Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=SmootSmack;782579]Let's not take this conversation in a direction it doesn't need to go[/quote]

I shall not...

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=SmootSmack;782579]Let's not take this conversation in a direction it doesn't need to go[/quote]


....just thinking,ya know if Hayensworth was Jewish.....you could combine all the threads.











.....oh come on it was a little funny.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

On the subject of DS' religion, I haven't checked, but I'm pretty damn sure he's the 1st Redskins owner that's Jewish. This is historically significant but doesn't get any attention due to the history of the Skins & their fanbase.

The Redskins were the team of the deep south before NO, Carolina, Atl, Tenn. & Dallas. George Marshall said he didn't want to integrate w/black players because he didn't think his fans would go for it. NOt saying that Jewish people were as discriminated then as much as black people were, but they certainly weren't accepted in the dominant Christian culture. The history of poor race relations w/the black community even came up this year after McNabb's benching.

Now, there's a Jewish owner of the team, yet no one has ever really pointed this out. We can blame the media for that, but maybe it hasn't been pointed out because no one thinks anything of it, i.e. it's a sign of progress that it doesn't need to be pointed out. If anything though, if the Danny was more humble & warm to the public, he might at least get some positive attention for it.

Judging by the comments here & elsewhere, no one thinks about his religion. There are plenty of wealthy Jewish role models to compare him to in America, and the vast majority aren't carrying such a poor rep. In the end, Snyder is being judged by his actions & his teams performance, both of which aren't exemplary.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

My mom asked me about this yesterday. I have no idea how she found out, but the fact that my mom of all people heard about this just goes to show how dumb snyder is to sue this paper and bring all this attention on himself.

Im happy hes doing this; hes a real piece of shit and now more people know.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

So the fact that your mother, who I'm pretty sure isnt a hermit, was able to either turn on the news, read the paper, go to work, or live in the area found out that the Redskins owner was suing a newspaper means that it's THAT bad ? Wow, I mean if she broke down the differences between Buddy Ryans 4-6 and the 4-6 used today you might have me but damn.

I mean it is a pretty big story around here.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=freddyg12;782646]On the subject of DS' religion, I haven't checked, but I'm pretty damn sure he's the 1st Redskins owner that's Jewish. This is historically significant but doesn't get any attention due to the history of the Skins & their fanbase.

The Redskins were the team of the deep south before NO, Carolina, Atl, Tenn. & Dallas. George Marshall said he didn't want to integrate w/black players because he didn't think his fans would go for it. NOt saying that Jewish people were as discriminated then as much as black people were, but they certainly weren't accepted in the dominant Christian culture. The history of poor race relations w/the black community even came up this year after McNabb's benching.

Now, there's a Jewish owner of the team, yet no one has ever really pointed this out. We can blame the media for that, but maybe it hasn't been pointed out because no one thinks anything of it, i.e. it's a sign of progress that it doesn't need to be pointed out. If anything though, if the Danny was more humble & warm to the public, he might at least get some positive attention for it.

Judging by the comments here & elsewhere, no one thinks about his religion. There are plenty of wealthy Jewish role models to compare him to in America, and the vast majority aren't carrying such a poor rep. In the end, Snyder is being judged by his actions & his teams performance, both of which aren't exemplary.[/quote]

Take a listen to this: You may get an idea as to what Snyder is most upset about. Click the Dan Snyder link. [url=http://newyork.cbslocal.com/category/sports/mike-francesa/#]Mike Francesa « CBS New York[/url]

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

I used to like joos until snyder took over the Redskins. lol

Yes, I am anti-jewish control of USA, just look how sh!tty of a job they have done with the federal reserve and opening the borders to third world immigrants. Destroying the USA in the process, yeah parasites suck. lol

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

Awesome. Internet really shows how ignorant and stupid people are.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

You are either drunk and or from another country and English is not your first language.

Either way the above post is really bad.

You can't honestly have intended to come across that offensive as there will be no place for you around here.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=14WOODS;783175]I used to like joos until snyder took over the Redskins. lol

Yes, I am anti-jewish control of USA, just look how sh!tty of a job they have done with the federal reserve and opening the borders to third world immigrants. Destroying the USA in the process, yeah parasites suck. lol[/quote]

Ummmmmmmmmmmm...are you Egyptian?

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Buster;783195]Ummmmmmmmmmmm...are you Egyptian?[/quote]

Only if they watch South Park there. That's the best explanation I can think of for spelling Jew as Joo, which is how Cartman spells it!

To his credit, he does have lol at the end of each sentence. Nonetheless, I was lost in that post.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=freddyg12;783200]Only if they watch South Park there. That's the best explanation I can think of for spelling Jew as Joo, which is how Cartman spells it!

