Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CapitalDefense;896410]Why can't this be discussed on the main board? It is relevant to football talk because our FA season for the next 2 seasons just went out the window.[/quote]

Huh? It's in the salary cap forum and is currently the top thread on the main page. Not sure what you're seeing.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

“@ZacBoyer: ESPN's Adam Schefter just said on SportsCenter the #Redskins found out about the salary cap ramifications this afternoon.”

Unbelievable.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=GMScud;896397]Wow, I can't believe this thread has nearly 200 posts already.

I'm sure it's been said, but I'm really miffed that there wasn't any specific rule that was broken. We lose $36M because we violated an [I][B]"understanding?"[/B][/I] Don't all deals have to be approved by the league? So the league approves these deals then drops a bomb on us for it?[/quote]

THIS is the most ass-chapping part. After some explanation by everyone else in this post, I now see where they came up with the numbers, but like Gmanc said, how did they know what we would have done had we NOT used the uncapped year?!

WTF?!?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

The timing of this HAD to be have been intentional too.

It just wasn't a giant coincidence. I never was a giant fan of Goodell, but he is officially on the shit list for me now.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;896415]The timing of this HAD to be have been intentional too.

It just wasn't a giant coincidence. I never was a giant fan of Goodell, but he is officially on the shit list for me now.[/quote]
Best part about it is that the Giants owner is the head of the council. Wonder what his impact was in all of this?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;896403]My personal preference is to cut some high cost players, restructure some contracts, sign a lot of younger (cheap) players and just take the full hit this year and get it over with.

We got RGIII, and I will NOT let this kill my buzz. Hail.......[/quote]

From the looks of it the only real candidate for a restructure in terms of getting a big chunk of cap space back in Silverback with his $12 million figure. D-Hall seems like a great candidate to release but seeing as how the penalty is related to front loading his contract I don't know how that would play out.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

The Redskins are still in an advantageous cap position in spite of this decision by the NFL, which is something the Cowboys are not. What this decision does do is make contention in 2012 behind the strength of a 90th percentile FA class unrealistic. Time to re-assess and look to catch some declining NFC East teams in 2013.

Which was arguably the better plan to begin with.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=GTripp0012;896421]The Redskins are still in an advantageous cap position in spite of this decision by the NFL, which is something the Cowboys are not. [I][B]What this decision does do is make contention in 2012 behind the strength of a 90th percentile FA class unrealistic. Time to re-assess and look to catch some declining NFC East teams in 2013.[/B][/I]

Which was arguably the better plan to begin with.[/quote]

En ingles por favor.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=12thMan;896407]My uninformed legal gut tells me the Redskins may be able to tie this up in an appeals court -- at least until after season. I would expect paperwork to filed with the quickness.[/quote]They're not being accused of violating US federal or state law though, so a lawsuit against the National Football League by the Washington Redskins is highly dubious.

If they violated any rule, it was a rule in the old CBA.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;896413]THIS is the most ass-chapping part. After some explanation by everyone else in this post, I now see where they came up with the numbers, but like Gmanc said, how did they know what we would have done had we NOT used the uncapped year?!

WTF?!?[/quote]

Exactly. Not to mention we got for the full $36M for the Hall/Haynesworth restructures, but the Cowboys pay Miles freaking Austin a base salary of $17M and they only get hit with $10M? This whole thing stinks to high heaven.

Snyder is lawyered up. Time to sick the dogs. I'm livid.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

How are the Bears unaffected? They gave Peppers an unreal amount of money in the uncapped year.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Another thing pissing me off is that not only are the Redskins and Cowboys punished, but other teams are REWARDED.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

If d Hall is cut how much cap will we get back?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=GTripp0012;896421]The Redskins are still in an advantageous cap position in spite of this decision by the NFL, which is something the Cowboys are not. What this decision does do is make contention in 2012 behind the strength of a 90th percentile FA class unrealistic. Time to re-assess and look to catch some declining NFC East teams in 2013.

Which was arguably the better plan to begin with.[/quote]

I heard on the radio today that if we split the $36M hit 50-50 with this year and next, we'll still have more cap room than all the other teams in the division, however they all already have more talented rosters.

Good news is we currently only have $83M on the book next year.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;896422]En ingles por favor.[/quote]The Redskins' quickest way to contend was sign a bunch of really good free agents, and get lucky enough that it all comes together in year one and they can contend on the backs of other team's castoffs. But now, the financial situation -- while still adventageous -- forces the Redskins to pick and choose their battles.

Curtis Lofton? Sure, but no London Fletcher. Vincent Jackson? Sure, but maybe Cooley is asked to restructure. Cortland Finnegan? Gotta get rid of Hall. And the backup QB is probably coming out of the bargain bin now.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

ouch. we badly need to make good use of our remaing picks in the draft.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=GMScud;896429]I heard on the radio today that if we split the $36M hit 50-50 with this year and next, we'll still have more cap room than all the other teams in the division, however they all already have more talented rosters.

