Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Don't alot of guys workout with McNabb in Arizona. Doesn't he work out with one of the professional training camps? They run drills and such for the guys to get into shape before TC in July. I believe there are multiple pros at his, I remember hearing alot of guys worked out with him there in the offseason, team mates or not.

I could be wrong and it may just be his personal training.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Hes gonna be suspended for like 4 games right? Hes a FA next year right? Why dont we just wait and get him next year by offering him big bucks. Would giving up a early pick for a guy that is gonna miss out on a 4th of the season make sense.

I really wanted Jared Gaither, but at the end of the day hes gonna be a FA next year. Just get him next year. This team has new coaches, a new GM a new offense and a dramatically new defense. Theres a big learning curve going on. Lets figure whats not working this year before making Vinny like decisions.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

I think it may be only a 2 game suspension. Go back a couple of pages and there is an article there that speculates a 2 gamer sus. they have good points to back up the arguement that it may only be 2.

I am waivering back and fourth on the idea of bringing him to DC, and I have a feeling this won't get done. No inside info just a hunch. LOL I never have inside info!

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/30/vincent-jackson-braces-for-four-game-suspension/]Vincent Jackson braces for four-game suspension | ProFootballTalk.com[/url]

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[QUOTE=mlmpetert;710046]Hes gonna be suspended for like 4 games right? Hes a FA next year right? Why dont we just wait and get him next year by offering him big bucks. Would giving up a early pick for a guy that is gonna miss out on a 4th of the season make sense.
[/QUOTE]

We could wait until next year, but:
(1) If the rumors are correct, some other team may pick him up this year first.
(2) There would be more teams interested next year (?) since he wouldn't be facing the 4 game suspension he is now.
(3) If the CBA is renegotiated, then SD can effectively renegotiate his contract themselves. Right now they're scared of the uncertainty next year.
(4) Not sure, but we may be able to give him a fat signing bonus in this uncapped year that we may not be able to later.
(5) He'd be one year older @ 28yrs.
(6) We're going to need him for the Super Bowl this year.


[personally i say we don't go for it. i don't care about snyder's money but draft picks are invaluable to a franchise and are always undervalued].

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

lol... love the optimism!

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

I was thinking, San Diego needs a SS, so we could throw in a player like a horton or doughty along with Malcolm and a pick for Vincent Jackson.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=ethat001;710051]We could wait until next year, but:
(1) If the rumors are correct, some other team may pick him up this year first.
(2) There would be more teams interested next year (?) since he wouldn't be facing the 4 game suspension he is now.
(3) If the CBA is renegotiated, then SD can effectively renegotiate his contract themselves. Right now they're scared of the uncertainty next year.
(4) [B]Not sure, but we may be able to give him a fat signing bonus in this uncapped year [/B]that we may not be able to later.
(5) He'd be one year older @ 28yrs.
(6) We're going to need him for the Super Bowl this year.


[personally i say we don't go for it. i don't care about snyder's money but draft picks are invaluable to a franchise and are always undervalued].[/quote]


That dosen't work we did it for #ss *ole (can't even bring myself to type his initials) & look were that got us.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;710075]That dosen't work we did it for #ss *ole (can't even bring myself to type his initials) & look were that got us.[/quote]

Also how much we can give him up front depends on how much he got paid last year.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Giving anyone a ton of upfront money is not the smartest move by any franchise right now. We of all teams know this first hand. Unless you are talking about a player who is worht the cash. IE McNabb or some of our current roster.

I think the FO is taking a wait and see approach with guys like Rocky and Carlos. If these guys perform well in the new 3-4 alignment I would think we would extend them past this year. Same goes for a guy like Brown.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=skinsnut;710041]Is there any link or has anyone else heard the rumors that McNabb is working out with Vincent Jackson in Arizona?
And if so...are there any sources that indicate that this is anything more than due diligence on the part of the Skins?[/quote]
Sam Wyche reported it on NFL Network yesterday.

