Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=celts32;608855]Louisville...my god are they out of their minds! Who do they think they are even putting Gruden on their list? Gruden is on Monday Night Football and is a candidate for like a half dozen NFL openings, but he's supposed to give that up to coach a basketball schools football program? I also heard that Temple has Bill Parcells #1 on their list! ND is the only school that Gruden would even take a call from.[/quote]

And Maryland wants Shanny or Holmgren. LOL.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

Aside from the rediculous Louisville Gruden nonsense, the interesting thing that Lombardi said on NFL Network last night was that he thinks the main reason Snyder may want to can Zorn during the season is so that he can talk to the big name candidates out in the open without having to worry about sneaking around behind the current coaches back.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

This team is a total mess.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

Someone I work with said they were up late last night watching ESPN360 and it was mentioned by one of the announcers that their top level inside source at Redskins Park informed them that there is already a deal in place with Gruden to be the next HC along with Gruden having front office authority of some type. Supposedly Snyder is not happy and has not spoken to Vinny or Zorn in the last few days to a week. Rumor is Zorn will be cut and Vinny will be let go. Supposedly, again rumor, is Snyder didn't want Zorn as OC or HC and Cerrato talked Snyder into picking up Zorn as OC. Then no coach's wanted Zorn as their OC and they started backing out of the HCing hunt. Again it was Cerrato who swindled Snyder into believing Zorn would be a good HC so they named Zorn the HC.

I did not hear this so I am only passing along rumor's as of right now but if anyone else heard it perhaps you can clarify. I looked all over and can't find it being discussed anywhere.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SBXVII;608925]Someone I work with said they were up late last night watching ESPN360 and it was mentioned by one of the announcers that their top level inside source at Redskins Park informed them that there is already a deal in place with Gruden to be the next HC along with Gruden having front office authority of some type. Supposedly Snyder is not happy and has not spoken to Vinny or Zorn in the last few days to a week. Rumor is Zorn will be cut and Vinny will be let go. Supposedly, again rumor, is Snyder didn't want Zorn as OC or HC and Cerrato talked Snyder into picking up Zorn as OC. Then no coach's wanted Zorn as their OC and they started backing out of the HCing hunt. Again it was Cerrato who swindled Snyder into believing Zorn would be a good HC so they named Zorn the HC.

I did not hear this so I am only passing along rumor's as of right now but if anyone else heard it perhaps you can clarify. I looked all over and can't find it being discussed anywhere.[/quote]

Why would ESPN360 be talking about this? I'll go back and check if you can tell me what he was watching, but that doesn't seem to make sense. Maybe you meant ESPN980

Not to dispute what you've written about Gruden, my top level Gruden source (and it's a really good source) says nothing is in place with Gruden (although this same source says Bruce Allen and Snyder did speak earlier this week...but they always talk to each other)

Snyder let Cerrato choose the HC. And after alienating both Williams and Fassel, Cerrato suggested Zorn. So yeah that's on Cerrato...but I don't think Snyder will fire Vinny so much as give him a reduced role. He'll have say, just not final say.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SmootSmack;608939]Why would ESPN360 be talking about this? I'll go back and check if you can tell me what he was watching, but that doesn't seem to make sense. Maybe you meant ESPN980

Not to dispute what you've written about Gruden, my top level Gruden source (and it's a really good source) says nothing is in place with Gruden (although this same source says Bruce Allen and Snyder did speak earlier this week...but they always talk to each other)

Snyder let Cerrato choose the HC. And after alienating both Williams and Fassel, Cerrato suggested Zorn. So yeah that's on Cerrato...but I don't think Snyder will fire Vinny so much as give him a reduced role. He'll have say, just not final say.[/quote]

