Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

We should have kept Chase...but seriously folks, Jake Plummer totally sympathizes with McNabb right about now.

But Shanahan tends to be this way, he likes to shake things up at seemingly the oddest times at the QB position. I don't think he will this time namely because I'm not sure he has anyone to turn to. I think he realizes McNabb is the best option. I don't know about the Shanahans not liking the tempo of how McNabb practices, but they certainly have been frustrated with certain elements of his game. Well one, his footwork

Back to Chase, I'm not saying we should have kept him (though we should have) and I'm not saying we should have traded up for Sam Bradford (would have taken him at #4 though if he was there)...but I'm still surprised we didn't draft any future QB in the later rounds.

I didn't see anything really from Beck to think he's the answer

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Mattyk;755213]Just shoot me now, not sure I can take 2 weeks of this talk[/quote]

You can thank the head coach for materializing this out of thin air.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Mattyk;755216]Norv isn't even 60 yet, where do u get this stuff?[/quote]

Matty please forgive me. I remembered Norv as a former coach from way back and confused him with Marty Shottenheimer, who i believe is near 70. Again, my apologies.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

Cmon guys Shanny isn't going anywhere

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755212]Shoot if Haslett could stay on and really get the D going, I would take another shot at Norv once the axe falls in San Diego, if Shanny bolts next season. Give Jim the HC job Norv back at OC or Give Norv the HC/OC and keep Jim as DC. I know I am really going off on a tangent, but these excuses coming out every few hours is moronic. Is this guy for real? He is losing credibility by the hour!!!!![/quote]

If we brought Norv back as HC, I would instantly resign as a moderator here and leave this site.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;755219]You can thank the head coach for materializing this out of thin air.[/quote]

Not sure I would say it's out of thin air, McNabb has played like shit most of the year. It was only a matter of time before it came to a head.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;755214]I'm all for blowing things up again here if the season totally tanks, but isn't Norv like 70 years old???

Nothing against elderly people (this time lol, reference to a thread long ago), but we need a somewhat young coach who could be here for more than 3 or 4 years.

But thinking of old coaches, is there any chance at all we can get Joe Gibbs to come back if Shanahan quits or is fired??:food-smil

That last part is meant to be a joke. I remember when i was still at Extreme Skins and they actually had a long thread about how they could try and get Joe Gibbs to come back after Zorn's first 8-8 season....lol[/quote]Norv isn't even 60, and honestly, we have not had a consistently decent offense since Norv was here. I would take him back as our OC after watching years of crap on the offensive side of the ball.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;755221]Cmon guys Shanny isn't going anywhere[/quote]

He's definitely not, the fact it's even being brought up is insanity.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;755214]I'm all for blowing things up again here if the season totally tanks, but isn't Norv like 70 years old???

Nothing against elderly people (this time lol, reference to a thread long ago), but we need a somewhat young coach who could be here for more than 3 or 4 years.

But thinking of old coaches, is there any chance at all we can get Joe Gibbs to come back if Shanahan quits or is fired??:food-smil[/quote]
Norv's problem was he was too laid back and his pass defense, minus Darrell was very bad. And I am not all that serious about wanting Norv back, but this excuse a minute for the benching crap is weird. I rather have a guy with balls, and who takes responsiblity, and can work with what he has and adapt that with his system he has brought in. Donovan came in here really excited and with a great attitude, just to be treated like a scapegoat? Sure I admit, that he hasn't played to expectations, but what QB can with a substandard line that is learning an entirely different blocking scheme? Gibbs would have never done this, Norv or Spurrier either.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=SouperMeister;755224]Norv isn't even 60, and honestly, we have not had a consistently decent offense since Norv was here. I would take him back as our OC after watching years of crap on the offensive side of the ball.[/quote]

I confused Norv with Shottenheimer. I agree with you though. Looking back on the stats, the redskins problem for a very long time has been a weak offense. Except for 2005, when were we blowing anybody out??

What was their secret in 2005? Brunell was playing like the Pro Bowl QB he was in Jacksonville, Portis was not physically shot, Santana was looking like an All Pro, and Joe Gibbs had found his Midas Touch again. But what did they actually do that made the offense so powerful?? I mean we even had a 43 year old starting lineman...

Why can't Shanahan do the same thing???

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Mattyk;755223]Not sure I would say it's out of thin air, McNabb has played like shit most of the year. It was only a matter of time before it came to a head.[/quote]

If McNabb has played like shit, how would you describe Rabach's play?

