Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;873418]Called it since day one:)[/quote]

Thanks swami!

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=mlmpetert;873282]My thought is that to call Flynn a system quarterback is to imply Rodgers is one too.[/quote]That might be your thought but its far from any implication I'm making.
Aaron Rodgers because of his skillset is scheme diverse.
To put it simply Aaron Rodgers is a fast, quick release and a strong arm, above average deep ball thrower and a playmaker who over the past couple season rushes for 300+ yards a season.
Aaron Rodgers is not a system QB.
Being a system QB is about skillset or lack thereof.

[quote]whats so bad about having a system that allows guys like Rodgers, Brady or Flynn to be successful?[/quote]Nothing and no one is saying there is anything wrong with having such a system.

[quote]Drafting a guys like Rodgers or Flynn that arnt as highly touted but still have the necessary abilities to be very successful when constrained to a particular system, to me, make teams much more flexible.[/quote]Huh?
Rodgers (a 1st round pick) has [I][B]elite[/B][/I] physical skillset Flynn does not.

[quote]If your schemes are designed for only the very best, then the team’s overall success has a ceiling that’s directly determined by team’s personal, just look at the Colts.[/quote]A team designs there scheme around their players.
The Colts had Peyton Manning and built there scheme around him.

But lets not mix issues here.
The Colts lacked a [I][B]competent[/B][/I] back-up QB this point is highlighted by the fact that when Dan Orlovsky was plugged into the line-up there was a significant uptick in the offense from Curtis Painter.

My point is this:
Matt Flynn is not Aaron Rodgers because of his physical skillset.
Judging Matt Flynn or any FA/draftable prospect QB based on their production is a false/innaccurate assessment of their individual ability because their production is part of a system that includes the OL, WRs, RB, scheme, coaching, chemistry, playcalling and continuity.
When you draft/trade or sign a player you only get their physical skillset not their system.
Therefore Flynn despite his production is still only as good or as valueable as his skillset.
Therefore any QB with Flynn's physical skillset could be as productive as Flynn.
Therefore there is no need to pay Flynn any more then it would cost to bring in a prospect with a similar skillset.
And prospects with Flynn skillset can be found later in the later rounds of the draft or through FA Brian Hoyer, Josh Johnson heck there are some even more tested/talented QBs available via FA like Matt Moore or Chad Henne.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

One guy who is also completely unproven who I think I'd gamble on before Matt Flynn?

Dennis Dixon.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=GTripp0012;873506]One guy who is also completely unproven who I think I'd gamble on before Matt Flynn?

Dennis Dixon.[/quote]

It worries me that he can't beat out Charlie Batch. What would it take to get him?

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=GTripp0012;873506]One guy who is also completely unproven who I think I'd gamble on before Matt Flynn?

Dennis Dixon.[/quote]I think he's every bit as viable as Flynn but I don't think that Dixon would be the type of QB that Kyle would look for:

here are some other options in the same vein as Flynn/Hoyer/Dixon:

Josh Johnson
Jimmy Clausen
Joe Webb (although I gave the same questions about Kyle wanting him as Dixon but he does come from a WCO)
Kevin O'Connell
Adam Froman
Josh Portis(WCO but same boat as see Dixon, Webb)
Dan LeFevour
Graham Harrel

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=30gut;873510]I think he's every bit as viable as Flynn but I don't think that Dixon would be the type of QB that Kyle would look for:

here are some other options in the same vein as Flynn/Hoyer/Dixon:

Josh Johnson
Jimmy Clausen
Joe Webb (although I gave the same questions about Kyle wanting him as Dixon but he does come from a WCO)
Kevin O'Connell
Adam Froman
Josh Portis(WCO but same boat as see Dixon, Webb)
Dan LeFevour
Graham Harrel[/quote]

Skins should be drafting their own stud QBs. That's what makes this draft so critical.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=diehard;873514]Skins should be drafting their own stud QBs. That's what makes this draft so critical.[/quote]I agree because the FO botched the QB decisions last year they've increased the pressure to make the correct decision in FA and the draft or else...

