Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[QUOTE=MTK;1218102]Enough with Mo Harris already, he hasn’t done shit


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You could literally insert 85 % of our roster into that sentence and it would still make sense.
Guice, Scherff, Moses, TW, Allen, Payne, Dunbar, Hopkins, Way. Not many others that I actually care if I ever see in the B & G again. Were fuckin light years away.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[QUOTE=Irrefutable;1218034]They need receivers and a TE that can stretch the field and BLOCK will help both the passing game and running game. Even if Sprinkle can block, they need at least 2 TEs. Also, the extra pick (2nd or 3rd round) can be used anywhere.[/QUOTE]



We have flannigan. I misspoke earlier. Flannigan is the one Cooley’s been raving about


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Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1218106]You could literally insert 85 % of our roster into that sentence and it would still make sense.
Guice, Scherff, Moses, TW, Allen, Payne, Dunbar, Hopkins, Way. Not many others that I actually care if I ever see in the B & G again. Were fuckin light years away.[/quote]

Did you say Scherff and Trent? GTFO

:doh:

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=Schneed10;1218120]Did you say Scherff and Trent? GTFO

:doh:[/quote]

Hard to tell but I think that's the list of keepers. I'd put Kerrigan on the list too but that's just me.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1218106][B]You could literally insert 85 % of our roster into that sentence and it would still make sense. [/B]
Guice, Scherff, Moses, TW, Allen, Payne, Dunbar, Hopkins, Way. Not many others that I actually care if I ever see in the B & G again. Were fuckin light years away.[/quote]

Truth hurts. Why make me sad?

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=Schneed10;1218120]Did you say Scherff and Trent? GTFO

:doh:[/quote]

99.99% positive those were the guys he loves.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

We need to keep AP. Even if its more than the minimun. Obviously not something crazy, but he needs to be back. He was fun to watch this year.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;1218120]Did you say Scherff and Trent? GTFO



:doh:[/QUOTE]



Im glad everyone else has the basic reading comprehension skills needed to understand my post....[emoji849]

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1218122]Hard to tell but I think that's the list of keepers. I'd put Kerrigan on the list too but that's just me.[/QUOTE]



Only hard to tell for Schneed because he is constantly in attack mode for some reason. Probably a deep rooted daddy or mommy issue but who has time for that...
Kerrigan definitely is part of that list. Like i said there are others....not many but others....

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Yep my bad, I deserve it. lol

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=MTK;1218102]Enough with Mo Harris already, he hasn’t done shit


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I was on the Mo Harris bandwagon. It is time to get off.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1218036]IMO TE is a need, just like pretty much every position on this team. Name me one position where we don't have a need? When we pick if a d-linemen was BPA I'd take him. We have needs at every position.[/quote]

D-line is pretty set, I think that's the only position I'd stay away from.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=mooby;1218101]We have no idea if AP will get legit offers or not. At least if he comes back here, he knows he will get carries behind Guice. Might not be too many teams interested in signing AP to a feature role, and if that's the case we have as good a chance as anyone plus the bonus of familiarity. I'd bring him back if the price is right.

Haha will get something decent in FA if he walks, but again, coming off a weak 2nd half of the season with us he might not get the offer he wants. If that's the case, look for him to possibly bet on himself with a 1-2 year deal with us with an opt out. I'm sure he'd like to see what he can do with an offseason to study and learn the D.

Crowder I'd bring back if the price is right.

Harris might get squeezed if we upgrade at WR, which should absolutely be a must fill this year.

Iupati? No idea if he's still good or not but if he's healthy I would say he's definitely a better option than Lauvao.[/quote]

As a 34 year old RB AP's market will be limited just like it was last offseason when he had to wait for an injury to get a shot. I think chances are good we can resign him for a team friendly deal.

HHCD is facing a market that has really dried up for safeties the last couple years. I could definitely see him back on a one year prove it deal.

I'd let Crowder walk unless the money is right.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Rob Ryan?

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=MTK;1218165]As a 34 year old RB AP's market will be limited just like it was last offseason when he had to wait for an injury to get a shot. I think chances are good we can resign him for a team friendly deal.

HHCD is facing a market that has really dried up for safeties the last couple years. I could definitely see him back on a one year prove it deal.

I'd let Crowder walk unless the money is right.[/quote]

Crowder really hasn't been effective these last couple years, but if we brought in 1 or possibly 2 starters I wouldn't mind seeing him back on a team friendly deal as the slot wideout (which seems to be his best role-playing situation, a guy who makes plays when there are better wideouts to draw coverage away from him). He's not starter material though, so if some team wants to pay him starter money he walks.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyQvsmEXgAA2ybd.jpg:large[/IMG]

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=MTK;1218162]D-line is pretty set, I think that's the only position I'd stay away from.[/quote]

K and P too.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=Irrefutable;1218092]You cannot be serious. AP will not sign for a minimal contract again. LOL on HaHa. No thanks on Crowder or Harris. Or Iupati and Collins.

