Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=#56fanatic;370948]I work with a Patriots fan and we just had a heated, VERY heated discussion about this. Its funny how most of us and sports columnist, experts feel this was classless act by what transpired on the field yesterday, he was flipping out defending his coach and team. I for one am a diehard skins fan and I guess I was brought up during Gibbs 1 and am i guessed spoiled by having a coach with class. Winning with class, losing with class is what I have always known. its amazes me to see how feverishly he was defending his teams actions and didn't think it was classless if not unwaranted behavior by his coach. I eventually had to end the conversation because I was getting a little over heated. It was not the fact we got our asses whipped, it is the fashion at which the patriots were instructed to play by their coach. He just could not see this and kept screaming this is what they are paid to do. I guess I was hoping to have a conversation with a knowledgable fan that understands the meaning of winning with class, but I guess I was wrong.

I just became on of the biggest colt supporters for next week. and who ever else plays their sorry asses the rest of the year. I hope he tries this shit with someone that has no patience or tollerance for that crap.[/quote]

One thing is for sure, the football world will be sharply divided during this game on Sunday. It's so funny how this is drawing contrasting, and depending on which side of the argument you fall on, surprising opinions.

People that rooted against the Colts all their life, just might be pulling for them to put a little egg on Belichick's face this coming Sunday.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=offiss;370949]I have a question for you, how appalled where you 2 seasons ago when we had the cowboys dead and buried in the 4th quarter and they were trying to move the ball for a consolation TD and Williams kept sending multiple blitzes at Bledsoe? I remember Bledsoe taking a beating of beatings that last drive did you have a problem with that? Because if I remember correctly most here thought it was great? I didn't have a problem with it at the time but then again I'm not a hypocrite. So is G. Williams a classless individual as well? I would love your expert opinion![/QUOTE]

Totally different situation.

Yes, the Cowboys were down but a huge deficit, but Parcells kept on pushing into the final seconds of the game, keeping his starters in. Most teams, down that much and in the final couple of minutes would have sent in the backups to throw it around. Parcells kept all his starterss in and kept driving for meaningless points in the last minute of the game, so yeah, I don't blame Williams one bit for sending blitzes in that situation.

I wouldn't blame Belichick one bit for blitzing us when we were pushing for meaningless points late in the game either. Frankly I'm not sure why CP, Moss, and our precious few offensive linemen that we have left were still in the game at that point. Seems like a needless risk by Gibbs and Co. to me.

So in that situation, yeah, Belichick can blitz all he wants and I've got no problem. Turning around and piliing it on with the offensive play calling is a different issue - he sets the tone with that, not us.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=Mattyk72;370956]C'mon dude we didn't run up the score in that one. It was 35-7 but it could have been much, much worse. We weren't blitzing much either, Daniels was just beating his man one on one. There's just no comparing that game to this one.[/quote]


Exactly. That game was 28 -7 at halftime. We could have run it up a lot more in the second half. In addition, when somebody in the PA booth started playing that Willie Nelson song, Gibbs was irate and signalled them to shut it off. Likewise, in Super Bowl 22 we could have probably scored 60 points if we wanted to. It's foolish and unnecessary.

The sickening part is that it is unlikely that anybody will have a chance to return the favor so long as Brady is their QB and I think it's extremely unlikely that Belichek will be around for the fallout once he retires. What I can't understand is the motivation behind it all. Belichek and the Patriots got caught violating NFL rules. Somehow in this man's crippled psychology he has turned that into a justification for trying to humiliate other teams - teams that had nothing whatsoever to do with the exposure of his shenanigans. I could understand paying Mangini back, but I think to do it to a respected coach from the other conference is a bit much.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=offiss;370959]Wow, I guess Irish has his nerve for actually having his own opinion, a little out of line with that don't you think?[/QUOTE]

Did Redskins say Irish couldn't have his own opinion? He just expressed his opinion about Irish's opinion, didn't say he couldn't have one.

For crying out loud, let's leave the straw man arguments in the barn where they belong.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=12thMan;370967]One thing is for sure, the football world will be sharply divided during this game on Sunday. It's so funny how this is drawing contrasting, and depending on which side of the argument you fall on, surprising opinions.