Aside from that, that report/rumor conflicts with Reports fron the WP that Snyder has been eating up alot of Zorn's time with meetings this week. I call BS on this rumor. I listen to ESPN980 every day and havent heard a thing about it. I think the dude just read some completely unsubstantiated speculation on extremeskins or some other ridiculous place and passed it on here.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SmootSmack;608939]Why would ESPN360 be talking about this? I'll go back and check if you can tell me what he was watching, but that doesn't seem to make sense. Maybe you meant ESPN980

Not to dispute what you've written about Gruden, my top level Gruden source (and it's a really good source) says nothing is in place with Gruden (although this same source says Bruce Allen and Snyder did speak earlier this week...but they always talk to each other)

Snyder let Cerrato choose the HC. And after alienating both Williams and Fassel, Cerrato suggested Zorn. So yeah that's on Cerrato...but I don't think Snyder will fire Vinny so much as give him a reduced role. He'll have say, just not final say.[/quote]

I checked with my man again and he said he heard it while watching "Washington Post live." If that helps at all.

Again it could all be rumor's and we all know how someone starts it and it will bounce between fans and media for weeks. I was just wondering if anyone else heard this or to clarify exactly what was said.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SBXVII;608957]I checked with my man again and he said he heard it while watching "Washington Post live." If that helps at all.

Again it could all be rumor's and we all know how someone starts it and it will bounce between fans and media for weeks. I was just wondering if anyone else heard this or to clarify exactly what was said.[/quote]

Ok well then that would have been CSN (Comcast SportsNet) Washington where he saw it, not ESPN

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SmootSmack;608960]Ok well then that would have been CSN (Comcast SportsNet) Washington where he saw it, not ESPN[/quote]

Yeah, I'm checking with their video's now. I'm really wondering if the first statement made about Gruden being front runner is now bouncing around from media to fans and the media picking back up on it and we get this. Thats why I was asking if anyone else saw or heard it even though it would have been better had I got the right show. :( sorry.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SBXVII;608957]I checked with my man again and he said he heard it while watching "Washington Post live." If that helps at all.

Again it could all be rumor's and we all know how someone starts it and it will bounce between fans and media for weeks. I was just wondering if anyone else heard this or to clarify exactly what was said.[/quote]

If it was on WaPo Live (which it wasn't cause I watch it) then it would be plastered all over the Post's website as well.

Interesting thought on Gruden's potentially landing here. Wouldn't it be interesting if Snyder hires Allen during the season who then hires Gruden (after interviewing Gray for Rooney consideration) before the end of the season for 2010. Would teams/coaches still be as open and accommodating to Gruden when he comes in for MNF prep?

I'm pretty sure there is a precedent for former coaches to be hired out of the booth for the following season but remaining in the booth for the remainder of the year.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

On ESPN980 today, Kevin was speculating that Holmgren as GM and Gruden as HC would be a great move for the Skins. i wonder how long it will be before someone who heard it, tells a friend, who tells another friend, who then comes on here and says its an actual rumor/report.

This is utterly ridiculous and i'm honestly getting tired of all the rampant speculation. Interestingly, Gruden was on Mike and Mike this morning and told fans not to beleive everything we hear.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;608970]On ESPN980 today, Kevin was speculating that Holmgren as GM and Gruden as HC would be a great move for the Skins. i wonder how long it will be before someone who heard it, tells a friend, who tells another friend, who then comes on here and says its an actual rumor/report.

This is utterly ridiculous and i'm honestly getting tired of all the rampant speculation. Interestingly, Gruden was on Mike and Mike this morning and told fans not to beleive everything we hear.[/quote]

Totally agree, I'm sorry for putting post up. I honestly did not find it anywhere on other boards or in the news so I thought maybe someone heard it and thought to ask here. Next time I'll waite to see if anyone posts about it first. I was just currious and my computer at work is giving me fits trying to run the video from WPL.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SBXVII;608925]Someone I work with said they were up late last night watching ESPN360 and it was mentioned by one of the announcers that their top level inside source at Redskins Park informed them that there is already a deal in place with Gruden to be the next HC along with Gruden having front office authority of some type. Supposedly Snyder is not happy and has not spoken to Vinny or Zorn in the last few days to a week. Rumor is Zorn will be cut and Vinny will be let go. Supposedly, again rumor, is Snyder didn't want Zorn as OC or HC and Cerrato talked Snyder into picking up Zorn as OC. Then no coach's wanted Zorn as their OC and they started backing out of the HCing hunt. Again it was Cerrato who swindled Snyder into believing Zorn would be a good HC so they named Zorn the HC.

