Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=GMScud;410946]Latest from JLC on Redskins Insider. Looks like this is gonna happen people. :doh:

[B]Posted at 9:10 PM ET, 01/22/2008[/B]

[B]Fassel and Rex Ryan[/B]

[FONT=Times New Roman,times,serif][SIZE=3]Continues to look like a pair of former Ravens could be perched here in a matter of time.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman,times,serif]I keep hearing that Fassel is in a great position to get this job, and when it all hits the fan that former Baltimore DC Rex Ryan would replace Gregg Williams if it goes down this way. That is the hot rumor at the Senior Bowl, and Rex knows Jim and Vinny Cerrato has ties to Rex. Makes sense. So you would be looking at major overhauls to the staff.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman,times,serif]Snyder and Cerrato are mulling this over tonight but I would not be surprised to see someone get an offer Wed. At this point I am told the Redskins have still said nothing to Williams and the rest of the coaches and all signs pointing to Fassel. Snyder could always go the other way, and, this organization is capable of anything, but there is lots of angst among the players and coaches - especially those down at the Senior Bowl in Mobile.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[/quote]

Doesn't Rex Ryan run the 3-4 defense. Talk about rebuilding changes that need to be done to the team as a whole if Fassel/Ryan are hired.

Snyder is a lame excuse for a symbolic figurehead of an organization. He said at the Gibbs presser that he wants stability and likes the roster as is. He pulls the trigger on this and all he is doing is lying to the very fan base that makes the Redskins as profitable as they are.

I just know when I wake up tomorrow that I'll see Fassel being introduced as head coach. Can you imagine how hositle that conference is going to be?

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

To hire Jim Fassel, and disrupt the continuity and rhythm built up with Gregg Williams would be a tremendous setback for the Redskins.

Dan Snyder has to realize that he is the steward of the Redskins, but the spirit of the team belongs to the fans. If he blows up the stability and train of progress that has been building with the team, and hires Jim Fassel, leaving not just Gregg Williams possibly out of a job, but many other coaches also crucial for continuity - it would be the height of foolishness.

The weight of criticism that Snyder will ultimately bring down on himself if he does this - he will be a very unhappy man I am confident.

I have to hope that this is a momentary loss of perspective for Snyder, and he will regain his focus and select Gregg Williams. Williams isn't certain of success, but to go in any other direction will take the Redskins off the rails in all likelihood.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

If Fassel becomes the new coach there needs to be a new thread started titled:

"What time are all members of Redskinswarpath.com meeting to collectively boo Jim Fassel's name when announced at the press conference?"


...pre-emptively, 3:30pm at the Redskins Park guard house is best for me.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Why in the world the Skins would hire this guy to be head coach is beyond me. He is yesterday's news. Of all the choices this would be maybe the worst of the bunch. Its another quick fix, stop-gap measure. He'll stick around a few years then be gone. This hiring would prove again that the skins are a disfunctional organization that will never be a consistent winner.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=Giantone;411049]Like it or not for a QB ...Fassel is the way to go.[/quote]
exactly what young qback has Fassel done anything with? Kerry Collins? Kyle Boller? give me a break. im not a big Greg Williams as head coach man. but in the best interests of the skins, i think that would be the best choice

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=dgack;411044]You know, those who question why there would be despair at the thought of Gggrilliamsss not getting the nod should think back to the time the "has the game passed Gibbs by" talk began among fans and sports journos.

Looking back now, what we have perspective on is that what Joe restored was a sense of stability, continuity, and perhaps most importantly, an atmosphere where the players believed that the team was headed in the right direction.

It also seemed that some of "The Gibbs" rubbed off on "The Danny" and what Fossil/Ryan represents is a scary regression there.

Passing by Gggrilliams sends a clear message that Snyder honors whatever his lawyers say he has to by the letter of his contracts, not necessary the spirit of his agreements, much less what's the "right" thing to do. It also sends a message that he knows better than the players and isn't really interested in what they think -- they'll play for who the hell he tells them to play for. I'm getting Lavernues Coles flashbacks here, people.

Considering the degree to which this team came together at the end of last year after a horrible tragedy, it just seems so callous to throw that all aside and basically break with everything there for what smacks of some kind of nepotism or Old Boy Network mentality.

