Commanders Post at The Warpath - Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

Commanders Post at The Warpath (http://www.thewarpath.net/forum.php)

- Debating with the enemy (http://www.thewarpath.net/forumdisplay.php?f=75)

- - Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA) (http://www.thewarpath.net/showthread.php?t=45946)

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=SirClintonPortis;878314][url=http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/248586/sopa_and_pipa_what_went_wrong.html]SOPA and PIPA: What Went Wrong? | PCWorld Business Center[/url]

[url=http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-57329001-281/how-sopa-would-affect-you-faq/]How SOPA would affect you: FAQ | Privacy Inc. - CNET News[/url][/quote]

Excellent stuff. I would recommend anyone interested to read through the first link and then follow the links through to the pieces by Freakonomics.com and the gentleman from the Cato institute. Both do a good job explaining why piracy and its effects are seriously misunderstood...mostly through incorrect propaganda perpetuated by the content-industry, either in a deceptive manner or simply out of ignorance.

Most research shows that piracy has no effect on an economy as a consumer who would have spent money on content, who then downloads something for free, then has that "saved" money to spend elsewhere in the economy.

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=SirClintonPortis;878307]Was the search tool, in the presented form in the video, was that tool still there after CBS actually bought CNET in 2008?

Anyway, while the vid had some interesting info, I really am not fond of video documentaries of any sort (whether I care about the agenda or not) since they hardly present enough info (and in a coherent manner) to see the whole picture. The are a stepping stone, but their thesis and logic to support said thesis, if that is their intent, is not to be taken without question.

Quite frankly, it's quite annoying to hear the guy say "hundreds of millions" without some sort of reference. He also seems to be using a colloquial form of vicarious liability to "expose" the hypocrisy of the top fat cats. While it indeed seems questionable that they twiddled their thumbs, they could have a legit they didn't know counterargument.

Besides, even without CNET, downloading p2p clients would still be possible since you could download from their official sites or mirrors/Bittorrent. That said, one could say that they could have used SOPA to shut down "enemy" sites to force users to go to CNET. It's one thing to have the law, it's another thing to go out and enforce it by filing for lawsuits.

But perhaps the fundemental flaw in his argument is that the software itself is quite legal and hence could not be taken down. You wonder why bittorent's creator hasn't had his hanging yet? Because one could say that he just made the software, but can't control users from doing legal or illegal acts.

Kazaa is an interesting and ironic case, since Kazaa LITE is an UNAUTHORIZED modification of Kazaa. Not only that,but Sherman Networks actually considered Kazaa Lite was a violation of copyright!!!

Now, in the following hypothetical scenario, where:
1. SOPA is in effect
2. Kazaa Lite somehow gets hosted on CNET

Sharman could go through the SOPA process and then CNET will suffer the consequences of SOPA. For hosting a copyright infringing program, CNET could suffer a ton of collateral damage. And this scenario involves two pieces of software that irks SOPA supporters. Now even if you're in support of anti-piracy, does CNET deserve to be subjected to such collateral damage? It's tough to make such a case.[/quote]

I don't know if the MP3 search was there in 2008, I'm probably going to go out on a limb and say it wasn't. Yeah, the guy in the video kind of reminded me of somebody who had a little too much coffee in the morning, and I'm sure some of his points in the video are probably a bit suspect, but he does raise some interesting points I thought. Just like you said, the software itself is not illegal. It's just like those politicians trying to ban the use of firearms - those guns aren't illegal in themselves (well unless you own fully automatic weapons) it's the purpose in which you use them. Same for the software. From what I remember, it seemed like some of those file sharing programs were only hosted on CNET. I could be wrong, but I seem to remember going to that software's website and going to the download page, and often times the download page was actually CNET's download page.

