Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=SmootSmack;420479]I'm so happy I've kept my Jim Zorn rookie card all these years[/quote]


LOL............I always thought he was a hellofa QB..........and a lefty to boot.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=Giantone;420497]No he was the scape goat,the O stunk becuase it was Billicks not Fassels.
Fassel is right,after the way all the coachs interviewed were treated Snyder is praying this works out becuase if it does'nt he's dead in the water.[/quote]

Jim Fassel is a bad candidate. The Ravens went 13-3 that year with their offense making a complete turn around after they fired fassel, so I don't think their faltering was billick's fault. The facts support the opposite...

I've been critical of Snyder, and flat out have little to no faith in Vinny, but how the hell did he mistreat all of the people he interviewed? Because they didn't get the job they were mistreated?

If someone minded being left on the hook, they would've withdrawn their name from consideration. DS actually spent time on this decision and didn't make a huge splash, so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt here.

BTW... Fassel's sour grapes comments hopefully give people a glimpse into the sides of his character that really rub people the wrong way. He's just [I]that [/I]kind of guy, you know....

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=jamf;420487]Worried about the Baltimore thing? That was more than just a thing Jim. Your best friend fired you for running the offense into the ground and being a poor play caller.[/QUOTE]

Oh please. Jim Fassel ran the Ravens offense into the ground?

That offense had been dead and buried for years before Fassel got there. That would be like Dennis Kucinich hiring a new campaign manager right before he dropped out and blaming failure on him.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

Fassel was just on Mike & Mike. The interesting thing he said was that he was [U]directly[/U] involved in the hiring of Zorn and Blache. He even was speaking with Zorn after Zorn became the OC. Bizarre.

As an aside, although Fassel is saying he likes DS, I think his press blitz has a point and that is to provide a cautionary tale to other coaches who in the future would be interviewing for the Skins. He is pointing out the fact that 2nd time coaches have been very successful as of late as opposed to first time coaches. He is also pointing out that he was all but offered the job and then got jilted. Don't think for a minute that this kind of stuff isn't remembered. I am going all in with Zorn because I think if he fails, this job would be even less attractive to a future HC candidate. Plus, Whatever the motive of Fassel he is sounding kind of whiny. And of course, Zorn has the old school flat-top so we have that going for us!

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

Fassel is on Mike and Mike right now. He is really taken the high road. He sais that he and Dan remain good friends. He also confirms that hiring Zorn as the OC was his recommendation and would have been his guy. Its kind of a sad thing for me...I almost wish he came out and slammed our organization, it would have been easier for me to dislike him. He spoke well of the organization and wished everyone well. Pretty classy guy.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=redwagonskins;420517]Fassel was just on Mike & Mike. The interesting thing he said was that he was [U]directly[/U] involved in the hiring of Zorn and Blache. He even was speaking with Zorn after Zorn became the OC. Bizarre.

As an aside, although Fassel is saying he likes DS, I think his press blitz has a point and that is to provide a cautionary tale to other coaches who in the future would be interviewing for the Skins. [B]He is pointing out the fact that 2nd time coaches have been very successful as of late as opposed to first time coaches.[/B] He is also pointing out that he was all but offered the job and then got jilted. Don't think for a minute that this kind of stuff isn't remembered. I am going all in with Zorn because I think if he fails, this job would be even less attractive to a future HC candidate. Plus, Whatever the motive of Fassel he is sounding kind of whiny. And of course, Zorn has the old school flat-top so we have that going for us![/quote]Who cares about his opinion on this. Just because other coaches have had success in other situations doesn't mean it would work out for us. Every situation is different. And secondly,being "all but offered a job" isn't the same as being "offered" a job.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=CooleyFanOV;420518]Fassel is on Mike and Mike right now. He is really taken the high road. He sais that he and Dan remain good friends. He also confirms that hiring Zorn as the OC was his recommendation and would have been his guy. Its kind of a sad thing for me...I almost wish he came out and slammed our organization, it would have been easier for me to dislike him. He spoke well of the organization and wished everyone well. Pretty classy guy.[/quote]

He knows how to play the game. Slamming the Redskins is not going to help his chances of getting back into coaching, whether it's a deserved slamming or not. The best thing he can do is take the high road.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=gibbsisgod;420520]Who cares about his opinion on this. Just because other coaches have had success in other situations doesn't mean it would work out for us. Every situation is different. And secondly,being "all but offered a job" isn't the same as being "offered" a job.[/QUOTE]

Well, actually, that isn't his opinion, that is a fact. Second times coaches have been more successful as of late than first time coaches. Whether it would work for the Skins is a whole different story. As for being all but offered the job, you are right. I was just pointing out that there is some motive to his going around on every sports show these last few days and it may have something to do with poisoning the well. Whether anybody cares or not is a totally different matter.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=Beemnseven;420509]Oh please. Jim Fassel ran the Ravens offense into the ground?

