Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;1067327]I would like to see Williams and Gettis get a shot to make contributions.[/quote]

I keep hoping for Williams because he's a little speedy guy. But I'm not sure how much upside he actually has.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

Barring injury you have to think that Garçon, Jackson, Roberts and probably a draft pick (4th or 5th rounder) are locks. Robinson and Hankerson are probably competing for one spot. Williams and Gettis will compete for likely a final roster spot.

Moss is a tough one. One argument is that his projected production is minimal at this point and unless he's the punt returner, he may not have a role on the field or team. So then do you bring him back in the 'Rex Grossman' role, on the 53 but mostly around for leadership and guidance? Probably inactive on game day but a valuable member of the team nonetheless.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=Paintrain;1067393]Barring injury you have to think that Garçon, Jackson, Roberts and probably a draft pick (4th or 5th rounder) are locks. Robinson and Hankerson are probably competing for one spot. Williams and Gettis will compete for likely a final roster spot.

Moss is a tough one. One argument is that his projected production is minimal at this point and unless he's the punt returner, he may not have a role on the field or team. So then do you bring him back in the 'Rex Grossman' role, on the 53 but mostly around for leadership and guidance? Probably inactive on game day but a valuable member of the team nonetheless.[/quote]

I'd give Moss the opportunity to find quality playing time elsewhere instead of making him a weekly inactive here.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1067345]we have two years, where young guys can come in, learn behind top talent, and be evaluated by our staff. That reps they get come in the meaningless games. Those reps do nothing for Hankerson or Robinson, they are who they are. If you get two young guys or more in the undrafted ranks, in this a particularly deep WR draft (so everybody says), then they get two offseasons, 1 preseason, this year, with no pressure just focusing on learning and improving. Next year you bring another guy in, hopefully one of the two this year has something, if not then move on.

People harp on how we haven't developed WR's which is true. But that's because we draft them and throw them in thinking they have to be the guys. If you want to develop a skill player in the NFL, most of the time you have to let them cut their teeth in training camp and preseason then let them start pushing the older guys.

But no, let's keep Hankerson and Robinson, they will not be good enough next year to supplant 1-3, and so we will let them go because we aren't going to commit long term to them after 4 years of less then stellar results. The following year, when Garcon and DJax are looking at other offers, we will be stuck drafting out of need, and not for development.

Good plan.[/quote]

yeah, cause we're really getting rid of garcon, jackson, and roberts next year with the 3 year contracts they all have. and i really said that hankerson was going to be our #1. thanks for implying things that were never said and great argument, but next time, try using facts.

or at least seeing what was written. if someone comes in here and blows it up, great. but saying you KNOW they will and hank/robinson WILL be cut is silly. show me some results first. let's not make assumptions, that based on history, are very low probability.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

Moss has value as a 4th WR in the slot in 4-WR sets. He also has the ability to replace Andre Roberts in the slot if Roberts gets hurt. You keep Moss active as your #4 on game days, and I probably make him my primary punt returner.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1067316]I think when you have solid starters is the time you bring in guys to see who wants to make it, you don't wait until the need is there (ie when Roberts DJax both are up for extensions in 2 to 3 years).

I said specifically that money isn't an issue either way, but the fact that you could have a guy under contract for 4 years with 1 to develop and 1 to challenge and then 2 more to play, makes a lot more sense than having a guy who hasn't developed enough in 3 years to prevent the team from bringing in a good FA (Roberts) to be the number 2 (until DJax was let go and signed).

[B]Serious question for all those who think Hankerson especially ought to be on the roster, what more do you need to see from him for him to take Roberts place as number 3, or Garcon's place as number one? And when would he get the chance to prove it (please don't say preseason) before his contract expires next year and you need to decide what you want to do with him?[/B][/quote]

His ceiling is nothing more than a good #2; he just doesn't have what it takes to be a Garcon, and certainly not an Andre Johnson.

