Re: Portis staying?
 

One more year for CP.

and screw the mock drafts. Id like O-Line 1st Round, 2nd Round RB, 3rd Round DB/LB or whatever order.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=dgack;658645]Wait, did someone actually say they'd rather keep CP than have Pierre Thomas? Pass whatever you're smoking, man. It's been a rough week, I need a hit.

Thomas has less carries on him in 3 years than CP took in any full season he's played in, and he crushes CP's career ypc -- 5.1 to 4.5 (and by the way, you take out those two years in Denver and CP's career ypc takes a 12% hit. He's logged an avg 4.1ypc since he arrived here.)[/quote]

Relax bro its easy to get YPC when you have Brees balancing the attack.

I dont agree buts its not like Pierre really can match a prime Portis.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Skins4L;658750]Relax bro its easy to get YPC when you have Brees balancing the attack.

I dont agree buts its not like Pierre really can match a prime Portis.[/quote]

What does a prime Portis have to do with anything? He hasn't been Prime Portis since he got here.

As for it being "easy to get ypc" in New Orleans, I don't know about that... Mike Bell got more carries than Thomas did behind that line this season and his ypc was a Portis-esque 3.8.

Look, I'm not saying Pierre Thomas is The Next Big Thing or anything, but it's pretty obvious that CP has racked up yardage by buying in bulk since he got here, not by running efficiently. You burn the candle at both ends, you pay the price eventually.

All I am saying is I would much rather have a young, low-mileage guy like Thomas in our backfield next year than someone with the warning signs written all over him like Portis.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Skins4L;658750]Relax bro its easy to get YPC when you have Brees balancing the attack.

[b]I dont agree buts its not like Pierre really can match a prime Portis.[/b][/quote]

dgack already pointed it out, but it needs to be said again...Portis in his prime is long gone. I'd love to sign Barry Sanders in his prime, but that aint happening. Portis has run his course in a skins uni.

Re: Portis staying?
 

Dgack and others ned to seriously look at total pictures. If you have an outstanding passing attack, of COURSE you can have a easier chance at the run. If you have a balanced attack, but an awesome line, Yes, you'll have great stats. With Portis' stats, especialy LAST year, were at least 60% of his 300+ carry seasons are behind injured, poorly put together, and jacked up o-lines. THe steelers last superbowl, they had a crappy line too, look at theri running stats. But their receivers can catch, so they had a passing attack. You can't jsut say, "Portis stats are low" and ignore the line. You REALLY can't say that shouldering the load with the amount of carries he had to have is a small feat either. That's called sacrafice and being a team player. I don't care what few comments were taken to heart by everyone BUT his teamates who forgive and have his back. He's a team player and far more durable than given credit for.

Re: Portis staying?
 

I find it hard to call Portis a team player, IF you define "team player" as someone who practices as hard as they play, who strives to minimize divisiveness, and who looks at the team goals over individual accomplishment. I think Portis is a self centered player who through his outstanding ability has, over the years lifted the play of the team. Now, though, as age and injuries become legitimately asked questions, he needs to transform his play and attitude to that of a mature superstar. That is what Shanahan spoke of in his introductory press conference, and that is what CP needs to do if he is going to stay here and excel. If he wants to be the center of it all, and not focus on team practice and conditioning, then he ought to find another stage to finish his career.

Re: Portis staying?
 

CP a "team player"? Now that's a good one!

Re: Portis staying?
 

when does everyone think we'll find out if portis is staying or going? i can't remember whether that sort of stuff usually happens before or after the start of free agency.

Re: Portis staying?
 

probably about 3/1, which is the start of Free Agency

Re: Portis staying?
 

I would say March 5th, our big FA splashes may be more likely who we let go this year, once the uncapped year officially starts. Although, MS may want to see what effort he shows at the OTA's, or see what - if any trade is possible.

Re: Portis staying?
 

i dont think a trade is possible - no one's going to want his contract. i also don't think he would find a job quickly if he were released. i think it would take a while for portis to realize he's not worth what he thinks.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Mattyk;659014]CP a "team player"? Now that's a good one![/quote]

Really. I've heard it all now. :doh:

Re: Portis staying?
 

Portis has always been a "team player" for "Team Portis", leave CRedskinsRule Alone!

Re: Portis staying?
 

I think you guys read into media way too much. It's not like he was all "T.O. after many games talking trash. I'm also, once again, not saying I'm all about trashing teamates. But the fact is that he was telling the truth and many people need to hear that. Sellers got over Portis' comments and you know what, maybe he NEEDED a kick in the rear! Not saying Sellers is the enemy either here, but the man did miss a block that caused a game momentum changing safety after our D worked their butts off to get us the bal back, as well as fumble in the begining of our overtime drive against the Saints, i can go on... I'm just saying, Portis doesn't ALWAYS talk trash and when he does, it's true. He was right about Zorn, right about Sellers, and he and Cooley BOTH have made statements against JC. Cooley "saying JC needs to have some balls and take more chances" isn't even in the discussion!?! Why? Cuz he's the man! So it Portis... don't read so much into a few bad comments when he's way more often said GOOD things about JC and his teamates.

