Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Even if John Beck isn't our savior, we have the sixth easiest schedule in the league we must have to rack up a few wins

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Given Denver's desire for a big-time DT, this story smells of a Haynesworth-for-Orton trade:
[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/06/as-nick-fairley-fell-broncos-tried-to-get-him/]As Nick Fairley fell, Broncos tried to get him | ProFootballTalk[/url]

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Lotus;801598]Given Denver's desire for a big-time DT, this story smells of a Haynesworth-for-Orton trade:
[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/06/as-nick-fairley-fell-broncos-tried-to-get-him/]As Nick Fairley fell, Broncos tried to get him | ProFootballTalk[/url][/quote]

Denver will need a proper DT for their 4-3 scheme. Personally, I feel that Dareus would have fit better. Von Miller is a helluva player, but he won't help them against the run in a conference with powerful running games (especially Oakland and KC). Haynesworth would be a huge gamble, but hey I don't care about that as long as they are willing to take him.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Lotus;801598]Given Denver's desire for a big-time DT, this story smells of a Haynesworth-for-Orton trade:
[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/06/as-nick-fairley-fell-broncos-tried-to-get-him/]As Nick Fairley fell, Broncos tried to get him | ProFootballTalk[/url][/quote]

Do you think Orton fits Shannys system? He's not that mobile tho.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Redskin Warrior;801600]Do you think Orton fits Shannys system? He's not that mobile tho.[/quote]

Personally I think he may fit KYLE Shanahan's system although less so MIKE's. And he may be the best option, fit or not. He actually had a pretty good year last year.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Ruhskins;801599]Denver will need a proper DT for their 4-3 scheme. Personally, I feel that Dareus would have fit better. Von Miller is a helluva player, but he won't help them against the run in a conference with powerful running games (especially Oakland and KC). Haynesworth would be a huge gamble, but hey I don't care about that as long as they are willing to take him.[/quote]

No offense to Von Miller but I agree. I would have taken Dareus.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Lotus;801606]Personally I think he may fit KYLE Shanahan's system although less so MIKE's. And he may be the best option, fit or not. He actually had a pretty good year last year.[/quote]

Who's offense are we running Kyle or Mike or a mixture of the two?

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Lotus..

KO has had a pretty good 3 years now in a row

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Is this all just wishful thinking?.....or is it as jippdsoul posted in his comment, Shanahan needs to be drug tested?

[url=http://blog.redskins.com/2011/05/03/looking-at-john-beck-as-a-qb-prospect/]Looking At John Beck As A QB Prospect[/url]

:happybday.....Johnny Unitas

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Orton aint Joe Namath. The Bears were happy enough to live without him and it appears Denver is too.
I wouldnt give a pick for him. I'd rather deal with what I have.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Ok , I'm going to get killed. I would like to see McNabb retire a redskin.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=redskin37;801829]Ok , I'm going to get killed. I would like to see McNabb retire a redskin.[/quote]

Why? Do you think he is worth the extension we gave him or do you just wish he would retire right now (like I do) and get off our team?

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=redskin37;801829]Ok , I'm going to get killed. I would like to see McNabb retire a redskin.[/quote]

Yeah he's washed up. Better for the league as a whole if he retires. That way the quality of competition across the league will remain high and he won't take a job away from an aspiring young QB.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

McNabb is a guy who likes to form his own clique and alienate his companions and coaches for his own self-benefit in the "public's eye", i.e in 2008 when he said "We showed our youth...".

It's just that the environment here was so horrible that Redskins players were in awe of his "leadership"(i.e some of Cooley's initial comments on McNabb way back when).

The bitch doesn't should retire a free agent and let the real, quality black QB down in Tampa should him how its done.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;801848]Yeah he's washed up. Better for the league as a whole if he retires. That way the quality of competition across the league will remain high and he won't take a job away from an aspiring young QB.[/quote]

There has been much debate [of late] as to whether McNabb should be considered in the top 100 QB's. The centerpiece of the debate centers around comparing his overall body of work with his play the last two years.

There was not a huge market offering overwhelming compensation to the Eagles for McNabb when they made the decision to trade him to the Redskins. Now, as the results of his one year here in Washington demonstrate, his value as an effective NFL QB has become muddled.

[url=http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=4&ved=0CDMQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdonovanmcnabb.net%2FNFL.htm&ei=g5PGTZPgPMfa0QHq_-WPCA&usg=AFQjCNEoFhgK_SLszgi5g0jP4t2Fg5Z4Yw&sig2=qSdfX5QWvGErkW1wpbmeFg]Donovan McNabb - Philadelphia Eagles Quarterback[/url]

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

I am actually warming to the idea of picking up VY once FA starts. I see alot of positives for adding his mobility.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;801856]McNabb is a guy who likes to form his own clique and alienate his companions and coaches for his own self-benefit in the "public's eye"[/quote]And you know this how?

[quote]i.e in 2008 when he said "We showed our youth...".[/quote]
You're gonna use this^^ to get to the statement you made in your OP?

Okay.

As for the rest of your post...