Explosiveness and health are the biggest things I would like to see improve. He comes off the line too slow, and then relies on physicality/size to beat DBs. Sort of on that same note, he has a hard time making defenders miss in the open field. But health is the bigger issue; he's only played in 30 of a possible 48 games. If he had stayed healthy last year, he would've put up 48 catches for 600 yards and 5 TDs. That's a serviceable #2, great #3.

Right back at you: what do you see in his game that says that he can't be a good contributor to our WR corps? What makes you think that he can't put his great measurables together and become a star? You say, "Well, if he hasn't done it yet, he probably never will." But why not?

[QUOTE=That Guy;1067398]yeah, cause we're really getting rid of garcon, jackson, and roberts next year with the 3 year contracts they all have. and i really said that hankerson was going to be our #1. thanks for implying things that were never said and great argument, but next time, try using facts.



or at least seeing what was written. if someone comes in here and blows it up, great. but saying you KNOW they will and hank/robinson WILL be cut is silly. show me some results first. let's not make assumptions, that based on history, are very low probability.[/QUOTE]


Did C Redskins quote you? I thought he was just saying that we should change the way we handled young talent in the past?

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

The Moss era needs to end. Cut the cord. Can't have an old guy as your 4th or 5th wr.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

Kind of off topic but with the signing of Djax it would easier to wash our hands of PG if he doesn't perform. Gtripp's bet is looking stronger by the day. =)

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=SirLK26;1067402]His ceiling is nothing more than a good #2; he just doesn't have what it takes to be a Garcon, and certainly not an Andre Johnson.

Explosiveness and health are the biggest things I would like to see improve. He comes off the line too slow, and then relies on physicality/size to beat DBs. Sort of on that same note, he has a hard time making defenders miss in the open field. But health is the bigger issue; he's only played in 30 of a possible 48 games. If he had stayed healthy last year, he would've put up 48 catches for 600 yards and 5 TDs. That's a serviceable #2, great #3.

[B]Right back at you: what do you see in his game that says that he can't be a good contributor to our WR corps? What makes you think that he can't put his great measurables together and become a star? You say, "Well, if he hasn't done it yet, he probably never will." But why not?[/B][/quote]
It's a fair question, and my best answer is this, over the past 3 years, name a WR on our team that you want to keep, and I can name at least a play or two that makes me go wow, and makes me think he's got something there:
for an example:
Garcon - he has multiple, but the Dallas game where he snagged a pass in the middle of the field and crossed all the way for a TD
Moss - obviously he has a ton
Robinson - the Dallas TD on Thanksgiving that sparked the team
Hankerson - nothin' maybe I just block it out, but I can't think of one play, where Hank made something out of nothing. What I mainly remember is a couple plays where he had the chance, and didn't make the play, or where with just a little more maybe he makes a game changing moment, but it never happened.

We have invested 3years of coaching and for Hank, not one play stands out to me as a "That's What I'm talking about moment". And this at a time when other than Garcon and Moss, the WR spot was there for the taking. Now, what motivates him, he's not going to overtake Garcon, or DJax, very unlikely to overtake Robinson. The best you can say is that it's his contract year so he's motivated for that, but isn't that the knock on most FA mistakes (I'm looking at you Albert) that teams make.

Get new guys in, give them a year of pure training, and special teams. 2015, let them get reps in the preseason games against the opponents starting defenses. and 2 years from now, when Roberts and Garcon and Djax all will at least be thinking about money, we have young guys who are ours for two more years, thinking about being our 1, 2, or 3.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=That Guy;1067398]yeah, cause we're really getting rid of garcon, jackson, and roberts next year with the 3 year contracts they all have. and i really said that hankerson was going to be our #1. thanks for implying things that were never said and great argument, but next time, try using facts.

or at least seeing what was written. if someone comes in here and blows it up, great. but saying you KNOW they will and hank/robinson WILL be cut is silly. show me some results first. let's not make assumptions, that based on history, are very low probability.[/quote]

Sorry if I implied things, but to that end my whole point is that we are definitely NOT getting rid of Garcon, DJax or Roberts next year. Since that is an absolute fact (barring injury or some catastrophe), why not take this year to bring in guys and let them learn. Why keep day old bread that is just ok, and will go stale before you use it (Hank/Robinson w/expiring contracts), when you can bring in new fresh bread(4th round or later picks), and see if that bread could be a new favorite.

