Commanders Post at The Warpath - What has Obama done well?

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Re: What has Obama done well?

Actually, I enjoy the politcal threads and think many issues were discussed and ideas exchanged - all in a rational (or close to rational) manner. It's just that by page 15 or so, we all know where we stand and the info has pretty much been exchanged and it degenerates into name calling. Just lock the thread when it gets to that point.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Mattyk72;579666]I think this thread illustrates that it's very rare that any political issues can be discussed in a rational, calm, and thoughtful manner around here. I guess it's just a reflection of society in general. Anyone think we should just go back to our old policy of no politics allowed?[/quote]

At least until the 2012 election is in full swing, and it should be its own forum so people who want to avoid it can avoid it. Let's face it, it's very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very rare that anybody on these political threads ever says "I was wrong" or "I hadn't thought about it that way" or "You (someone with an opposing view) bring up a good point."

You'll see most people admitting mistakes, misconceptions, changes of opinion in the locker room but almost never in these threads. And it just really renders the point of a message board moot. Not to single dblanch out, but what the heck, his response to SS33's post with links refuting his assertion pretty much epitomizes all that is wrong with these threads.

The shame of it all is that there a handful of people here who (while they generally don't waver at all) can engage in pretty intelligent political discussion. There are too many people here though who can't.

I have one other idea which I'll PM to you.

Re: What has Obama done well?

Maybe we should just be more aggressive in locking these bad boys. Or yeah, maybe it's own forum would make sense. I think these threads make people shy away from off topic talk in general since it tends to dominate the conversations.

Re: What has Obama done well?

Look, I'll admit I can be as intransigent as the next guy. At the same time, I also enjoy better understanding opposing points of view if only to make me question and better understand my own.

I think a separate political forum would be great. I enjoy debating politics with other skins fans b/c, at the end of the day, we can find SOMETHING to agree upon. There was a time when you linked to a different forum for political discussion. I went there and that ended up with just basic name calling w/out so much as a "how-do-you-do". Here at least, there is [I]some[/I] intelligent discussion before we get to the "poopy headed, bible thumping, cross-burner" portion of the thread.

Re: What has Obama done well?

It would be a shame to have to shut them down, I like hearing the wide diversity of views we have. We can still discuss things because at the core we all share a love of the Skins. SS & JoeR's takes are right on IMO. Maybe you guys could make them a separate forum and remove access to that forum from those who can't "play nice".

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=JoeRedskin;579693]Look, I'll admit I can be as intransigent as the next guy. At the same time, I also enjoy better understanding opposing points of view if only to make me question and better understand my own.

I think a separate political forum would be great. I enjoy debating politics with other skins fans b/c, at the end of the day, we can find SOMETHING to agree upon. [B]There was a time when you linked to a different forum for political discussion. I went there and that ended up with just basic name calling w/out so much as a "how-do-you-do". Here at least, there is [I]some[/I] intelligent discussion before we get to the "poopy headed, bible thumping, cross-burner" portion of the thread.[/B][/quote]

I see...Matty we should nix the thought of revisiting the idea of linking to a separate forum (not the same one as JR mentions here)

But what you experienced I think is a testament to Matty and how he runs this site and the standards he has set and expects and what you found elsewhere

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=SmootSmack;579698]I see...Matty we should nix the thought of revisiting the idea of linking to a separate forum (not the same one as JR mentions here)

[B]But what you experienced I think is a testament to Matty and how he runs this site and the standards he has set and expects and what you found elsewhere[/B][/quote]

Absolutely. It is why I would hate for a few a-holes to cause the elimination of a place where at least some relatively respectful discussion can take place. In just about every other forum that discusses politics, it is either a name calling fest OR preaching to the choir. I realize the political threads probably cause more moderator issues than others but, to me, the generally fair resolution of those issues makes this a desirable place to hold such discussion.

Re: What has Obama done well?

Nice try young grasshopper but freedom of speech only applies as the mods see fit.

Re: What has Obama done well?

I have said this before but make just a poltic form, then those who want to go in there can.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Mattyk72;579753]Nice try young grasshopper but freedom of speech only applies as the mods see fit.[/quote]

Dick Tater?

Re: What has Obama done well?

How about we just junk the off topic stuff completely?

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Mattyk72;579761]How about we just junk the off topic stuff completely?[/quote]

Do we get a vote or have you already made up your mind?

