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[url=http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82007352/article/skins-coaches-say-their-views-not-reflected-in-nflca-brief]NFL.com news: 'Skins coaches say their views not reflected in NFLCA brief[/url]

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[quote=SmootSmack;804679][url=http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82007352/article/skins-coaches-say-their-views-not-reflected-in-nflca-brief]NFL.com news: 'Skins coaches say their views not reflected in NFLCA brief[/url][/quote]

...all the coaches or just Mike? My guess Mike's salary is guaranteed regardless of lockout or not.

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[quote=NC_Skins;804686]...all the coaches or just Mike? My guess Mike's salary is guaranteed regardless of lockout or not.[/quote]

All the coaches but Mike

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The coaches are making a sound business decision...aligning themselves with the man who signs the checks. Distancing themselves from the NFLCA filing while at the same time being vague enough to not alienate the players.

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[quote=Son Of Man;804688]The coaches are making a sound business decision...aligning themselves with the man who signs the checks. Distancing themselves from the NFLCA filing while at the same time being vague enough to not alienate the players.[/quote]

How many of those guys are actually getting paid during the lockout? If I were a position coach not getting paid, I'd side with the NFLCA.

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[quote=Son Of Man;804688]The coaches are making [B]a sound business decision[/B]...aligning themselves with the man who signs the checks. Distancing themselves from the NFLCA filing while at the same time being vague enough to not alienate the players.[/quote]

I don't get how "not getting paid" is a sound business decision. Not to mention that coaches are measured on the performance of the players, which is being hindered by this lockout. Like I said, I'm curious how trigger happy will owners be about firing coaches, given that this lockout is a huge negative for team performance next season (if there is one).

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[quote=NC_Skins;804689]How many of those guys are actually getting paid during the lockout? If I were a position coach not getting paid, I'd side with the NFLCA.[/quote]

My guess is that DS is paying them tho'. I haven't heard anything that says the Skins have furloughed or reduced any pay. I think if we actually miss games then maybe, but like the Skins coaches said, people need to work it out and get back to football.

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;804628]NC_Skins, without getting into it too far, since 2 big guys here are sick of it :cheeky-sm

if the owners hadn't opted out, we would be at this same place just 2 years later. Opting out was legal and in the spirit of the CBA. Leaving bargaining 6 hours early to disclaim interest and avoid the constructs written into the CBA in case it expires. I see a difference if you don't nothing I say will change it.

One other point, and I think this is fair, but also certainly speculative. Shortly after the owners opted out, Gene Upshaw died, and the whole system got thrown into a bit of a chaotic state for a while, and by the time it resolved both sides were set in their strategies. Had he not been taken away as he was, even if he retired, perhaps the transitions and plans may have been more steadied. The owners couldn't un-opt out to give more time to DSmith et al to get some ground under their feet and get a feel for NFL labor relations.

Oh well, we are where we are, and all sides are pretty unyielding (IMO)[/quote]

You and Mr. Brees seem to agree about Upshaw

[url=http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/jim_trotter/05/26/lockout/index.html]Saints QB Drew Brees explains players side in NFL labor issue - Jim Trotter - SI.com[/url]

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;804698]You and Mr. Brees seem to agree about Upshaw

[url=http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/jim_trotter/05/26/lockout/index.html]Saints QB Drew Brees explains players side in NFL labor issue - Jim Trotter - SI.com[/url][/QUOTE]
I think we agree his death impacted these negotiations, I don't think I believe his take on it.
Also surprised me how negative the comments were towards him and his sentiment.

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Well, many say none of this would have happened if Upshaw didn't know that Tags was going to retire during the last negotiation. They say Upshaw knew that Tags was planning to announce his retirement and he (Tagliabue) didn't want his legacy to be his tenure ended with a lockout/strike so Upshaw got Tags and the owners to agree to things they normally wouldn't have otherwise.