People that rooted against the Colts all their life, just might be pulling for them to put a little egg on Belichick's face this coming Sunday.[/QUOTE]

Absolutely right, and regardless of your position on all of this, I think we can all agree that this coming weekend is going to be one hell of a game to watch, especially given how divided and passionate the fans are on both sides.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

I'll tell you what this game is really headed toward: The day when Roger Goodell has to hand over that Vince Lombardi trophy to Bob Kraft and that SOB Belichick and feign his sincerest congratulations to the Patriots and their city. You think Belichick isn't replaying this in his mind somehow?

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=#56fanatic;370948]I work with a Patriots fan and we just had a heated, VERY heated discussion about this. Its funny how most of us and sports columnist, experts feel this was classless act by what transpired on the field yesterday, he was flipping out defending his coach and team. I for one am a diehard skins fan and I guess I was brought up during Gibbs 1 and am i guessed spoiled by having a coach with class. Winning with class, losing with class is what I have always known. its amazes me to see how feverishly he was defending his teams actions and didn't think it was classless if not unwaranted behavior by his coach. I eventually had to end the conversation because I was getting a little over heated. It was not the fact we got our asses whipped, it is the fashion at which the patriots were instructed to play by their coach. He just could not see this and kept screaming this is what they are paid to do. I guess I was hoping to have a conversation with a knowledgable fan that understands the meaning of winning with class, but I guess I was wrong.

I just became on of the biggest colt supporters for next week. and who ever else plays their sorry asses the rest of the year. I hope he tries this shit with someone that has no patience or tollerance for that crap.[/quote]

Most of the sports reporters have never ever played sports. They just report on them. So what they say should not really mean anything. Also not all of the people believe what NE did was wrong. I am one of them.

I have heard most of the former Redskin players say that NE did nothing wrong. You have your opinion but as I've said before, the defense is suppose to stop the offense.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=offiss;370949]I have a question for you, how appalled where you 2 seasons ago when we had the cowboys dead and buried in the 4th quarter and they were trying to move the ball for a consolation TD and Williams kept sending multiple blitzes at Bledsoe? I remember Bledsoe taking a beating of beatings that last drive did you have a problem with that? Because if I remember correctly most here thought it was great? I didn't have a problem with it at the time but then again I'm not a hypocrite. So is G. Williams a classless individual as well? I would love your expert opinion![/QUOTE]

First of all, if you don't understand why I love Gibbs than I really don't have much to say to you.

Second, it's one thing to play defense, it's another to run up the score when you've clearly got the game in hand. I don't think I have ever heard anyone complain about the Patriots playing defense until the bitter end.

Third, perhaps you were not an avid Spurrier fan and, if that is the case, I stand corrected. Perhaps you just piss and moan about everything this organization has ever done.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=ArtMonkDrillz;370714]I heard that belichick doesn't wash his hands after he goes to the bathroom and that he farts in public.
(there, that should end this thread)[/QUOTE]

LOL! here, here!

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

Take a look at a great piece by John Clayton on ESPN.com:

"Running it up: Belichick, Pats take no prisoners"

Among other things Clayton writes: "...On Sunday, Belichick kicked a Hall of Fame coach while he was down, running up the score on Joe Gibbs' Redskins in a 52-7 win..."

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=3084539]ESPN - Clayton: Running it up: Belichick, Pats take no prisoners - NFL[/url]

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

All I know about this is - class or no class, I would be pissed if I was one of the redskins. The rest of the season, I would be looking to tear someone's head off on every play - just to get another chance at putting Brady or Vrabel's ass in the hospital, hopefully in the superbowl.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=mheisig;370969]Totally different situation.

Yes, the Cowboys were down but a huge deficit, but Parcells kept on pushing into the final seconds of the game, keeping his starters in. [b]Most teams, down that much and in the final couple of minutes would have sent in the backups to throw it around.[/b] Parcells kept all his starterss in and kept driving for meaningless points in the last minute of the game, so yeah, I don't blame Williams one bit for sending blitzes in that situation.

I wouldn't blame Belichick one bit for blitzing us when we were pushing for meaningless points late in the game either. Frankly I'm not sure why CP, Moss, and our precious few offensive linemen that we have left were still in the game at that point. Seems like a needless risk by Gibbs and Co. to me.