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=mredskins;579756]I have said this before but make just a poltic form, then those who want to go in there can.[/quote]

That would get my vote. We have one for other sports, we have one for Madden, we can have one for politics.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Trample the Elderly;579762]Do we get a vote or have you already made up your mind?[/quote]

This isn't a democracy.

Re: What has Obama done well?

I don't see what the big deal is as it is the off topic section and without politics it will become about as busy as the other sports section. If you don't want to talk politics then don't click on the thread and the ones that do click on the threads reframe from personal attacks. I have found that after so many pages on a subject it becomes the same thing over and over again and that the same for any topic on this entire site. Just read any of the longer threads about our O line or JC.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Mattyk72;579761]How about we just junk the off topic stuff completely?[/quote]

Seriously??? I think that is a bad idea, outside of the poltical threads there is very little fighting in the off topic section plus I usually get a good laugh, good advice, or learn something new in there.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=firstdown;579770]I don't see what the big deal is as it is the off topic section and without politics it will become about as busy as the other sports section. If you don't want to talk politics then don't click on the thread and the ones that do click on the threads reframe from personal attacks. I have found that after so many pages on a subject it becomes the same thing over and over again and that the same for any topic on this entire site. Just read any of the longer threads about our O line or JC.[/quote]

I would disagree I think there is a lot of traffic here in off topic even without the political stuff.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Mattyk72;579753]Nice try young grasshopper but freedom of speech only applies as the mods see fit.[/quote]

Hay, I'm down with "warning->temp ban->ban" model but to get rid of the whole forum section because of few bad apples seems too tyrannical to me.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Mattyk72;579761]How about we just junk the off topic stuff completely?[/quote]
[B]Turn that frown upside down Mister![/B]
Banish it to another forum area if you must............Let the "off topic" live on!!!!

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=mredskins;579774]I would disagree I think there is a lot of traffic here in off topic even without the political stuff.[/quote]

I'm wrong your right. Ok, Matty some one said it.

Re: What has Obama done well?

I'm really not serious about getting rid of the off topic talk.

Guess I'm just tired of clicking on a political thread and seeing 20 pages of:

You're an idiot...

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Mattyk72;579799]I'm really not serious about getting rid of the off topic talk.

Guess I'm just tired of clicking on a political thread and seeing 20 pages of:

You're an idiot...

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot

No, you're an idiot[/quote]

Of course you would never do any of that yourself. You idiot.LOL

Re: What has Obama done well?

in the...........off-season, the off-topic is the main forum

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=saden1;579777]Hay, I'm down with "warning->temp ban->ban" model but to get rid of the whole forum section because of few bad apples seems too tyrannical to me.[/quote]
Saden its becuase of you. LOL

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=JoeRedskin;579693]Look, I'll admit I can be as intransigent as the next guy. At the same time, I also enjoy better understanding opposing points of view if only to make me question and better understand my own.[/quote]

Inner conflict is the catalyst for moral development. As you already understand, an argument doesn't have to reach a resolution for it to be valuable. In fact, you could argue that conflict without resolution is the most valuable discussion of all.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;579877]Inner conflict is the catalyst for moral development. As you already understand, an argument doesn't have to reach a resolution for it to be valuable. In fact, you could argue that conflict without resolution is the most valuable discussion of all.[/quote]

There you go with that hippie nonsense again. Inner conflict, moral development, conflict resolution, how is it that you watch football? Do drop blotter when you watch it?

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Trample the Elderly;580094]There you go with that hippie nonsense again. Inner conflict, moral development, conflict resolution, how is it that you watch football? Do drop blotter when you watch it?[/quote]

I'll break it down for your feeble, bitter mind, inside that massively large head of yours... ;)

When people argue/discuss, two things can happen:

1.) You hear an idea that conforms to your already established beliefs

2.) You hear an idea that contradicts your established beliefs

When you hear an idea that contradicts your established beliefs, three things can happen:

1.) The conflict between the beliefs leads to a new belief (usually a synthesis of the two)

2.) The conflict between the beliefs is eventually dismissed and your previously held belief is stronger for withstanding the challenge

3.) The conflict between the beliefs is resolved by accepting the new belief

So, you see, true thought progress is made by conflict -- the inner conflict that happens within your mind when you consider new ideas that don't conform with established ones. The conflict is the catalyst for development. This is why I believe that discussing ideas with people that only agree with you is far less valuable than unresolved arguments where there is a lot of conflict.

