Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=Mattyk72;538287]Why do you figure that?

It's probably the hardest considering the center typically makes the line calls and needs to make pre-snap reads of the D.[/quote]

Hey ya'll, I found the Ross Tucker article referred to earlier where he gives order of importance when it comes to the o-line. Center is last (or least depending how you look at it)...

There's a nice pic of Samuels dominating btw.

[url=http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/ross_tucker/04/02/oline.rankings/index.html]SI.com - Writers - Ross Tucker: Ranking the five O-line positions - Friday April 4, 2008 11:53AM[/url]

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

... btw if you take Tucker's analysis to heart it's almost impossible to argue we can go into the season w/o upgrading RT. Also per his analysis if Rabach can pull his head out and stop making so many friggin mental errors he wouldn't be half the liability he was last year. Is it just me or did Rabach regress "mentally" in a big way? Wassup wid dat?

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=The Goat;538443]... btw if you take Tucker's analysis to heart it's almost impossible to argue we can go into the season w/o upgrading RT. Also per his analysis if Rabach can pull his head out and stop making so many friggin mental errors he wouldn't be half the liability he was last year. Is it just me or did Rabach regress "mentally" in a big way? Wassup wid dat?[/quote]Tucker's analysis though, is dealing with the concepts of relative value and replacability, more than degree of difficulty (though he uses relative difficulty as a supporting reason for his argument).

He also makes the assumption at the beginning that run blocking is negigible, which is obviously a generalization, because you have to consider run blocking before you sign a player.

The point, as Tucker would make it, is that when we replace Casey Rabach, we shouldn't invest a considerable amount to do it unless we're getting a truly special player. He's saying "Don't give Jason Brown what the Rams did. That's spending stupid." (or Dock with Buffalo)

Likewise, spending the 13th pick on Mack is equally stupid if we don't think he's the best OLman available when we pick. It's just too easy to get a Center in the 3rd or 5th round to pass on a better lineman.

Tucker isn't saying "Rabach shouldn't be replaced because all centers are interchagable." He's just pointing out that if you spend a lot of money on a Center or LG (like Faneca), you're overestimating his effect on the entire line.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=GTripp0012;538446]Tucker's analysis though, is dealing with the concepts of relative value and replacability, more than degree of difficulty (though he uses relative difficulty as a supporting reason for his argument).

He also makes the assumption at the beginning that run blocking is negigible, which is obviously a generalization, because you have to consider run blocking before you sign a player.

The point, as Tucker would make it, is that when we replace Casey Rabach, we shouldn't invest a considerable amount to do it unless we're getting a truly special player. He's saying "Don't give Jason Brown what the Rams did. That's spending stupid." (or Dock with Buffalo)
[B]
Likewise, spending the 13th pick on Mack is equally stupid if we don't think he's the best OLman available when we pick. It's just too easy to get a Center in the 3rd or 5th round to pass on a better lineman.[/B]

Tucker isn't saying "Rabach shouldn't be replaced because all centers are interchagable." He's just pointing out that if you spend a lot of money on a Center or LG (like Faneca), you're overestimating his effect on the entire line.[/quote]

1.) I think that selecting Duke Robinson who would still be high at 13 is still a better pick then Alex Mack.

2.) At thirteen im looking for a player to come in and have an immediate impact. If we drafted Mack or Robinson, they are probaly not going to start. I would say that the position where we could select someone to come in and start right away would be a DE/LB.

3.) Im on the Mack bandwagon as well but I just cant see selecting him with our first. I'm by no means saying that Rabach should stay, im just saying that it's something that can be addressed in the third.(Shipley, Caldwell,etc)

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

I'd have to go with Maybin even though I like Cushing and Oher alot. Maybin can play DE and LB as where Cushing can only play LB (granted all three spots). I don't understand why everyone is picking Rey at 13 if he was already selected, and are we really talking about drafting a center with the 13th pick. Duke and Mack may be great players but not at 13! They don't even draft guards that high.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

I now think the pick is going on defense, and it's either Maybin or Cushing at 13. Even if Maualuga "was" available I think he would be a [B]huge[/B] risk. He can only play 1 LB spot (MLB) and his speed (4.8) is questionable as well as his character. In the 3rd we should draft a C like Shipley and 1-2 years he can replace Rabach. Hopefully we can sign Shaffer to start at RT, but I think he might go to the Bears.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