But I think the main point I'm trying to drive home is simply that, one, CNET obviously looked like a very profitable investment for CBS to purchase, two, CNET was profitable because they made money off of hosting/advertising all types of software, peer to peer software included. And finally, it just looks bad to me when you're getting money from these companies and then want to turn them over to the authorities for piracy. Even when the piracy issue first came up with Napster, CNET still kept hosting other file sharing programs that did the same thing that Napster did (Morpheus, Kaaza, Winmx, etc..) You would just assume if they were really against piracy (which again is head scratcher considering they had their own MP3 search and download tool on their site) they would have removed all of those file sharing programs at once. But no, obviously there was some sort of profit to be made by keeping them on their servers and they did so for awhile.

Speaking of, I just went to CNET and they still have file sharing software that can be downloaded from their site, so again, I just find them to be big hypocrites. Check it out for yourselves:

[URL="http://download.cnet.com/1770-20_4-0.html?query=limewire&platformSelect=Windows&platformSelect=Mobile&platformSelect=Webware&tag=srch&searchtype=downloads&filterName=platform%3DWindows%2CMobile%2CWebware&filter=platform%3DWindows%2CMobile%2CWebware"]CNET File Sharing Software[/URL]

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=NC_Skins;878330][url=http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2012/01/23/if-you-thought-sopa-was-bad-just-wait-until-you-meet-acta/]If You Thought SOPA Was Bad, Just Wait Until You Meet ACTA - Forbes[/url]

Got a even darker cloud on the horizon.
[/quote]

Ridiculous!!!

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=skinsguy;878365]I don't know if the MP3 search was there in 2008, I'm probably going to go out on a limb and say it wasn't. Yeah, the guy in the video kind of reminded me of somebody who had a little too much coffee in the morning, and I'm sure some of his points in the video are probably a bit suspect, but he does raise some interesting points I thought. Just like you said, the software itself is not illegal. It's just like those politicians trying to ban the use of firearms - those guns aren't illegal in themselves (well unless you own fully automatic weapons) it's the purpose in which you use them. Same for the software. From what I remember, it seemed like some of those file sharing programs were only hosted on CNET. I could be wrong, but I seem to remember going to that software's website and going to the download page, and often times the download page was actually CNET's download page.

But I think the main point I'm trying to drive home is simply that, one, CNET obviously looked like a very profitable investment for CBS to purchase, two, CNET was profitable because they made money off of hosting/advertising all types of software, peer to peer software included. And finally, it just looks bad to me when you're getting money from these companies and then want to turn them over to the authorities for piracy. Even when the piracy issue first came up with Napster, CNET still kept hosting other file sharing programs that did the same thing that Napster did (Morpheus, Kaaza, Winmx, etc..) You would just assume if they were really against piracy (which again is head scratcher considering they had their own MP3 search and download tool on their site) they would have removed all of those file sharing programs at once. But no, obviously there was some sort of profit to be made by keeping them on their servers and they did so for awhile.

Speaking of, I just went to CNET and they still have file sharing software that can be downloaded from their site, so again, I just find them to be big hypocrites. Check it out for yourselves:

[URL="http://download.cnet.com/1770-20_4-0.html?query=limewire&platformSelect=Windows&platformSelect=Mobile&platformSelect=Webware&tag=srch&searchtype=downloads&filterName=platform%3DWindows%2CMobile%2CWebware&filter=platform%3DWindows%2CMobile%2CWebware"]CNET File Sharing Software[/URL][/quote]

They are now doing external linking for at least some of the "naughty" programs on the list and putting a big Editor's Note at the top of the list. They're catching on.

And they actually were sued by some artists for promoting LimeWire
[quote]
In 2011, CNET and CBS Interactive were sued by a coalition of artists (led by FilmOn founder Alki David) for copyright infringement by promoting the download of LimeWire, a popular peer to peer downloading software. [26] [27] Although the original suit was voluntarily dropped by Alki David he vowed to sue at a later date to bring "expanded"[28] action against CBS Interactive. In November 2011, another lawsuit against CBS Interactive was introduced, claiming that CNet and CBS Interactive knowingly distributed LimeWire, the file sharing software. [29]

# ^ Gustin, Sam, paidcontent.org (2011-11-16). "Alki David Drops CNET Lawsuit; Vows to Bring 'Expanded' Action". PaidContent.org.
# ^ Ernesto, torrentfreak.com (2011-11-15). "Artists Sue CBS, CNET, for Promoting and Profiting from Piracy". TorrentFreak.[/quote]

It will be interesting to see how this turns out.