If this happens, it seems pretty clear that Snyder really hasn't learned much from Joe, and maybe he wasn't really listening at all while Joe was here anyway.[/quote]I think you are jumping a pretty big gap in logic here. Just because Gibbs supports Williams and Williams coached under Gibbs [I]does not[/I] automatically make him more fit for the job.

The players endorse him, much because they have to. That doesn't mean Snyder should be cornered into hiring Gregg Williams if he doesn't feel he's fit to be coach of the Redskins.

The Redskins went through due process on this one. They interviewed a bunch of candidates. They gave second interviews. Snyder included Vinny and Gibbs in the process. The methodology of this decision had everything we as fans could ask for.

I already know the single best candidate for the job (Schwartz) is going to get passed up. The point is, if Danny feels that Fassel makes a better coach than Williams (and the evidence is conflicting), we really can't produce any conclusive evidence that the team is better or worse off. Why not just optimistically wait and see?

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Quick look at the great Fassel:
As HC of the Giants, 3 out of 7 seasons w/ winning records. 2-3 record in playoffs (2 WC losses and a beat down in the SB). Career at Utah even more impressive: 8-4 first season there but ended 25-33 (that's 17-29 in last four seasons there).

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

There's a difference between trading two mid round picks for TJ Duckett, or two mid round picks for Brandon Lloyd, and hiring Fassel over Gregg Williams.

The difference is there is no evidence to assume on that Williams would be the better choice, while you can look at Duckett's production, or Lloyd's production, and pretty much know right off the bat the Skins got jobbed.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

This is going to be very interesting over the next couple of days.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=dmek25;411081]exactly what young qback has Fassel done anything with? Kerry Collins? Kyle Boller? give me a break. im not a big Greg Williams as head coach man. but in the best interests of the skins, i think that would be the best choice[/quote]

In fairness to Fassel, Kyle Boller really is the exception and he has had success with QBs in his career. Kerry Collins had by far his best years in the three year stretch between 2000-2002, Fassel was also in Arizona when Jake Plummer was a hot commodity in the mid-1990s. He also gets credit for working with John Elway (kind of a softball there, no?) and Phil Simms. Of course, wasn't Norv Turner also good for QBs ... as an OC?

In some ways you can say that this search does represent something of a departure. Fassel is far from the 'sexy' pick and there is some case to be made that someone with his credentials does make a legitimate candidate. I am concerned, however, by at least two things. One is the fact that the search represents (it certainly seems at least) an even more heightened role for Vinny Cerrato (or at least a continuing prominence), which causes many of us here much concern. Gibbs provided us all with some security that a check existed against the Synder/Cerrato faction and with that gone it seems a lot like 2003 all over again. Also, if someone other than G. Williams was going to get the job I, like GTripp, would have preferred a younger assistant (specifically Schwartz) though that also would probably have caused similar angst amongst most fans.

The bottom line is that no one other than Synder trusts Cerrato so when we all see his level of influence so clearly, and without the Gibbs check, it looks like a return to old ways. More than anything I think that is what is driving our collective concern, even more than G. Williams apparently being shown the door. The one is merely a symptom of a larger problem. Obviously only time will tell as to whether the concern was justified.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Aahhhh! Redskinland, would not be Redskinland without, at least a modicum of turmoil, discontent, and panic over the...............not yet happened, or next percieved........possible tragedy..........

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

if he gets the job,i'll really be dissappointed !it will just screw everything gibbs did the last 4 years all to hell!

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

I almost threw up my Frosted Flakes this morning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... i thought this was mostly just BS........ If Snyder pulls the trigger on this????
What the F!@#$% is he thinking?????????

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=oldhog44;411098]I almost threw up my Frosted Flakes this morning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... i thought this was mostly just BS........ If Snyder pulls the trigger on this????
What the F!@#$% is he thinking?????????[/quote]

He's thinking he can get a yes man in place for a year until he can go after Cower next year...ie...he's not thinking

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Can anybody find a clip of Joe Gibbs saying that he supports GW as our new head coach or is everyone basing this off rumors?

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=SBXVII;410982]I have been dwelling on another thought also....what if Snyder was not happy about the offense last year and told Gibbs he would give Saunders one more year to get it scoring and it didn't. What if partial reasoning for Gibbs leaving is because Snyder said it's time for Saunders to be let go and try something else and Gibbs said I'm outa here. I'm sure his grandchild was more the reason but what if he was told he was going to have to let Saunders or Williams go because Snyder was not impressed with how they performed.