I did not hear this so I am only passing along rumor's as of right now but if anyone else heard it perhaps you can clarify. I looked all over and can't find it being discussed anywhere.[/quote]

If this is true then why not clip Vinny and bring in someone new to pick personel and head coach?? Bringing in Gruden doesn't solve anything. Also the buck stops w/ the owner and he should know not to let a man run his team that suggests hiring a man w/no OC/HC experience. He needs to fire Vinny FIRST then go from there.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;608970]On ESPN980 today, Kevin was speculating [B]that Holmgren as GM and Gruden as HC would be a great move[/B] for the Skins. i wonder how long it will be before someone who heard it, tells a friend, who tells another friend, who then comes on here and says its an actual rumor/report.

This is utterly ridiculous and i'm honestly getting tired of all the rampant speculation. Interestingly, Gruden was on Mike and Mike this morning and told fans not to beleive everything we hear.[/quote]

Yeah I heard him saying this and I think it's a terrible move. MH doesn't have experience in personel. He's a football coach that had those duties stripped from him in Seattle. He doesn't live sleep eat and breathe personel like the Bill Polian or Scott Pioli does. Again Snyder needs to go out and find a true hard core personel man first.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=skinsfan69;609000]Yeah I heard him saying this and I think it's a terrible move. MH doesn't have experience in personel. He's a football coach that had those duties stripped from him in Seattle. He doesn't live sleep eat and breathe personel like the Bill Polian or Scott Pioli does. Again Snyder needs to go out and find a true hard core personel man first.[/quote]

I like the next guy would like a proven GM. No doubt, but do you think some of MH problems were he was taking on too much work? I have never liked the idea of a HC also taking a front office job cause I have to imagine splitting time would be difficult and might interfier with each job. I think MH is good at evaluating talent because he was a head coach and knows what to look for in a player in each position. Also putting him at GM would most likely help in getting the players Gruden would need. MH knows the system Gruden would be implimenting and know what players would work well in it. I don't have a problem with the owner picking a HC first so long as the GM is well versed in what ever style, ie; WCO, the HC is running in order to pick up the talent needed to get the system to work properly.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

I just can't imagine what dumb a** hires a 1st time OC, w/out a coach in place. The more I continue to think about it the more stupid it gets. The Vinny. He's a piece of work. Crazy.

I'm don't think that JZ deserves to get fired right now, but w/ all this going on I do think in the best interest of the Redskins he should be let go if he loses this week or next. It's really not JZ's fault. We have a crappy organization. Crappy depth. The hiring of JZ was a horrible hire to begin with. If it was someone that was a good hire like a Jim Schwartz, Ryan, or Josh McD and we had some assemblence of some FO organization we should ride it out. At this point, we need to get started on a GM and coach search soon for the benefit of the Redskins.

Sorry JZ, but unless we put together a huge win streak, we gotta move on.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=skinsfan69;609000]Yeah I heard him saying this and I think it's a terrible move. MH doesn't have experience in personel. He's a football coach that had those duties stripped from him in Seattle. He doesn't live sleep eat and breathe personel like the Bill Polian or Scott Pioli does. Again Snyder needs to go out and find a true hard core personel man first.[/quote]

He took it from Chris Mortenson, who speculated a few weeks ago that he could see that combination returning together to the NFL. My thought on that is is each would command a lot of money so really only two teams would make such a bid...Dallas or Washington.

