Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

Sound like it might be good news to us that Scot McCloughan turned down the Raiders.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1103360]So is the McCloughlin /AJ Smith choice an either/or choice? Or would they be working together? Seems to me they both are GM position level guys.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk[/quote]

I heard an interview with Michael Robinson coming into work....he would think McCloughlin would want only a GM position. He's the type who would want to run the show and has been in front office power struggles before and wouldnt want that environment again.

So seems like a long shot at this point if this is truely the case.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Paintrain;1103361]I read somewhere earlier today (I did a quick search on Twitter but couldn't find the link/source) that there's still a play for both to come aboard because Smith is still reluctant to move to DC full time as would be required but he still may get a 'promotion'. There's probably a structure that works for both of them to share power a la Bethard and Casserley back in the day.

For example Smith could be over pro personnel like pro scouts, free agents, maybe even involved in final say on the 53 while McC could be the director of football operations and oversee the entire scouting department, draft, coaching staff, football decisions and the ultimate decision maker for any player acquisition or release.

Either way, as long as Allen is off hosting an alumni picnic while the adults are making these decisons, it's an improvement.[/quote]

I draw the opposite conclusion.

If we bring both McCloughlin and AJ Smith on board, neither would have any real power. They both would essentially be consultants. It would show the same pattern we've seen: that Bruce will only make changes which do not threaten his power and authority.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Lotus;1103383]I draw the opposite conclusion.

If we bring both McCloughlin and AJ Smith on board, neither would have any real power. They both would essentially be consultants. It would show the same pattern we've seen: that Bruce will only make changes which do not threaten his power and authority.[/quote]

I disagree Scot McCoughan turned down the Raiders job because they wouldn't give him the power of football operations if he comes here he will have control over all football decsions.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Paintrain;1103361]
Either way, as long as Allen is off hosting an alumni picnic while the adults are making these decisons, it's an improvement.[/quote]

LOL, that is an awesome quote!!

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=OmahaRedskins;1103341]I thought Shanny had final say on all roster moves. If yes, why is Bruce being held accountable for the first four years?

If you want to fire him for not canning Jim last year, so be it.

Shanny received all the praise for finding Morris in the 6th round. He should receive the criticism for all bad picks.[/quote]

Loyal Warpath readers (that is not a shot at you) know that Allen has always had a say in personnel matters. The idea that Shanny chose personnel and Allen just signed contracts is a false myth.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1103366][IMG]http://gretachristina.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341bf68b53ef01156fb855cc970c-800wi[/IMG]

NOBODY expects the good ol' boy network! Our chief weapon is networking...networking and fear...fear and networking.... our two weapons are fear and networking...and ruthless efficiency.... Our three weapons are fear, networking, and ruthless efficiency...and an almost fanatical devotion to a coach/GM we already know.... Our four...no... amongst our weapons.... amongst our weaponry...are such elements as fear, networking.... I'll come in again.[/quote]

Pretty much this exactly. If you really think about it though, these guy have zero chance of finding talent though.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Lotus;1103392]Loyal Warpath readers (that is not a shot at you) know that Allen has always had a say in personnel matters. The idea that Shanny chose personnel and Allen just signed contracts is a false myth.[/quote]

I don't think there is anyone who would argue that Bruce Allen had/has a say in personnel matters. Of course he has a say in personnel matters. But I think when it comes down to your job and credibility, if Allen has the chance to bring in someone who can make all the right moves in player (and coach) personnel while Bruce basically keeps his job, salary, and pseudo status with the team, then why would he not go for that? Everybody wins. Allen is viewed as the humble leader who will still be the face of the front office, but Scot and AJ (or Scot alone) would be the ones who truly do the heavy lifting. It would be a dream scenario for Bruce Allen.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Lotus;1103392]Loyal Warpath readers (that is not a shot at you) know that Allen has always had a say in personnel matters. The idea that Shanny chose personnel and Allen just signed contracts is a false myth.[/quote]

I was talking to someone like last night that deals with the Redskins often and he pretty much said that Allen's involvement in personnel decisions is way overestimated. I found this to be a bit surprising

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

I just don't understand what's the point of throwing money to this or that person if you are not going to allow them to do their job. Not to mention hiring people that are capable of doing their job. I was excited years ago about the Bruce Allen hire, but only because as a fan, we were sold a bill that Bruce Allen met all of the qualifications to do what ol' Vinny couldn't do for years which was stand up to Snyder and make quality football decisions. I'm not buying anything in the offseason anymore. Its all comical entertainment to me at this point.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;1103398]I was talking to someone like last night that deals with the Redskins often and he pretty much said that Allen's involvement in personnel decisions is way overestimated. I found this to be a bit surprising[/QUOTE]