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=30gut;873510]I think he's every bit as viable as Flynn but I don't think that Dixon would be the type of QB that Kyle would look for:

here are some other options in the same vein as Flynn/Hoyer/Dixon:

Josh Johnson
Jimmy Clausen
Joe Webb (although I gave the same questions about Kyle wanting him as Dixon but he does come from a WCO)
Kevin O'Connell
Adam Froman
Josh Portis(WCO but same boat as see Dixon, Webb)
Dan LeFevour
Graham Harrel[/quote]

That list makes me gag.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=30gut;873510]I think he's every bit as viable as Flynn but I don't think that Dixon would be the type of QB that Kyle would look for:

here are some other options in the same vein as Flynn/Hoyer/Dixon:

Josh Johnson
[B]Jimmy Clausen[/B]
Joe Webb (although I gave the same questions about Kyle wanting him as Dixon but he does come from a WCO)
Kevin O'Connell
Adam Froman
Josh Portis(WCO but same boat as see Dixon, Webb)
[B]Dan LeFevour[/B]
Graham Harrel[/quote]

the only 2 id take out of that list.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

Matt Flynn To the Washington Redskins?

[url=http://wusa9.com/sports/article/183175/387/Elfins-Endzone-Redskins-Need-A-QB-In-The-Worst-Way]Matt Flynn To the Washington Redskins? | wusa9.com[/url]

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;873544]That list makes me gag.[/quote]Rex Grossman and John Beck we're our QBs last year.
That fact should pretty much make any QB list gag proof.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=Big C;873545]the only 2 id take out of that list.[/quote]I'm surprised anyone recognizes all the names enough to disapprove.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=GTripp0012;873506]One guy who is also completely unproven who I think I'd gamble on before Matt Flynn?

Dennis Dixon.[/quote]

From your boys at [URL="http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7413505/nfl-does-matt-flynn-week-17-performance-mean"]Football Outsiders...[/URL]
[I]
"It's only one game, but the simple fact is that mediocre quarterbacks are almost [/I][I]never this good. On the other hand, it's not the first start of Flynn's career. Last year, Flynn started in Foxborough and completed 65 percent of his passes with three touchdowns. New England's weak secondary had a lot to do with that, but it's still not a game that looks bad on a quarterback's résumé. Flynn is 26 years old and has four years of apprenticeship in one of the best offenses in the league. His ceiling is Hall of Famer; his realistic floor is something at least close to a Pro Bowler. That's got to be worth more than an unproven rookie, doesn't it?"[/I] [I]- Vince Verhei[/I]

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=30gut;873557]I'm surprised anyone recognizes all the names enough to disapprove.[/quote]

I'm surprised you had the gall not to mention my main man...but I guess you're just throwing caution to the wind with your membership here

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=SmootSmack;873569]I'm surprised you had the gall not to mention my main man...but I guess you're just throwing caution to the wind with your membership here[/quote]

Maybe force him to have a Chase Daniel avatar for 30 days?

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=SmootSmack;873569]I'm surprised you had the gall not to mention my main man...but I guess you're just throwing caution to the wind with your membership here[/quote]Its payback for the free for all you started about my avatar.

But seriously, I don't think there's any chance the Saints let their back-up QB go without hefty compensation at least equal to Flynn.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[YT]_C8F0cWvAfo[/YT]

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[url=http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012/01/04/elfin-go-get-your-franchise-qb-shanahans/]Elfin: Go Get Your Franchise QB, Shanahans « CBS Washington[/url]

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[url=http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/future-for-flynn-just-got-a-lot-brighter-3r3lasl-136790128.html]Future for Flynn just got a lot brighter - JSOnline[/url]

Good breakdown of Flynn situation from Milwaukee Wisconsin journal sentinel.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

honestly Flynn and Rodgers kinda look identical on the field, wonder how good Flynn would be for 16 games in GB

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;873808]honestly Flynn and Rodgers kinda look identical on the field, wonder how good Flynn would be for 16 games in GB[/quote]
You mean apart from athleticism, mobility, throwing velocity, deep ball accuracy, and ability to make plays and throw on the run?

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=30gut;873812]You mean apart from athleticism, mobility, throwing velocity, deep ball accuracy, and ability to make plays and throw on the run?[/quote]


I'm not saying they are the same in fact AROD is a ELITE QB I'm js in that offense they look just alike

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;873808]honestly Flynn and Rodgers kinda look identical on the field, wonder how good Flynn would be for 16 games in GB[/quote]

TJ Yates has done more on the field than Flynn, so why are people hyping Flynn like he's the next Joe Montana?


There is a reason why Flynn was a late round talent and why Rodgers was a 1st round talent. I don't think I see anything identical about those two.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=NC_Skins;873815]TJ Yates has done more on the field than Flynn, so why are people hyping Flynn like he's the next Joe Montana?