I wouldn't be opposed to Holmgren as President. I don't think his problem in Seattle was so much his personnel acumen it was handling that and coaching, if he just does one that would be ok I think.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SBXVII;609008]I like the next guy would like a proven GM. No doubt, but do you think some of MH problems were he was taking on too much work? I have never liked the idea of a HC also taking a front office job cause I have to imagine splitting time would be difficult and might interfier with each job. I think MH is good at evaluating talent because he was a head coach and knows what to look for in a player in each position. Also putting him at GM would most likely help in getting the players Gruden would need. MH knows the system Gruden would be implimenting and know what players would work well in it. I don't have a problem with the owner picking a HC first so long as the GM is well versed in what ever style, ie; WCO, the HC is running in order to pick up the talent needed to get the system to work properly.[/quote]

I'm not sure what his problems were. All I know is he's not an NFL personel guy and that's all I need to know. This isn't the place for him to be GM. If he would come here and coach then fine...I'm all for it as long as there is a guy who knows the inner ropes of personel above him, and has final say over him.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SmootSmack;609030]He took it from Chris Mortenson, who speculated a few weeks ago that he could see that combination returning together to the NFL. My thought on that is is each would command a lot of money so really only two teams would make such a bid...Dallas or Washington.

I wouldn't be opposed to Holmgren as President. I don't think his problem in Seattle was so much his personnel acumen it was handling that and coaching, if he just does one that would be ok I think.[/quote]

I hear you....but I just don't understand why we don't have someone like a Bill Polian. We spend all this money on players yet we have Vinny Cerrato as the GM w/out the title. As I said I want a guy that truly knows the ropes of NFL and college scouting and I don't think that's Mike H. But as a HC I think he's EXACTLY what we need on the sidelines.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=skinsfan69;609036]I hear you....but I just don't understand why we don't have someone like a Bill Polian. We spend all this money on players yet we have Vinny Cerrato as the GM w/out the title. As I said I want a guy that truly knows the ropes of NFL and college scouting and I don't think that's Mike H. But as a HC I think he's EXACTLY what we need on the sidelines.[/quote]

Yeah I mean I'd much rather go with a Bruce Allen, Jimmy Raye III, or Bill Kuharich type. I was just saying if it's Holmgren then I'd be ok with it. Think it will be Shanahan still...and I'm not crazy about that

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SmootSmack;609030]He took it from Chris Mortenson, who speculated a few weeks ago that he could see that combination returning together to the NFL. My thought on that is is each would command a lot of money so really only two teams would make such a bid...Dallas or Washington.

I wouldn't be opposed to Holmgren as President. I don't think his problem in Seattle was so much his personnel acumen it was handling that and coaching, if he just does one that would be ok I think.[/quote]


Agreed. They would command 10Million+. Granted its not our money. Mike wore too many hats, but was actually drafting decent. He was just not giving all the time he needed to coaching.

Him and Gruden would be my first choice. Actually Dan selling is first but that will never happen.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

I could handle Gruden/Holmgren or Gruden/Bruce Allen. As long as there isn't a Vinny squeezed in there.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SmootSmack;607865]Make Holmgren the President, Jerry Gray HC, and Turner Gill OC!!!!!

:)

I just hope we do our research, I mean really do our research...as in Shanahan is not a good judge of talent (or character)[/quote]

Who would run the defense, Gray? could he handle dual roles..