Everyone brings up how the Skins won the last 5 games and how they were starting to come together. I'm comfused but I thought that happened last year also didn't it? They won a few last games and everyone was happy that we would carry it over to this year and be a scoring power house. I'll admit we broke 21 points several times but I didn't see the scoring power house Saunders is associated with in KC. Maybe next year will be different. Maybe not. Maybe Snyder in his "impatiantness" is wanting more. I am by no means saying Fassell is the answer. Things may turn out fabulous next year and everyone will be saying "I didn't see that coming."

Perhaps Fassell is offering his services on the cheap because no one is calling on him and he asking Snyder for a favor. Who knows. Fassell never impressed me but maybe with the right OC and DC he will shine. I really don't have a problem with Rex. He had the defense running well (except for the Miami game). Maybe Snyder is thinking instead of building from the back to the front on defense, it's time to build from the front to back. Maybe Fassells phylosophy on Offense is not much different then Saunders and we keep AS for another year. Who know.

This is exactly why I try to have two favorite teams. I have always liked Tampa and have enjoyed the games we play with them (although when we lose I am down.lol) I started adopting NE a few years ago because I thought highly of the coach and thought he was a classy guy. Good team with a good QB. however since they totally humiliated us and did not have the decency to just let it be close, screw NE. I hoped and hoped they would make it to the SB only to be let down hard. Go Giants![/quote]
Sounds like you change around on teams quite often.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=SmootSmack;410376]I still think ultimately Williams will be the choice, and I know if he is he'd like to make Schwartz his top assistant. On the offensive side of the ball, not sure what they're aiming for. But I get a feeling we could see some [B]West Coast offense[/B][/quote]If we bring in a coach that wants to install a West Coast Offense, then we may as well trade Jason Campbell and bring in a QB experienced in that system. Even good QBs typically don't do well until their 3rd year in a WCO.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=SouperMeister;411115]If we bring in a coach that wants to install a West Coast Offense, then we may as well trade Jason Campbell and bring in a QB experienced in that system. Even good QBs typically don't do well until their 3rd year in a WCO.[/quote]

JC has played in a WC based offense before.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=Mattyk72;411118]JC has played in a WC based offense before.[/quote]What, for one season at Auburn? He was thrown into a new offensive system every year in college.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

At this point in his NFL career it shouldn't be as dramatic of a change for Campbell. He's already greatly improved his mechanics, decision making, and overall speed and timing of the NFL game. A coaching change is not going to be a disaster. It's part of the game.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[QUOTE=SouperMeister;411124]What, for one season at Auburn? He was thrown into a new offensive system every year in college.[/QUOTE]

Happened to be his best season. Biggest problem, in my opinion, about the WCO for Campbell is that it tends to negate his powerful arm

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=djnemo65;411023]What about what went down in Buffalo that same season? The Bills quit on GW too.

Which is why I think it is significant that the players are so solidly behind him this time around. Clearly he has refined his message.[/quote]

I think he has clearly learned from his mistakes in Buff. One thing that stands out to me is GW has the respect of the guys on offense. Very tough thing to do IMO. The guy coaches the defense and I've heard several guys on offense lobby for him.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=skinsfan69;411138]I think he has clearly learned from his mistakes in Buff. One thing that stands out to me is GW has the respect of the guys on offense. Very tough thing to do IMO. The guy coaches the defense and I've heard several guys on offense lobby for him.[/quote]
The reason that the O liked him is because they could score only two TDs and we would still win by 3 points.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=Mattyk72;411128]At this point in his NFL career it shouldn't be as dramatic of a change for Campbell. He's already greatly improved his mechanics, decision making, and overall speed and timing of the NFL game. A coaching change is not going to be a disaster. It's part of the game.[/quote]One note on that - look at some of the most successful QB's over the past decade, and they spent their formative years with the same offensive guru:

Tom Brady (Charlie Weis): 2000-2004
Brett Favre (Mike Holmgren): 1992-1998
Peyton Manning (Tom Moore): 1998-Present
Donovan McNabb (Andy Reid): 1999-Present

The Saunders system has worked everywhere else he has been, but we knew that there was a 2 year learning curve based on past results. I was really hoping Al Saunders would be able to work with Campbell for an extended period. Changing the OC every two years just kills offensive stability and chemistry. I guess that change for changes sake is embedded in The Danny's DNA, and he will never learn.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

I'm really not putting much stock into the whole "the players are lobbying for GW" thing anymore. Of course the players are going to be in favor of as little change as possible.