I don't have a lot more to say about Mack. The information has been put forth and I'll leave it at that. But I will say this....the chances of a player like Maybin or Cushing being a bust at #13 are considerably more than Mack.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

I can understand saying a 1st rd DE has a strong chance to be a bust; however, the two safest positions to pick in the 1st are OT and LB. Cushing would be an awesome addition and would produce more than maybe a Maybin would, but IMO we have a much bigger hole to fill at DE than at LB.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=ibleedburgandy;538533]I can understand saying a 1st rd DE has a strong chance to be a bust; however, the two safest positions to pick in the 1st are OT and LB. Cushing would be an awesome addition and would produce more than maybe a Maybin would, but IMO we have a much bigger hole to fill at DE than at LB.[/quote]

Cushing played a little DE for USC two years ago due to injuries on their line. Dude's a beast.

I still want Maualuga!!!

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Rey-Rey! The Latest: [url=http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/559367]Rey Maualuga, Southern California, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com Football[/url]

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Clay Matthews! The Latest: [url=http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/504552]Clay Matthews, Southern California, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com Football[/url]

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=Son Of Man;538536][B]Cushing played a little DE for USC two years ago due to injuries on their line. Dude's a beast.[/B]

I still want Maualuga!!![/quote]

Cushing is a stud LB who can play all LB positions and DE. The only knock on him that I know of is durability issues. He's had various ankle, knee and shoulder injuries and some surgery. I've read that after his showing at the combine (or proday can't remember which) scouts are no longer worried about his shoulder. 30 reps of 225 lbs.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Cushing is a product of roids... look at pics from him in high school, till his surgery, till now... obvi fishy

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=ecupirate08;538570]Cushing is a product of roids... look at pics from him in high school, till his surgery, till now... obvi fishy[/quote]

Yeah...because most guys finish puberty before HS and college.:doh:

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Matthews was a 166 lb. LB/TE as a freshman. He's now a 240 lb. LB.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=53Fan;538582]Matthews was a 166 lb. LB/TE as a freshman.[/quote]

In highschool?

I was 147 lbs as a freshman, 170 as a senior, and 4 years later I was 205. And I was not a professional athlete or heavy into lifting during that 4 year span. I was in the Army though so there was physical exercise. That was a 21% increase in weight and mass over 8 years.

Brian Cushing had a 35% increase, but he was playing football and lifting heavy while in college. It is not much of a stretch to see those type of gains when you are working hard.

Hell, nowadays (12 years later) I'm pushing 230, but I need to get back to 195-205...beer hasn't been kind to me.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=Angry;538593][B]In highschool?[/B]

I was 147 lbs as a freshman, 170 as a senior, and 4 years later I was 205. And I was not a professional athlete or heavy into lifting during that 4 year span. I was in the Army though so there was physical exercise. That was a 21% increase in weight and mass over 8 years.

Brian Cushing had a 35% increase, but he was playing football and lifting heavy while in college. It is not much of a stretch to see those type of gains when you are working hard.

Hell, nowadays (12 years later) I'm pushing 230, but I need to get back to 195-205...[B]beer hasn't been kind to me[/B].[/quote]

No, at USC. You can gain a lot of weight when you're undersized and trying to be a starter at LB at a major program. I think it's more a case of hard work than steroids. I hear ya. It wasn't that kind to me either. :)

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=Angry;538593]In highschool?

I was 147 lbs as a freshman, 170 as a senior, and 4 years later I was 205. And I was not a professional athlete or heavy into lifting during that 4 year span. I was in the Army though so there was physical exercise. That was a 21% increase in weight and mass over 8 years.

Brian Cushing had a 35% increase, but he was playing football and lifting heavy while in college. It is not much of a stretch to see those type of gains when you are working hard.

Hell, nowadays (12 years later) I'm pushing 230, but I need to get back to 195-205...beer hasn't been kind to me.[/quote]


Actually it is more of a 44% increase (that's 6% shy of half his body mass- 74 divided by 166 ). And that's 4 years. I don't know if that's normal.