I have no idea whether anybody will be cut, I am only saying what I would like to see, because as everyone know our history at the wide receiver position isn't a very good one.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1067406]The Moss era needs to end. Cut the cord. Can't have an old guy as your 4th or 5th wr.[/quote]

As cruel as this sounds, the 4th or 5th spots really need to be for young physical special teams players. Note I said physical (tackling, wedge busting, gunner, blocking) not a little return guy (Moss) that is not known for physical play.
The Redskins need to get more physical on special teams.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1067406]The Moss era needs to end. Cut the cord. Can't have an old guy as your 4th or 5th wr.[/quote]

agree. Moss been one of my favorties for awhile, time to go.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

Robinson can't catch. If you can't catch by 7th grade then you can't catch.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1067408]It's a fair question, and my best answer is this, over the past 3 years, name a WR on our team that you want to keep, and I can name at least a play or two that makes me go wow, and makes me think he's got something there:
for an example:
Garcon - he has multiple, but the Dallas game where he snagged a pass in the middle of the field and crossed all the way for a TD
Moss - obviously he has a ton
Robinson - the Dallas TD on Thanksgiving that sparked the team
Hankerson - nothin' maybe I just block it out, but I can't think of one play, where Hank made something out of nothing. What I mainly remember is a couple plays where he had the chance, and didn't make the play, or where with just a little more maybe he makes a game changing moment, but it never happened.<snip>[/quote]

While I don't think your reasoning is a good basis for whether or not a WR "has something there" or should or shouldn't make a roster, you're not trying hard enough. Remember Hankerson's 68 yard catch-and-run TD against St. Louis? Remember his 54 yard TD grab against triple coverage in Cleveland? And these aren't the only big plays, either...

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1067412]Robinson can't catch. If you can't catch by 7th grade then you can't catch.[/quote]
I don't know about that ... even hands of stone Carlos Rogers started catching some interceptions. It just depends on how much Robinson is willing to work (on it).

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=SirLK26;1067415]While I don't think your reasoning is a good basis for whether or not a WR "has something there" or should or shouldn't make a roster, you're not trying hard enough. Remember Hankerson's 68 yard catch-and-run TD against St. Louis? Remember his 54 yard TD grab against triple coverage in Cleveland? And these aren't the only big plays, either...[/quote]

Those two are the ones that stand out to me. I think the biggest issue is his health. I'm not too concerned about his speed, because Jerry Rice wasn't fast. His hands have improved. I don't see him as being a #2, ever, but I think there's reason to believe that he could easily be a #3 or #4. In this case, I can see him beating out Moss.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=skinsguy;1067428]Those two are the ones that stand out to me. I think the biggest issue is his health. [B]I'm not too concerned about his speed,[/B] because Jerry Rice wasn't fast. His hands have improved. I don't see him as being a #2, ever, but I think there's reason to believe that he could easily be a #3 or #4. In this case, I can see him beating out Moss.[/quote]

I'm not either. 4.43 speed ain't nothin' to sneeze at.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

I feel that we can draft a player with size like Brandon Coleman for cheap, develop him then either trade or let Hank walk. That is the better move for the cap IMO.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=SirLK26;1067415]While I don't think your reasoning is a good basis for whether or not a WR "has something there" or should or shouldn't make a roster, you're not trying hard enough. Remember Hankerson's 68 yard catch-and-run TD against St. Louis? Remember his 54 yard TD grab against triple coverage in Cleveland? And these aren't the only big plays, either...[/quote]