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

Possibly dangerous but also could go a long way towards improving society. This is basicaly the end game of file sharing.

[url=http://techland.time.com/2012/01/24/next-frontier-in-piracy-downloading-physical-objects-to-your-3d-printer/#ixzz1kP0C9dOM]Next Frontier in Piracy: Downloading Physical Objects to Your 3D Printer | Techland | TIME.com[/url]

[I]Per the Pirate Bay:[/I]
[QUOTE]We believe that the next step in copying will be made from digital form into physical form. It will be physical objects. Or as we decided to call them: Physibles. Data objects that are able (and feasible) to become physical. We believe that things like three dimensional printers, scanners and such are just the first step. We believe that in the nearby future you will print your spare parts for your vehicles. You will download your sneakers within 20 years.
[/QUOTE]

It's like, imagine if you only had to pay for housing, medical care, and services? People would have more disposable income. Less people would go hungry. I haven't thought it out fully but it seems like a good thing. Then again if you can download guns and keys.

Read more: [url=http://techland.time.com/2012/01/24/next-frontier-in-piracy-downloading-physical-objects-to-your-3d-printer/#ixzz1kP0C9dOM]Next Frontier in Piracy: Downloading Physical Objects to Your 3D Printer | Techland | TIME.com[/url]

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=Dirtbag59;878444]Possibly dangerous but also could go a long way towards improving society. This is basicaly the end game of file sharing.

[url=http://techland.time.com/2012/01/24/next-frontier-in-piracy-downloading-physical-objects-to-your-3d-printer/#ixzz1kP0C9dOM]Next Frontier in Piracy: Downloading Physical Objects to Your 3D Printer | Techland | TIME.com[/url]

[I]Per the Pirate Bay:[/I]

It's like, imagine if you only had to pay for housing, medical care, and services? People would have more disposable income. Less people would go hungry. I haven't thought it out fully but it seems like a good thing. Then again if you can download guns and keys.

Read more: [url=http://techland.time.com/2012/01/24/next-frontier-in-piracy-downloading-physical-objects-to-your-3d-printer/#ixzz1kP0C9dOM]Next Frontier in Piracy: Downloading Physical Objects to Your 3D Printer | Techland | TIME.com[/url][/quote]

Free copper pipes. Now, how do you print out the copper? Sounds more like sci-fi to me.

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

Wow...imagine porn.......;)

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=skinsguy;878456]Wow...imagine porn.......;)[/quote]

Ha ha. I'm reminded of a quote from Frasier.

Sleeping with the Enemy (series 3)
Daphne: Oh, come on now, Dr Crane. It's not like men have never used sex to get what they want.
Frasier: How can we possibly use sex to get what we want?! Sex IS what we want!

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=Dirtbag59;878460]Ha ha. I'm reminded of a quote from Frasier.

Sleeping with the Enemy (series 3)
Daphne: Oh, come on now, Dr Crane. It's not like men have never used sex to get what they want.
Frasier: How can we possibly use sex to get what we want?! Sex IS what we want![/quote]

hahahaha!!!! Man I miss that show!!

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

This goes back to the Hollywood Accounting tricks I was talking about earlier.