Angry, you had a 39% increase (from 147 to 205), but that was 8 years.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=53Fan;537393]This is an easy one for me. Alex Mack-Center-Cal. It's time to stop putting the win on the defenses shoulders all the time. Nice Thread![/quote]Could not agree more. This guy can play guard or center. He'll be here for at lkeast 7 years and will be an all-pro by his second year.

It's not going to happen because the Skins never pick OL with their first pick. But if they did, this should be the guy.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=warriorzpath;538616]Actually it is more of a 44% increase (that's 6% shy of half his body mass- 74 divided by 166 ). And that's 4 years. I don't know if that's normal.

Angry, you had a 39% increase (from 147 to 205), but that was 8 years.[/quote]


Yeah, I calculated percentage from his current weight. The Army teaches interpulation rather than math. We were also taught 1 and 1 is 3...Long story. Not that either of those is a solid excuse for my incorrect calculations.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

I'd be happy if we picked any of the following...

LB Cushing
LB Maualuga
T Oher
T A. Smith
DE Maybin
DE Jackson

All three would be an improvement from what we have now!

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=ibleedburgandy;538813]I'd be happy if we picked any of the following...

LB Cushing
LB Maualuga
T Oher
T A. Smith
DE Maybin
DE Jackson

All three would be an improvement from what we have now![/quote]

Ugh... i still don't get the luv for Cushing. I'd take Marcus back any day of the week over him.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

matthew stafford. keep him or use as a trade bait for those needing a QB, a pick and a veteran star player of need for us

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[I]matthew stafford. keep him or use as a trade bait for those needing a QB, a pick and a veteran star player of need for us [/I]

WHAT?

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Cushing. Cushing. Cushing. Easy choice

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=bertoskins2;538889]matthew stafford. keep him or use as a trade bait for those needing a QB, a pick and a veteran star player of need for us[/quote]

I think a more realistic scenario would be that if Stafford is available at #13, team needing a QB would be willing to trade with us (giving us multiple picks hopefully).

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

I think if Oher, Andre Smith or even Rey is available @ 13 we need to take the dude rather than trade back. It's time to get a franchise player in the draft and I believe any one of those guys fits the bill... basically we can fill our other needs thru FA.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Not at #13 but im loving Jarron Gilbert. He is the only DE that I would like to see us draft. If we stay at #13, its gotta be RT or Rey. No to Cushing or Mathews at #13 or any of the smallish DE out there. Id love to see us trade back and pick a RT, Gilbert and A LB in the 3rd?... Follet or Sidbury maybe? I bet ya Oher or Smith drops to at least 20th. Bottom line is I want Gilbert somehow!!!

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=mrreddman;538966]Not at #13 but im loving Jarron Gilbert. He is the only DE that I would like to see us draft. If we stay at #13, its gotta be RT or Rey. No to Cushing or Mathews at #13 or any of the smallish DE out there. Id love to see us trade back and pick a RT, Gilbert and A LB in the 3rd?... Follet or Sidbury maybe? I bet ya Oher or Smith drops to at least 20th. Bottom line is I want Gilbert somehow!!![/quote]

That's about a perfect scenario buddy...

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=The Goat;538963]I think if Oher, Andre Smith or even Rey is available @ 13 we need to take the dude rather than trade back. It's time to get a franchise player in the draft and I believe any one of those guys fits the bill... basically we can fill our other needs thru FA.[/quote]

Here you go Goat: [url=http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story?id=09000d5d80f4a526&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true]Mock draft 2.0: Chiefs might not be able to pass on Crabtree[/url]

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=53Fan;538972]Here you go Goat: [url=http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story?id=09000d5d80f4a526&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true]Mock draft 2.0: Chiefs might not be able to pass on Crabtree[/url][/quote]

Nice find sir... seen a few other mocks where we take Rey too. I think the interesting thing about this one is Oher falling to 28th overall. That seems unlikely IMO. The trouble I have taking Rey or any d player w/ our first pick is it's the offense needing the help... obviously the o-line. Our d is most likely in the top 5 again and possibly the best overall for '09... hard to justify our franchise-player pick on another defender. The counter argument is we'll likely see more OL FA talent available after the draft so we could still seriously upgrade the unit but just not in the draft. This mock predicts Levi Jones will be dropped after Cinci grabs one of the best OTs in the draft. Jones is still very good but way too expensive under his current contract... we could get him for a reasonable rate about a month from now.