There is a reason why Flynn was a late round talent and why Rodgers was a 1st round talent. I don't think I see anything identical about those two.[/quote]

Draft position is meaningless. Jason Campbell was selected 1 spot behind Rodgers, Kurt Warner wasn't drafted, Brady was a 6th rounder, Brees a second, etc.. Flynn could turn out to be a bust, but his draft position doesn't mean a thing.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=44Deezel;873819]Draft position is meaningless. Jason Campbell was selected 1 spot behind Rodgers, Kurt Warner wasn't drafted, Brady was a 6th rounder, Brees a second, etc.. Flynn could turn out to be a bust, but his draft position doesn't mean a thing.[/quote]

I wasn't referencing the draft position. Notice I said NOTHING in regards to their position. I said 1st round talent and late round talent. I'm referencing the grades they were given on their abilities.


This whole Flynn shit reminds me of the whole Cult Brennan fiasco. Dude had a stellar pre-season and all of a sudden he's All-Pro.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=NC_Skins;873815]TJ Yates has done more on the field than Flynn, so why are people hyping Flynn like he's the next Joe Montana?


There is a reason why Flynn was a late round talent and why Rodgers was a 1st round talent. I don't think I see anything identical about those two.[/quote]

Because Flynn is an unrestricted free agent that won't cost draft picks for years to come and because Green Bay back-ups have a pretty good track record and because he's had 4 years to develop. Meanwhile, Yates is a rookie under contract and his coaches thought Matt Leinart was more worthy of being Matt Scaub's back-up. Doesn't mean he won't turn out to be legit. Just 2 totally different set of circumstances.

No flynn has proven in two starts he can get it done brennan never even got on the field

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=NC_Skins;873815]TJ Yates has done more on the field than Flynn, so why are people hyping Flynn like he's the next Joe Montana?


There is a reason why Flynn was a late round talent and why Rodgers was a 1st round talent. I don't think I see anything identical about those two.[/quote]

Rodgers was once a 2nd stringer behind a great qb and people questioned him based on little play.. not saying he's another Rodgers... but that doesn't mean he is Curtis Painter either

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=tryfuhl;873830]Rodgers was once a 2nd stringer behind a great qb and people questioned him based on little play.. not saying he's another Rodgers... but that doesn't mean he is Curtis Painter either[/quote]

Rodgers was drafted as a #1 QB. He was to take over the reigns for Farve when he walked away. It just happened that Brett took longer than they probably wanted. Rodgers was already telling them if they weren't going to start him, he wanted out after his rookie contract ended.


Flynn on the other hand was drafted to be a backup. They'd laugh if he told them the same thing. Huge difference.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

I don't know if it will be Flynn but we have to sign a QB in the FA period. That way if we decide to trade up in the draft teams can't demand the world. We are going to pay alot to trade up, but it will be alot more if we don't have a contingency plan.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;873900]I don't know if it will be Flynn but we have to sign a QB in the FA period. That way if we decide to trade up in the draft teams can't demand the world. We are going to pay alot to trade up, but it will be alot more if we don't have a contingency plan.[/quote]

Yup. And that FA can't be Rex, because he gives us no leverage

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

Big assumption but assuming MS likes Flynn, I wouldn't be opposed to offering him a contract and using a high draft pick on a QB. I don't think Matt Flynn will get huge money. Let's look who needs a QB:
Cleveland- Will most likely draft one
Miami- Just went thru several seasons w/ Henne, are they willing to gamble again w/ Flynn?
Seattle-Maybe

So you get Flynn & Griffin/Tannehill/Foles/or anyone else MS likes.

Flynn Starts year 1. There's a few scenarios:
1. Flynn is very good. This is the best scenario. Now you have a good problem, a good starter and a legit trade piece.
2. Flynn is bad. You've got a young QB ready to take over.
3. Flynn is mediocre. You've still got a guy ready to take over.

We've got some money to play w/. Don't break the bank but it's worth the discussion and I'm sure they've had it.

We're assuming the Shanahan think highly enough of Flynn.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=30gut;873812]You mean apart from athleticism, mobility, throwing velocity, deep ball accuracy, and ability to make plays and throw on the run?[/quote]

LOL....other than that they're pretty much the same guy!

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;873900]I don't know if it will be Flynn but we have to sign a QB in the FA period. That way if we decide to trade up in the draft teams can't demand the world. We are going to pay alot to trade up, but it will be alot more if we don't have a contingency plan.[/quote]

But...but...we have Beck already. :)

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=redsk1;875240]Big assumption but assuming MS likes Flynn, I wouldn't be opposed to offering him a contract and using a high draft pick on a QB. I don't think Matt Flynn will get huge money. Let's look who needs a QB:
Cleveland- Will most likely draft one
Miami- Just went thru several seasons w/ Henne, are they willing to gamble again w/ Flynn?
Seattle-Maybe

So you get Flynn & Griffin/Tannehill/Foles/or anyone else MS likes.