As for nobody wanting Portis, I remember the Cardinals taking an 'over the hill' Emmit Smith, then a 'used, but servicable' Edgerin James. Any team that falls under a "needs a tough, every down back" as a last piece to the puzzle would want him. Not a team that intends to build a franchise around a guy, but a team that is like, "Man, all we need is a veteran HB" would GLADLY take him and pay the cost. he's not as bad and slow and crappy as you guys make him out to be. Portis behind a bad line and injured is still better than many other backs.

This reminds me of when i was in another room. People were mocking me and laughing because i said a team was gonna make some noise after picking up 3 people.

One was an old has-been wide receiver that takes plays off and never could take his team to the big game. "He's past his prime!" they said. "His best years were forever ago! He needs to retire". They ignored me when i attributed the bad years to the team he was on and the QB.

The other was a guy who just was never good enough to be a #1 receiver. Not very sure handed. What good is a YAC man that can't get the C part down? They ignored me when i said that as long as he isn't the #1 receiver, he can kill #2 corners on most teams.

The last guy was a little chump that couldn't even barely make 4th string on the Dolphins. People laughed at me when i said that he was a beast and never stops until after the whistle is blown. They said he was trash and would end up getting traded or released before preseason.

I can't remember how many records Brady broke with those guys... all I know is that calling Randy Moss a hasbeen is reasonable since i think the last year he was in Oakland he had fewer yards and TDs than Chris Cooley the same year. For someone of his reputation to make such meager stats, he MUST be past his prime! Right!? BIG PICTURE PEOPLE! You don't rate Moss by his stats with the Raiders and you don't snub CP and call him 'aging' right after a probowl behind a crappy line! I mean holy crap! Look at his stats from last year from game one to eight! Tell me how many yards he would've gotten if we didn't have injuries to our o-line!

Another thing, when the game is on the line, great players want the ball. Did you look at the sickening look on Manning's face as he watched his back-up throw away their perfect season? Great players wanna be there... On the flip side, every carry after 22 carries in one game are pretty much chipping away at a runningback's longevity. Most Runningbacks pull themselves out of games as tired or talk their way into being situational backs in order to last longer. You'll never see LT or Fast Willie taking the load for 30+ carries. If the team has to lean on Adrian Peterson, he's not gonna be the same after a year or two. That Portis has managed to get a probowl nod is beyond me. NO back that wants to last wants to carry the ball 300+ times in a season! He didn't do it because he wanted to. He did it because Brandon Lloyd and Keenan McCardell didn't do squat. The two rookie receivers we picked up last year got hurt and took a year and a half to be half decent. Randel el did just okay as a receiver but could never step up to be the number one guy in Moss' absence and he constanly gave us horrible field position. JC had only two options, Cooley and Moss. With Cooley as a blocker to assist a crumbling line, the passing attack was still hampered by receivers dropping catchable balls and Moss getting double and triple teamed. Gibbs asked Portis to carry the load and he did it. He did it without complaining until Zorn and we all see what he was now. (I could've told you he was crap after looking at his QB stats. I mean holy crap! His best years were below JC in rating and more than half the time he threw more picks than TDs)

Re: Portis staying?
 

If Portis changes, i think people here will take the "too little too late" approach.

Portis knows he's done just as much as we do....

Re: Portis staying?
 

Bottom line, CP talks too much, and so do his supporters. Let's see some results and then we'll revisit this.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Mattyk;659074]Bottom line, CP talks too much, and so do his supporters. Let's see some results and then we'll revisit this.[/quote]

While this is true it is unfortunate. Because it means a wasted 10million this season, for another unproductive running game. And even then the same people will blame everybody but CP himself..

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Beneil (diehard since 87);659067] He did it without complaining until Zorn and we all see what he was now. (I could've told you he was crap after looking at his QB stats. I mean holy crap! [B]His best years were below JC in rating[/B] and more than half the time he threw more picks than TDs)[/quote]


you cant compare qb stats from the 70's to qb stats in 2009. hell you cant even compare qb stats in the early 2000's to 2009.

but your point that a former player with average stats while he was in the nfl could never be a good coach is 100% correct. noone could argue otherwise.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;659076]While this is true it is unfortunate. Because it means a wasted 10million this season, for another unproductive running game. And even then the same people will blame everybody but CP himself..[/quote]

I forget who said it, but Portis' money is spent this year regardless of what he does, and since there is no cap this year it doesn't affect the teams ability to acquire the players they want. The debate about Portis this year should be solely on his ability/work ethic, and Matty is right, we will have to see this year's CP (at OTA's etc) and then see what the team does. The finances are moot since it's an uncapped year.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Mattyk;659074]Bottom line, CP talks too much, and so do his supporters. Let's see some results and then we'll revisit this.[/quote]

i agree. i think a huge problem was portis going on the john thompson show every week. portis was frustrated (which he had a right to be) but he was airing his frustration over the radio (which was wrong) he needs to keep those things in house. imo, players should not agree to weekly radio interviews, they're setting themselves up for trouble if the team is not playing well because you know certain questions are gonna be asked. it's best to let the coaches handle the tuff questions. the players need to keep their mouths closed and just play (and practice).