I really don't, and I am fully aware that I was pretty much done with him before the 2013 season, so I am pretty heavily biased at this point. Now that we have a solid 1-2-3 corps, I am mostly looking at how can we have capable replacements in place when 2016/17 rolls around. I don't see Hank or Robinson as that.

that said, I went and looked up and found this highlight clip from 2012:
[YT]f0ER1fz5WvA[/YT]

watch that, and see how many times the first guy takes him down, or he goes down "easily", most catches he's open, but that's because he's not drawing major coverage. Even the two you cited
St Louis is the first one on the clip, he nearly dropped the ball and the lone defender on him, no over the top safety help, caught up to him and tripped him up
The Browns play(1:38-1:44) was probably the best on that whole video, still all the defense went for the ball, even tripped over themselves, had one been behind him, he would have been tagged down.

Watch the play at 1 minute, and instead of turning up field he goes out of bounds. 0:34 is kinda the same but much much more difficult. Could've been a real wow, but wasn't

Finally, I cite:0:27, 1:09, 1:16,1:23, 1:30, 1:34 he often crumples at first contact, and in this highlight reel I didn't see one play where he broke something out of nothing.

Look, he's a guy, he's not a scrub like DT, or unable to stay healthy like MK. I wish he had trade value, but not this draft season, and not next year when he's a UFA. Again, maybe it's worth holding onto him to get a compensatory pick next year. But that's all he is to me, a 2016 compensatory 5th or 6th round pick.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

Isnt this thread about DeSean Jackson?

[url=http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/41728/NFLPA-to-probe-Jackson-s-release-by-Eagles/Default.aspx]NFLPA to probe Jackson's release by Eagles[/url]

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1067436]watch that, and see how many times the first guy takes him down, or he goes down "easily",[B] most catches he's open, but that's because he's not drawing major coverage.[/B] Even the two you cited
St Louis is the first one on the clip, he nearly dropped the ball and the lone defender on him, no over the top safety help, caught up to him and tripped him up
The Browns play(1:38-1:44) was probably the best on that whole video, still all the defense went for the ball, even tripped over themselves, had one been behind him, he would have been tagged down.

Watch the play at 1 minute, and instead of turning up field he goes out of bounds. 0:34 is kinda the same but much much more difficult. Could've been a real wow, but wasn't

Finally, I cite:0:27, 1:09, 1:16,1:23, 1:30, 1:34 he often crumples at first contact, and in this highlight reel I didn't see one play where he broke something out of nothing.[/quote]

First, on the bold,[quote] "Hank has always been one our best guys in terms of separation," said offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan. "That’s usually the first thing you look for in a receiver.[/quote]

On that video, I didn't see one play where he crumpled easily or went out of bounds instead of turning up field. At the :27 mark, he's leading with his shoulder, plowing into the defender. He had no chance to elude the tackle, partially because he's not that great at eluding tacklers, partially because the tackler was right there when he turned up field, and partially because he was surrounded by Bucs. At :34, that was an amazing catch; he leaps for the ball, hauls it in with his hands, and stutter-steps backwards out of bounds. Not a WR in the league, in that situation, is going to stay in bounds and pick up YAC on that play. Don't know what you're seeing there. At 1:09, it's difficult to tell what's going on, but he's surrounded by defenders; absolutely nowhere to go. At 1:16, he maybe could've made something out of that, but it was a nice tackle. Probably your best example. At 1:23, he again plows into the defender with his shoulder, but is brought down by both defenders. If he were Victor Cruz, he gets out of that; but I already said he struggles to elude tackles at times. At 1:30, WTF, dude? How's he supposed to make something out of that one? At 1:34, yeah, he went down too soon, but he did lead with his shoulder. It's not like he just goes down at first contact.

Heck, we each have different opinions, and mine is that he's a great #3, a solid #2 when healthy, and deserves a roster spot. Yours is different, and you're entitled to that. But I really can't understand why you would cut the guy now(I know, you've already explained it, but it still doesn't make sense). Even weirder, why would you have cut the guy before last season? You would've given a [I]WR [/I] just two seasons to prove himself? That's just...well...I mean...whatever.

