Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=mooby;652081]I feel like I'm completely in the same boat. Usually when we get our new head coach it's like, oh boy this time it should work, I can't see anything I don't like so far.

But this time it's just like, I don't know what to expect, I've been too excited before, and this latest season convinced me we have much deeper problems than just a couple injuries or missing players. Like, our franchise will never be successful unless something drastically changes, not just the coach/Vinny getting fired.

I mean I could list all the feelings I've felt throughout the years whenever we started over with a new coach. It's like:

Zorn - [B]Well Gibbs left the roster in pretty good shape[/B] and if Snyder and Cerrato really think this guy is not just good enough to be a OC but a head coach as well then the odds are pretty decent that this works out. Besides I've grown to like the idea of hiring unproven talent and finding that next gem in the coaching ranks.

Gibbs - Well if anybody can fix what Spurrier did it will be Gibbs. How can you question this? Man won 3 SB's for us and we were hella good back in his day. Even at his worst he'll upgrade the team seriously from Spurrier's days

Spurrier - well he was a great college coach and I like the idea of the fun'n'gun, a great aerial attack is something I'd love to see. Good idea by Snyder and co.

Shotty - Well he's proven so that's a good thing. Also I don't know much about football seeing as how I was 13ish at the time and was still feeling my way around it.

Turner - too young to really understand. At that age I was like, oh we try and score, and the defense tries to stop the other team from scoring. Shouldn't be too hard. All the head coach has to do is make sure everything's copacetic (sp?).

So long story short I'm not even cautiously optimistic. I'm still in wait and see mode, aka talk is cheap these days and the actions of this franchise will prove over time if a serious change has been made from the days of old.[/quote]

Our offensive line was on a downward slope when Joe Gibbs was here and he has to take some of the blame for our line being where it is now. Who built the Hogs anyway????

Let's wait and see who Shannahan builds his staff with before we jump on him. If rumors of Jerry Gray as our DC turn out to be true, then I might be the first one to question Shanny.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

Well, I haven't really seen this mentioned, and I may be reading too much into the few interviews I've seen, but here is my tempered expectation.
The 3 main guys right now are, BA MS and Kyle. All have sounded upbeat and positive, but one theme seems to be buried deep in their statements: They expect to argue thru their disagreements: Shanny said repeatedly, he expects Allen to challenge him. In the Texans interview piece Kyle spoke enthusiastically about working with his dad, but mentioned in several ways that he and his dad have gotten into it over things and his dad usually wins. BA seems like a key to this not getting out of control, he will have to negotiate the churning waters and make sure that feelings/emotions don't take over.

I certainly expect everyone to work together professionally and capably, but Redskins stress has been known to crack the hardest of shells.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;652239]Well, I haven't really seen this mentioned, and I may be reading too much into the few interviews I've seen, but here is my tempered expectation.
The 3 main guys right now are, BA MS and Kyle. All have sounded upbeat and positive, but one theme seems to be buried deep in their statements: They expect to argue thru their disagreements: Shanny said repeatedly, he expects Allen to challenge him. In the Texans interview piece Kyle spoke enthusiastically about working with his dad, but mentioned in several ways that he and his dad have gotten into it over things and his dad usually wins. BA seems like a key to this not getting out of control, he will have to negotiate the churning waters and make sure that feelings/emotions don't take over.

I certainly expect everyone to work together professionally and capably, but Redskins stress has been known to crack the hardest of shells.[/quote]

Good observations. I think over the next few years we are going to see how much BA has diplomatic skills...or not.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

good analysis CRR. I agree BA is the key to everything. He definitely has all the "diplomatic" skills. Since personnel issues are a weakness for both him and Shanahan, I would not mind at all if BA ends up being promoted to Team President and another GM is brought in. BA certainly seems to have all the intangibles of someone you want [B][U]LEADING[/U][/B] the organization.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

We've had some soft coaches in the past several years.. I think that Shanahan at least brings back some sort of "earn your spot" type of leadership and gets us more tight-knit. That can only help us work together as a team better.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=Mattyk;651862]Oh yeah... pie and pudding. It's what we're good for here.

I like old school butterscotch pudding, hell even some good ol' rice is good too.[/quote]

I was just about to suggest butterscotch or rice but didn't want to continue the hijack. You sir, have fine taste in pudding.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=WaldSkins;652087]Our offensive line was on a downward slope when Joe Gibbs was here and he has to take some of the blame for our line being where it is now. Who built the Hogs anyway????

