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[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;297048]Schneed, I can tell you from experience that it does in fact affect your lungs (no real surprise there). Since I have reduced the frequency with which I smoke, I have noticed a difference. There was a time when I couldn't play intense basketball for more than 10 minutes, without feeling like I was suffocating. Although, that could be related to smoking tobacco for 6 years -- even though I have been a non-smoker for about 4 years now.

That said, I still don't think it should be illegal. I think I deserve the right to do to my body as I wish. It frustrates me that other people think they have the authority to grant, or deny, me that right.

If the only adverse affects are related to inhaling the smoke, how do you feel about eating it? Many of the same benefits can be received through eating it, without many, if any, of the costs. Would you be opposed to the legalization of cannabis pills?[/quote]

I guess what I'm saying is that I concede that my argument for keeping it illegal isn't all that strong. There are some objective reasons for it which I still believe strongly in keeping it illegal (and I won't rehash because I've expressed them already). But there are strong arguments in favor of legalizing it, the biggest of which is that people should be free to eff themselves up if they want to, which I actually buy into. If you want to make a bad decision regarding how to treat your body, you should be free to do so. I think the affect of legalizing will be deleterious to our youth. Us adults, we'll be just fine. But it's the kids I'd worry about with the increased accessibility to pot.

But mainly at this point, I've moved on to expressing my subjective and personal distaste for marijuana and those who smoke it. I agree that you should be free to make decisions regarding your own body (to the extent it doesn't affect others). But I also feel that if you're going to make bad decisions regarding your health, you should be prepared to deal with uppity people like me who consider you an idiot for doing so. Freedom is a two-way street; if you're free to decide to smoke pot, others should be free to look at you with derision, voice their opinions, and shake their heads in disgust.

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It's hard to argue with that post Schneed.

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[quote=Schneed10;297043]That's the thing, the medical consensus is moving to it being harmful. Matty's stuff was from 2003. That's four years old, which is ages in the medical community.[/quote]

There has been more recent research, [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/25/AR2006052501729.html"]one study concluded that pot doesn't have any long-term link to cancer[/URL]

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[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;297024]Are you assuming, however, that there is a causal relationship between your friends' laziness and weed? Maybe they were lazy to start with. I too know heavy users who are outstanding employees at various jobs. I also know a few alcoholics who are jorribly lazy and mean.[/quote]

I am attributing in these particular instances, they are who they are. There use of the weed is what IT is.
Yes, because of there dependance or maybe............Adoring love of it, (if you don't like the word dependance) and it's use, has had profound and lifelong negative effects. I have no idea whether they are the norm, or the exception. Fact is they are lifelong potheads who have adopted losing, and uselessness as their career path.

Note: I do not suggest anywhere that alcohol abuse is more preferred than that of Cannabis.

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[quote=Mattyk72;297058]There has been more recent research, [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/25/AR2006052501729.html"]one study concluded that pot doesn't have any long-term link to cancer[/URL][/quote]

This makes sense, our lung docs here at Temple agree with this. But it still causes emphysema.

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[quote=Schneed10;297051]I guess what I'm saying is that I concede that my argument for keeping it illegal isn't all that strong. There are some objective reasons for it which I still believe strongly in keeping it illegal (and I won't rehash because I've expressed them already). But there are strong arguments in favor of legalizing it, the biggest of which is that people should be free to eff themselves up if they want to, which I actually buy into. If you want to make a bad decision regarding how to treat your body, you should be free to do so. I think the affect of legalizing will be deleterious to our youth. Us adults, we'll be just fine. But it's the kids I'd worry about with the increased accessibility to pot.

But mainly at this point, I've moved on to expressing my subjective and personal distaste for marijuana and those who smoke it. I agree that you should be free to make decisions regarding your own body (to the extent it doesn't affect others). But I also feel that if you're going to make bad decisions regarding your health, you should be prepared to deal with uppity people like me who consider you an idiot for doing so. Freedom is a two-way street; if you're free to decide to smoke pot, others should be free to look at you with derision, voice their opinions, and shake their heads in disgust.[/quote]

I'm sure we could look at your lifestyle and find some questionable decisions in there regarding your health. Difference is I wouldn't shake my head in disgust or judge you. Your life is your own and as long as your decisions don't directly effect my life, to each his own.

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[quote=Mattyk72;297061]I'm sure we could look at your lifestyle and find some questionable decisions in there regarding your health. Difference is I wouldn't shake my head in disgust or judge you. Your life is your own and as long as your decisions don't directly effect my life, to each his own.[/quote]

If you smoke weed around me, then it affects me. I have to smell the crap and it grosses me out, and watching people do it makes me feel dumber by association.

I don't ever come in contact with you guys so I don't have a problem if you're smoking it; so you're right, I should clarify. The concept of smoking weed doesn't bother me. But doing it around me, that's when I'd drop the judgment on a pot smoker.

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[quote=Schneed10;297066]If you smoke weed around me, then it affects me. I have to smell the crap and it grosses me out, and watching people do it makes me feel dumber by association.