[quote=Alvin Walton;1067439]Isnt this thread about DeSean Jackson?

[url=http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/41728/NFLPA-to-probe-Jackson-s-release-by-Eagles/Default.aspx]NFLPA to probe Jackson's release by Eagles[/url][/quote]

Yeah, it is. So from now on, I'll discuss DeSean Jackson only in this thread. :Smoker:

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

I'd like to turn the conversation back to laughing at our friends in Philadelphia for making DeSean Jackson available for us, please.

Post your funny Philly fan gifs.

[IMG]http://i45.tinypic.com/2pzicxx.gif[/IMG]

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

Let me be the millionth to say: really happy about this deal and the dimensions it gives the Redskins offense.

I figured that going from Shanahan to Gruden would make the Redskins offense a lot more watchable, but I didn't think they'd be able to get the pieces they needed to contend in 2014. They just might have done that.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

More media flap.

[url=http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2014/04/04/sources-desean-jackson-was-a-problem-for-kelly-eagles-in-locker-room/]Sources: DeSean Jackson Was A Problem For Kelly, In Eagles Locker Room « CBS Philly[/url]

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;1067448]More media flap.

[url=http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2014/04/04/sources-desean-jackson-was-a-problem-for-kelly-eagles-in-locker-room/]Sources: DeSean Jackson Was A Problem For Kelly, In Eagles Locker Room « CBS Philly[/url][/quote]

Gotta love "sources close to and around the team".

Let me add, if the following is true, and it's not hard to believe:
[quote]“With Reid, [Jackson] tried pushing boundaries there, too, but he looked at Reid, I think, much differently than he looked at [Kelly]. Reid came in with an NFL pedigree. He was the guy that drafted [Jackson]. He was the one that called him on draft day and laid the law down right then: [Reid] wouldn’t tolerate any outside interference from anyone. Now you get this college guy [Kelly] and he’s not going to tell [Jackson] what to do. [Kelly] has a vision for this team—and he is a very old-school coach in a lot of ways. But there’s only so much [a coach] can take.”[/quote]
then I think we get good mileage out of him, and the way the Skins FO handled him was exactly right. Griffin then DHall then even Garcon, let him know he's wanted. I think he has to respect what Gruden has done with his offenses. So yeah, Philly's loss is our gain.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=Paintrain;1067393]Barring injury you have to think that Garçon, Jackson, Roberts and probably a draft pick (4th or 5th rounder) are locks. Robinson and Hankerson are probably competing for one spot. Williams and Gettis will compete for likely a final roster spot.

Moss is a tough one. One argument is that his projected production is minimal at this point and unless he's the punt returner, he may not have a role on the field or team. So then do you bring him back in the 'Rex Grossman' role, on the 53 but mostly around for leadership and guidance? Probably inactive on game day but a valuable member of the team nonetheless.[/quote]I agree that Hankerson and Robinson are competing for one spot at this point.

I still think they'll draft a receiver at some point on day three who can assist on special teams for a year while waiting to move up on the depth chart due to injuries (although probably a healthy inactive with the top four available). The sixth receiver figures to be Josh Bellamy or someone who is a true specialist. Not a guy who figures to be in the receiver rotation.

I'm not sure where Jackson-Garcon-Roberts would rank in terms of NFL receiving depth charts, but I think you have to go back to the Norv days to find a comparable group for the Redskins. 1999 at least. Maybe not quite top ten in the NFL, but best Washington receiver group in 15 years.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=GTripp0012;1067452]I agree that Hankerson and Robinson are competing for one spot at this point.

I still think they'll draft a receiver at some point on day three who can assist on special teams for a year while waiting to move up on the depth chart due to injuries (although probably a healthy inactive with the top four available). The sixth receiver figures to be Josh Bellamy or someone who is a true specialist. Not a guy who figures to be in the receiver rotation.