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Mattyk;755225]He's definitely not, the fact it's even being brought up is insanity.[/quote]

I don't think he is either, but you have to admit this is bizarre. Why all of a sudden turn on your star QB with 2 minutes left in a game? If you wanted to try and light a spark, just say so, no controversy. Shanny is losing credibilty. He is coming off as a hypocrite also. My point with the ex Skins coaches is that they had class and took responsiblity, and either left or got canned, without blaming folks. Shanny wants his player to take responsiblity and walk the walk, then he should be the one leading by example.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755227]Norv's problem was he was too laid back and his pass defense, minus Darrell was very bad. And I am not all that serious about wanting Norv back, but this excuse a minute for the benching crap is weird. I rather have a guy with balls, and who takes responsiblity, and can work with what he has and adapt that with his system he has brought in. Donovan came in here really excited and with a great attitude, just to be treated like a scapegoat? Sure I admit, that he hasn't played to expectations, but what QB can with a substandard line that is learning an entirely different blocking scheme? Gibbs would have never done this, Norv or Spurrier either.[/quote]I honestly don't want Norv either, but it's fun to reminisce to a time when we had an offense that could kick some serious ass with both potent running and passing attacks.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;755229]If McNabb has played like shit, how would you describe Rabach's play?[/quote]

There's a lot of guys that need to pick it up. Fair or not things always start and end with the QB though.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

Also if all these things Shanny has said were his true thoughts, why did it take for him to pull Donovan with less than 3 minutes left against the Lions? Shoot name Rex the starter against the Lions, da Bears, Pack, etc, if DM was out of shape and not getting the offense.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755230]I don't think he is either, but you have to admit this is bizarre. Why all of a sudden turn on your star QB with 2 minutes left in a game? If you wanted to try and light a spark, just say so, no controversy. Shanny is losing credibilty. He is coming off as a hypocrite also. My point with the ex Skins coaches is that they had class and took responsiblity, and either left or got canned, without blaming folks. Shanny wants his player to take responsiblity and walk the walk, then he should be the one leading by example.[/quote]

Damn straight, even Zorn did not give a straight answer regarding his opinion on whether or not JC was a "franchise QB" and instead praised JC's toughness to dodge the question.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

I guarantee you guys mike shanahan will make this team a contender really soon.. Shit we were 4-12 last season, we could double that in one year.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

McNabb is one and done. He's not what they are looking for to run this offense and will not be a Redskin next season IMO.

Win some, ya loss some. This is a second and I believe a future fourth round (Maybe contingent) pick loss for us. I have been very dissatisfied with McNabb being way to inconsistent and very slow at best to learn this system.

The End.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;755236]I guarantee you guys mike shanahan will make this team a contender really soon.. Shit we were 4-12 last season, we could double that in one year.[/quote]

Good luck with that, I thought I would be drinking the Kool-Aid again within 2-3 years, but it seems I'll have to postpone it until we're laughing at Carlos Rogers being old and washed up on some other team 5 years from now.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Mattyk;755233]There's a lot of guys that need to pick it up. Fair or not things always start and end with the QB though.[/quote]

I agree Matty, but my whole thing is if all these excuses coming from Shanny are true, then why did DM even get the start? And if it was to get a spark going, just say so, and it just blows over. Now you have the press all over Redskin Park looking for any juicy tidbit that will play a major distraction to a team that needs a lot of work. Shanny isn't coming off as really savvy here.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=SouperMeister;755232]I honestly don't want Norv either, but it's fun to reminisce to a time when we had an offense that could kick some serious ass with both potent running and passing attacks.[/quote]

Bring back Terry Allen and Henry Ellard.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

Norv repeatedly passed the buck, but this isn't about Norv...

We all like that Shanahan/Allen have been much more secretive, less forthcoming than Zorn/Cerrato who were extremely candid. Zorn, at least. But right now I don't know if Shanahan is purposely saying all these different things publicly to confuse people or if he's been so focused on keeping people guessing that he's confusing even himself.