Let's wait and see who Shannahan builds his staff with before we jump on him. If rumors of Jerry Gray as our DC turn out to be true, then I might be the first one to question Shanny.[/quote]

I said pretty good shape, not "we have no holes whatsoever". And back in '07 our line wasn't that bad, sure downward slope maybe but Zorn coulda done plenty to shore it up before the '08 and '09 seasons. He had 2 offseasons to get a new guy or two in there and the only guy we really got that will be here awhile looks like Dockery.

FYI I'm not jumping on him, just saying that hiring a new GM/HC isn't making me break out the rose colored glasses again.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

How can you break the rose colored glasses yet or have reservations about whether Allen and Shanny can turn it around. 7 HCs in 10 years? Different systems, coaches, players, and same crap result with the exception of the rare playoff appearances. And even those sucked. Norv had the only really decent playoff team in that 10 year stretch and he got canned. Only smart thing to do is have subdued positivism. It is nice a GM was hired, but that in itself doesn't guarantee success. Don't get me wrong I am excited, but I am not going to give myself all giddy until I see some positive results where they count and that is on the field!!!!!!

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

Line didn't suck in 2007, Portis still was productive for the most part. In '08 it slid, but was still OK. THis year age finally took its toll with the injuries. Thing was the FO thought short term while they needed to invest in young linemen via the draft or even FA. The thinking under Snyder has always been in the short term, try and turn it a round within one offseason or two. That wasn't ever going to happen.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;652688]How can you break the rose colored glasses yet or have reservations about whether Allen and Shanny can turn it around. 7 HCs in 10 years? Different systems, coaches, players, and same crap result with the exception of the rare playoff appearances. And even those sucked. Norv had the only really decent playoff team in that 10 year stretch and he got canned. Only smart thing to do is have subdued positivism. It is nice a GM was hired, but that in itself doesn't guarantee success. Don't get me wrong I am excited, but I am not going to give myself all giddy until I see some positive results where they count and that is on the field!!!!!![/quote]

Totally, this probably resembles the Marty hire as much as anything...if Snyder even tones down his meddling and we don't big time miss in this draft (or the next few drafts), we should be okay for the next few years.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

So, what are the chances Snyder wants to have 1-2 hour meetings to break down film with Shanahan, too?

[url=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/01/jim_zorn_broke_down_game_film.html]D.C. Sports Bog - Jim Zorn broke down game film with Dan Snyder[/url]

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=WaldSkins;652087]Our offensive line was on a downward slope when Joe Gibbs was here and he has to take some of the blame for our line being where it is now. [B]Who built the Hogs anyway????[/B]

Let's wait and see who Shannahan builds his staff with before we jump on him. If rumors of Jerry Gray as our DC turn out to be true, then I might be the first one to question Shanny.[/quote]
Bobby Beathard, He should be credited for assembling the Hogs, but also Bugel for doing a great job coaching them up.. I'm hoping between Allen and Shanny they adress the O-line first and formost of all of our personell problems. The Redskins will be very fortunate if these two can aquire half the tallent on o-line that Beathard did in the 80's..

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;653732]So, what are the chances Snyder wants to have 1-2 hour meetings to break down film with Shanahan, too?

[URL="http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/01/jim_zorn_broke_down_game_film.html"]D.C. Sports Bog - Jim Zorn broke down game film with Dan Snyder[/URL][/quote]

Sounds like that's over with thankfully

[quote]
sometime during the season the weekly film sessions stopped, perhaps as part of the broader changes instituted by Allen. For example, Hellie also talked to a player recently who had attempted to see the owner to lobby for his positional coach to keep his job.

"He was literally stopped at the door by the secretary, who said all football matters have to go through Bruce Allen," Hellie told me. Which seems to make some amount of sense.
[/quote]

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

Great thread topic by the way.

All Skins fans should take the enthusiasm out of the front office moves until their is on field production yielded from them.

Re: The Tempered Expectations Thread
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;653732]So, what are the chances Snyder wants to have 1-2 hour meetings to break down film with Shanahan, too?

[URL="http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/01/jim_zorn_broke_down_game_film.html"]D.C. Sports Bog - Jim Zorn broke down game film with Dan Snyder[/URL][/quote]

Oh god. The Danny and Zorn breaking down film together? I can only imagine how hard other NFL coaches and Execs would laugh at that scene.

I did read one great thing in that post:

[I]Anyhow, sometime during the season the weekly film sessions stopped, perhaps as part of the broader changes instituted by Allen. For example, Hellie also talked to a player recently who had attempted to see the owner to lobby for his positional coach to keep his job.[/I]

[I]"He was literally stopped at the door by the secretary, who said all football matters have to go through Bruce Allen," Hellie told me. Which seems to make some amount of sense.[/I]