Flynn Starts year 1. There's a few scenarios:
[B]1. Flynn is very good. This is the best scenario. Now you have a good problem, a good starter and a legit trade piece. [/B]
2. Flynn is bad. You've got a young QB ready to take over.
3. Flynn is mediocre. You've still got a guy ready to take over.

We've got some money to play w/. Don't break the bank but it's worth the discussion and I'm sure they've had it.

We're assuming the Shanahan think highly enough of Flynn.[/quote]

You think if we found a way to get Flynn and Griffin, and Flynn does well, we would really trade Griffin?

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=chrisl13;875258]You think if we found a way to get Flynn and Griffin, and Flynn does well, we would really trade Griffin?[/quote]

The top free agent QB is going to want to make sure that he gets a one year grace period when it comes to acquiring other top tier QB prospects. I seriously doubt that drafting RGIII would sit well with him not to mention it would negate the flexibility that Matt Flynn would give us in the draft to take the BPA.

And make no mistake about it. Matt Flynn is not going to come cheap. Maybe cheap by Peyton Manning/Tom Brady QB standards. Still look at what these unproven but highly touted QB's got.


2007 - Matt Schuab - 6 Years $48 Million - $7 Million Signing Bonus
2009 - Matt Cassell - 6 Years $63 Million - $28 Million Signing Bonus
2011 - Kevin Kolb - 5 Years $63 Million - $20 Million Signing Bonus
2011 - Ryan Fitzpatrick - 6 Years $59 Million $15 Million Signing Bonus

If any of you think that Flynn would come with a low signing bonus and a $4 million a year cap hit at most then you're nuts.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=chrisl13;875258]You think if we found a way to get Flynn and Griffin, and Flynn does well, we would really trade Griffin?[/quote]

We would have the option of trading either Flynn or Griffin. If Flynn came in and played very well, we would then have options. One option would be to keep Flynn and trade Griffin. Of course, if MS thought highly enough of Griffin after one year, he would have the option of trading Flynn. Having two QB's gives us a better shot to find one good one and gives us more options down the road.

Assuming we like Flynn, I'm all for it.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;875264]And make no mistake about it. Matt Flynn is not going to come cheap. Maybe cheap by Peyton Manning/Tom Brady QB standards. Still look at what these unproven but highly touted QB's got.


2007 - Matt Schuab - 6 Years $48 Million - $7 Million Signing Bonus
2009 - Matt Cassell - 6 Years $63 Million - $28 Million Signing Bonus
2011 - Kevin Kolb - 5 Years $63 Million - $20 Million Signing Bonus
2011 - Ryan Fitzpatrick - 6 Years $59 Million $15 Million Signing Bonus

If any of you think that Flynn would come with a low signing bonus and a $4 million a year cap hit at most then you're nuts.[/quote]


Don't think you can compare Flynn to these guys those. Schaub and Kolb were both higher round picks with higher grades on their potential/skills. Cassell and Fitzpatrick played well for more than just 2 games. They did it for a whole season.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;875264]The top free agent QB is going to want to make sure that he gets a one year grace period when it comes to acquiring other top tier QB prospects. I seriously doubt that drafting RGIII would sit well with him not to mention it would negate the flexibility that Matt Flynn would give us in the draft to take the BPA.

And make no mistake about it. Matt Flynn is not going to come cheap. Maybe cheap by Peyton Manning/Tom Brady QB standards. Still look at what these unproven but highly touted QB's got.


2007 - Matt Schuab - 6 Years $48 Million - $7 Million Signing Bonus
2009 - Matt Cassell - 6 Years $63 Million - $28 Million Signing Bonus
2011 - Ryan Fitzpatrick - 6 Years $59 Million $15 Million Signing Bonus

If any of you think that Flynn would come with a low signing bonus and a $4 million a year cap hit at most then you're nuts.[/quote]

I'm not sure he's going to get that type of money, as those 3 above. Flynn has started 2 games, I believe. The 3 above all had 1 season + in starts. Flynn is a bit of an unknown.

I'm not sure I see him getting over 25-30 million. It wouldn't totalling surprise me though. I guess it depends what the scouts see in him. I just don't see that much demand.

Re: What is Matt Flynn Worth to the Redskins
 

Truthfully, with as stupid as some owners/GMs are, it wouldn't surprise me to see anything. Teams are so QB desperate, they probably will pay premium money. Hell, they paid $50 mil guaranteed to Bradford who'd never took a snap in the NFL.