And Lawrence will not be eligible for the draft.[/quote]

I love your thoughts, but who are you going to replace or make upgrades these players with? Since we have no money, honestly I do not think many free agents will seriously entertain coming here unless we overpay.

My statement on Lawrence is based on the premise that I expect this year to be a wash and we should position ourselves to get a better Qb in next years draft whether that be him or someone else in a stronger draft class. If he is not eligible, others are.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Keim covers a lot of ground here but the thing that stuck out the most was no meaningful discussions with Preston Smith so far.

Looks like they are content to let him walk:

[url]http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/38137/redskins-need-a-qb-but-other-draft-areas-could-bring-better-results[/url]

I have a real problem with how they negotiated with Kirk, not necessarily letting him walk, but the arrogance during the whole contract back and forth through the media.

I hope it's not a similar attitude toward Smith. Players talk and text.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Who would pay Smith a lot of cash? He's not worth a big contract.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1218716]Who would pay Smith a lot of cash? He's not worth a big contract.[/quote]

Multiple teams would pay for Smith, I've never understood the dissatisfaction with him.

Trent Murphy got 22 Million over 3 years, averaging about 7 mill/year.

Smith is a better player, who has never had a serious injury, entering free agency where the cap has gone UP yet again. He could easily earn 8-10 mil/year.

Idk what you consider to be a "big contract" but the skins dont really have the capital to afford any substantial contracts. Somebody else could easily sign him away.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=sevier2;1218717]Multiple teams would pay for Smith, I've never understood the dissatisfaction with him.
[/quote]

4 sacks!

You want to pay a guy who has never managed 5 or more sacks in back to back years?


Someone might pay him hoping they can more out of him but no one is licking their chops trying to get this guy and he won't get a 5 year contract.

If you are going to defend PS and blame then system/Manusky then realize that Preston probably doesn't want to come back for another 4 sack season.

Regardless of what anyone thinks about Preston, we should all agree that we need more out of our primary edge rusher.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=sevier2;1218717]Multiple teams would pay for Smith, I've never understood the dissatisfaction with him.

Trent Murphy got 22 Million over 3 years, averaging about 7 mill/year.

Smith is a better player, who has never had a serious injury, entering free agency where the cap has gone UP yet again. He could easily earn 8-10 mil/year.

Idk what you consider to be a "big contract" but the skins dont really have the capital to afford any substantial contracts. Somebody else could easily sign him away.[/quote]


So for $7.33 million the highly intelligent Buffalo Bills got a whopping 14 solos tackles and 4 sacks from Trent Murphy in 2018. That averages to 1 tackle a game and .30 sacks a game.
So under that same example you gave you want to pay millions to Preston Smith who averaged 1.75 tackles a game, .23 sacks a game. Not million dollar production.
OLB in 3-4 defense is a critically important position. We can do a lot better at a very key position. This draft is talent heavy with defense and outside pass rushers. One of the strongest outside pass rushers draft classes in a long time. Add a few teams will trade up and overreach to get QB's there will be a blue chip pass rusher there for the taking.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=Defensewins;1218720]So for $7.33 million the highly intelligent Buffalo Bills got a whopping 14 solos tackles and 4 sacks from Trent Murphy in 2018. That averages to 1 tackle a game and .30 sacks a game.
So under that same example you gave you want to pay millions to Preston Smith who averaged 1.75 tackles a game, .23 sacks a game. Not million dollar production.
OLB in 3-4 defense is a critically important position. We can do a lot better at a very key position. This draft is talent heavy with defense and outside pass rushers. One of the strongest outside pass rushers draft classes in a long time. Add a few teams will trade up and overreach to get QB's there will be a blue chip pass rusher there for the taking.[/quote]

I think you're missing my point here...

Trent Murphy was not worth that contract, I agree. But the fact of the matter is [B]HE GOT IT.[/B] I don't care for all the numbers and averages you've laid out. [B]The NFL pays for potential.[/B] And a players worth is WHATEVER another team [I]decides[/I] it is.

Have you ever sold a car? When anybody asks, "How much is it worth?" The answer is, "As much as somebody is willing to pay." That's what it's worth.

Now, I agree that Preston Smith's numbers DO NOT deserve a large contract (although I think i'm a bit higher on him than you are). But do you really think the NFL is going to all of a sudden STOP overpaying for players in free-agency?

Look at Sam Bradford. How much money has he made in the league compared to what his numbers would determine he "deserves?"