P.S.: I don't watch football, I'm only here for political discussion :)

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;580153]I'll break it down for your feeble, bitter mind, inside that massively large head of yours... ;)

When people argue/discuss, two things can happen:

1.) You hear an idea that conforms to your already established beliefs

2.) You hear an idea that contradicts your established beliefs

When you hear an idea that contradicts your established beliefs, three things can happen:

1.) The conflict between the beliefs leads to a new belief (usually a synthesis of the two)

2.) The conflict between the beliefs is eventually dismissed and your previously held belief is stronger for withstanding the challenge

3.) The conflict between the beliefs is resolved by accepting the new belief

So, you see, true thought progress is made by conflict -- the inner conflict that happens within your mind when you consider new ideas that don't conform with established ones. The conflict is the catalyst for development. This is why I believe that discussing ideas with people that only agree with you is far less valuable than unresolved arguments where there is a lot of conflict.

P.S.: I don't watch football, I'm only here for political discussion :)[/quote]

Well said. Careful though. You may be labeled "bad apple" and the stormtroopers will be knocking on your door.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=dblanch66;580157]Well said. Careful though. You may be labeled "bad apple" and the stormtroopers will be knocking on your door.[/quote]
No one is going to overreact to a well thought out post such as Ghettos, although some may disagree. However PERHAPS you could learn from a well thought out post as well, and refrain from more juvenile tactics as name calling, etc.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=CRedskinsRule;580183]No one is going to overreact to a well thought out post such as Ghettos, although some may disagree. However PERHAPS you could learn from a well thought out post as well, and refrain from more juvenile tactics as name calling, etc.[/quote]

please forgive me.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;580153]I'll break it down for your feeble, bitter mind, inside that massively large head of yours... ;)

When people argue/discuss, two things can happen:

1.) You hear an idea that conforms to your already established beliefs

2.) You hear an idea that contradicts your established beliefs

When you hear an idea that contradicts your established beliefs, three things can happen:

1.) The conflict between the beliefs leads to a new belief (usually a synthesis of the two)

2.) The conflict between the beliefs is eventually dismissed and your previously held belief is stronger for withstanding the challenge

3.) The conflict between the beliefs is resolved by accepting the new belief

So, you see, true thought progress is made by conflict -- the inner conflict that happens within your mind when you consider new ideas that don't conform with established ones. The conflict is the catalyst for development. This is why I believe that discussing ideas with people that only agree with you is far less valuable than unresolved arguments where there is a lot of conflict.

P.S.: I don't watch football, I'm only here for political discussion :)[/quote]

That's very lofty. No good comes from drugs & alcohol. Remember that.

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=dblanch66;580185]please forgive me.[/quote]

It's not really about "forgiving you", as much as just encouraging you to have more civil tone. If you "got it" already, then outstanding!

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=Trample the Elderly;580189]That's very lofty. No good comes from drugs & alcohol. Remember that.[/quote]

What about good ........................ times? :D

(in the spirit of Hog1)

Re: What has Obama done well?

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;580192]What about good ........................ times? :D

(in the spirit of Hog1)[/quote]

That reminds of the Dave Chapelle show when they did the skit about the beer comercial and what they don't show you.

Re: What has Obama done well?

Originally Posted by SmootSmack
Very true...although it's interesting to note that when anyone mentioned how actions taken (or not taken) during the Clinton administration may have impacted the Bush administration that was usually brushed aside. Every president affects future presidents. It didn't just start with Bush/Obama

[I]I know. Having all that excess money in the National Treasury must've been a real bitch. [/I]

This was my first post. Tongue in cheek. Duh.