I don't ever come in contact with you guys so I don't have a problem if you're smoking it; so you're right, I should clarify. The concept of smoking weed doesn't bother me. But doing it around me, that's when I'd drop the judgment on a pot smoker.[/quote]

Ok I can understand that. I don't have a problem with people who smoke cigarettes, it's their choice if they want to shorten their lives, but if someone is blowing cigarette smoke in my direct area then I have a problem with it.

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[QUOTE=Mattyk72;297070]I don't have a problem with people who smoke cigarettes, it's their choice if they want to shorten their lives, but if someone is blowing cigarette smoke in my direct area then I have a problem with it.[/QUOTE]

I certainly understand that. Just don't be that person who is 30 feet from a smoker and can't possibly smell the smoke, but who coughs (a la "I've got the black lung pop") to make a point.

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[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;297072]I certainly understand that. Just don't be that person who is 30 feet from a smoker and can't possibly smell the smoke, but who coughs (a la "I've got the black lung pop") to make a point.[/quote]

No, I'll just glare and shake my head in disgust. ;)

I smoked cigs for 5-6 years, I quit back in '97. Best thing I ever did.

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[QUOTE=Schneed10;297051]I guess what I'm saying is that I concede that my argument for keeping it illegal isn't all that strong. There are some objective reasons for it which I still believe strongly in keeping it illegal (and I won't rehash because I've expressed them already). But there are strong arguments in favor of legalizing it, the biggest of which is that people should be free to eff themselves up if they want to, which I actually buy into. If you want to make a bad decision regarding how to treat your body, you should be free to do so. I think the affect of legalizing will be deleterious to our youth. Us adults, we'll be just fine. But it's the kids I'd worry about with the increased accessibility to pot.

But mainly at this point, I've moved on to expressing my subjective and personal distaste for marijuana and those who smoke it. I agree that you should be free to make decisions regarding your own body (to the extent it doesn't affect others). But I also feel that if you're going to make bad decisions regarding your health, you should be prepared to deal with uppity people like me who consider you an idiot for doing so. Freedom is a two-way street; if you're free to decide to smoke pot, others should be free to look at you with derision, voice their opinions, and shake their heads in disgust.[/QUOTE]

I think our opinions are closer than you, or I, thought. I would like to stop completely. I really just think it is a waste of money. However, I have the same opinion about alcohol. I think I just have less judgment, because I myself am a user. I don't think pot smokers are dumb because they smoke pot, but there are certainly a lot of dumb pot smokers.

I totally accept other people's opinions about smoking pot. It doesn't bother me if people think I am making a bad decision about smoking pot. I have made, and will continue to make, poor decisions throughout my life. It's mostly due to a lack of self-discipline. I don't really have a problem with the criticism. I just don't like people trying to control my life, based on their own morals/opinions. Just because another person's lifestyle does not conform to your own, does not mean it is any less valid (note: I mean 'your' in a general sense -- not you specifically).

:food-smil

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Word.

Part of being a judgmental asshole like I can be sometimes is that if I'm going to dish it out, I have to be willing to take it. Or even more than that, I have to apply my own harsh standards to myself.

Once in college I drove home from a bar pretty drunk. Didn't get caught, and made it home fine. But I was kicking myself for that one the next day, because not only was it wreckless with my own life, I could have crashed into someone just on their way to get a midnight burrito from Taco Bell. If you're going to be judgmental with others, then you have no choice but to be your own worst critic, or you end up a pathetic hypocrite.

Of course there's a good chance someone up at 2:00 am and headed to T-Bell for a burrito is stoned, so maybe crashing into them is no big loss!

(j/k of course, thought this thread could use a little levity)

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[QUOTE=ArtMonkDrillz;297039]Also, I had a roommate in college that was pretty severely bi-polar. He was prescribed many different antidepressants, but he said nothing ever worked as good as smoking pot.
I don't think it was just the pot itself that allowed him to relax. I think the whole ritual of rolling a blunt and going out and smoking it alone made him feel better. I know that probably won't make sense for someone who has never smoked and thinks that marijuana is an evil weed, but I do think there is something to it.[/QUOTE]

I can agree with that. Really, the ones that are dead set against it, generally are people that haven't tried it, or didn't have a "positive" effect when they did try it.

Someone said they had friends that were lazy after habitual use. I have only 1 friend that does it habitually and he's 32. (I do not see myself as a habitual user since I do it once a month or so at max) My friend has smoked twice a day, every day since he was a freshman in college when a very handsome and strapping young fellow introduced it to him. (me, hehe) He manages an electrical supply company and makes right around 6 figures a year. He has worked for this company for 9 years. When he thought about moving to a different company, the owner begged him to stay and upped his pay by 15k a year because of his value to his company. How many people here can match that salary / longevity within a company / and value? I can't really say it's definitive proof about a person not eing lazy after habitual use, but I think it's a pretty good indicator.
Just remember this, if you WANT to be lazy, you will be. The ONLY thing keeping you on that sofa is YOU. You can use any excuse you want, but it is you.

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If we do, we will truely become a nation of zombies. Clean living guys...

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[quote=4mrusmc;297778]If we do, we will truely become a nation of zombies. Clean living guys...[/quote]

Glad to see there's at least one other person on this site who doesn't believe in rotting his brain with chemicals.