Nothing to read into though. Just 2 football players tossing the ball around. This happens all over the league every day of the week.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

I just watched multiple segments on nfl.com about the vincent jackson's trade. Apparently he wants more money than brandon marshall, and the trade market should be about the same with 2 2nd round picks for him. This is something I do not understand, Marshall is FAR superior to Jackson, not IMO, fact.
All the numbers support it, over the last 3 years, brandon marshall has averaged about 300 more yards per season, about 50 more receptions! and has about 1.5 more tds per season. That is all considering that Marshall has less years in the league, played in less games over those three season, started even less, is NOT being suspended 4 games, and had the poop king kyle orton throwing to him last year instead of the elite phillip rivers.
I'd honestly put him at a 2nd rounder period for trade value considering in his 5 nfl years has had 1 truly good year with an elite qb throwing to him, and a genius offensive coordinator as a head coach. And it wasn't even [U]that[/U] good a year.
Please someone explain to me why jackson should be traded for the same and get more money instead of significantly less money and significantly less value

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Sorry for the double post, but I also wanted to say something else about this trade scenario. If we get Jackson, and Haynsworth makes amends with the team (and we stay injury free), I think we have a legitimate shot at being contenders. Our biggest weakness right now is WR, considering we have inadequate talent at the top, and poor depth, we have no other position where both these things are true. Jackson would help us out immensely which makes me want him, but also scares me because I feel like our desperate need for him to contend will make us overpay for him in draft picks and in salary cap space. If the move doesnt boost us into contenders, it will all significantly hinder us for years to come considering he comes with a two big price tags.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=skinster;710114]I just watched multiple segments on nfl.com about the vincent jackson's trade. Apparently he wants more money than brandon marshall, and the trade market should be about the same with 2 2nd round picks for him. This is something I do not understand, Marshall is FAR superior to Jackson, not IMO, fact.
All the numbers support it, over the last 3 years, brandon marshall has averaged about 300 more yards per season, about 50 more receptions! and has about 1.5 more tds per season. That is all considering that Marshall has less years in the league, played in less games over those three season, started even less, is NOT being suspended 4 games, and had the poop king kyle orton throwing to him last year instead of the elite phillip rivers.
I'd honestly put him at a 2nd rounder period for trade value considering in his 5 nfl years has had 1 truly good year with an elite qb throwing to him, and a genius offensive coordinator as a head coach. And it wasn't even [U]that[/U] good a year.
Please someone explain to me why jackson should be traded for the same and get more money instead of significantly less money and significantly less value[/quote]


The number of catches over the last three years is strickly related to the offenses they played in. In Denver, Marshall was in an offense that threw the ball a quite bit more. Plus looking at the numbers over the last three years comparing the two, the only thing that sticks out is the catches. The yards were about the same and the TD's were exactly the same. I think this speaks to how Norv likes to run the ball and hit the deep balls with play action. If Jackson had played in an offense where the ball was thrown 10-15 more times a game then his catches would be similar. So I dont understand where everyone is saying that Marshall is by far the superior receiver. I definatly think we should make a play for this guy. he is big, strong, and can get down the field. His size and speed is very attractive ala Andre Johnson. Plus he is a threat in the redzone, which we really haven't had other than cooley, which teams have figured that out! Teaming him up with Moss and thomas would be pretty damn interesting. Along with Cooley and Davis. I dont put Kelly in the mix because I can see him as being part of the deal. Plus i think we could move Moss to more of the #2 receiver and more slot routes which I think he would be extremely had to cover in motion and going across the middle.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Adam_Schefter

Filed to ESPN: The NFL suspended SD Pro Bowl WR Vincent Jackson three games for violating the league's personal conduct policy. 10 minutes ago via UberTwitter

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Wonder if he will appeal and try to get it reduced to 1-2.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=skinster;710118]Sorry for the double post, but I also wanted to say something else about this trade scenario. If we get Jackson, and Haynsworth makes amends with the team (and we stay injury free), I think we have a legitimate shot at being contenders. Our biggest weakness right now is WR, considering we have inadequate talent at the top, and poor depth, we have no other position where both these things are true. Jackson would help us out immensely which makes me want him, but also scares me because I feel like our desperate need for him to contend will make us overpay for him in draft picks and in salary cap space. If the move doesnt boost us into contenders, it will all significantly hinder us for years to come considering he comes with a two big price tags.[/quote]