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[url=http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/27102/lockout-will-hurt-the-redskins]Lockout will hurt the Redskins - NFC East Blog - ESPN[/url]

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Damn Republicans!!!!

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[quote=jtrob_1;804866]Damn Republicans!!!![/quote]

Um...what?

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[quote=jtrob_1;804866]Damn Republicans!!!![/quote]

I don't follow my man.

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[quote=jtrob_1;804866]Damn Republicans!!!![/quote]

[quote=Ruhskins;804869]Um...what?[/quote]


He is inferring that Republicans favor big business, ergo, would support the NFL's wishes of the stay of the lockout.

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[quote=SkinzWin;804871]He is inferring that Republicans favor big business, ergo, would support the NFL's wishes of the stay of the lockout.[/quote]

^^ This.

Re: 8th Circuit Court Grants Stay, Lockout Continues
 

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/news/story?id=6599574]NFL, Dallas Cowboys want Super Bowl seat suit tossed - ESPN Dallas[/url]


NFL again showing how stupid and arrogant they are, not to mention they don't give two shits about the fans. First they raise prices on jerseys during a lock out, now this. Here you go goes, take this shit sandwich and enjoy it. I"m going to keep feeding it to you because I know you'll keep eating it.



[quote]According to the motion, the NFL and the Cowboys didn't know until just before the game that the temporary seats would be inadequate and worked into the afternoon that day to deal with the issue.[/quote]

LOL. Do they think people are really that stupid? We've seen the emails from the city inspectors telling them they were unsafe. What bunch of bafoons.

Re: 8th Circuit Court Grants Stay, Lockout Continues
 

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=wojciechowski_gene&page=wojciechowski/110527&sportCat=nfl]Miami Dolphins owner Stephen Ross made comments about the NFL lockout this week that don't stand up to real-world scrutiny. - ESPN[/url]


Holy crap some of these owners are idiotic. I suppose the public will believe anything considering how the rest of our nation is heading.


[quote]Someone needs to remind Ross that this is an owner-orchestrated-and-imposed lockout. NFL players didn't wake up one day and decide not to go to work. The owners decided it for them.

And enough already with, "It's about having a system that works." No, it's about having a system that works for the owners. At the very least, Ross could have been honest about that.

Just because Ross says the owners aren't greedy doesn't mean it's true. It just means that Ross thinks it's true. Have him Google "personal seat licenses" & "taxpayers and new stadiums" & "NFL preseason ticket prices" & "Colts leave Baltimore for Indianapolis," then get back to me.

My favorite is the bit about the players looking to see how much they can really get. Was Ross not in owners school the day the teacher told them the players were happy with the previous collective bargaining agreement? That it was the owners who opted out of the CBA, not the players?

[/quote]


Wojciechowski is bringing the pain in this article.


[quote]Yes, NFL players make a lot of money. But they'll never make as much as NFL owners. And a player's career can end in a nanosecond. So tell me again how many concussion syndrome tests an owner goes through? Or how often he has to slide slowly, step by step down a staircase, as running back Jerome Bettis did the morning after games because his knees and legs were too battered to walk?

[/quote]

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Ross is quickly climbing the ranks of the worst owners in the league.

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What would be best is for folks like Ross and Brees to STFU. Get the negotiating teams from both sides out of the courtroom and to the negotiating table and work this out.

Re: 8th Circuit Court Grants Stay, Lockout Continues
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;804890]What would be best is for folks like Ross and Brees to STFU. Get the negotiating teams from both sides out of the courtroom and over the negotiating table and work this out.[/quote]

Maybe one of my favorite vintage war related images ever....
And yet, it is essentially universal in its usage.

[IMG]http://images1.cpcache.com/product/282333201v6_480x480_Front.jpg[/IMG]

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[quote=SkinzWin;804871]He is inferring that Republicans favor big business, ergo, would support the NFL's wishes of the stay of the lockout.[/quote]

Devil's advocate: Seeing as though democrats favor the rights of unions and collective bargaining, wouldn't they be against the players decertifying and basically walking away from the negotiating table: essentially minimizing the usefullness of CBA's? It could be argued that democrats would rule against the players as well in order to protect the collective bargaining rights for unions (those who actually need it like teachers, tradesman, coal miners, etc.)