To his credit, he does have lol at the end of each sentence. Nonetheless, I was lost in that post.[/quote]

Actually I'm starting to wish that this story got some more coverage so Matt Stone and Trey Parker could justify making an episode where Snyder is demonized. I mean they're NFL fans so it's not like they haven't heard about it. Unfortunately/fortunately it's not big enough to get them to do an episode about it.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/02/06/AR2011020602499.html]Courtland Milloy - Snyder's devil is in the details - and a name[/url]

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

Longtimefan:

Good pull here.

It would be difficult for one to say that Courtland Milloy is a long-time Snyder-hater.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

I don't know. I think this city can be to hostile at times. I understand we haven't been consistently good for 20 years, but some of this is just unnecessary.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=RedskinsfaninBaltimore;783246]I don't know. I think this city can be to hostile at times. I understand we haven't been consistently good for 20 years, but some of this is just unnecessary.[/quote]

What was REALLY unnecessary was the lawsuit that kicked this boulder over the cliff...

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Longtimefan;783220][url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/02/06/AR2011020602499.html]Courtland Milloy - Snyder's devil is in the details - and a name[/url][/quote]

he's really focused on changing the name huh

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

Snyder just needs to ignore this guy. I mean it isn't the first time he has been trashed in the print media. He should be used to it by now. Also, by getting pissed, he lets others know you can get under his skin, which will entail more articles like this in the future.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;783262]Snyder just needs to ignore this guy. I mean it isn't the first time he has been trashed in the print media. He should be used to it by now. Also, by getting pissed, he lets others know you can get under his skin, which will entail more articles like this in the future.[/quote]
[RIGHT]
[IMG]http://www.urban.org/images/tuesdays/FT_nov00_milloy.jpg[/IMG][/RIGHT]

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Longtimefan;783220][url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/02/06/AR2011020602499.html]Courtland Milloy - Snyder's devil is in the details - and a name[/url][/quote]

He doesn't cite a credible source with regards to that "every Native American organization" statement regarding the trademark.

He commits an error in reasoning. Simply because a ****ton of schools stopped using Native American names and mascots does NOT mean that Native Americans viewed them as racist. It means that more and more people think that Native Americans view them as racist.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;783271]He doesn't cite a credible source with regards to that "every Native American organization" statement regarding the trademark.

He commits an error in reasoning. Simply because a ****ton of schools stopped using Native American names and mascots does NOT mean that Native Americans viewed them as racist. It means that more and more people think that Native Americans view them as racist.[/quote]

This is the feeling shared by Americans, not just the ones we characterize as native.

[url=http://www.westernoregonjournal.com/post/is-native-american-imagery-of-sports-mascots-racist-1.1748350]" + artTitle.replace("-","") + " - " + "The Journal" + " - " + "Post" + "[/url]

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

Its only a matter of time before the Redskins change their name.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

I heard an interview a few years ago regarding the Florida Seminoles over the same issue. The interviewer was clearly laying the ground work in the opening moments of the int with the Chief of the Seminole nation in Florida (which is big).
The objective (by the interviewer) was obviously aimed at the outrage and shame the use of the sacred tribal name had caused..........etc.
Surprisingly (and very disappointingly to the interviewer) the Chief responded that it was indeed NOT a disgrace of any kind....but an honor.
Furthermore, the Chief asked the interviewer if he had ever attended a Seminole game or event? The answer was no. The Chief then iterated that the reverence and high esteem the Seminole fans held for his tribes namesake was something to behold. The Chief was clearly pleased with that notion.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Hog1;783324]I heard an interview a few years ago regarding the Florida Seminoles over the same issue. The interviewer was clearly laying the ground work in the opening moments of the int with the Chief of the Seminole nation in Florida (which is big).
The objective (by the interviewer) was obviously aimed at the outrage and shame the use of the sacred tribal name had caused..........etc.
Surprisingly (and very disappointingly to the interviewer) the Chief responded that it was indeed NOT a disgrace of any kind....but an honor.
Furthermore, the Chief asked the interviewer if he had ever attended a Seminole game or event? The answer was no. The Chief then iterated that the reverence and high esteem the Seminole fans held for his tribes namesake was something to behold. The Chief was clearly pleased with that notion.[/quote]

I had always heard that FSU did an admirable job in honoring the Seminoles. Pretty cool that they were able to make the tribe part of the process and celebrate their tradition.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

I'll just repost what I did a couple of years ago when we talked about a name change for the Redskins:

It admittedly does get increasingly difficult to pretend that the team's name does not have some other connotation. And the really cold fact is that, because Native Americans have been so marginalized in our society (once their society), that the offensiveness passes unnoticed because there is really no one around to hear the tree fall in the forest. A name that gave that kind of depiction to Blacks or Ricans like me would get shouted down because there are enough people in that constituency with enough of a relevant voice sure to tell society that that is unacceptable.