Good post. Agree 110%

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;710136]Adam_Schefter

Filed to ESPN: The NFL suspended SD Pro Bowl WR Vincent Jackson three games for violating the league's personal conduct policy. 10 minutes ago via UberTwitter[/quote]

Now would be the time to move in. The suspension may make SD move him out a little faster

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=#56fanatic;710134]The number of catches over the last three years is strickly related to the offenses they played in. In Denver, Marshall was in an offense that threw the ball a quite bit more. Plus looking at the numbers over the last three years comparing the two, the only thing that sticks out is the catches. The yards were about the same and the TD's were exactly the same. I think this speaks to how Norv likes to run the ball and hit the deep balls with play action. If Jackson had played in an offense where the ball was thrown 10-15 more times a game then his catches would be similar. So I dont understand where everyone is saying that Marshall is by far the superior receiver. I definatly think we should make a play for this guy. he is big, strong, and can get down the field. His size and speed is very attractive ala Andre Johnson. Plus he is a threat in the redzone, which we really haven't had other than cooley, which teams have figured that out! Teaming him up with Moss and thomas would be pretty damn interesting. Along with Cooley and Davis. I dont put Kelly in the mix because I can see him as being part of the deal. Plus i think we could move Moss to more of the #2 receiver and more slot routes which I think he would be extremely had to cover in motion and going across the middle.[/quote]

Well said.

In the end I think Marshall is the better player than Jackson, but not by a wide margin.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=#56fanatic;710134]The number of catches over the last three years is strickly related to the offenses they played in. In Denver, Marshall was in an offense that threw the ball a quite bit more. Plus looking at the numbers over the last three years comparing the two, the only thing that sticks out is the catches. The yards were about the same and the TD's were exactly the same. I think this speaks to how Norv likes to run the ball and hit the deep balls with play action. If Jackson had played in an offense where the ball was thrown 10-15 more times a game then his catches would be similar. So I dont understand where everyone is saying that Marshall is by far the superior receiver. I definatly think we should make a play for this guy. he is big, strong, and can get down the field. His size and speed is very attractive ala Andre Johnson. Plus he is a threat in the redzone, which we really haven't had other than cooley, which teams have figured that out! Teaming him up with Moss and thomas would be pretty damn interesting. Along with Cooley and Davis. I dont put Kelly in the mix because I can see him as being part of the deal. Plus i think we could move Moss to more of the #2 receiver and more slot routes which I think he would be extremely had to cover in motion and going across the middle.[/quote]

I see your point, but I still disagree. Just coming from last year alone, orton threw the ball about 50 more times than rivers, and marshall had 33 more catches than jackson while not starting in 2 less games (If I remember correctly he wasn't really played in those games). But the main reason why I disagree with that is not just their production, but who was throwing the ball to them while they were producing. I dont think you can disagree that rivers is far superior than orton. The fact that marshall got better numbers last year (his worst of the last 3 years) in yards per game played, catches total, and tds total while being thrown to by a guy nobody wants on their team, then jackson who last year (his by far best of the last 3 years) was thrown to by an elite qb speaks miles to me. The last thing I will say why I believe marshall is significantly more valuable is consistency, Marshall has had three straight 100 plus catch seasons, while jackson has had one season that has matched up to marshall. Jackson hasn't proven he that he can do it year in and year out. For all we know he might be able to, but he hasn't proven that he can.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

I think the poll got it right...no one on this board it seems (who has voted) is behind aggressively chasing this guy. I don't think he makes us contender whatsoever. WE WERE 4-12 LAST YEAR !!!

How could anyone possibly think that he makes us Super Bowl contenders when we are learning yet another new offense, forcing a top 10 defense to learn a completely different paradigm and [B]not even put on pads yet[/B].