I'm not saying P. Smith is going to re-set the market come free-agency with every team bidding for his services. But I DO fully expect him to get multiple offers from other teams who might offer 1-2 Mil./year MORE than we do. In which case he'll probably take it.

Smith is a [I]solid[/I] OLB and for a lot of teams they would welcome that as an upgrade. We've gotten used to having stable play there for a long time but it's not just a given somebody will step in and fill that role if he leaves.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Hoping Smith signs a big enough contract to give us a 3rd round compensatory pick.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[QUOTE=BigHairedAristocrat;1218729]Hoping Smith signs a big enough contract to give us a 3rd round compensatory pick.[/QUOTE]I don't see it, I could see us getting a 4th - 6th round pick for Smith.

I liked Smith as he played well (in general) last season and I was hoping he would continue the trend this year but he didn't improve much. I am fine with letting him walk away as long as we have an adequate replacement (Anderson doesn't count as adequate replacement).

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=sevier2;1218721]I think you're missing my point here...

Trent Murphy was not worth that contract, I agree. But the fact of the matter is [B]HE GOT IT.[/B] I don't care for all the numbers and averages you've laid out. [B]The NFL pays for potential.[/B] And a players worth is WHATEVER another team [I]decides[/I] it is.

Have you ever sold a car? When anybody asks, "How much is it worth?" The answer is, "As much as somebody is willing to pay." That's what it's worth.

Now, I agree that Preston Smith's numbers DO NOT deserve a large contract (although I think i'm a bit higher on him than you are). But do you really think the NFL is going to all of a sudden STOP overpaying for players in free-agency?

Look at Sam Bradford. How much money has he made in the league compared to what his numbers would determine he "deserves?"

I'm not saying P. Smith is going to re-set the market come free-agency with every team bidding for his services. But I DO fully expect him to get multiple offers from other teams who might offer 1-2 Mil./year MORE than we do. In which case he'll probably take it.

Smith is a [I]solid[/I] OLB and for a lot of teams they would welcome that as an upgrade. We've gotten used to having stable play there for a long time but it's not just a given somebody will step in and fill that role if he leaves.[/quote]

So what if the bad teams like the terrible Buffalo Bills overpay under productive players like Trent Murphy or that other misguided teams over pay for an under productive players. That is what bad teams do.
We should not do that.
We overpaid for Paul Richardson, Jordan Reed and Shawn Lauvau. With Jordan Reed it is not so much because of talent, Reed has plenty of receiver skills. It is his lack of production due to consistently being injured. Plus he is a terrible run blocker, enough that it effects our running game. Even when healthy he has holes in his game. So it reaches a point that after years of seeing this that they are not worth multi-millions dollars of salary.

Preston Smith is not a solid OLB. He is a one dimensional pass rush DE being forced to play OLB. He is terrible at setting the edge against the run. He is terrible at reading run and pass plays. LB have to be good at reading plays.
I played OLB and watching Preston Smith play against the run is embarrassing. I am sure he gets his ass chewed out on film day for not protecting his edge. I can not tell you how many times he misread a run play and blew right by the RB going after the QB. That is part of why he is not getting a contract offer. he has holes in his game. Do not give him millions of dollars. We CAN do a lot better.
In a 3-4 defense having two great OLB's makes a good defense great. Both OLB's have to produce sacks in today's pass crazy NFL. If we get another solid OLB to go with Ryan Kerrigan, to go with that great D-Line, to go with Rueben Foster and Zach Brown. we should have a top 5 defense. Plus all of the DB's coming back from injury

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=Defensewins;1218760]So what if the bad teams like the terrible Buffalo Bills overpay under productive players like Trent Murphy or that other misguided teams over pay for an under productive players. That is what bad teams do.
We should not do that.
We overpaid for Paul Richardson, Jordan Reed and Shawn Lauvau. With Jordan Reed it is not so much because of talent, Reed has plenty of receiver skills. It is his lack of production due to consistently being injured. Plus he is a terrible run blocker, enough that it effects our running game. Even when healthy he has holes in his game. So it reaches a point that after years of seeing this that they are not worth multi-millions dollars of salary.

Preston Smith is not a solid OLB. He is a one dimensional pass rush DE being forced to play OLB. He is terrible at setting the edge against the run. He is terrible at reading run and pass plays. LB have to be good at reading plays.
I played OLB and watching Preston Smith play against the run is embarrassing. I am sure he gets his ass chewed out on film day for not protecting his edge. I can not tell you how many times he misread a run play and blew right by the RB going after the QB. That is part of why he is not getting a contract offer. he has holes in his game. Do not give him millions of dollars. We CAN do a lot better.
In a 3-4 defense having two great OLB's makes a good defense great. Both OLB's have to produce sacks in today's pass crazy NFL. If we get another solid OLB to go with Ryan Kerrigan, to go with that great D-Line, to go with Rueben Foster and Zach Brown. we should have a top 5 defense. Plus all of the DB's coming back from injury[/quote]

Dude I've been agreeing with you, I don't think Smith is worth a massive contract either...