That offense had been dead and buried for years before Fassel got there. That would be like Dennis Kucinich hiring a new campaign manager right before he dropped out and blaming failure on him.[/quote]

I agree. B-more was Billick's mess all the way and Fassel just got caught in the middle and ended up being his scapegoat.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;420522]He knows how to play the game. [B]Slamming the Redskins is not going to help his chances of getting back into coaching[/B], whether it's a deserved slamming or not. The best thing he can do is take the high road.[/QUOTE]

My take on the interview is that he is being very subtle in his criticism, the subtext being "I gave these guys Zorn's name as my OC when they were saying I would be the HC, and then they stab my in the back." Maybe I'm reading too much into it but that's how it seemed to play.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=redwagonskins;420523]Well, actually, that isn't his opinion, that is a fact. Second times coaches have been more successful as of late than first time coaches. .[/quote]I would love for you to name some coaches to back that up because I'll bet I could name a few first timers that were just as successful. I could also name a few retreads that were total failures.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=redwagonskins;420525]My take on the interview is that he is being very subtle in his criticism, the subtext being "I gave these guys Zorn's name as my OC when they were saying I would be the HC, and then they stab my in the back." Maybe I'm reading too much into it but that's how it seemed to play.[/quote]He isn't they only one who had JZ high on their list of OC's.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=gibbsisgod;420526][B]I would love for you to name some coaches to back that up[/B] because I'll bet I could name a few first timers that were just as successful. I could also name a few retreads that were total failures.[/QUOTE]

SB XLII Winner Tom Coughlin, SB XLI Winner Tony Dungy, SB XXXIX, XXXVIII, XXXVI Winner Bill Belichick, SB XXXVII Winner John Gruden, SB XXXIV Winner Dick Vermeil, SB XXXIII, SB XXXII Winner Mike Shanahan. In fact, during that stretch (since 1997), only Cowher has won as a first time HC and he had been with the Steelers since 1992 and had 13 years in the position before winning in 2005.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=gibbsisgod;420527]He isn't they only one who had JZ high on their list of OC's.[/QUOTE]

I'm not saying he was, I am saying that is how he is spinning it.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

I can't answer yes or no because I don't know.

All I know about him is that he's the man who took Matt Hasselbeck from being a backup to a Pro-Bowler.

That's good. I've seen his short resume and can't make a decision either way.

I heard him speak about the offensive plans (keeping running game and blocking schemes the same whlle bringing in a West Coast-type passsing game) and his respect for our tradition and history.

I can't decide, it's a wait-and-see for me.

Not voting.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=gibbsisgod;420527]He isn't they only one who had JZ high on their list of OC's.[/QUOTE]

I think we should all just start calling our coach Jay-Z! (maybe Beyonce will accidentally show up at a press conference)

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=redwagonskins;420529]SB XLII Winner Tim Coughlin, SB XLI Winner Tony Dungy, SB XXXIX, XXXVIII, XXXVI Winner Belichick, SB XXXVII Winner John Gruden, SB XXXIV Winner Dick Vermeil, SB XXXIII, SB XXXII Winner Mike Shanahan. In fact, during that stretch (since 1997), only Cowher has won as a first time HC and he had been with the Steelers since 1992 and had 13 years in the position before winning in 2005.[/quote]
Well, I know when I have been beat! Gotta say, I didn't put as much thought in to it as you. I can give a few names of first timers that have been succesful but not to that extent (Payton, Mangini, Smith, Reid ,GB coach whose name I cant think of, etc.) None have SB rings but have been playoff teams and in the case of the first two, their first seasons as coaches they took their teams to the playoffs.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=gibbsisgod;420537]Well, I know when I have been beat! Gotta say, I didn't put as much thought in to it as you. I can give a few names of first timers that have been succesful but not to that extent (Payton, Mangini, Smith, Reid ,GB coach whose name I cant think of, etc.) None have SB rings but have been playoff teams and in the case of the first two, their first seasons as coaches they took their teams to the playoffs.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I was pretty shocked by this myself when I looked into it. Credit goes to Paintrain for setting me straight on this.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[YT]J2P1lvw4840[/YT]