I'm not sure where Jackson-Garcon-Roberts would rank in terms of NFL receiving depth charts, but I think you have to go back to the Norv days to find a comparable group for the Redskins. 1999 at least.[B] Maybe not quite top ten in the NFL[/B], but best Washington receiver group in 15 years.[/quote]

Tripp, they top 10.

I know you liked that Desean move and to follow that up with Colt? Come on Tripp, credit is due. And the contract for Desean?

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

who has a better 1/2/3 than us right now? the bears i guess, denver? others might, but i'm having trouble naming them. I believe we're in the 3-5 range there as of right now.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=That Guy;1067461]who has a better 1/2/3 than us right now? the bears i guess, denver? others might, but i'm having trouble naming them. I believe we're in the 3-5 range there as of right now.[/quote]

Ehhh...we have a darn good WR corps, but top 5? I'd say Denver, Houston, Chicago, Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Cleveland, Dallas, and Atlanta are all either ahead of ours, or right behind. I love Garcon, but he's no Andre Johnson or Brandon Marshall, and those types of elite receivers give an edge to any team that has them. Now if you're throwing TEs into the mix, too, then Washington is probably top 5. Only Denver, Detroit, Cincinnati, Atlanta, and perhaps Cleveland are in the same boat.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=SirLK26;1067466]Ehhh...we have a darn good WR corps, but top 5? I'd say Denver, Houston, Chicago, Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Cleveland, Dallas, and Atlanta are all either ahead of ours, or right behind. I love Garcon, but he's no Andre Johnson or Brandon Marshall, and those types of elite receivers give an edge to any team that has them. Now if you're throwing TEs into the mix, too, then Washington is probably top 5. Only Denver, Detroit, Cincinnati, Atlanta, and perhaps Cleveland are in the same boat.[/quote]

I wouldnt put Dallas, Cleveland, or Houston's group ahead of ours at all. I would put our 1/2/3 at top 5 maybe top 3, trailing only Atlanta for sure.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

^and possibly Chicago

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1067468]I wouldnt put Dallas, Cleveland, or Houston's group ahead of ours at all. I would put our 1/2/3 at top 5 maybe top 3, trailing only Atlanta for sure.[/quote]

You're probably right. But those first 3 teams you mentioned have elite WRs, guys who are at the top of the NFL at their positions. Of those 3, I would definitely put Houston's WR corps ahead of our's, but you're probably correct about the other two, since Bryant and Gordon have very little support from their WR corps.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

Houston has little support, Hopkins is not better than Jackson and Andre Johnson has regressed the last two seasons. I think you are overvaluing their overall group a bit.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

As far as WR corps go, only Atlanta boasts a better 1/2/3 punch than Garcon, DJax, and Roberts. Chicago has a better 1/2 but is their 3 better than Roberts??

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

If Nicks is healthy you can throw in Indy to the top 5 as well

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

If you're grading WR groups. IMO you have to take into account the QB, you have Cleveland on that list who's there QB.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;1067475]If you're grading WR groups. IMO you have to take into account the QB, you have Cleveland on that list who's there QB.[/quote]

If you are going to take into account the QB, don't forget the line.
Desean Jackson is not going to do anything for us if we continue with the 3 step drops. He needs time to get deep and take the safeties with him.

Re: Redskins Sign DeSean Jackson
 

[quote=jamf;1067477]If you are going to take into account the QB, don't forget the line.
Desean Jackson is not going to do anything for us if we continue with the 3 step drops. He needs time to get deep and take the safeties with him.[/quote]

The Cowboys and Chiefs beg to differ on that. DeSean isnt Aldrick, he can run other routes besides the deep ball, catch a slant make a guy miss 80 yards later you are dancing in the end. Zone

Bears have the best starting group with Marshall and Jeffery. As far as entire group I'd say we r sitting pretty high

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