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Son Of Man;801861]I am actually warming to the idea of picking up VY once FA starts. I see alot of positives for adding his mobility.[/quote]

Can't hurt to bring him in with a contract that makes sense for the team and let him compete for the job.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Who else we going to get folks? VY is the best available

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=30gut;801867]And you know this how?


You're gonna use this^^ to get to the statement you made in your OP?

Okay.

As for the rest of your post...[/quote]

How about I bring up Hugh Douglas's comments or him blaming his defense after the Cardinals loss? Or how the entire Eagles' lockerroom gravitated towards Kolb for leadership and support?

Leaders influence others such that the others will do and/or not do certain tasks and activities. That an unknown QB who hasn't proven his technical prowess managed to snatch away the lockerroom from an "established" QB like McNabb is a bad sign.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

I wouldn't bash McNabb for last season entirely , he had a bad year and didnt fit our scheme . crap happens let's move on to a new QB

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;801874]I wouldn't bash McNabb for last season entirely , he had a bad year and didnt fit our scheme . crap happens let's move on to a new QB[/quote]

Two sides failed to diffuse the situation. Right now, I'm throwing daggers at McNabb because, boy oh boy, he does deserve it for his BS, but I have no love for the Shanahans' brain farts--it brings to light the question of whether the younger Shanahan really is that good of an OC--regarding the situation either.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;801873]How about I bring up Hugh Douglas's comments or him blaming his defense after the Cardinals loss? Or how the entire Eagles' lockerroom gravitated towards Kolb for leadership and support?

Leaders influence others such that the others will do and/or not do certain tasks and activities. That an unknown QB who hasn't proven his technical prowess managed to snatch away the lockerroom from an "established" QB like McNabb is a bad sign.[/quote]You can choose to believe Hugh Douglass or whomever/whatever supports your opinion.

But, it [I][B]is[/B][/I] in fact the [I]minority[/I] opinion when it comes to McNabb.

And there will always be a minority opinion; someone somewhere can/will find something negative to say about anyone from Favre to Marino to Brady to Manning etc.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;801870]Who else we going to get folks? VY is the best available[/quote]

Technically he isn't available. He hasn't been released so he isn't a FA, and there are mixed reports about him being traded. I think him getting traded is definitely in the rumor mill but hasn't been authenticated by anyone of significant importance in the Tennessee organization. SS, Titans are your bull pen team, I believe, heard anything different than this?

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=30gut;801878]You can choose to believe Hugh Douglass or whomever/whatever supports your opinion.

But, it [I][B]is[/B][/I] in fact the [I]minority[/I] opinion when it comes to McNabb.

And there will always be a minority opinion; someone somewhere can/will find something negative to say about anyone from Favre to Marino to Brady to Manning etc.[/quote]

I feel confident with my chances, even though it is a minority opinion. After all, it's only an inductive refutation. My chances of being correct relies solely on whether there is enough evidence and that said evidence actually relates to the topic of leadership, and I believe it does.

Technical prowess and leadership are not one and the same, and they are certainly not strongly correlated.

Throwing stuble jabs at his fellow teammates could have been taken the wrong way(and actually were). Considering how butthurt he was for Shanahan making embarassing comments about him in public, perhaps he should have stuck to similar principles during his earlier Philly tenure when talking about the young guys on his team or his defense.

Alienating teammates through the media certainly creates distance between him and the blamed. Yes, the jabs regarding the Eagles D are subtle, but he had the opportunity to hold himself accountable for his part in the loss but instead distracted the audience to focus on the D. Nope, not me, 'twas the D.

On a separate note, that Kolb, who is certainly not as accomplished and proven, was able to gain the favor of players over McNabb is not exactly a good sign of a supposed leader.

What McNabb does in his cries through the media is triangulation. Rather than engage in direct communication with the folks he has problems with, he brings the issue to the media and public, and then scores an "win" since the public will favor him since he's so accomplished in terms of accolades.

The situation with Kolb developing "links" of affinity with the other members of the Eagles is that McNabb failed to foster the concept of "we" with newcomers.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

I'm sorry but am I the only one that thought "we showed our youth" was not even close to warranted any controversy? They were a young team, they showed inexperience, that's it.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=SkinzWin;801909]Technically he isn't available. He hasn't been released so he isn't a FA, and there are mixed reports about him being traded. I think him getting traded is definitely in the rumor mill but hasn't been authenticated by anyone of significant importance in the Tennessee organization. SS, Titans are your bull pen team, I believe, heard anything different than this?[/quote]

They plan to release him last I heard. Were holding out some hope of trading him during the draft, but the lockout made that impossible. If he is indeed released, he's definitely on our radar screen.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=GreekSkin;801921]I'm sorry but am I the only one that thought "we showed our youth" was not even close to warranted any controversy? They were a young team, they showed inexperience, that's it.[/quote]

You are not alone. That comment and its supposed fallout were way overblown.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;801923]They plan to release him last I heard. Were holding out some hope of trading him during the draft, but the lockout made that impossible. If he is indeed released, he's definitely on our radar screen.[/quote]

Did Kyle and Vince cross paths at Texas or were they 5+ years apart?