I find that surprising and at the same time not really. He doesn't strike me as some egomaniac control freak, the way he's been vilified lately is a little unfair. But I know it comes with the territory when GM is in your title.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Mattyk;1103401]I find that surprising and at the same time not really. He doesn't strike me as some egomaniac control freak, the way he's been vilified lately is a little unfair. But I know it comes with the territory when GM is in your title.[/quote]

I have not meant to portray him as an "egomaniac control freak." To me it seems:

1) he wants to keep his job, and be empowered at his job, just like the rest of us
and
2) he has no clue that he sucks at his job in terms of personnel, so in his mind there is no reason to delegate power.

That is, personally I see Allen less as controlling and more as incompetent and unaware of his incompetence.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1103398]I was talking to someone like last night that deals with the Redskins often and he pretty much said that Allen's involvement in personnel decisions is way overestimated. I found this to be a bit surprising[/quote]

If this is true, and BA brings someone into to run the show (two big ifs I know) like AJ Smith, then maybe there is ...dare I say...hope.

As a fan I am 95% emotion, as an organizer or manager (at work) I need to be 95% patient and support folks as they learn how to get better with in guidance.

Attempt 1: All trust in Shanaclan, fail.

Attempt 2: New coach, I run operations, fail.

Attempt 3: Provide stability and support for someone good at operations to run operations......

If this is how it works out maybe we are finally on the right track. Not saying I think this is the case, just a possibility,......said another way: I will believe it when I see it.

The 95% emotional fan in me wants to see it that way for sure, and I get tired of all the negativity. I have to have some hope...other than Obi Wan Kenobi

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1103398]I was talking to someone like last night that deals with the Redskins often and he pretty much said that Allen's involvement in personnel decisions is way overestimated. I found this to be a bit surprising[/quote]

Interesting. Thank you for that.

It raises the question, though: if not Allen, who has been making our personnel decisions since Shanahan left? If not Bruce, who made the call to take Murphy in the second? Who made the call to sign Porter and Lauvao? Etc.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1103398]I was talking to someone like last night that deals with the Redskins often and he pretty much said that Allen's involvement in personnel decisions is way overestimated. I found this to be a bit surprising[/quote]

Well I thought he was GM??...So the obvious is who is making the personnel decisions?...Campbell, Gruden, AJ Smith, Danny Boy, Doug Williams, the fantasy football champion of the office?

I dont get the stucture of this organization...something is clearly wrong within the offices of Redskins Park. WTH???

Bruce is the GM and I thought the primary job of the GM...

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1103407]Well I thought he was GM??...So the obvious is who is making the personnel decisions?...Campbell, Gruden, AJ Smith, Danny Boy, Doug Williams, the fantasy football champion of the office?

I dont get the stucture of this organization...something is clearly wrong within the offices of Redskins Park. WTH???

Bruce is the GM and I thought the primary job of the GM...[/quote]

I would imagine Gruden may have had a lot of input then, since I doubt Snyder would care about signings such as Luvao and T. Porter.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[QUOTE=Lotus;1103404]I have not meant to portray him as an "egomaniac control freak." To me it seems:



1) he wants to keep his job, and be empowered at his job, just like the rest of us

and

2) he has no clue that he sucks at his job in terms of personnel, so in his mind there is no reason to delegate power.



That is, personally I see Allen less as controlling and more as incompetent and unaware of his incompetence.[/QUOTE]


I don't see him as a bumbling idiot but that's just me.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

I think the current (BA) and previous (BA/Shanny) regime may have had a big problem in talent scouting and depending too much on old/mediocre players in some important areas. The team has whiffed on a number of o-linemen and secondary draft picks in the past couple of years. They've also ended up gambling on the likes of Fletcher, Chester, Polumbus, and T. Porter to fill in areas that were not able to be addressed by the draft or free agency. The team needs to bring in a personnel guy that can fix this issue right away.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1103414]I think the current (BA) and previous (BA/Shanny) regime may have had a big problem in talent scouting and depending too much on old/mediocre players in some important areas. The team has whiffed on a number of o-linemen and secondary draft picks in the past couple of years. They've also ended up gambling on the likes of Fletcher, Chester, Polumbus, and T. Porter to fill in areas that were not able to be addressed by the draft or free agency. The team needs to bring in a personnel guy that can fix this issue right away.[/quote]

this is true but the have also been handcuffed with the salary cap penalty and the RGIII trade (their own doing). Fletcher, Chester, Polumbus, and T. Porter might have been at the time their only choices considering their limitations.