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

It really sucks when we have a 13 page thread on Jon Gruden being the HC when it is only week 6 and all of this is purely speculative. I had some pretty high expectations this year. As did so many others on this site. Now we are the Raiders. Uggg. I hate being a Skins fan at times. Danny boy fire Vinny. You have to fire the slug at this point. Start over in the FO then let them work their way down to next years coaches and then to the players. Something tells me this Redskin Team next year is not going to resemble much of what is here right now.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;609067]It really sucks when we have a 13 page thread on Jon Gruden being the HC when it is only week 6 and all of this is purely speculative. I had some pretty high expectations this year. As did so many others on this site. Now we are the Raiders. Uggg. I hate being a Skins fan at times. Danny boy fire Vinny. You have to fire the slug at this point. Start over in the FO then let them work their way down to next years coaches and then to the players. Something tells me this Redskin Team next year is not going to resemble much of what is here right now.[/quote]

You are probably right, but the win/loss record just might resemble what we have right now.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

I cannot believe DS has the cajones to keep plugging away with the current front office structure when not a single good SB winning coach wants to come to DC. I mean, when is he going to realize the onus is on him? or is he that clueless?

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;609067]It really sucks when we have a 13 page thread on Jon Gruden being the HC when it is only week 6 and all of this is purely speculative. I had some pretty high expectations this year. As did so many others on this site. Now we are the Raiders. Uggg. I hate being a Skins fan at times. Danny boy fire Vinny. You have to fire the slug at this point. Start over in the FO then let them work their way down to next years coaches and then to the players. Something tells me this Redskin Team next year is not going to resemble much of what is here right now.[/quote]

Honestly I actually hope it doesn't. I wish we could get rid of all the high priced primidana's, and get rid of the coach's stuck in their old ways. Bring in new coach's ....NFL qualified coach's ...and start rebuilding a young, healthy, fast team.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=rbanerjee23;609089]I cannot believe DS has the cajones to keep plugging away with the current front office structure when not a single good SB winning coach wants to come to DC. I mean, when is he going to realize the onus is on him? [B]or is he that clueless?[/[/B]quote]

Elvis was, Michael Jackson was, and several other millionairs, billionairs. They get yes men to hang around them and protect them from societies negative influences.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=redsk1;609051]I could handle Gruden/Holmgren or Gruden/Bruce Allen. As long as there isn't a Vinny squeezed in there.[/quote]

I don't think anyone's hungry for a Vinny Sandwich but the menu choices are sparse at best :oink:

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SBXVII;608957]I checked with my man again and he said he heard it while watching "Washington Post live." If that helps at all.

Again it could all be rumor's and we all know how someone starts it and it will bounce between fans and media for weeks. I was just wondering if anyone else heard this or to clarify exactly what was said.[/quote]

Not ESPN reporting...now I give it a little more credibility.

That scenario would be incredible.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

The season's not over yet you got to have faith. On another note please not Gruden don't like him.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;609316]The season's not over yet you got to have faith. On another note please not Gruden don't like him.[/quote]

Hogwash! The season was over before it began. This is at best / miracle, an 8-8 season. I think what you were getting at is that Gruden's players don't like him. Well that's too effing bad. That's exactly what we need, someone who will bench these little nancies or send them to the showers.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

I don't know if Gruden is the right coach for the Redskins. Even though he won a superbowl with Tampa Bay, in the the last few years with the Bucs, the quarterback position there brought uncertainty to the offense and the team. This is the opposite of what the redskins need right now.

Shanaghan and Cowher are coaches that may be better suited for the redskins especially considering the team's current situation. They are different from one another in their coaching and offensive style of play, but both should bring in a better ground game and more than likely solidify the offensive line.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;609316]The season's not over yet you got to have faith. On another note please not Gruden don't like him.[/quote]

It's over as far as playoffs are concerned. Not gonna catch NY and we already have 3 conference losses.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=warriorzpath;609370]I don't know if Gruden is the right coach for the Redskins. Even though he won a superbowl with Tampa Bay, in the the last few years with the Bucs, the quarterback position there brought uncertainty to the offense and the team. This is the opposite of what the redskins need right now.

Shanaghan and Cowher are coaches that may be better suited for the redskins especially considering the team's current situation. They are different from one another in their coaching and offensive style of play, but both should bring in a better ground game and more than likely solidify the offensive line.[/quote]

You know, whether it's Gruden, Holmgren, Shanahan, or even Armstrong, I'm not going to complain. What this team needs is a proven winner who commands respect and demands 110% effort and accountability.