:D

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=redwagonskins;420529]SB XLII Winner Tom Coughlin, SB XLI Winner Tony Dungy, SB XXXIX, XXXVIII, XXXVI Winner Bill Belichick, SB XXXVII Winner John Gruden, SB XXXIV Winner Dick Vermeil, SB XXXIII, SB XXXII Winner Mike Shanahan. In fact, during that stretch (since 1997), only Cowher has won as a first time HC and he had been with the Steelers since 1992 and had 13 years in the position before winning in 2005.[/QUOTE]

You forgot Billick as a 1st time coach that won a Super Bowl.. Easy mistake though, everyone considers him a loser.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=Paintrain;420545]You forgot Billick as a 1st time coach that won a Super Bowl.. Easy mistake though, everyone considers him a loser.[/QUOTE]

Billick XXXV. The list is complete (i'm too lazy to go any further back) ;)

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

Zorn has a good rep and many say great things about him. I truly hope (make that: “pray”) he has years of success running the Redskins. However, JZ, and sadly to an extent now Joe Gibbs, sound like shills for Dan Snyder. When Zorn says “I'm very excited that Dan and all those involved kept the continuity here before the head coach got here…” [url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/10/AR2008021002583.html]washingtonpost.com[/url]
It sounds so contrived and I’m sorry, but “continuity” went out the window when Gregg Williams was kicked to the curbside. During the press-conference at Redskins Park yesterday, Gibbs skirted that very issue very well when asked about it from Kelly Johnson of CSN. Spin control at its very best.

The thing that worries me the most is Jason Campbell’s development. Just how many different offensive schemes can one expect him to learn?? And it didn’t sound as if JZ cared very much about that fact as he stated “He's (JC) had all these coordinators in all these different years. Eh, bummer. That's his career…” Wow. If I’m JC, I’m not getting a warm fuzzy feeling about my new HC that allegedly has so much to offer from a QB coach’s standpoint. Like some of you, I’ll wait and see before I cast judgment. But for now, I’m leaning toward expecting the worst, and hoping for the best.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=redwagonskins;420554]Billick XXXV. The list is complete (i'm too lazy to go any further back) ;)[/QUOTE]

LOL, truth be told, I heard the names on Mike and Mike this morning after they talked to Fassel and I had forgotten Billick myself..

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

I guess Fassel has learned that when interviewing for a new job do not throw out names of other coaches who may be a better choice or liked more by the owner.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=Dlyne8r;420591]Zorn has a good rep and many say great things about him. I truly hope (make that: “pray”) he has years of success running the Redskins. However, JZ, and sadly to an extent now Joe Gibbs, sound like shills for Dan Snyder. When Zorn says “I'm very excited that Dan and all those involved kept the continuity here before the head coach got here…” [url=http://washingtonpost.com]washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines[/url]
It sounds so contrived and I’m sorry, but “continuity” went out the window when Gregg Williams was kicked to the curbside. During the press-conference at Redskins Park yesterday, Gibbs skirted that very issue very well when asked about it from Kelly Johnson of CSN. Spin control at its very best.

The thing that worries me the most is Jason Campbell’s development. Just how many different offensive schemes can one expect him to learn?? And it didn’t sound as if JZ cared very much about that fact as he stated “He's (JC) had all these coordinators in all these different years. Eh, bummer. That's his career…” Wow. If I’m JC, I’m not getting a warm fuzzy feeling about my new HC that allegedly has so much to offer from a QB coach’s standpoint. Like some of you, I’ll wait and see before I cast judgment. But for now, I’m leaning toward expecting the worst, and hoping for the best.[/quote]

I don't agree that continuity was out the window just because GW left. Our current staff is very much intact from last season so there is still a significant amount of continuity carried over.