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[quote=Schneed10;297781]Glad to see there's at least one other person on this site who doesn't believe in rotting his brain with chemicals.[/quote]

Damn, Schneed! I was a major contributor to the anti-smokin' coalition and I get no recogntition?


By the by, tonight I was permitted to imbibe in a large quantity of fermented beverages with the understanding that I would have a DD. It has been a loooooong time since such an occurrence has taken place. I think I had like 3 or 4 beers.

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[quote=Mattyk72;296047]At the root of the issue is this, it grows out of the freaking ground. All you have to do is dry it out and smoke it. There's no process to making it, it's 100% natural. It amazes me that something that grows from the earth is deemed illegal.

Is there anything else that grows naturally that is illegal?[/quote]


Shrooms, Coke, Toad, jypsy weed...........................

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Heres my take on it, if it is legalized it should all be private use and need to remain that way, you cant be drunk in public and you cant be high in public. Upon even the slightest hit you are no longer able to drive a car and i think that would make it ok.

On a positive note new businesses would spring up everywhere and crime may even go down a little.

Negative note is its true what they say pot is a gateway drug and could lead to more harmful substances that would make a difference in you life, try to argue its not i have friends going down that road.

Bottom line is you would have to be mature about the usage of pot.

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I have never smoked marijuana in my life, but being the Libertarian that I am I do think marijuana should be legalized, because I believe it is the persons own decision on wether he should participate in such activities

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I'm sure you guys have seen the reports, but here is a link that smoking weed does not cause cancer in the lungs, or any other area like the throat etc.
[url=http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v05/n1106/a09.html]US CA: Column: Marijuana Smoking Does Not Cause Lung Cancer[/url]

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[QUOTE=4mrusmc;297778]If we do, we will truely become a nation of zombies. Clean living guys...[/QUOTE]

Then it should be absolutely easy for someone like you to get a great job from all those zombies right?
I'd say let all the people become "zombies" if they want to, that would leave all sorts of opportunities for those that are not "zombies". So what are you afraid of?

Again, I will say, 142 IQ, MBA in Finance...non zombie. Of course I am not a habitual user so maybe I do not qualify.

I made a comment about people that are against it are people that have either never tried it, or tried it once and didn't get the desired effect. So those who are against it, have you actually tried it...or are you just spewing fear based hate for something you know nothing about?

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Who needs weed when this stuff is already legal:

[URL]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Zb4xzsJD-0[/URL]

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^^ I've had a few times where i could try this but i didn't really want to. The people i knew who tried it had a great time but I've heard of pretty bad experiences with salvia. Funny thing is, some of the people that have tried it never did any drug before it but did this because it was legal.

Someone showed me this site a while back. Its just a lot of experiences, good and bad, with a lot of different things. Its just important to know what you are trying before you try it.
[url=http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp_list.shtml]Erowid Experience Vaults:[/url]

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I never even heard of that stuff. It seems like it would cause damage.

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It doesn't look like the effects last as long.

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[QUOTE=Mattyk72;296063]Right, I'm talking about things that are unprocessed. Things like coke, booze, etc., come from natural ingredients of course but need to be processed into their final forms.

I'm not sure about opium, but they do use the poppy seeds for food. I'm not 100% sure of the process of turning the plant into it's drug form though.[/QUOTE]

Well since Im from New Mexico I can think of one...peyote.

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[quote=NM Redskin;316161]Well since Im from New Mexico I can think of one...peyote.[/quote]

thanks, we did hit on this about 10 pages ago ;)

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[QUOTE=Mattyk72;316163]thanks, we did hit on this about 10 pages ago ;)[/QUOTE]

My bad, Im just hear trying to inflate my post count anyway.

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LOL me too

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[quote=hesscl34;296061]When your child is approahing his/her teens years you just might think differnetly aboout this drug....[/quote]

hess I'm with ya on this one. We have college students and kids getting ready to graduate from high school. How many that answered yes also have kids in this age bracket or kids at all for that matter....?

In short version, NO.

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I bet 25 Warpath points that someone says that it will be cool with them once their kids are old enough.

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[QUOTE=724Skinsfan;316219]I bet 25 Warpath points that someone says that it will be cool with them once their kids are old enough.[/QUOTE]

You mean like if they said they don't have a problem with their kids drinking when they're old enough?

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[quote=724Skinsfan;316219]I bet 25 Warpath points that someone says that it will be cool with them once their kids are old enough.[/quote]

I wouldn't take that bet....? Next thread will be who's got a kilo for sale..? Didn't your folks tell ya DOPE IS FOR DOPES....?

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Hey, when my kids are old enough, they can make decisions for themselves and smoke whatever they want, and do whatever drugs they want. In fact, I encourage it!

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LOL...just kidding.
Like Mr. Mackey says: Drugs are bad mmkay. I can't imagine the damage kids do to themselves when they do most of these drugs. Im an advocate for weed, but I still wouldn't want my kids doing it. Just cause it's legal doesn't mean it's OK. Drinking is legal, and I wouldn't want my kids to do it.

ps- where's my $25?