Re: Portis staying?
 

EIther you guys didn't read my post or you didn't comprehend it, that's for sure.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Beneil (diehard since 87);659247]EIther you guys didn't read my post or you didn't comprehend it, that's for sure.[/quote]

I think many people read it, comprehended it, and then disagreed with it.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=over the mountain;659077]you cant compare qb stats from the 70's to qb stats in 2009. hell you cant even compare qb stats in the early 2000's to 2009.

but your point that a former player with average stats while he was in the nfl could never be a good coach is 100% correct. noone could argue otherwise.[/quote]The "Advanced Passing" section of pro football reference does adjust for the passing climate of the era, whereas stats like QB rating are just heavily skewed towards players that play today.

It doesn't adjust for opponents though, so it's not perfect.

is 2 out of 11 bad?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;659256]The "Advanced Passing" section of pro football reference does adjust for the passing climate of the era, whereas stats like QB rating are just heavily skewed towards players that play today.

It doesn't adjust for opponents though, so it's not perfect.[/quote]

Forget the era. Simple concept. End of the game and end of the season, you want your QB to have thrown more touchdowns than interceptions. Every touchdown is a chance to win and every interception is a chance for the OTHER team to win and that goes for every era. Zorn threw 111 tds and 141 ints... Simple as that.

huh? Can i Make it worse? Okay. His first season, Zorn threw 12 tds and 27 interceptions. TO be fair, i'll count his rushing touchdowns and say 16 tds and 27ints.

in his 11 seasons he only has 2 seasons with more touchdowns than interceptions... TWO OUT OF ELEVEN!!??!?!

Let's compare him to OUR qb in the same era for a little perspective. Theisman threw 160 tds 138 ints. 50% of his seasons were with more TDs than INTs including one with 29 tds and 11 ints. (If you count rushing TDs with passing, then Joe Theisman he has 7 out of 12 seasons with more TDs than Ints)

I can go on, but i wont, due to an abundance of short attention spans in here.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Lotus;659253]I think many people read it, comprehended it, and then disagreed with it.[/quote]

I dont' care if you disagree. I just want a real debate or some reasons. I made my case the the following responses are like, "Portis BAD!"

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Mattyk;659074]Bottom line, CP talks too much, and so do his supporters. Let's see some results and then we'll revisit this.[/quote]


You walk the walk you can talk the talk. CP walked the walk for many seasons dealing with mediocre play from his compadres. The guy was the only consistent functioning part of the offense for more than a few seasons. That being said he still does need to quiet down a bit. Barry Saunders had to put up with the same type of crap, but was able to hold out longer til he said "F*&^% it" and left. IF CP is let go it should be because of his concussion and the fact that the Skins used him up rather quickly. The guy isn't a TO in that he opened up his mouth when the season was already lost. CP is a Pro Bowler RB, that was behind a terrible, injury ridden O line(same line that JC had to contend with) and folks want to see results?

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Beneil (diehard since 87);659387]I dont' care if you disagree. [B]I just want a real debate[/B] or some reasons. I made my case the the following responses are like, "Portis BAD!"[/quote]

It is the experience of myself and others that we do offer "real debate," you just don't listen to points which disagree with yours.

Now you've moved on to wholesale put-downs of others. This is not your best strategy for encouraging "real debate."

For me personally, I think every angle of the Portis debate has been explored. :bdh: It is time to move on to talking about something more important or at least different.

Re: Portis staying?
 

[quote=Beneil (diehard since 87);659387]I dont' care if you disagree. I just want a real debate or some reasons. I made my case the the following responses are like, "Portis BAD!"[/quote]

And all we seem to be hearing from you is how great Portis is.

Let's just drop it for now and wait and see if he's even on the team next season.

Re: Portis staying?
 

Lotus, if any comment about portis is "beating a dead horse" to you, then WHY ARE YOU ON THE PORTIS PAGE!?!?! That's like me going to all the other ones and saying STOP BLOGGING AND POSTING THINGS as a blog or a post. It's a cute reply, yes, but only if everyone on here is dumb enough to not notice that you are in a PORTIS ROOM saying STOP TALKING ABOUT PORTIS!

Mattyk, You are also being a bit dim. FYI, anyone who is FOR Portis can be misquoted as saying he's god. Anyone AGAINST Portis can be accused of ignoring his positive stats. Try something else. I KNOW he's not perfect. Never said he was. I never said he was great, but if YOU think that the fact that he is the only part of our offense that has been consistantly good from the year he joined the team until now, or if YOU think him making a pro-bowl in his "latter years" behind a crappy line makes him 'great', then maybe you're on the wrong side of the argument.

Also, its obvious that any argument for or against him is moot should the doctor say, "No more football" or Shanahan say, "Better luck elsewhere". Until then, this thread is where people state their case in the scenario of him being cleared to play. That should've been obvious.

Re: Portis staying?
 

Sometimes a thread gets to the point where the original debate is lost and we're just going in circles, I think this thread has reached that point.