End of the day, as long as he is forthright and honest with McNabb and the rest of the players I don't really care if he tells me he didn't want McNabb playing at the end because his astrologer told him not to

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;755236]I guarantee you guys mike shanahan will make this team a contender really soon.. Shit we were 4-12 last season, we could double that in one year.[/quote]


Let's see what Rex does before you mention the words really soon. For Shanny's system to work we will have to replace our entire line and the backups with guys that can perform his new blocking schemes. That is two seasons at the very least. You have to also flip a coin if Grossman can somehow materialize into an all pro QB(unlikely). If not, you have to draft a kid, and if we finish 7-9 to 9-7 forget getting the top QB(s). Bottom line is you aren't going to erase the damage Vinny has done over a decade in a couple seasons.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Longtimefan;755244]Bring back Terry Allen and Henry Ellard.[/quote]Our two best signings early in the Norv Turner era. Allen was a warrior and Ellard was the perfect route runner. Give me a team full of Terry Allens and Henry Ellards.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=SouperMeister;755248]Our two best signings early in the Norv Turner era. Allen was a warrior and Ellard was the perfect route runner. Give me a team full of Terry Allens and Henry Ellards.[/quote]

They were beasts in Madden '95. :D

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

This is how dishonesty starts...you tell a lie to cover for yourself...then you tell another to cover for that...then a 3rd...

Lets see.
Grossman knew the 2 minute drill better....then
McNabb isn't in condition....then
McNabb doesn't practice well enough.

The next thing I expect Shanny to say is...."I slept with McNabb's Mother!"

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=skinsnut;755250]This is how dishonesty starts...you tell a lie to cover for yourself...then you tell another to cover for that...then a 3rd...

Lets see.
Grossman knew the 2 minute drill better....then
McNabb isn't in condition....then
McNabb doesn't practice well enough.

The next thing I expect Shanny to say is...."I slept with McNabb's Mother!"[/quote]

Did she provide Chunky Soup for dinner?

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=SmootSmack;755046]While we're talking McNabb. Watching that Armstrong 50 yard pass, the one that led to the Keiland Wiliams TD. Is it just me or does Armstrong have to stop and adjust for most of McNabb's deep throws? Not seeing many in stride[/quote]I thought on one that Armstrong throttled down to catch the ball, he still could have turned it on after the catch and split the two safeties. I think he went and cut it back to the outside and got around one safety while the other tackled him.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

I guess the "blind faith" Shanny can do no wrong love goggles are finally coming off for some of you guys...thank goodness.
We can finally see things more objectively....

Perhaps....perhaps....Haynesworth isn't the antichrist we thought he was....and Devin Thomas and Dockery? maybe...."possibly" Shanny "maybe" could have made a mistake there too?

Let's not always drink the kool-aid when we get a new coach guys.
And Bruce Allen aint God either....he is a GM...an average one...yes better than pure crap...but an average one.

You can generally believe patterns of people to continue.
Shanny to be an ego-maniac, Hasslet to produce 20th ranked defenses, Allen to be average, McNabb to be hot and cold and have occassional irratic accuracy.
So Shanny won 2 SB's....remember they fired the guy too...and there just as much reason for that as there was for Philly trading us McNabb.

I don't know of another SB winning coach that was ever fired...these current actions certainly are consistant with his past M.O.

Don't get me wrong...I still think he is rock solid...he can just be a jerk sometimes and who wants a boss who is a jerk?

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;755251]Did she provide Chunky Soup for dinner?[/quote]

That was in lieu of a cigarette

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

Brian Billick and Jon Gruden come to mind quickly.


[quote=skinsnut;755255]I guess the "blind faith" Shanny can do no wrong love goggles are finally coming off for some of you guys...thank goodness.
We can finally see things more objectively....

Perhaps....perhaps....Haynesworth isn't the antichrist we thought he was....and Devin Thomas and Dockery? maybe...."possibly" Shanny "maybe" could have made a mistake there too?

Let's not always drink the kool-aid when we get a new coach guys.
And Bruce Allen aint God either....he is a GM...an average one...yes better than pure crap...but an average one.

You can generally believe patterns of people to continue.
Shanny to be an ego-maniac, Hasslet to produce 20th ranked defenses, Allen to be average, McNabb to be hot and cold and have occassional irratic accuracy.
So Shanny won 2 SB's....remember they fired the guy too...and there just as much reason for that as there was for Philly trading us McNabb.

[B]I don't know of another SB winning coach that was ever fired[/B]...these current actions certainly are consistant with his past M.O.