As for his take on JC, I don't see anything wrong with what he said at all. If anything it's the cold hard truth. What happened in the past isn't his concern and it shouldn't be.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=Dlyne8r;420591]Zorn has a good rep and many say great things about him. I truly hope (make that: “pray”) he has years of success running the Redskins. However, JZ, and sadly to an extent now Joe Gibbs, sound like shills for Dan Snyder. When Zorn says “I'm very excited that Dan and all those involved kept the continuity here before the head coach got here…” [url=http://washingtonpost.com]washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines[/url]
It sounds so contrived and I’m sorry, but “continuity” went out the window when Gregg Williams was kicked to the curbside. During the press-conference at Redskins Park yesterday, Gibbs skirted that very issue very well when asked about it from Kelly Johnson of CSN. Spin control at its very best.

The thing that worries me the most is Jason Campbell’s development. Just how many different offensive schemes can one expect him to learn?? And it didn’t sound as if JZ cared very much about that fact as he stated “He's (JC) had all these coordinators in all these different years. Eh, bummer. That's his career…” Wow. If I’m JC, I’m not getting a warm fuzzy feeling about my new HC that allegedly has so much to offer from a QB coach’s standpoint. Like some of you, I’ll wait and see before I cast judgment. But for now, I’m leaning toward expecting the worst, and hoping for the best.[/quote]
Well JC has not shown me enough on the field to make hiring and firing decisions based off of what might or might not be JC best interest. Is he even a franchise QB? People point to the fact that he was hand picked by Gibbs and that Gibbs knows how to find QB's. Well if you look back at history Gibbs found 3 QB's which won SB's behind a very strong team but were any of these francise QB's? I'd say no. I'm not knocking how we won our SB's I'm pointing out that they were not franchise QB's and maybe JC is not either.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;420598]I don't agree that continuity was out the window just because GW left. Our current staff is very much intact from last season so there is still a significant amount of continuity carried over.

As for his take on JC, I don't see anything wrong with what he said at all. If anything it's the cold hard truth. What happened in the past isn't his concern and it shouldn't be.[/QUOTE]

I would say that "some" of the current staff is intact, and disagree that "...current staff [is] very much intact." Given the latest debacle with Earnest Byner, we may lose yet another coach. I simply can't accept where continuity was kept intact after Joe Gibbs resigned. You, nor anyone else for that matter, will ever be able to convince me otherwise.

I'm not so sure JC needed someone, especially the new HC, to remind him of the "cold hard truth" regarding his multiple offensive coordinators over the years. I thought it was a little flippant and inappropriate to say given that JZ was on a "national" stage.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;420602]Well JC has not shown me enough on the field to make hiring and firing decisions based off of what might or might not be JC best interest. Is he even a franchise QB? People point to the fact that he was hand picked by Gibbs and that Gibbs knows how to find QB's. Well if you look back at history Gibbs found 3 QB's which won SB's behind a very strong team but were any of these francise QB's? I'd say no. I'm not knocking how we won our SB's I'm pointing out that they were not franchise QB's and maybe JC is not either.[/QUOTE]

You somewhat prove my point. If JG hand picked JC, and JG won 3 SB's w/ 3 different QB's, then isn't it important to futher the development of JC? I would think that this was surely a big consideration when hiring JZ contrary to your comment. But, to potentially go to a WCO would set back a QB like JC as his strength has been the deep ball and not quick timing routes. I don't know fellas, I'll just have to wait and see on this one and hope that JC can adapt.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=Dlyne8r;420614]I would say that "some" of the current staff is intact, and disagree that "...current staff [is] very much intact." Given the latest debacle with Earnest Byner, we may lose yet another coach. I simply can't accept where continuity was kept intact after Joe Gibbs resigned. You, nor anyone else for that matter, will ever be able to convince me otherwise.

I'm not so sure JC needed someone, especially the new HC, to remind him of the "cold hard truth" regarding his multiple offensive coordinators over the years. I thought it was a little flippant and inappropriate to say given that JZ was on a "national" stage.[/quote]

Sounds like you've already got your mind made up on things, so I guess there's not much use to continuing a discussion.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;420602]Well JC has not shown me enough on the field to make hiring and firing decisions based off of what might or might not be JC best interest. Is he even a franchise QB? People point to the fact that he was hand picked by Gibbs and that Gibbs knows how to find QB's. Well if you look back at history Gibbs found 3 QB's which won SB's behind a very strong team but were any of these francise QB's? I'd say no. I'm not knocking how we won our SB's I'm pointing out that they were not franchise QB's and maybe JC is not either.[/QUOTE]


The Zorn decision while not limited to the development of JC, played a very important part in the decision to hire him. We do not know if Campbell is what's considered a "franchise" QB yet, but he was drafted with the hope of him becoming such in mind.