Also I think the front office needs a strong minded HC who knows personnel in this league. If we can't get Vinny outta there and a real GM in place, let's at least get a HC who has been around the block when it comes to building a team.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=Mattyk72;609390]You know, whether it's Gruden, Holmgren, Shanahan, or even Armstrong, I'm not going to complain. What this team needs is a proven winner who commands respect and demands 110% effort and accountability.

Also I think the front office needs a strong minded HC who knows personnel in this league. If we can't get Vinny outta there and a real GM in place, let's at least get a HC who has been around the block when it comes to building a team.[/quote]

Yes, any of them would be a big upgrade right now.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=warriorzpath;609370]I don't know if Gruden is the right coach for the Redskins. Even though he won a superbowl with Tampa Bay, in the the last few years with the Bucs, the quarterback position there brought uncertainty to the offense and the team. This is the opposite of what the redskins need right now.

Shanaghan and Cowher are coaches that may be better suited for the redskins especially considering the team's current situation. They are different from one another in their coaching and offensive style of play, but both should bring in a better ground game and more than likely solidify the offensive line.[/quote]

I don't see how the player aquasition is any different then what Zorn has done or what Shanahan has done.

Gruden stock piled QB's
Shanahan stock piled RB's
Zorn stock piled RB's.

The only difference is their personalities. We need a coach who is not going to coddle the players and pat their backs, we need one that will get in their faces.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=Mattyk72;609390]You know, whether it's Gruden, Holmgren, Shanahan, or even Armstrong, I'm not going to complain. What this team needs is a proven winner who commands respect and demands 110% effort and accountability.

Also I think the front office needs a strong minded HC who knows personnel in this league. If we can't get Vinny outta there and a real GM in place, let's at least get a HC who has been around the block when it comes to building a team.[/quote]

I agree with everything you said here, but I don't want Gruden to continue this issue that the redskins have with the doubt at quarterback which affects the entire offense. I want a head coach to know what a great quarterback is, and then get and/or be able to develop one; not a head coach who will continue to bring uncertainty at the quarterback position. Gruden doesn't seem to have a great eye for talent especially at quarterback; I believe that Rich Gannon was a perfect fit for him, but he fell into Gruden's lap. And to me, Gruden winning the superbowl in his first year at Tampa Bay, but not coming close to that success in following years - is a testament to Gruden's lack of player personnel knowledge/skills.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=SBXVII;609261]Honestly I actually hope it doesn't. I wish we could get rid of all the high priced primidana's, and get rid of the coach's stuck in their old ways. Bring in new coach's ....NFL qualified coach's ...and start rebuilding a young, healthy, fast team.[/quote]

Yeah I hope not either. Some guys have to go. We need an influx of young talent that wants to win a SuperBowl not just get paid. That is what we are missing. Guys who arent here to get paid.

I agree SBXVII. We need to start fresh all the way around.

Re: Sources: Gruden the front runner
 

[quote=warriorzpath;609409]I agree with everything you said here, but I don't want Gruden to continue this issue that the redskins have with the doubt at quarterback which affects the entire offense. I want a head coach to know what a great quarterback is, and then get and/or be able to develop one; not a head coach who will continue to bring uncertainty at the quarterback position. Gruden doesn't seem to have a great eye for talent especially at quarterback; I believe that Rich Gannon was a perfect fit for him, but he fell into Gruden's lap. And to me, Gruden winning the superbowl in his first year at Tampa Bay, but not coming close to that success in following years - is a testament to Gruden's lack of player personnel knowledge/skills.[/quote]

I am a Gruden guy but his handling of the QB position is the biggest knock against him in my eyes. He tends to fall in and out of love with QB's very quickly and it's hard to win big without stability at that position. IMO if we found him one good enough that would prevent this from happening but that is a concern with Gruden.