Re: 8th Circuit Court Grants Stay, Lockout Continues
 

[quote=Son Of Man;804944]Devil's advocate: Seeing as though democrats favor the rights of unions and collective bargaining, wouldn't they be against the players decertifying and basically walking away from the negotiating table: essentially minimizing the usefullness of CBA's? It could be argued that democrats would rule against the players as well in order to protect the collective bargaining rights for unions (those who actually need it like teachers, tradesman, coal miners, etc.)[/quote]

I don't think most would consider an NFL union in the same light as a union in a "real workforce industry". Something the country must have in order to survive. NFL is entertainment. To Democrats it is not a serious union. To Republicans it is a large part of the big corporate machine that pads many peoples' pockets and in the eyes of many, drives this country's economy. That is all strictly IMO.

Re: 8th Circuit Court Grants Stay, Lockout Continues
 

[quote=Son Of Man;804944]Devil's advocate: Seeing as though democrats favor the rights of unions and collective bargaining, wouldn't they be against the players decertifying and basically walking away from the negotiating table: essentially minimizing the usefullness of CBA's? It could be argued that democrats would rule against the players as well in order to protect the collective bargaining rights for unions (those who actually need it like teachers, tradesman, coal miners, etc.)[/quote]

No,this has nothing to do with Dem or Rep....this has to do with owners and greed.

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[quote=Giantone;805115]No,this has nothing to do with Dem or Rep....this has to do with owners and greed.[/quote]
The salary cap has risen in 15 years from 34M to 123M. I guess, I see both sides as having greed as a part of the factor.

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[quote=Giantone;805115]No,this has nothing to do with Dem or Rep....this has to do with owners and greed.[/quote]

I agree with this statement. Though I would revise to "owners, players and greed".

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;805117]The salary cap has risen in 15 years from 34M to 123M. I guess, I see both sides as having greed as a part of the factor.[/quote]

The salary cap is based off the revenue taken in.(minus the 1 billion off top for owner expenses) It's not like the salary cap is set in place prior.

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[quote=NC_Skins;805130]The salary cap is based off the revenue taken in.(minus the 1 billion off top for owner expenses) It's not like the salary cap is set in place prior.[/quote]
To be fair the percentage of the revenue has grown with each CBA extension as well. In other words, the 1994 salary cap computation wasn't 1b off the top, then 60/40 (approx). The deals have gotten more and more favorable to the players as time went by.

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;805131]To be fair the percentage of the revenue has grown with each CBA extension as well. In other words, the 1994 salary cap computation wasn't 1b off the top, then 60/40 (approx). The deals have gotten more and more favorable to the players as time went by.[/quote]

Right now, they are looking at 53% of the total revenue.(actually it went down for the players since 1994) I think 53% to the players is fair. Also, we have to remember that these contracts aren't guaranteed.

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[quote=NC_Skins;805134]Right now, they are looking at 53% of the total revenue.(actually it went down for the players since 1994) I think 53% to the players is fair. Also, we have to remember that these contracts aren't guaranteed.[/quote]
You are right, that it has gone down.

question, do you think the players would lower their percentage in order to gain guaranteed contracts?

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;805140]You are right, that it has gone down.

[B]question, do you think the players would lower their percentage in order to gain guaranteed contracts?[/B][/quote]

You think the owners would be okay with guaranteed contracts? I just don't see it from their part.

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I have a question that I dont think has been answered in this thread.

My question is concerning the lockout and how it relates to players who are supposed to have this year being their last contract year.

If the lockout lasts the entire season, does the player become a "free agent", or does the last year of the contract go to next year since there is no NFL year.

in example, Mark Brunell for the Jets. This is his last year under contract. Does he get one more year in NY if there is no season this year? Or will he expire even though there is no season.