All of my comments were 'general' and not aimed at one particular person on the board or character assasinations of any one poster. Here's where it started:

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33
Bush positives: - concept of No Child Left Behind
- Tax cuts resulting in 52 consecutive months of job creation
- minimized federal funding of abortion
- Partial Birth Abortion Ban Act
- Global HIV/AIDS funding
- instrumental in expanding NATO alliance
- Roberts & Alito and other strict constructionalist judge appointments.
- consolidated and reformed intelligence sharing
- parts of Homeland Security (agencies under HS should've consolidated more to reduce costs not as much new spending)
- Bush Admin thwarted additional terrorist attempts to attack US citizens/interests.
- Afghanistan (should've had better long term strategy)
- Iraq (actual war well executed, long term strategy not-so-much.) Troop surge worked though.
- Response to early 2000s (Clinton) recession.
- Economic Stimulus Act (mostly tax rebates)
- Do Not Call Act

[I]Can I have some of the acid you just dropped? [/I]

I guess that was just way too mean. It's called "sense of humor". Suggesting that Slingin' was doing acid was a .....joke...

Then Slingin says: [I]Surprise, a lefty from LA disagrees.[/I]

My reply: [I]Assume my affiliations if you will. I voted for Paul. Independent from LA if you please. Did you understand all of "My Pet Goat" when Bush was reading it to you during the 911 attacks? [/I]

Again: joking. If I don't type a smiley face when kidding here, does it not come through? Then, I posted a few Bush You Tube links and wrote this:

[I]I can keep going. It's infinite, like the number of homosexual scandals of the republican party. [/I] Again...joke. Then came this:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack
[I]Me can't not undderstoood Myller. Me Stoopid Repbulican. Myller1oh1 so smart.

Ok, gotta run. Going to book my tickets for the Martha's Vineyard White House Tour. [/I]

Then me:

[I]Well...statisitcally 1/2 of [B][U]America[/U][/B] believes that christianity is older than judaism and I do believe most christians in the US are republican so..draw your own conclusions.[/I] Ok. Really? Did that really offend? And just because I don't post a link doesn't make it not true. It was quoted on All Things Considered on NPR. That's where I heard it.

To which this was the result:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack
[I]Woah, woah, woah...you're asking me to do math and also draw? That's too much for my little republican brain to handle all at once.[/I]

[I]hmmm...sarcasm. uneducated wit. [/I]

It's an Oscar Wilde quote. kinda witty.

Then this from Slingin:

[I]Link to this stat please.

Also may want to check this out....looks like Christian Democrats outnumber Christian Republicans, genius.

Mainline shows shift to Democrats | Christian Century | Find Articles at BNET

Among Catholics, the Ds outnumber Rs pretty significantly. Catholics make up about 23% of the country and are a solid chunk of the total number of Christians in the U.S.

[url]http://cara.georgetown.edu/pr061808.pdf[/url]

[B]So what conclusion should we draw again smart guy?[/B][/I]

I sure he meant "smart guy" in a nice way.

Then:

JoeRedskin writes:

[I]That dblanche is an idealogue with an agenda and obvious bias. Also, that dblanche calling Bush stupid is pretty much the kettle calling the pot black[/I].

[I]He probably gets the same "tingle" up his leg as Chris Matthews when Obama speaks.[/I]

and:
[I]And I would suggest someone who paints with as "wide a brush" in calling people dumbasses should look in the mirror to find the dumbass.[/I]

I never called anyone a dumbass.

And from Hog1:

[I]dblanche E Coyote...........Soooper genius [/I]

And more kindness from JoeRedskin with this lovely comment:

[I]You, however, make broad sweeping statements impying anyone who might have a different opinion from you is an idiot. Post whatever you want, you've already shown youself to be a mindless biased drone.[/I]

I guess none of those comments were provocation for my most controversial next post:

[I]I don't know, [U]poopy head[/U]. Maybe it's because more and more folks in 2008 wanted to disassociate themselves from the sinking ship. Sounds like you are a little butt hurt so a nerve was obviously struck.
It's nice to see a president that can have a beer because he isn't a dry drunk.
Speaking of which, republicans are like a college chick. give her a couple of long island ice teas and they can be talked into anything...war, patriot act, confirming a cleaning lady to the supreme court.
You need to replace your town halls with study halls.[/I]

Now see if you understand now, my use of "poopy head" was commenting on the childishness and personal venom of the prior comments. I was using HUMOR to illustrate a point which obviously soared above some very low heads. Then the whole thing went into a tailspin which I happily fueled to again prove a point. If you don't believe me, go back to page 14 or 15 to see for yourselves. Spin away, Karl Rove.

Re: What has Obama done well?

Would have been a lot simpler if you had said "I heard on All Things Considered that..." But you didn't so I guess we'll have to forgive you