In my job if my office VP was leaving, of course I would want someone from within to be promoted vs. someone coming in from outside. You know the people you work with and that's what you are comfortable with. Nobody likes change.

In the end no matter what happens the players are going to suit up and go to work for the new coach. Will some of them be disappointed initially if GW doesn't get it? Of course. But will they suck it up and move on? Definitely.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=firstdown;411139]The reason that the O liked him is because they could score only two TDs and we would still win by 3 points.[/quote]

LOL! Yeah you might be right on that one. But so much of being a good/great HC is not so much X/O's. It's being able to get the guys to play hard for you, trust you, respect you, believe in what you're saying. I also think your HC has to be able to instill some fear in you as well. I'm sorry but Jim Fassel just doesn't do it for me. He's more of a Norv Turner type. But in the end, if we have good players we'll win and that's the bottom line. It always comes down to who has the best players.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Just to throw this out there for discussion, why do we just assume it's all Snyder's fault?

Just for arguments sake what if Gibbs isn't 100% behind GW?

What if Williams was just a bad interview... or what if he wants too much control and or too much $$?

In the end Snyder is the one that is going to have to work closely with a new coach. Snyder is also the one that is the most informed about the potential candidates. As fans we know very little of what has gone on behind the scenes.

I think it's only fair that he brings in a guy that he's comfortable working with and someone that he feels is best for the job. Personally I'm going to hold off on my ultimate judgement until we see what the new HC is able to accomplish on the field. All of these emotional knee-jerk reactions are pretty silly and useless.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Snyder is no dumb guy. He has to know what the delay is causing so there must be a VERY good reason why its not Williams job already.

And yes, as fans we don't know what that is.

I would want anyone before Fassel in my opinion he's a lame duck.

Just don't know why Vinny and Snyder wouldn't interview Al Saunders for the job as a courtesy if you're gonna go Fassel?? The Fassel interveiw makes it fact that the first choice was Cower, then Carol, then anyone but Williams or our staff.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

I couldn't be any more upset with Snyder than I am now. Fassel just got run out of two cities. WTF!!!!! The guy is definitely not the innovative mind we were looking for, and certainly not the disciplinarian. He's just FASSEL. The worst part is that this hire will run Williams out of town....who by the way, is the best coach on our staff. Everyone has a right to be angry, no matter which way you put it.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Don't like Fassell and can't get excited about the upcoming season. If the HC is GW then I can only think we will build on this year...just look at the giants run to the super bowl...get hot at the right time and you can punch your ticket. We are starting to do this but all will be for nothing when Fassel takes over.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

If Fassel had his first interview on 1/11 then maybe Fassell was my
cousin Vinnies first choice all along.

Fassell makes as much since as Harbaugh in Baltimore. I don't
understand the process and how these coaches are choosen.
Baltimore has first-hand experience with Fassell and he was never considered for the job. It boils down to personality and who can be controlled. I do not believe GW is a yes man and not as diplomatic as JG and there's the rub.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=Mattyk72;411151]Just to throw this out there for discussion, why do we just assume it's all Snyder's fault?

Just for arguments sake what if Gibbs isn't 100% behind GW?

What if Williams was just a bad interview... or what if he wants too much control and or too much $$?

In the end Snyder is the one that is going to have to work closely with a new coach. Snyder is also the one that is the most informed about the potential candidates. As fans we know very little of what has gone on behind the scenes.

I think it's only fair that he brings in a guy that he's comfortable working with and someone that he feels is best for the job. Personally I'm going to hold off on my ultimate judgement until we see what the new HC is able to accomplish on the field. All of these emotional knee-jerk reactions are pretty silly and useless.[/quote]


Great post but I think that thinking is valid! But...Snyder has not earned the right for this thinking!!!! we can only go on track record.

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

Fassel didn't get hired yet! Still could be Williams job, just no way of knowing anything. Also really sucks how our ENTIRE STAFF hasn't even been given a peep from Vinny or Dan, typical......