Couple of ironies though. One is that the fact is that when you say the word "Redskins" in so-called mainstream U.S. society, what people think of first IS the football team, and NOT the ethnic group. Another is that research (which I don’t have right in front of me right now) reveals that Native Americans themselves throughout the years at all levels of sport have themselves named their teams Redskins. Hmm.

When people talked about "ni**ers" that word was laced with hatred and a misguided superiority at the time it was being said, with violence, lynchings, separate restrooms, back of the bus, you name it. But when we say the word Redskins today, there is no associated hatred or sense of supremacy vis a vis Native Americans; the word comes out of the mouth without any associated negative baggage. Sure, it is the same "word," but the substance is not the same at all. The prevailing argument is that we should dispense with the word because it is offensive and does not represent our society today. But since we know that it does not represent today's society, then the alleged offensive substance of the word has already been rendered meaningless !

Even on the team itself, I don't remember anyone thinking Mark Rypien was dumb or reviled as the quarterback because he was Native American; of course not. So, where is the real offensiveness? What was that we learned in school, "sticks and stones may break my bones..."

Growing up for me (and I’m sure others), the name depicted bravery and glory etc. and that, as far as the Washington Redskins were concerned specifically to be called a "true Redskin" was a badge of honor in the sports world and in the local community, as it stood for humble guys who worked hard on the field with great teamwork and gave to the community off of it. It was hardly disparaging at all and really had nothing to do with offending Native Americans b/c again, Redskin conjured up the image of Darrell Green and Art Monk, not Sitting Bull.

As a minority myself, I sometimes find it perplexing that other minorities in the U.S. would look so quickly to self-identify as hyphenated, and to marginalize themselves by choosing to direct their collective energy to take up the cause of being offended by labels and semantics.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

The name isn't going to change. This has been going on forever now. It's doubtful it will ever gain enough traction to happen.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[COLOR="Red"]Growing up for me (and I’m sure others), the name depicted bravery and glory etc. and that, as far as the Washington Redskins were concerned specifically to be called a "true Redskin" was a badge of honor [/COLOR]

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=SmootSmack;783329]I'll just repost what I did a couple of years ago when we talked about a name change for the Redskins:

It admittedly does get increasingly difficult to pretend that the team's name does not have some other connotation. And the really cold fact is that, because Native Americans have been so marginalized in our society (once their society), that the offensiveness passes unnoticed because there is really no one around to hear the tree fall in the forest. A name that gave that kind of depiction to Blacks or Ricans like me would get shouted down because there are enough people in that constituency with enough of a relevant voice sure to tell society that that is unacceptable.

Couple of ironies though. One is that the fact is that when you say the word "Redskins" in so-called mainstream U.S. society, what people think of first IS the football team, and NOT the ethnic group. Another is that research (which I don’t have right in front of me right now) reveals that Native Americans themselves throughout the years at all levels of sport have themselves named their teams Redskins. Hmm.

When people talked about "ni**ers" that word was laced with hatred and a misguided superiority at the time it was being said, with violence, lynchings, separate restrooms, back of the bus, you name it. But when we say the word Redskins today, there is no associated hatred or sense of supremacy vis a vis Native Americans; the word comes out of the mouth without any associated negative baggage. Sure, it is the same "word," but the substance is not the same at all. The prevailing argument is that we should dispense with the word because it is offensive and does not represent our society today. But since we know that it does not represent today's society, then the alleged offensive substance of the word has already been rendered meaningless !

Even on the team itself, I don't remember anyone thinking Mark Rypien was dumb or reviled as the quarterback because he was Native American; of course not. So, where is the real offensiveness? What was that we learned in school, "sticks and stones may break my bones..."

Growing up for me (and I’m sure others), the name depicted bravery and glory etc. and that, as far as the Washington Redskins were concerned specifically to be called a "true Redskin" was a badge of honor in the sports world and in the local community, as it stood for humble guys who worked hard on the field with great teamwork and gave to the community off of it. It was hardly disparaging at all and really had nothing to do with offending Native Americans b/c again, Redskin conjured up the image of Darrell Green and Art Monk, not Sitting Bull.

As a minority myself, I sometimes find it perplexing that other minorities in the U.S. would look so quickly to self-identify as hyphenated, and to marginalize themselves by choosing to direct their collective energy to take up the cause of being offended by labels and semantics.[/quote]

Great points SS. I wish there could be an objective summit of sorts to hash this issue out w/various Native American groups & point out the things you mention, especially the use of 'Redskins' by N. american sports teams. Unfortunately, I think as long as Snyder owns the team, any kind of reaching out to those groups that he might do, would be construed as subjective.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Mattyk;783330]The name isn't going to change. This has been going on forever now. It's doubtful it will ever gain enough traction to happen.[/quote]

Within 10 years the name will have changed. It will be DS's last ditch attempt at good PR.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=irish;783338]Within 10 years the name will have changed. It will be DS's last ditch attempt at good PR.[/quote]

Anytime the name/logo/trademark has been challenged, the courts have ruled in the team's favor. Good PR is not worth what the team would stand to lose in terms of lose of revenue over changing the brand and overall identity. All the good PR the franchise needs is to win games.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

Washington...........wizards...sick
AND I heard the other day, they are thinking of changing it back to Bullets? I guess it is no longer offensive to have an object of death and destruction representing your team?
PC.......go figure.........