Hindsight is a beautiful thing.

What would you have done with regards to those players? For every action their is a reaction.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Mattyk;1103411]I don't see him as a bumbling idiot but that's just me.[/quote]

I don't see him as a "bumbling idiot," either.

You must have known someone in a position of power in a business who was not competent to fill the job but who did not know this. Because they lack self-awareness and are convinced that they are competent, they never consider the moves needed to become successful. Haven't we all known someone like this?

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Mattyk;1103411]I don't see him as a bumbling idiot but that's just me.[/quote]
I don't think he's a bumbling idiot in the way that Vinny was. Vinny just did and said things that were embarrassing, like a goofy uncle who thought he was cool.

Allen just seems out of his depth in football operations. Mike Jones said in his e-mailbag that he always thinks he's the smartest guy in the room and is surprised when he's not and doesn't handle it smoothly. Another description I read last year is that he was born on third base, thought he hit a triple and isn't interested in moving. Basically he's really content in being who he is and doesn't really care what you think about it. He doesn't have the fear and hunger of a scout and I think he has an air of entitlement so he doesn't think he has to put in the hard work necessary to improve.

Bumbling idiot, no. Smug jackass, quite possibly.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Paintrain;1103421]I don't think he's a bumbling idiot in the way that Vinny was. Vinny just did and said things that were embarrassing, like a goofy uncle who thought he was cool.

Allen just seems out of his depth in football operations. Mike Jones said in his e-mailbag that he always thinks he's the smartest guy in the room and is surprised when he's not and doesn't handle it smoothly. Another description I read last year is that he was born on third base, thought he hit a triple and isn't interested in moving. Basically he's really content in being who he is and doesn't really care what you think about it. He doesn't have the fear and hunger of a scout and I think he has an air of entitlement so he doesn't think he has to put in the hard work necessary to improve.

Bumbling idiot, no. Smug jackass, quite possibly.[/quote]

Brilliantly put.

You also made a comment a few days ago about our being in a Matt Millen situation. Also well put.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Paintrain;1103421]I don't think he's a bumbling idiot in the way that Vinny was. Vinny just did and said things that were embarrassing, like a goofy uncle who thought he was cool.

[B]Allen just seems out of his depth in football operations[/B]. Mike Jones said in his e-mailbag that he always thinks he's the smartest guy in the room and is surprised when he's not and doesn't handle it smoothly. Another description I read last year is that he was born on third base, thought he hit a triple and isn't interested in moving. Basically he's really content in being who he is and doesn't really care what you think about it. He doesn't have the fear and hunger of a scout and I think he has an air of entitlement so he doesn't think he has to put in the hard work necessary to improve.

Bumbling idiot, no. Smug jackass, quite possibly.[/quote]

I think he'd be out of his depth in a parking lot puddle, at least insofar as talent evaluation is concerned. It sounds like he's reaslanbly good at contract negotiations. I hate him as any kind of spokesperson -- he comes across to me at least as a bad combination of smug, uninformed (and thus far too reliant on soundbites). I'd love to see him move over the President of Football Operations, and see AJ and/or Scot take over personnel decisions and talent evaluation. But Allen strikes me as too prideful to do that.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

Might have to change this thread title. Deal is all but done with McCloughan

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet)
1/6/15, 13:11
There it is RT @RealMikeRob: BREAKING! Scot McCloughan will be Redskins GM. Just spoke with him! Good for you! Press conference end of week

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=smootsmack;1103427]might have to change this thread title. Deal is all but done with mccloughan[/quote]

awesome!

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=redskins5044;1103429]Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet)
1/6/15, 13:11
There it is RT @RealMikeRob: BREAKING! Scot McCloughan will be Redskins GM. Just spoke with him! Good for you! Press conference end of week[/quote]

Yep! Hopefully he was smart enough to get full autonomy written into the contract;)

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

Yahoo!!

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

McCloughan! Four year deal per Rapoport

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

i think this is a good move...just worried about how Scot will celebrate the new position

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Paintrain;1103421]I don't think he's a bumbling idiot in the way that Vinny was. Vinny just did and said things that were embarrassing, like a goofy uncle who thought he was cool.