Vincent Jackson is attractive but I am in favor of seeing how McNabb and our receivers mesh before giving up even a 3rd for the guy. Plus, the guy is suspended, has had (multiple?) alcohol related issues, and would need a high draft picks to acquire. No way it is a good move for the Skins.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

NFL Network also reported yesterday that the Bears proposed a trade to SD for Jackson. The Bears were supposedly offering up two-2nd rounders for Jackson.

And SD said no.

That is AJ Smith for you though. He is a serious hardass as a GM. He will not give in to Jacksons hold out.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;710152]NFL Network also reported yesterday that the Bears proposed a trade to SD for Jackson. The Bears were supposedly offering up two-2nd rounders for Jackson.

And SD said no.

That is AJ Smith for you though. He is a serious hardass as a GM. He will not give in to Jacksons hold out.[/quote]

If true, the Bears offered too much and the Chargers are insane for turning it down, considering Jackson is threatening to hold out, is now suspended and doesn't seem to want to stay with SD.


This says otherwise though:

[URL="http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/06/source-bears-not-pursuing-chargers-jackson.html"]Source: Bears not pursuing Chargers' Jackson - Chicago Breaking Sports[/URL]

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

The Bears if report is true like giving away more than we do for disgruntled players.

Have we contacted them about AH, they play a 4-3. And I am sure we would take 2 2nds for him.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Wow, I am so happy the Chargers want more that 2 2nd rounders for Vincent Jackson. Hopefully this will dissuade our front office from pursuing him.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;710155]The Bears if report is true like giving away more than we do for disgruntled players.

Have we contacted them about AH, they play a 4-3. And I am sure we would take 2 2nds for him.[/quote]

This would work for me!!!

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=rbanerjee23;710156]Wow, I am so happy the Chargers want more that 2 2nd rounders for Vincent Jackson. Hopefully this will dissuade our front office from pursuing him.[/quote]

Yeah, Marshall went for a single 2nd-rounder.

Sounds like they're trying to make him happy by "offering" him up for trades but don't really want to deal him.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=Buster;710162]Yeah, Marshall went for a single 2nd-rounder.

Sounds like they're trying to make him happy by "offering" him up for trades but don't really want to deal him.[/quote]

They really shouldn't want to trade him. Him and Antonio Gates are big reasons why Rivers has been so successful and with a rookie RB who may or may not be competent, the receiving game has to be there for San Diego to continue its success.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=skinster;710146]I see your point, but I still disagree. Just coming from last year alone, orton threw the ball about 50 more times than rivers, and marshall had 33 more catches than jackson while not starting in 2 less games (If I remember correctly he wasn't really played in those games). But the main reason why I disagree with that is not just their production, but who was throwing the ball to them while they were producing. I dont think you can disagree that rivers is far superior than orton. The fact that marshall got better numbers last year (his worst of the last 3 years) in yards per game played, catches total, and tds total while being thrown to by a guy nobody wants on their team, then jackson who last year (his by far best of the last 3 years) was thrown to by an elite qb speaks miles to me. The last thing I will say why I believe marshall is significantly more valuable is consistency, Marshall has had three straight 100 plus catch seasons, while jackson has had one season that has matched up to marshall. Jackson hasn't proven he that he can do it year in and year out. For all we know he might be able to, but he hasn't proven that he can.[/quote]


You are missing some key factors here. early in Jackson's career they had some guy named LT getting the ball 30 times a game. Not sure the QB comparison is as important as you make it. It does help, but all Kyle orton does is win ball games, and if I am correct the broncos were undefeated with orton and he was having a stellar year before we about broke his foot off. I am not in total disagreement that Marshall is a better receiver, he is, but to say that he is heads and shoulders above Jackson is just not accurate. You can't compare two guys that played in two TOTALLy different offensive philosophies. Plus, Gates was a beast a couple of years ago catching a ton of balls for SD, taking away a number of balls to WR's. Other than Marshall, Denvers receivers aren't actually scary, nor the tight ends, which aren't involved as much as SD. There are a ton of factors into a WR #'s when you compare them to another WR. I think an equal comparison to Marshall would be Randy Moss's numbers over the last few years, or Reggie Wayne. They all play in very similar offenses.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=rbanerjee23;710156]Wow, I am so happy the Chargers want more that 2 2nd rounders for Vincent Jackson. Hopefully this will dissuade our front office from pursuing him.[/quote]
Has nothing to do with whether or not the Bolts would take two-2nd rounders for him or anyone else.