Don't get me wrong...I still think he is rock solid...he can just be a jerk sometimes and who wants a boss who is a jerk?[/quote]

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

Seifert, Gruden, Billick, all SB winning coaches that got fired. I'm sure there are many others.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755206]Doesn't matter who we bring in man, we have no line, or a good WR corp!!!!! We could bring Peyton Manning or Aaron Rodgers in here and either one of them would be ineffective. Shanny is being exposed for being an egomaniac or at the very least too akin to knee jerk decisions. I am really starting to believe we were yet again sold a bill of goods. Yet another "savior" HC pick that will turn us around. Thing is our linemen are not used to or built for his blocking schemes. He needs to figure out how to tinker with this or he is going to bolt like Spurrier. [B]Shit, I would take Spurrier over Shanny anyday.[/B] He might have ruined Ramsey trying the Fun N Gun, but he didn't blame anyone or throw folks under the bus, when it didn't work out. I still root for Spurrier. The man has class, like Coach Gibbs.[/quote]

Get out. You know nothing.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755234]Also if all these things Shanny has said were his true thoughts, why did it take for him to pull Donovan with less than 3 minutes left against the Lions? Shoot name Rex the starter against the Lions, da Bears, Pack, etc, if DM was out of shape and not getting the offense.[/quote]

The "excuse a minute" is coming from the media -- not Shanahan. Everyone has an opinion, or something to add. It's not Shanahan, so chill out.

Your problem is that you believe everything you read, and most of it isn't even coming from Redskins park. Shanahan doesn't think Grossman is the answer, and the 2 minute stuff is just a lame excuse to make the reporter shut up. Like SS has said several times, they were pissed about the pick, McNabb set up the wrong play at least once, and they had enough crap so they pulled him. It was a knee-jerk reaction, and I'm sure looking back Shanahan knows it was a mistake. Over and done. Move on.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;755268]Get out. You know nothing.[/quote]


Know nothing!!!!!! The guy didn't seem arrogant to me. Yeah, he might have misjudged that the Fun N Gun would work in the NFL, but he never pulled an excuse a minute thing pulling a QB. I am talking about character more than anything. Besides, Spurrier seems to know how to build something, just not in the NFL unfortunately.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755241]I agree Matty, but my whole thing is if all these excuses coming from Shanny are true, then why did DM even get the start? And if it was to get a spark going, just say so, and it just blows over. Now you have the press all over Redskin Park looking for any juicy tidbit that will play a major distraction to a team that needs a lot of work. [B]Shanny isn't coming off as really savvy here.[/B][/quote]

You're right about this: Shanahan is not media savvy, and that is really what this is all about. He's not a smooth-talker, and he doesn't have the elegance to dodge questions gracefully. This could have been diffused with some good lying, but Shanahan's not a good liar. So what.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;755273]The "excuse a minute" is coming from the media -- not Shanahan. Everyone has an opinion, or something to add. It's not Shanahan, so chill out.

Your problem is that you believe everything you read, and most of it isn't even coming from Redskins park. Shanahan doesn't think Grossman is the answer, and the 2 minute stuff is just a lame excuse to make the reporter shut up. Like SS has said several times, they were pissed about the pick, McNabb set up the wrong play at least once, and they had enough crap so they pulled him. It was a knee-jerk reaction, and I'm sure looking back Shanahan knows it was a mistake. Over and done. Move on.[/quote]


Well then NFL.com and Yahoo sports are a bunch of liars. My question to you was why didn't Shanny just say he thought a spark was needed and defuse the situation. The whole thing is dumb. He had every right to pull him, but these excuses make it look bad. The last thing we need is controversy, when the staff needs to right what is wrong with the offense.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755274]Know nothing!!!!!! The guy didn't seem arrogant to me. Yeah, he might have misjudged that the Fun N Gun would work in the NFL, but he never pulled an excuse a minute thing pulling a QB. I am talking about character more than anything. Besides, Spurrier seems to know how to build something, just not in the NFL unfortunately.[/quote]

We're talking about a guy who basically laughed in the faces of all NFL coaches and their work hours. Yeah no arrogance there.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;755276]Well then NFL.com and Yahoo sports are a bunch of liars. My question to you was why didn't Shanny just say he thought a spark was needed and defuse the situation. The whole thing is dumb. He had every right to pull him, but these excuses make it look bad. The last thing we need is controversy, when the staff needs to right what is wrong with the offense.[/quote]

How do you know a controversy exists? Other than the media suggesting such things. The media is frequently more concerned with being first to break a story whether one exists or not all to often.

Re: Mcnabb appears to be done and he is the reason for this loss
 

[quote=Mattyk;755277]We're talking about a guy who basically laughed in the faces of all NFL coaches and their work hours. Yeah no arrogance there.[/quote]


[IMG]http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/spurrierpresserfinal.jpg[/IMG]
"[URL="http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/08/post_14.html"]We wound up 5-11!!![/URL]"