Allen just seems out of his depth in football operations. Mike Jones said in his e-mailbag that he always thinks he's the smartest guy in the room and is surprised when he's not and doesn't handle it smoothly. Another description I read last year is that he was born on third base, thought he hit a triple and isn't interested in moving. Basically he's really content in being who he is and doesn't really care what you think about it. He doesn't have the fear and hunger of a scout and I think he has an air of entitlement so he doesn't think he has to put in the hard work necessary to improve.

Bumbling idiot, no. Smug jackass, quite possibly.[/quote]

Alot of speculation here. He definitely cleaned up our cap situation. He is better off staying on the money said of the biz.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

This is the best Redskins news I've heard in a long long time! We finally will have a proven professional picking players. I like this a lot. Now hopefully Bruce and Dan will step aside and let this guy do his thing.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

His 2007 draft with the 49ers - [url=http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000131972/article/san-francisco-49ers-had-incredible-2007-draft-class]San Francisco 49ers had incredible 2007 draft class - NFL.com[/url]

First 5 picks started in the Super Bowl a few years later and the first 3 became pro-bowlers.

Drafted 15 of the 22 starters that played in the SB.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

According to Rapoport, it is the GM position. Wow.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

Happy with the move to put McCloughan in the GM seat. FINALLY a 'real GM' with football chops who has recent and relevant success in building a team.

If his recent history in Seattle is any indication, he was part of a major and rapid turning over of the roster. I'm still not expecting much in terms of improvement in 2015 but if it's because we've shed the roster of some underperforming players to make room for draft picks and smart free agents, I'm on board.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

Dianna Marie Russini ‏@NBCdianna 7m7 minutes ago
I can confirm Scot McCloughlan will be new Redskins GM. I'm told Bruce Allen will be President of Redskins.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

This move is not without risk... But hands down the best decision Synder has made since he has owned the team... I am in shock that we actually hired a top 5 personnel guy as our GM... Holy Shit!

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

[quote=Paintrain;1103421]I don't think he's a bumbling idiot in the way that Vinny was. Vinny just did and said things that were embarrassing, like a goofy uncle who thought he was cool.

Allen just seems out of his depth in football operations. Mike Jones said in his e-mailbag that he always thinks he's the smartest guy in the room and is surprised when he's not and doesn't handle it smoothly. Another description I read last year is that he was born on third base, thought he hit a triple and isn't interested in moving. Basically he's really content in being who he is and doesn't really care what you think about it. He doesn't have the fear and hunger of a scout and I think he has an air of entitlement so he doesn't think he has to put in the hard work necessary to improve.

Bumbling idiot, no. Smug jackass, quite possibly.[/quote]

Sounds like a reasonable description. If true, then who is behind the personnel move? Danny? Or is BA really going to cede power of his own volition?

I like the names being bandied about -- Smith, McCloughlan (yes, I know he has the alcohol risk factor), and Phillips. My skepticism, however, is at an all time high. W/out fundamental structural changes, I see no room for improvement. I think the best we can currently hope for is something like:

1. Gruden picks his coaches. Period. None of this group think stuff. Coaching staff and final roster are entirely at Head Coach's discretion.

2. Scott McC or AJ Smith is the talent accumulator epicks the players with Gruden's input in terms of "I need WR's that block well even if they are not speedsters (or vice versa); I need power O-Linemen rather than athletic ones; I need CB's that play man better than zone," and etc. Trades, drafting, UFA's are all under this person.

3. BA negotiates the deals. As someone said earlier, Smith / McC pick the players and BA pays the players. BA has NO say in who to acquire and who to keep. BA also serves as the go between / buffer between Coaches & Talent Acquisition and Dan Snyder.

No matter how you cut it though, I still see this as being a management nightmare with BA at its head. In the above, who mediates between Talent and Coaching? Inevitably, they will clash at times. If it is BA, I don't trust his ability to do anything right in the personnel arena. [Question, if anyone knows - Who was negotiating the trades on draft day? Did Shanny say, "get us into the 2nd spot BA" and then BA did it? Or was the negotiating all (or mostly) done by Shanny?]

I dunno. The only think I think is a sure thing is that, somehow, even if the Skins find qualified people, they will manage to f*** it all up.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

But he is a West Coast, he must not be good :) Ha, ha best hire in years, now let him pick our future DC.

Re: A.J. Smith to be Redskins GM?
 

So as I was typing that, I discover that Scott McC is all but certain to become GM.

If he can keep his demons in check, if BA can truly step aside, and if McC and Gruden are a good fit, this looks like a really big bonus.

Dunno, lot of BIG ifs in that previous statement.