So in that situation, yeah, Belichick can blitz all he wants and I've got no problem. Turning around and piliing it on with the offensive play calling is a different issue - he sets the tone with that, not us.[/quote]

So yesterday when it was 45-0 in the 4th quarter, why did Gibbs keep the starters in the game, if what you say is true?

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

I'll be pissed if you guys let me get to post #5,000 while defending Bill Belichick!

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;370986]So yesterday when it was 45-0 in the 4th quarter, why did Gibbs keep the starters in the game, if what you say is true?[/quote]

You said a mouthfull, and to your point, if Gibbs had pulled his starters, it's reasonable to think BB would have done the same. Don't keep your starters in the game, and at the same time complain about running up the score. Again, my definition of "running up the score" requires that one team has an unfair advantage over the other one. This wasn't the case.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=sandtrapjack;370986]So yesterday when it was 45-0 in the 4th quarter, why did Gibbs keep the starters in the game, if what you say is true?[/QUOTE]

If you read on to the next paragraph I said it seemed like a needless risk by Gibbs and Co. I still question that one, especially given how beat up we already are by injuries. At 45-0 in the 4th quarter I would have pulled the entire offensive line.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=Hog1;370857]Honestly Matty,
Heartbreaking though to watch, they did us a favor. They showed us how it really is to play a top flight team. Where we are in the pecking order. How many weakness's we have a what they are.[/QUOTE]

Couldn't agree more!

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=12thMan;370988]You said a mouthfull, and to your point, if Gibbs had pulled his starters, it's reasonable to think BB would have done the same. Don't keep your starters in the game, and at the same time complain about running up the score. Again, my definition of "running up the score" requires that one team has an unfair advantage over the other one. This wasn't the case.[/quote]
If he pulled the entire line who would play?

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

Man the more I read this thread the more I wish it was us smacking teams around the field like they have been doing. Indy is next and will loose by more than 14 points!

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=mheisig;370969]Totally different situation.

Yes, the Cowboys were down but a huge deficit, but Parcells kept on pushing into the final seconds of the game, keeping his starters in. Most teams, down that much and in the final couple of minutes would have sent in the backups to throw it around. Parcells kept all his starterss in and kept driving for meaningless points in the last minute of the game, so yeah, I don't blame Williams one bit for sending blitzes in that situation.

I wouldn't blame Belichick one bit for blitzing us when we were pushing for meaningless points late in the game either. Frankly I'm not sure why CP, Moss, and our precious few offensive linemen that we have left were still in the game at that point. Seems like a needless risk by Gibbs and Co. to me.

So in that situation, yeah, Belichick can blitz all he wants and I've got no problem. Turning around and piliing it on with the offensive play calling is a different issue - he sets the tone with that, not us.[/QUOTE]


Well did we pull all our starters out on defense and run up the white flag? If not according to what you have said there is no difference in circumstances.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=firstdown;370998]Man the more I read this thread the more I wish it was us smacking teams around the field like they have been doing. Indy is next and will loose by more than 14 points![/quote]Indy has a good D, plus, their offense can take time off the clock and actually score points. I won't be surprised at all if Indy wins, actually I expect them to.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=offiss;370999]Well did we pull all our starters out on defense and run up the white flag? If not according to what you have said there is no difference in circumstances.[/quote]

And if we did that, I can't even fathom the kind and quantity of venom people would be spewing here today.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=TheBigD;371000]Indy has a good D, plus, their offense can take time off the clock and actually score points. I won't be surprised at all if Indy wins, actually I expect them to.[/quote]
Thats all good but the Pats are playing with the attitude to go along with great play and is going to stuff the Colts.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=firstdown;371007]Thats all good but the Pats are playing with the attitude to go along with great play and is going to stuff the Colts.[/quote]
The Colts aren't bad themselves. Why expect them to lose when they are as good if not better? It was in the 4th quarter that the game out of reach for Dallas. I expect Indy to score more than Dallas (if needed) and stay close and win.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