Good news is we currently only have $83M on the book next year.[/quote]Right. We're not in bad cap position at all. We're just in the bottom five team in the league in talent that's returning from last year (not counting our UFAs like Landry.

If you take the AV (approximate value) ratings of everyones roster going back to 2009, and just add it up to create a "veteran talent power rankings" the NFL looks like this at the moment:
[INDENT]Green Bay - 582
Philadelphia - 530
Pittsburgh - 522
Atlanta - 509
Houston - 490
New England - 488
New Orleans - 477
NY Jets - 466
Dallas - 466
Baltimore - 449
San Francisco - 447
Chicago - 434
San Diego - 432
Detroit - 420
NY Giants - 414
Jacksonville - 413
Miami - 412
Carolina - 408
Arizona - 407
Tennessee - 381
Buffalo - 380
Minnesota - 371
Kansas City - 370
Oakland - 361
Denver - 343
Cincinnati - 326
Tampa Bay - 316
Washington - 315
Cleveland - 315
Seattle - 289
St. Louis - 287
Indianapolis - 199[/INDENT]
That's current as of Sellers' release. So yeah, there's a gap in the NFC between the haves the four have nots.

I'll repost this list after everyone's cuts come in. It will change significantly.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

I still don't know what rule they supposedly broke.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=GMScud;896429]I heard on the radio today that if we split the $36M hit 50-50 with this year and next, we'll still have more cap room than all the other teams in the division, however they all already have more talented rosters.

Good news is we currently only have $83M on the book next year.[/quote]

So are we subtracting $18 million from $47 million to get $29 million in cap space before cuts and restructures?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;896427]Another thing pissing me off is that not only are the Redskins and Cowboys punished, but other teams are REWARDED.[/quote]
It's truly mind blowing isn't it? I've never seen something like this.

When the New Jersey Devils were punished for front loading Ilya Kovalchuks contract, they were punished 1 first round pick. That first round pick could be from either the 2010,11,12,13 draft.

Redskins get 36 million dollars which essentially takes them out of free agency for two seasons, and the rest of the leagues pockets free money? Unreal.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;896422]En ingles por favor.[/quote]

Hahahaha I was thinking the same thing

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Ok, so how is it the NFL fails to mention this from Sept. to March? and waits until the eve of Free Agency to announce that they are going to take away mill. of $$$?

Spirit or not if it's not in the rules that says they can't do it then the Skins did nothing wrong. If I'm DS I'm filing an appeal. Hope that the appeal would keep the NFL from doing anything until after we've picked up our players and have had a chance to have a lawyer prove they did nothing wrong.

How they going to all of a sudden come up with some BS about how it violated the spirit of the rules. Heck the Skins did that for years when they back loaded contracts and there was no penalty for that.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Mayor;896436]I still don't know what rule they supposedly broke.[/quote]

exactly. a verbal agreement between the league and other owners in an uncapped year. its amazing what Vladamir Goodell has gotten away with...cant believe this bullshit 24 hours before free agency

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=mbedner3420;896442]Hahahaha I was thinking the same thing[/quote]

Lol, yeah Tripp is probably the smartest guy here, it's just sometime he enjoys speaking in calculus while the rest of us are left dazed and confused.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=GTripp0012;896431]The Redskins' quickest way to contend was sign a bunch of really good free agents, and get lucky enough that it all comes together in year one and they can contend on the backs of other team's castoffs. But now, the financial situation -- while still adventageous -- forces the Redskins to pick and choose their battles.

Curtis Lofton? Sure, but no London Fletcher. Vincent Jackson? Sure, but maybe Cooley is asked to restructure. Cortland Finnegan? Gotta get rid of Hall. And the backup QB is probably coming out of the bargain bin now.[/quote]

"F" that. Draft another QB in the 3rd and have two Rookies to develope. Atleast they would be young and healthy.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=SBXVII;896443]Ok, so how is it the NFL fails to mention this from Sept. to March? and waits until the eve of Free Agency to announce that they are going to take away mill. of $$$?

Spirit or not if it's not in the rules that says they can't do it then the Skins did nothing wrong. If I'm DS I'm filing an appeal. Hope that the appeal would keep the NFL from doing anything until after we've picked up our players and have had a chance to have a lawyer prove they did nothing wrong.

How they going to all of a sudden come up with some BS about how it violated the spirit of the rules. Heck the Skins did that for years when they back loaded contracts and there was no penalty for that.[/quote]

If there was EVER a time for Snyder to let the lawyers run wild this is it.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Like somebody said, if Dan Snyder can go all out to sue some small city newspaper over a bogus cause, than he should be going balls deep into the NFL with litigation over this since those contracts were approved by the very council that is handing down this punishment.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[IMG]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_vKyfBzh4-Gk/TUeH-iXuT_I/AAAAAAAAAr8/KhUpaUk5Zvc/s320/pissed_sm.jpg[/IMG]

Admittedly, I had to look up collusion. This is the 100% definition. JoeRedskin will be able to tell us for sure. It's the combination of reward to other teams, disregard for what the numbers MIGHT have been and the timing of this.