Joe Theisman ultimately became our FQ when you consider his length of service, despite the fact he was not origionally drafted by the Redskins. Doug Williams was drafted to be a FQ by the TBB, unfortunately, he was unable to spend his entire career with that franchise. Mark Rypien was a late round draft choice, not drafted with the idea of being considered a "Franchise QB" The jury is out on JC, there are unanswered questions, and we wont know until we weigh the results after he has maxed out his potential.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=Mattyk72;420621]Sounds like you've already got your mind made up on things, so I guess there's not much use to continuing a discussion.[/quote]

SNAFU in Skinsville

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

Only time will tell, he is at best an unknown entity??? I think this is more about the Redskins organization and how they make major staff hiring decision which clearly is “puzzling” at best.....

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

After thinking about it for a few days, I think I like this. I'm happy with having a young unproved HC that everyone seems to like and thinks is a "nice guy". I'm crossing my fingers for the best!!!

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

I think the defense will be fine and continue to grow. The Defensive Coordinator was promoted from within, so the defensive philosphy should stay realtively intact.

The offense will be the something to keep an eye on though.

An offensive change at this time in Campbells development is critical. He was just starting to hit his stride and be really comfortable in the old offense. This is not like JC is a 6 or 8 year veteran who has been around the block a few times. The timing of this with regard to the development of JC could not have been worse.

Not saying there will be failure, but it seems that right after the "growing pains" were waning with regard to JC, we will have to endure a whole new period of growing pains in a new offense.

Many will raise the "pot calling the kettle black" when I speak of Snyders "unique" hands-on management style. Simply because if my fan affiliation and the owner/GM I endure.

All I am saying is do you think Jack Kent Cooke would be doing business the same way, or approve of the way Snyder is doing business?

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

Jack Kent Cooke was definitely hands on. Times were different though. Difficult to compare the two really

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=Dlyne8r;420618]You somewhat prove my point. If JG hand picked JC, and JG won 3 SB's w/ 3 different QB's, then isn't it important to futher the development of JC? I would think that this was surely a big consideration when hiring JZ contrary to your comment. But, to potentially go to a WCO would set back a QB like JC as his strength has been the deep ball and not quick timing routes. I don't know fellas, I'll just have to wait and see on this one and hope that JC can adapt.[/quote]

Zorn specifically said during the press conference that the attack was going to be west coast influenced, not pure west coast. He was also adamnet about using the deep ball, as that plays to JC's strengths. So personally I don't see the deep ball going away any time soon. Hail!!!

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;420660]I think the defense will be fine and continue to grow. The Defensive Coordinator was promoted from within, so the defensive philosphy should stay realtively intact.

[/quote]

The best part about using the same system with a differnt coordinator is that the tendencies that your divison picked up on throughout the years are pretty much out the window. Now the teams in NFC East have to get used to preparing against Greg Blache while during the past four years they were use to preparing for Gregg Williams.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

I said yes...but this is a balsy move.
You ditch 2 coordinators with Head coaching experience and lose a HOF head coach and replace him "externally" with a position coach without HC experience.

Virtually all of our coaching staff would be considered equally or more experienced than Zorn....but....if Snyder is going with his gut....I can respect that.

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[QUOTE=sandtrapjack;420660]

All I am saying is do you think Jack Kent Cooke would be doing business the same way, or approve of the way Snyder is doing business?[/QUOTE]

Although Snyder and Cooke were radically different in many ways, this one move would be similar....this is a going with your gut hire.
Something Cooke did a lot

Re: BREAKING NEWS: Multiple Sources Confirm Jim Zorn Named Head Coach
 

[quote=SmootSmack;420666]Jack Kent Cooke was definitely hands on. Times were different though. Difficult to compare the two really[/quote]


Jack K Cooke was hands on but also new when to back off ...............something the Danny does"nt know.Jack Kent Cooke new GM's!