You know as much as I would love to see the Colts kick the crap out of the Patriots it just isn't going to happen. The Patriots are simply too good. Yes, the Colts are probably the 2nd best team in the NFL, but the Patriots are head and shoulders above everyone else.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=TheBigD;371015]The Colts aren't bad themselves. Why expect them to lose when they are as good if not better? It was in the 4th quarter that the game out of reach for Dallas. I expect Indy to score more than Dallas (if needed) and stay close and win.[/quote]
No after you took the lead and the Pats got the ball back you guys were done. Maybe not by the score board but the Pats were determined to do you in from that point on. They came back and scored and never looked back.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

This is [I]professional [/I]football. Bilicheck did not show professionalism. He risked his players, risked his opponents players and flat out violated what has been a "Gentlemen's Agreement" since pro football began.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=offiss;370993]Couldn't agree more![/QUOTE]

Because at 38-0 we didn't realize just how many problems we have? :doh:

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=Skinsfan1967;371037]This is [I]professional [/I]football. Bilicheck did not show professionalism. He risked his players, risked his opponents players and flat out violated what has been a "Gentlemen's Agreement" since pro football began.[/quote]

Although I agree with you about risking his players ,he has nothing to do with risking the Skins and the "Gentleman's Agreement" you talk of has never existed.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

I am not advocating anything in particular here, but I really do hope for something real bad to happen to the pats. Classless pieces of sub-human feces. I have never felt that way towards any other team, including dallas.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=Giantone;371062]Although I agree with you about risking his players ,he has nothing to do with risking the Skins and the "Gentleman's Agreement" you talk of has never existed.[/QUOTE]

I certainly beg to differ. There has always and yes I do mean always been an agreement not to run up the score in the NFL. It is called sportmanship, something that a fan of a team as rich in history as the Giants surely understands.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

get over it. Maybe gibbs will learn a lesson. Never let you foot of the opponents throat. Its the defense's job to stop the pats. But they couldnt do it so too bad. Its time for the skins to stop crying and wins some damn games. Did we stop trying to score we were down 38-0?? No then why should they. Maybe that why the pats are winners and we are at best .500 team.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

the only thing i have to say is, does anyone think coach Gibbs would be going for a 4th and 2 leading 38-0? you can say what you want to about our coach, but the word class will always fit next to our hall of fame coaches name. that was rubbing it in, no matter how you look at it. these guys are pros, and you know the old saying, what comes around always goes around. it would be a shame to see Brady go down with a really big lead. to me, the patriots coach might be as good as they come, but is really lacking in professionalism

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=Giantone;371062]Although I agree with you about risking his players ,he has nothing to do with risking the Skins and the[B] "Gentleman's[/B] [B]Agreement"[/B] you talk of has never existed.[/quote]
these guys are grown men. can you remember any other teams trying to humiliate another team like the patriots do? in 1991, the skins could have really laid it to some teams. but our coach always takes the high road. i would rather win with coach Gibbs, the right way.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=dmek25;371089]these guys are grown men. can you remember any other teams trying to humiliate another team like the patriots do? in 1991, the skins could have really laid it to some teams. but our coach always takes the high rode. i would rather win with coach Gibbs, the right way.[/QUOTE]

And how about Super Bowl XXII as well?

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[QUOTE=CHIEF CHUCKING MY SPEAR;371078]get over it. Maybe gibbs will learn a lesson. Never let you foot of the opponents throat. Its the defense's job to stop the pats. But they couldnt do it so too bad. Its time for the skins to stop crying and wins some damn games. Did we stop trying to score we were down 38-0?? No then why should they. [B]Maybe that why the pats are winners and we are at best .500 team[/B].[/QUOTE]

Or maybe it's the reason why everyone thinks the Pats lack class. It's akin to beating a guy in a boxing match and then just stomping on his head as he sits there motionless. Sorry, but that's a punk move.

Also, FYI 4-3 is above .500.

Finally, I'm tired of hearing people say that we are crying like babies for calling the Pats out for showing no class. I'm not crying, I'm pissed. Perhaps you cry when you are angry, but I don't.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;371101]Or maybe it's the reason why everyone thinks the Pats lack class. It's akin to beating a guy in a boxing match and then just stomping on his head as he sits there motionless. Sorry, but that's a punk move.

Also, FYI 4-3 is above .500.