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=The Zimmermans;411162]I couldn't be any more upset with Snyder than I am now. Fassel just got run out of two cities. WTF!!!!! The guy is definitely not the innovative mind we were looking for, and certainly not the disciplinarian. He's just FASSEL. The worst part is that this hire will run Williams out of town....who by the way, is the best coach on our staff. Everyone has a right to be angry, no matter which way you put it.[/quote]
I'm mad as he!! and I'm not going to take this anymore!

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

What he said!

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

What bothers me is the secret talk... the mixed messages in the media, etc... I know more about the 27 presidential candidates (esp. candidates 13-27) then I do those being seriously considered for the Redskins HC job. We love football, we love our team, we'll do anything for them including hours upon hours on sites such as this to get the latest..... but it's not the freaking Commander in Chief!!! Throw a dog a bone every now and then - let the fanbase get excited and supportive of the organization. Instead - we are held out, nothing is released, etc. and it leads to this type of thread exactly. Hearsay, Guesses, Opinions and much to do about nothing.

GW could be the guy, part of me really wants this. Part of me releates this to a "We Are Marshall" type event. GW knows what these young men went through and continue to go through. How could having him HC not help these guys and the organization in the healing process. However, part of me is scared of GW due to his 'my way or the highway' attitude to matters and his performance with the Bills. Second chances are good, hopefully that holds true if he is hired.

Fassell, Shotts, Norv.... all these guys are the same to me. They're not a 'face' of a team and I think here in D.C. we have had that 'Face' HC (two times) and are a little uneasy as to how to act with simply a puppet as a HC, which I believe Fassell would be. Dan and Vinny holding the strings.

Cowher - something to get excited about, I just don't see it happening. Too many things point in another direction.

I honestly think GW deserves this job - he deserves the chance to see if his ''we don't have starters..." ideaology works from a team aspect as opposed to a defense only aspect........ Four interviews and nothing for over a week scares me though. God, I can only imagine what he must be thinking all day, every day.

In the end - it will work out. We will ALL support whomever the HC is, like it or not. If he starts out hot next year we'll love him. If he struggles we'll come here and bash him and his performance. Either way we're fans - it's not our call and we simply move on when the call is made.

I love this team - I love this franchise and I LOVE SINGING THAT WONDERFUL SONG AFTER POINTS SCORED!!!!

HAIL!!!

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/01/22/AR2008012203341.html]washingtonpost.com[/url]

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[quote=QBall;411177][url=http://washingtonpost.com]washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines[/url][/quote]

actually some sound points here by Wilbon:

But to the outside world it looks like Snyder, with all these meetings, is trying to find a reason to promote Williams . . . or a reason not to. And that's fine, because Snyder is the one who's going to be on the hook for, what, $12 million at the very least? He ought to make sure he's comfortable with the next coach.

What I really want to know is how this fancy new title changes Cerrato's life. If he's got the exact same duties and has input but no power to make football decisions, so what? If he's the Boss of All Things Football, a position I keep pushing Snyder to create, then this could be a significant step in the right direction. Cerrato has taken more criticism than anybody in the organization. [B]But I know this much: His advice as to what to do was wiser in several instances than the course of action the Redskins took. [/B]

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

This is depressing me. I was mad about Fassell being interviewed back in 2004. Say it aint so!

Re: Fassel meets with Redskins over coaching vacancies
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;411151]Just to throw this out there for discussion, why do we just assume it's all Snyder's fault?

Just for arguments sake what if Gibbs isn't 100% behind GW?

What if Williams was just a bad interview... or what if he wants too much control and or too much $$?

In the end Snyder is the one that is going to have to work closely with a new coach. Snyder is also the one that is the most informed about the potential candidates. As fans we know very little of what has gone on behind the scenes.

I think it's only fair that he brings in a guy that he's comfortable working with and someone that he feels is best for the job. Personally I'm going to hold off on my ultimate judgement until we see what the new HC is able to accomplish on the field. All of these emotional knee-jerk reactions are pretty silly and useless.[/QUOTE]


To add to that, while Fassel wouldn't be my first choice (don't know if Williams would either), to just declare a Redskins apocalypse because of him is simply idiotic. We don't know what other coaches will be hired, what free agents signed, trades made, draft picks selected. There is so much more to be done between now and opening day, beyond just picking a head coach.