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Hog1;783361]Washington...........wizards...sick
AND I heard the other day, they are thinking of changing it back to Bullets? I guess it is no longer offensive to have an object of death and destruction representing your team?
PC.......go figure.........[/quote]


I really don't see any problem with Washington changing the name back to the Bullets. A bullet itself isn't going to cause death and destruction, it's the one pulling the trigger. Let's also remember that Lions, Tigers, and Bears (OH MY) can also cause death and destruction.....Jaguars as well! So, that can't, or at least shouldn't be a reason to change the name of a team.

In regards to the Redskins, just as what SmootSmack had posted, is pretty much the way I feel. The word is not used in a disparaging manner in today's society. Words change meanings. I believe just as some regular words turn into disparaging words throughout the years, I think the exact opposite can easily happen as well.

As being a fan, I don't believe I could ever get used to any other moniker except for one that would describe an American Indian. "The Washington Warriors"....I could probably live with that, or even the Washington Braves, but I would much rather keep it the Washington Redskins.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=skinsguy;783390]I really don't see any problem with Washington changing the name back to the Bullets. A bullet itself isn't going to cause death and destruction, it's the one pulling the trigger. Let's also remember that [B]Lions, Tigers, and Bears (OH MY)[/B] can also cause death and destruction.....Jaguars as well! So, that can't, or at least shouldn't be a reason to change the name of a team.
[/quote]

:lol:

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Mattyk;783345]Anytime the name/logo/trademark has been challenged, the courts have ruled in the team's favor. Good PR is not worth what the team would stand to lose in terms of lose of revenue over changing the brand and overall identity. All the good PR the franchise needs is to win games.[/quote]

I personally dont have a problem with the name and dont care what the team is called.

The name wont be changed because of a court challenge it will be done a PR move as a way to take the organization in a new direction. If anything I think the team will gain in revenue as everyone will head out to the stores to buy new gear and identity because the way things are going the Redskins arent really viewed as one of the NFL's better brands.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

Despite the struggles under Snyder the Redskins are one of the NFL's most storied franchises. Changing the identity of the team would be a bad idea if it's just for a PR move.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=skinsguy;783390]I really don't see any problem with Washington changing the name back to the Bullets. A bullet itself isn't going to cause death and destruction, it's the one pulling the trigger. Let's also remember that Lions, Tigers, and Bears (OH MY) can also cause death and destruction.....Jaguars as well! So, that can't, or at least shouldn't be a reason to change the name of a team.

In regards to the Redskins, just as what SmootSmack had posted, is pretty much the way I feel. The word is not used in a disparaging manner in today's society. Words change meanings. I believe just as some regular words turn into disparaging words throughout the years, I think the exact opposite can easily happen as well.

As being a fan, I don't believe I could ever get used to any other moniker except for one that would describe an American Indian. "The Washington Warriors"....I could probably live with that, or even the Washington Braves, but I would much rather keep it the Washington Redskins.[/quote]

Sorry Skinsguy, my level of disgust for the team name change to Wizards must have been a little to thickly veiled? I am NOT a proponent for bending to such foolishly motivated PR moves.
I agree with you.......

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Mattyk;783402]Despite the struggles under Snyder the Redskins are one of the NFL's most storied franchises. Changing the identity of the team would be a bad idea if it's just for a PR move.[/quote]

Thats the thing, the organization will tell everyone its about taking the organization in a new direction in order to look like they didnt cave into the PC crowd. Even if they do change the name it not like people arent going to know who they are or where to see them play.

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Hog1;783408]Sorry Skinsguy, my level of disgust for the team name change to Wizards must have been a little to thickly veiled? I am NOT a proponent for bending to such foolishly motivated PR moves.
I agree with you.......[/quote]

I wasn't quite sure which way you were going with it. :)

I'm surprised the same PC crowd wouldn't say that the terms "wizard" would be promoting black magic...lol!

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=skinsguy;783412]I wasn't quite sure which way you were going with it. :)

I'm surprised the same PC crowd wouldn't say that the terms "wizard" would be promoting black magic...lol![/quote]

A Harry Potter generation?

Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!
 

[quote=Hog1;783414]A Harry Potter generation?[/quote]

Hahaha...maybe that's the reason!