It has everything to do with the fact that the Bolts front office is not going to give into a players contract demands.

AJ Smith is gonna let Jackson holdout all he wants. Fact of the matter is if Jackson does not sign his tender by August 8th, he looses and additional year of veteran eligibility.

JAckson has stated that he is wil to holdout until week 10 if needed. AJ Smith is just gonna let him do it.

The only one with something to loose in this situation is Jackson. The Bolts? They loose nothing.

Smith is calling his bluff. And he has done it several times in the past with other players.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;710168]Has nothing to do with whether or not the Bolts would take two-2nd rounders for him or anyone else.

It has everything to do with the fact that the Bolts front office is not going to give into a players contract demands.

AJ Smith is gonna let Jackson holdout all he wants. Fact of the matter is if Jackson does not sign his tender by August 8th, he looses and additional year of veteran eligibility.

JAckson has stated that he is wil to holdout until week 10 if needed. AJ Smith is just gonna let him do it.

The only one with something to loose in this situation is Jackson. The Bolts? [B]They loose nothing.[/B]

Smith is calling his bluff. And he has done it several times in the past with other players.[/quote]

Not really. Jackson is one of their biggest weapons. If he misses 10 games, that sets back their offense for sure.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=Buster;710162]Yeah, Marshall went for a single 2nd-rounder.

Sounds like they're trying to make him happy by "offering" him up for trades but don't really want to deal him.[/quote]

no.. he went for 2 2nds

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

Just to play Devil's Advocate a little bit, we do have a top tiered QB in Ol' DC again. So VJ would still have a top notch QB throwing to him meaning we should be able to get great production out of him.

Also if we have a good ground game ( which I am assuming that we will becasue of MS ) it should open up the passing game more. With the addition of Mcnabb and the roll out play action play there will be ample opportunity for guys to make plays at the reciever position.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5345629&campaign=rss&source=twitter&ex_cid=Twitter_espn_5345629]San Diego Chargers' Vincent Jackson suspended 3 games by NFL, source says - ESPN[/url]

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

not sure if this has been reported on here yet, but apparently Jackson is in Arizona working out with McNabb. He hasn't been doing this during the offseason, so sounds like maybe there is something in the works. Now, it is fact he is in arizona working out with McNabb, but the something in the works is just speculation by me.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=#56fanatic;710192]not sure if this has been reported on here yet, but apparently Jackson is in Arizona working out with McNabb. He hasn't been doing this during the offseason, so sounds like maybe there is something in the works. Now, it is fact he is in arizona working out with McNabb, but the something in the works is just speculation by me.[/quote]

Reported a few pages back.

Probably not a big deal really. McNabb works out with a lot of guys in the offseason.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

[quote=GMScud;710169]Not really. Jackson is one of their biggest weapons. If he misses 10 games, that sets back their offense for sure.[/quote]
A lot of folks thought the same way when T.O. was released in Dallas.

Lost their biggest weapon, right?

Then this kid named Austin stepped up and made some plays here and there.
Holdouts and vacant roster spots provide opportunities for those further down the depth chart.

And if the Chargers are hanging their season on whether or not Jackson is there, they have bigger scouting issues than this beef with VJ.

They have a pretty good QB in Rivers, a Pro-Bowl TE in Gates, pretty solid stable of RB's. They'll be okay.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

So he gets a 3 game suspension. I just don't see us going after this guy. He's going to be expensive and the suspension doesn't help.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

And I know were pursuing a trade but I still don't see us landing him. And if we do I just hope we don't give up everything for him. Unless it's Haynesworth.

Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson
 

I agree TD. We gave up a lot to get McNabb, and 5 years down the road we can all be saying what a stupid move that was if Donovan doesn't get the job done. I don't think we get VJ, but the thing that should worry us is that this move proves Shanny and the FO have no confidence in our WR corp.