Finally, I'm tired of hearing people say that we are crying like babies for calling the Pats out for showing no class. I'm not crying, I'm pissed. Perhaps you cry when you are angry, but I don't.[/quote]


SBF, here's where I split with the masses on this issue. In your example, and trust me I'm not trying to nit pick here, but you said if a guy is down and get's stomped (paraphrase after two glasses of wine), then that's a classless act. I agree there. I think classless, by my own definition, is when the other guy can't do anything about it or there is clear disadvantage. Sure, BB in his heart probably has ill intentions not entirely directed at the Redskins or coach Gibbs, mind you, but there was no clear disadvangtage on our part. So I don't really see where he was being so classless. Is he bitter? Perhaps. Classless, I don't know.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;371101]Or maybe it's the reason why everyone thinks the Pats lack class. It's akin to beating a guy in a boxing match and then just stomping on his head as he sits there motionless. Sorry, but that's a punk move.

Also, FYI 4-3 is above .500.

Finally, I'm tired of hearing people say that we are crying like babies for calling the Pats out for showing no class. I'm not crying, I'm pissed. Perhaps you cry when you are angry, but I don't.[/quote]

We're seeing eye to eye on this one. While I do agree that it's our job to stop them, having Brady in the game and going for it on 4th down when it's 42-0 and their on the 40-something yard line is a total punk move.

Numerous players, including LT, just about the classiest guy around, has called out Belichick for this kinda stuff. Oh yeah, he also cheats and then lies about it. I'm really pissed too. Frankly I'd like punch him straight in his smug little smirk. Assbag.

At the same time, I think we have a massive amount of work to do. We all knew going into this game our offense had and continues to have major issues. Now we lose Rogers for the year and get completely trampled on D?? If some things don't start changing I could definitely see us ending up as an average, .500 team.

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

Running up the score is definitely classless. Once you've shown your opponent that the game is decided in your favor you back off, put in your replacements and let the game finish. That's learned by most humans in Little League Sports 101.

I can't say I was/am pissed about it, I know some people are just naturally weak and can't control the urge to rub it in...that's life. We all run into these types of peole in just about every facet of life. Best thing to do is pay him no mind. I do feel annoyed and dissappointed simply because there are probably more than a few kids in the Boston area that will learn from this and think it's okay. Oh well, there's a correlation to more time spent on the field and injuries suffered. Play your guys when you don't to and you can be sure sooner or later a knee will blow out or a shoulder will seperate or....

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

I have no problem with the Patriots offense doing what offenses are supposed to do -- score points. It is not the job of any offense to deliberately not make it into the endzone just to make the opposing team feel better.

If you don't want the score to be run up then stop them, or shut up.

How about this... if a team that is ahead by an absurd margin agrees not to "run up the score", should the other team also agree not to try to score?

Re: Classless Coach Belichick
 

Classless or not, I would think running up the score would be dangerous. ...for your quarterback. I would think that eventually somebody's gonna go Buddy Ryan on your ass.

I mean, if I'm the Jets or Miami--two teams that have all but given up on the season--why would I go out there and embarrass myself in front of my fans against a team that totally outclasses me and fully intends to run up the score? At some point, when a coach is watchin' the film, it has to occur to him that his best chance of winning, rather, his best chance of not getting completely embarrassed is to knock Tom Brady out of the game.

I mean, if I'm the coach of a marginal team, a guy who may or may not be on the hot seat anyway, what's worst?

A) Getting the score run up on you in front of your home crowd.
B) The opposition ridiculing you by putting their defense in as offense.
C) Both A and B
D) Taking a fifteen yard penalty and breaking Tom Brady's legs.

I think Buddy Ryan would opt for the latter. It only takes one coach to come to that conclusion. The Pats have a bunch more games to play, some of them against their division rivals, and it only takes one--just one coach--to say, "I'm not gonna let that happen to me."

Belichick is gonna take Tom Brady out of the game [I]after[/I] they run up the score, so if you want to stop that from happening, logic says you're gonna have to take care of Tom Brady [I]before[/I] he runs up the score.

Things happen in games. Players get ejected. Players get suspended--it happens all the time. Every week some players get hurt. If they have a penalty for something, in a way, it's part of the game. It wouldn't be the first time a quarterback's leg was broken.