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[quote=Ruhskins;805145]You think the owners would be okay with guaranteed contracts? I just don't see it from their part.[/quote]

I don't know, I would expect not but if it got the numbers closer to where they want it? I just wondered what NC_Skins thought about that type tradeoff.

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[quote=SolidSnake84;805157]I have a question that I dont think has been answered in this thread.

My question is concerning the lockout and how it relates to players who are supposed to have this year being their last contract year.

If the lockout lasts the entire season, does the player become a "free agent", or does the last year of the contract go to next year since there is no NFL year.

in example, Mark Brunell for the Jets. This is his last year under contract. Does he get one more year in NY if there is no season this year? Or will he expire even though there is no season.[/quote]

I would expect that since no league year ever occurred, and no games took place everyone's contract picks up where it left off last year.

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;805161]I would expect that since no league year ever occurred, and no games took place everyone's contract picks up where it left off last year.[/quote]

I would think it all depends on how each individuals contract reads. Basic contract, yes it would probably pick up where it left off since there is probably a claus that says he has to work for a specific number of yrs. Say he had a 3 yr contract and he just finished his 2nd yr then he still is under contract for 1 more year.

But I can see where some smart sob lawyer might have put a claus in their clients contract that whether he plays or not he becomes a free agent, which might mean some players will be FA's next year whether there is a season or not.

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[quote=NC_Skins;805134]Right now, [B]they are looking at 53% of the total revenue.[/B](actually it went down for the players since 1994) I think 53% to the players is fair. Also, we have to remember that these contracts [B]aren't guaranteed[/B].[/quote]

Two things:

1st part: I think your right depending on how you look at it. 53% of the total 9 bill, or.... 60% of the 8 bill. I could be wrong so don't ring my neck but it's funny how both sides keep coming up with two different figures in regards to what the players were getting. The players are playing off the fact they only get closer to [B]50% of total revenue[/B], and the owners seem stuck on the[B] 60% of split[/B].

2nd part: The contracts are not guaranteed but the agents have been able to get money guaranteed for their clients. As in Haynesworths situation he was the 100 mill dollar man but I think only 40 mill was guaranteed. The team could have cut him but they would still owe him the rest to make the 40 mill. Some players have used this system to benifit themselves. Jason Taylor comes to mind. Currently we still owe Cartwright, ARE, T.Collins, Betts, and a ton of others.

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What the eff?

[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-silver_panthers_moronic_for_locking_out_media_during_workout_060111]Punk move by Panthers players to lock out media - NFL - Yahoo! Sports[/url]

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[quote=SmootSmack;805166]What the eff?

[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-silver_panthers_moronic_for_locking_out_media_during_workout_060111]Punk move by Panthers players to lock out media - NFL - Yahoo! Sports[/url][/quote]

Man, that reporters is pissed.
I wonder if the Panther players just wanted some privacy just in case they wantet to talk about CBA related items while they were all together for practice? Just a thought.

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Could be any number of reasons why the Panthers didn't want reporters there, but in a situation like this, any transparency the players can give to the fans is better than being secretive. Sort of.

Who knows, maybe they didn't want to show footage of Cam Newton throwing up dugs and trying to figure out what the offense meant. It's probably more innocent than a slap in the face, but I can understand why a reporter (who's job is pretty effectively being screwed up by the lockout) would get mad that all of the sudden, [i]he[/i] can't do his job because of something he's not involved in.

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[quote=Defensewins;805168]Man, that reporters is pissed.
I wonder if the Panther players just wanted some privacy just in case they wantet to talk about CBA related items while they were all together for practice? Just a thought.[/quote]

They can just tell the media practice is closed to reporters today, or during these hours it's closed, or you can watch practice on the field but can't enter the facilities today. There are many ways to deal with it. I don't know that having a cop keeping reporters away was really all that necessary