I just can't imagine this was a perfect storm. SUCH BULLSHIT.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=GTripp0012;896424]They're not being accused of violating US federal or state law though, so a lawsuit against the National Football League by the Washington Redskins is highly dubious.

If they violated any rule, it was a rule in the old CBA.[/quote]

That is true. A lawsuit would be unlikely anyway, given that the owners are their own "old boys club," however dysfunctional.

Owners don't sue the NFL unless their name is Al Davis.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=NC_Skins;896449]Like somebody said, if Dan Snyder can go all out to sue some small city newspaper over a bogus cause, than he should be going balls deep into the NFL with litigation over this since those contracts were approved by the very council that is handing down this punishment.[/quote]

The lawsuits against the fans and the tiny paper were training......training to strip the lawyers of their last glimpse of humanity all leading up to this day where the NFL decided to stop playing fair and start playing dirty.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

In class right now but just had to add my semi-confused, fully infuriated "WTF?!?". Can't really add much that hasn't already been said, but every part of this just pisses me off. Anyways... back to the lecture.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=bertoskins2;896432]ouch. we badly need to make good use of our remaing picks in the draft.[/quote]

Whereas before we could have pissed them away willy nilly?

I would like to see the team push $26 mil into 2013 and sue the NFL, the other owners, the mgmt council and the NFLPA for collusion. This whole thing reeks of BS.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=IrMitchell;896426]How are the Bears unaffected? They gave Peppers an unreal amount of money in the uncapped year.[/quote]

This is what I don't get? The Skins were not the only team that tried to benifit from the lack of a CBA. and how can the NFL enforce something that was not in place?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=SBXVII;896458]This is what I don't get? The Skins were not the only team that tried to benifit from the lack of a CBA. and how can the NFL enforce something that was not in place?[/quote]

I guess the Giants owner didn't see it benefiting them much since they don't play in the NFC East?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

So basically if this thing comes to pass without any change, can the owners just get together when a team wins the Super Bowl multiple times in a row and just say "in the spirit of parity, we're cutting your cap substantially!"?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=SBXVII;896458]This is what I don't get? The Skins were not the only team that tried to benifit from the lack of a CBA. and how can the NFL enforce something that was not in place?[/quote]

This is the Bears plan as I alluded to earlier in the day. Last time we tried to acquire a weapon in the passing game the Bears outbid us. This time they knew they wouldn't be able to outbid us again for VJax so they did the next best thing.

Anyway new plan. Draft Vontaze Burfict, put him on Redskins One and have him pay a visit to every owner except ironically.....Dallas.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;896451][IMG]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_vKyfBzh4-Gk/TUeH-iXuT_I/AAAAAAAAAr8/KhUpaUk5Zvc/s320/pissed_sm.jpg[/IMG]

Admittedly, I had to look up collusion. This is the 100% definition. JoeRedskin will be able to tell us for sure. It's the combination of reward to other teams, disregard for what the numbers MIGHT have been and the timing of this.

I just can't imagine this was a perfect storm. SUCH BULLSHIT.[/quote]

Soo, your saying when the NFL read the contracts and approved them they didn't feel the need to deny the contracts and inform the Skins that it was collusion at the time? Instead they approved the contracts. Then instead of informing the Skins anywhere form Sept to now they wait until March 12th, the eve of Free Agency to say "oh by the way we are taking away some of your money because we made a mistake and allowed contracts to go through that were collusion? WTF?

This screams of someone being pissed that the Skins made a trade for RGIII and still have a ton of money to get a specific player that they would like to see go elsewhere. If nothing else "IF" the NFL chooses to punish the Skins then they should make it apart of NEXT yrs salary CAP and the year after not all of a sudden out of the blue right before we are planning to spend money that the NFL originally said we had.

According to Redskins Nation on CSN this stinks but really doesn't derail us
You know who it does suck for big time? OJ and Sellers

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Yessir. Basically we're bent over a barrel at the most inopportune time for FA. We most likely had a plan in place and now we're scrambling due to this bullshit.

I need to calm down, I just haven't been this pissed with something Skins-related in a while.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

This is completely unacceptable.

Reading some of the comments in the section of the PFT article. There was a guy who made the case that this is the best evidence brought forward so far where the league is in collusion.

The owners had a wink wink deal in place to not forgo some money in the uncapped year, but these two owners did it anyway because there was no document binding them not too. If this gets to a legal case, there can be a very good case made by our team to get these fines reduced or dropped.

What is really getting in my crawl is that the other 28 teams in the NFL get to spend our money? WTF is that. We are going to reward everyone else for what the Skins and Boys did wrong.

This is ridiculous and has just ruined our chances of competing any time soon.