[url=http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20120124/04344817524/wil-wheaton-says-chris-dodd-is-lying-about-lost-jobs-says-mpaa-accounting-creates-more-losses-than-piracy.shtml?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter]Wil Wheaton Says Chris Dodd Is Lying About Lost Jobs; Says MPAA Accounting Creates More Losses Than Piracy | Techdirt[/url]

Will Wheaton, of Star Trek fame and more recently as a Recurring Guest on The Big Bang Theory where he plays himself.
[QUOTE]I have lost more money to creative accounting, and American workers have lost more jobs to runaway production, than anything associated with what the MPAA calls piracy. Chris Dodd is lying about piracy costing us jobs. Hollywood’s refusal to adapt to changing times is what’s costing the studios money. That’s it.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;878330][url=http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2012/01/23/if-you-thought-sopa-was-bad-just-wait-until-you-meet-acta/]If You Thought SOPA Was Bad, Just Wait Until You Meet ACTA - Forbes[/url]
Got a even darker cloud on the horizon.
[/QUOTE]

If Chris Dodd thought the blackouts for SOPA and PIPA were an abuse of power wait until he sees how hard the world pushes back against ACTA. I mean to think of how involved people got in other countries over a piece of US legislation. Now imagine how hard those same people will protest when it their own countries become directly involved.

Ironically these antipiracy measures have been discussed for a while with a limited amount of talk towards implementation. People were sure back in November that SOPA was going to pass and it got annihilated once mass awareness was raised.

ACTA has been around since April 2010. The reason people don't care yet is because for now it's only a threat. Trust me once ACTA goes on the fast track heads will roll. It'll make the SOPA blackout look like a bottlerocket in comparison.

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=Dirtbag59;878504]
If Chris Dodd thought the blackouts for SOPA and PIPA were an abuse of power wait until he sees how hard the world pushes back against ACTA. I mean to think of how involved people got in other countries over a piece of US legislation. Now imagine how hard those same people will protest when it their own countries become directly involved.

Ironically these antipiracy measures have been discussed for a while with a limited amount of talk towards implementation. People were sure back in November that SOPA was going to pass and it got annihilated once mass awareness was raised.

ACTA has been around since April 2010. The reason people don't care yet is because for now it's only a threat. Trust me once ACTA goes on the fast track heads will roll. It'll make the SOPA blackout look like a bottlerocket in comparison.[/quote]

Chris Dodd is an idiot. This is all going to backfire in his face. And I agree, the people won't go for this. I thought it was unconstitutional for the US government to go into secret treaties with other countries?

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[url=http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20120124/04344817524/wil-wheaton-says-chris-dodd-is-lying-about-lost-jobs-says-mpaa-accounting-creates-more-losses-than-piracy.shtml]Wil Wheaton Says Chris Dodd Is Lying About Lost Jobs; Says MPAA Accounting Creates More Losses Than Piracy | Techdirt[/url]

Even actors know the film industry is full of shit.

[quote]I have lost more money to creative accounting, and American workers have lost more jobs to runaway production, than anything associated with what the MPAA calls piracy. Chris Dodd is lying about piracy costing us jobs. Hollywood’s refusal to adapt to changing times is what’s costing the studios money. That’s it.[/quote]

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

[quote=Dirtbag59;878444]Possibly dangerous but also could go a long way towards improving society. This is basicaly the end game of file sharing.

[url=http://techland.time.com/2012/01/24/next-frontier-in-piracy-downloading-physical-objects-to-your-3d-printer/#ixzz1kP0C9dOM]Next Frontier in Piracy: Downloading Physical Objects to Your 3D Printer | Techland | TIME.com[/url]

[I]Per the Pirate Bay:[/I]

It's like, imagine if you only had to pay for housing, medical care, and services? People would have more disposable income. Less people would go hungry. I haven't thought it out fully but it seems like a good thing. Then again if you can download guns and keys.

Read more: [url=http://techland.time.com/2012/01/24/next-frontier-in-piracy-downloading-physical-objects-to-your-3d-printer/#ixzz1kP0C9dOM]Next Frontier in Piracy: Downloading Physical Objects to Your 3D Printer | Techland | TIME.com[/url][/quote]

If everything is free then no one will make anything, innovate anything, do anything.

Re: Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA)

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