I was simply saying that there WILL be another team that DOES offer him that money. I'm not advocating we do that, i'm not even commenting on his play really. Just saying he is good enough to get some offers come free-agency.

I was using Murphy as an example of how much a player can make in this league with minimal production....

And i'm not even going to get into your "Top 5 Defense" claim. This team has a lot to prove up and down the roster. We are not one OLB away from being top 5.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Preston is an enigma. Is he actually at the best he can be? Has he been underperforming? Is he lazy and content? I want to keep him because the idea of long term Skins players is awesome. But to me, unless its an obvious team friendly deal, I'd cut him loose.

Note - this is my opinion. I can 100% see both sides of the argument for keeping him or not.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1218771]Preston is an enigma. Is he actually at the best he can be? Has he been underperforming? Is he lazy and content? I want to keep him because the idea of long term Skins players is awesome. But to me, unless its an obvious team friendly deal, I'd cut him loose.

Note - this is my opinion. I can 100% see both sides of the argument for keeping him or not.[/quote]


Preston Smith won't get better than what he already is...he's never had more than 8 sacks in a season which means he's never had double digit sacks in 4 seasons....I would let him go based on that alone....he has had a lot of pressures on the QB...but he doesn't get home...the team can either sign a edge rusher llike Javeion Clowney or draft an edge rusher in rounds 1-3 of the upcoming draft.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=REDSKINS4ever;1218778]Preston Smith won't get better than what he already is...he's never had more than 8 sacks in a season which means he's never had double digit sacks in 4 seasons....I would let him go based on that alone....he has had a lot of pressures on the QB...but he doesn't get home...the team can either sign a edge rusher llike Javeion Clowney or draft an edge rusher in rounds 1-3 of the upcoming draft.[/quote]

I think you mean Jadeveon Clowney and there's no way we could afford him. Especially if we want to re-sign Scherff or Crowder.

I can see both sides to signing/not signing P. Smith as well but everyone here is talking like we can just go out and pick some guy up and we won't miss a beat. Smith isn't elite but we know what we have with him. If he came at a reasonable deal i'd definitely keep him on board.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=sevier2;1218787]I think you mean Jadeveon Clowney and there's no way we could afford him. Especially if we want to re-sign Scherff or Crowder.

I can see both sides to signing/not signing P. Smith as well but everyone here is talking like we can just go out and pick some guy up and we won't miss a beat. Smith isn't elite but we know what we have with him. If he came at a reasonable deal i'd definitely keep him on board.[/quote]

Key words: reasonable deal. Since pass rushing is overvalued it's easy to see him getting an above-average market deal, at which point I'd pass. He's not worth above-average money.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Bottom line is he was in a contract year and had 4 sacks. He ain't getting a big contract. He'll get a pay raise but that's it. He needs to go to a 4-3 team and play DE. OLB in a 3-4 is just a waste of time for Preston.

And I don't care what anyone says that 3-4 sucks a pile of shit. I can't wait to get rid of this fucking miserable defense. Let our d-linemen attack, be playmakers, get up field and be more disruptive. Hope after Gruden gets fired we go back to a pure 4-3.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

HE'll get 8-10 M I'd imagine

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Spencer Long signs a 3 year contract with Buffalo .

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Love Chris Cooley agreeing with me on go getting TE Boyle from Baltimore in free agency.

Top Blocking TE, cheap, who can leak out a grab a couple passes.

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=Chico23231;1218891]Love Chris Cooley agreeing with me on go getting TE Boyle from Baltimore in free agency.

Top Blocking TE, cheap, who can leak out a grab a couple passes.[/quote]

You mean finally (after 6 f'n years) go get a TE who blocks in the run game to plug into an offense which relies on TE's who block in the run game?

Nah. What's the point?

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=DYoungJelly;1218897]You mean finally (after 6 f'n years) go get a TE who blocks in the run game to plug into an offense which relies on TE's who block in the run game?

Nah. What's the point?[/quote]

Lolol. Well when you put it like that... it seems so obvious!

Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

Shady to Redskins rumors up here in buffalo.. I don't see how that happens tho

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Re: Offseason starts now: A Redskins players thread
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1218901]Shady to Redskins rumors up here in buffalo.. I don't see how that happens tho

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no chance, McCoy averaged 3.2 yards per carry and has a $9.2 million dollar contract