respected head coach in charge of all football matters.

We have young weapons on offense and could add more through free agency.

We have a near elite defense.

Adding him to the team would put us as an instant favorite to win the division.

People are talking about the Jets and Dolphins as options for Watson, solely based on their ability to provide picks for a trade. But are they any better than us as an organization?

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=SunnySide;1275307]For Watson? Id consider that but honestly I havent watched a lot of Watson (or Stafford). but 5k yards on that team this past year is impressive.

no. 19 and payne/allen for Stafford? - thats a no from me. 1st and 3rd is my fan arm chair GM limit.[/quote]

Payne or Allen.

I hate to do it, but yes our first plus 1 or the other would do it. You need a franchise qb.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1275315][B]Why wouldn't we be on his list?[/B]

We have a respected head coach in charge of all football matters.

We have young weapons on offense and could add more through free agency.

We have a near elite defense.

Adding him to the team would put us as an instant favorite to win the division.

People are talking about the Jets and Dolphins as options for Watson, solely based on their ability to provide picks for a trade. But are they any better than us as an organization?[/quote]

Two words: Dan Snyder.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1275323]Two words: Dan Snyder.[/quote]

But the JETS are one of his favourites???? It would hardly be consistent if he rejected WFT for the JETS.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[IMG]https://blog.mint.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/U.S.-Income-Tax-Map.png[/IMG]

MD income tax is 5.75%
Watsons contract is 156M
156,000,000*.0575 = [B]$8,970,000 million dollars[/B] more he would make in 4 years playing for Miami vs Skins.

Watson playing in Texas has personally seen and enjoyed the no income tax state of Texas and wants to go to Miami, also a no income tax state.

(i think whether you pay tax on a game check is based on where the game was played so I dont think all 156M is subject to no income tax but im not 100% sure -- what happens if a player misses a few away games, he still gets paid anyway under what state's tax law? idk)

-----------------

Seahawks, all the florida and texas teams, Vegas raiders, titans to a degree enjoy a big competitive advantage in FA.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[QUOTE=SunnySide;1275334][IMG]https://blog.mint.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/U.S.-Income-Tax-Map.png[/IMG]



MD income tax is 5.75%

Watsons contract is 156M

156,000,000*.0575 = [B]$8,970,000 million dollars[/B] more he would make in 4 years playing for Miami vs Skins.



Watson playing in Texas has personally seen and enjoyed the no income tax state of Texas and wants to go to Miami, also a no income tax state.



(i think whether you pay tax on a game check is based on where the game was played so I dont think all 156M is subject to no income tax but im not 100% sure -- what happens if a player misses a few away games, he still gets paid anyway under what state's tax law? idk)



-----------------



Seahawks, all the florida and texas teams, Vegas raiders, titans to a degree enjoy a big competitive advantage in FA.[/QUOTE]That makes sense but he has said NY as well which is the opposite end of the tax spectrum. Ultimately, we need a guy (Chase or Terry maybe) to pitch him on Rivera and coming to our team, IF the FO wants to invest what it would take to get him.

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Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1275323]Two words: Dan Snyder.[/quote]

Watson's beef with his team has to do with the football operations and how basically Bill O'Brien pulled a Josh McDaniels and ran the team into the ground. I doubt Snyder comes into the equation, but even then, having the team run by a respected coach like Rivera should easily overcome this.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1275293]Keim said 19 and Payne or Allen would do it[/quote]

I'd rather send a 1st and one of our 3rd's.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=sevier2;1275377]I'd rather send a 1st and one of our 3rd's.[/quote]

And even that’s too much

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[QUOTE=sevier2;1275377]I'd rather send a 1st and one of our 3rd's.[/QUOTE]



Yup. That would work for me.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1275394]Yup. That would work for me.[/quote]

1st and Landon Collins, throw in Apke.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

No one wants Landon Collins!!

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1275411]No one wants Landon Collins!![/quote]

or Apke or any terrible player in our team.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1275419]or Apke or any terrible player in our team.[/quote]

A 1st and we promise not to force them to take Collins and Apke! They’ll jump at that.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;1275405]1st and Landon Collins, throw in Apke.[/quote]

So a first and a 7th rounder and a ham sandwich basically?

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

This is an interesting video from last year's combine with Kyle Smith. So what happened between Kyle and Ron? I don't believe Kyle was in Ron's radar from the beginning and blew sunshine up his ass.

[url]https://youtu.be/FaTfkG_OdnA[/url]

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;1275426]This is an interesting video from last year's combine with Kyle Smith. So what happened between Kyle and Ron? I don't believe Kyle was in Ron's horizon from the beginning and blew sunshine up his ass.

[url]https://youtu.be/FaTfkG_OdnA[/url][/quote]

I'm starting to believe they had a philosophical difference on how to build the team. Guessing Kyle was the more pragmatic, slow and steady type, and Ron thinks we have an opportunity to win now and he wants to seize it. If that is the case, the marriage was doomed as soon as our "window" opened during the season last year.

Re: Marty Hurney Thread
 

[quote=mooby;1275427]I'm starting to believe they had a philosophical difference on how to build the team. Guessing Kyle was the more pragmatic, slow and steady type, and Ron thinks we have an opportunity to win now and he wants to seize it. If that is the case, the marriage was doomed as soon as our "window" opened during the season last year.[/quote]

Watch the video.