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Paintrain;801983]Did Kyle and Vince cross paths at Texas or were they 5+ years apart?[/quote]

Young was a true freshman during Kyle's Redshirt Senior year in 2002.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Paintrain;801983]Did Kyle and Vince cross paths at Texas or were they 5+ years apart?[/quote]

They were purple drank buddies.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Lotus;801989]They were purple drank buddies.[/quote]


No, no, no! Red River Rum Punch. They didn't play for South Central Texas. lol

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;801985]Young was a true freshman during Kyle's Redshirt Senior year in 2002.[/quote]

I was just wondering if there was a pre-existing relationship that would make Kyle/Mike think he would be more professional or work better with Kyle than he did with Fisher. Talent wise he's got a lot to work with. Effort/mentality/intangible wise though, he's a potential nightmare.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

SirClintonPortis-
Your post still represents the minority opinion when it comes to McNabb.

I could counter with the vast majority of players and coaches in the NFL and in college that respect McNabb as leader, but it would be pointless because you still wouldn't agree.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=30gut;802035]SirClintonPortis-
Your post still represents the minority opinion when it comes to McNabb.

I could counter with the vast majority of players and coaches in the NFL and in college that respect McNabb as leader, but it would be pointless because you still wouldn't agree.[/quote]

If only the world were so simple that the causal links were ignored and I could simply just follow percentages and nonsubstantive cliches. Tell me what he has done, and I'll give an ear, if only for a brief moment.

Telling me to just follow with an appeal to the majority, that will NEVER ever fly. because there is absolutely NO substantive attempt to persuade, just follow the leader and shut up.

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=Son Of Man;801861]I am actually warming to the idea of picking up VY once FA starts. I see alot of positives for adding his mobility.[/quote]

[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/post/vince-young-and-redskins-mentioned-in-same-sentence/2011/05/09/AFduaqYG_blog.html]Vince Young and Redskins mentioned in same sentence - The Early Lead - The Washington Post[/url]

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;802040] Tell me what he has done, and I'll give an ear, if only for a brief moment.

Telling me to just follow with an appeal to the majority, that will NEVER ever fly. because there is absolutely NO substantive attempt to persuade, just follow the leader and shut up.[/quote][IMG]http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/9596/kobewhatever2.png[/IMG]
Funny, I don't see where I tell or suggest for you to do anything.

If you think the sky is red that is your right.
But, what sense would it make to argue with a man yelling at the top of his lungs that the sky is red?

There is no need for me to convince you that its not, that would be silly because your mind is made up.

However, lest you think others agree with you, I'll simply remind you that the sky is blue.

The onus is on you to prove otherwise with something more then a couple of dissenting largely anecdotal minority opinions.

I'll repeat, at the end of the day the notion that you're pushing is still the minority opinion regardless of how loud you yell it.

-Hail

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Shein says no to Beck and Grossman. Mark Bulger??

[url=http://msn.foxsports.com/video?vid=26d7af95-68f8-4cfe-b155-ebfbcfd4434b&from=mymsn]All Sports Video - All Sports - FOX Sports on MSN[/url]

[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/post/john-beck-is-already-being-a-leader/2011/05/10/AFrLyOgG_blog.html]John Beck is already being a leader - DC Sports Bog - The Washington Post[/url]

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Marc Bulger??? Great???

[url=http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BulgMa00.htm]Marc Bulger NFL & AFL Football Statistics - Pro-Football-Reference.com[/url]

Marc Bulger - 9 years in the league - 8 years playing on the field with 2 winning seasons and 1 season going 8-8 plus his first year of 6-1. His record of the last three playing years is a grand total of 5-30. Yep Bulger must be the answer!

With 27 TDs to 34 INTs posted in those last three playing years, what with 2010 being a year riding the pine!

Re: Redskins 2011 Starting Quarterback: John Beck?
 

Are Vince Young, Marc Bulger and John Beck -- that much *better* than McNabb? Come on, McNabb (in his second year in system) should be comparable to these guys. Sure he didn't do well last year, and now we've benched him an alienated him. Perhaps he wasn't right for Shanahan's system. McNabb made poor decisions and didn't know the playbook as well as he should.

BUT:
1) McNabb was hired only 4-5 months before season
2) It was the first year in new offensive system for everyone on offense
3) Poor offensive line play
4) 3rd and 4th string RBs with Portis and even Torrain out for part/most of system
5) Only an aging Moss and a CFL wide receiver to throw to..


I just think McNabb had an off year, but people are throwing him under the bus. He was a Pro Bowl QB for 10 years, and I don't think you lose it in 1-2 years. Is he what he was when he went to the Super Bowl? Maybe not, but I don't think he's "washed up" quite yet.

I know he's on his way out, but I would have preferred to keep McNabb, tailor the offense around him and use him for 2-3 years like we planned. Now we're just searching for another FA QB, without any assurance they'll be better or viable long-term. McNabb is now just a wasted 2nd round (& mid-round) draft pick. Not to mention - we could have kept Campbell, and he couldn't have done too much worse.