Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

I like Chase young and all, but I still think if they can pull off a trade or two that gives the team 3 or 4 picks in the first two rounds rather than just the one, they can make this team much better, much quicker. Maybe come away with a top OT, top TE, a CB, and still get a real good edge rusher...Of course they need willing trade partners, but that would be my game plan #1. If no willing partner(s), then CY it is.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=SunnySide;1246011]You have the no. 1 overall, there is a consensus best QB who put up monster stats in a pro style offense against SEC defenses and who also seems NFL ready .... malpractice to get cute imo.

I think you keep drafting a QB until you get it right.

Stars lined up right for Cincy, just like it looks like the stars lined up right for us.[/quote]

I tend to agree with this. I see the #1 and #2 picks being no-brainers for the two teams picking first. After that, it's a free for all. Cincy needs a franchise QB and Burrow is looking like the best bet since Luck. And we'd get the player that many think is the overall best player in the draft. I have a feeling that after all is said and done, this is what will happen, and then there will be a frenzy afterwards.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

The #1and #2 picks are set. Anyone who wants to really move up talks to Detroit first because they are far cheaper than us or Cincy. If I was Detroit and got an offer I would then call Miami and ask them to better it. Miami has the most to trade BY FAR and will move up if they have to.

Although I think big mega-deals are possible, the history of them is pretty bad and they are fairly rare. Only a nimrod like Bruce Allen makes the RG3 deal.

The truth is draft picks, especially at QB, sometimes are busts. So trading many high draft picks for ONE GUY, is very high risk. Look what happened to Shanahan here when RG3 tanked.

I give it a 99% chance we will take Chase Young and I’m very excited to see him on our defense.


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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

Has there ever been a mega deal where the guy a team traded a ton of capital for turned out to be worth it?

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

On April 10th we should have a clearer view of whether or not some team will pay a high price to move up for Tua. That's because Tua is scheduled to take a medical exam tomorrow, March 9th, that could result in his final clearance to resume all football activities and, if he is cleared, the next step for him is his own Pro Day which is currently scheduled for Thursday, April 19th.

If Tua aces his Pro Day, I anticipate that multiple teams will attempt to move up to draft Tua. Those teams will need to draft ahead of Miami and it will cost a lot. Who knows who will try to move up, how far they'll try to move up, or if Miami will try to move up, as well.

One thing that no team that covets Tua wants to do is to trade a ton of draft capital only to see Tua taken ahead of them. That's why I think the Redskins #2 pick will be the target of these teams. I also think that the trade, if it happens, will be done prior to the draft so the team that wants Tua will not risk losing him to another team on a crazy draft day deal. Lastly, the #2 pick needs to be their target because if the Bengals surprise and take Tua, then the team that traded up for him can then take Burrow. Trying to read the minds of the teams drafting at #2, #3, and #4 is risky business.

The Skins need to continue to state and act like they are undecided between Young, Tua, or Burrow with their #2 pick in order to be able to receive and evaluate any trade offers they may get for that pick. It's simply smart business.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=mooby;1246200]Has there ever been a mega deal where the guy a team traded a ton of capital for turned out to be worth it?[/quote]

Yes. Trades for Jerry Rice, Tony Dorsett, Earl Campbell, Dick Butkus, Eric Dickerson, Michael Vick, and Julio Jones.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1246222]Yes. Trades for Jerry Rice, Tony Dorsett, Earl Campbell, Dick Butkus, Eric Dickerson, Michael Vick, and Julio Jones.[/quote]

Jerry Rice wasn't a mega-deal, the 49ers traded their first two picks to move up to 16 to get him.

I'm talking MEGA-deals, i.e. the Redskins give up 3 ones and a 2 for RG3. The Saints give up an entire draft for Ricky Williams.

I'll concede the Dickerson and Dorsett deals as both were worth it, but the Butkus trade wasn't a mega-deal and Vick was absolutely not worth it.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1246226]Jerry Rice wasn't a mega-deal, the 49ers traded their first two picks to move up to 16 to get him.



I'm talking MEGA-deals, i.e. the Redskins give up 3 ones and a 2 for RG3. The Saints give up an entire draft for Ricky Williams.



I'll concede the Dickerson and Dorsett deals as both were worth it, but the Butkus trade wasn't a mega-deal and Vick was absolutely not worth it.[/QUOTE]



A lot more mega-busts than mega-deals. Look at RG3 for example.....


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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

If we Trade Trent for a 1st rounder and then trade #2 for 5 and 18, look out!

Wishful thinking I Know

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=Warthog;1246231]A lot more mega-busts than mega-deals. Look at RG3 for example.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

Warthog, I tried sending you a couple PMs, but it doesn't look like it worked. Anyway if they didn't check out my parking lot post on Kratom for back trouble.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1246295]If we Trade Trent for a 1st rounder and then trade #2 for 5 and 18, look out!

Wishful thinking I Know[/quote]

Need to get more than just #18 to trade #2 for #5. That would be equivalent value on the value chart, but given how highly Young is rated vs. the average player normally available at #2 and the apparent strong desire to get Tua by Miami, I think that requiring #39 in the deal as well would be the least I would consider. Just keeping Young still might be the better choice, but #2, #18, and #39 makes it an interesting option.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1246295]If we Trade Trent for a 1st rounder and then trade #2 for 5 and 18, look out!

Wishful thinking I Know[/quote]

I'd have to get 2 first rounders and a 2nd before I would even consider that. Because we'd be losing on on Chase. Tua, and potentially Simmons for that trade

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

With Trents age and injury history no way you get two first rounders but if you do trade Trent do you take an OT with the number 2 pick?

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=Giantone;1246319]With Trents age and injury history no way you get two first rounders but if you do trade Trent do you take an OT with the number 2 pick?[/quote]

In two words: HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLL No

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1246313]I'd have to get 2 first rounders and a 2nd before I would even consider that. Because we'd be losing on on Chase. Tua, and potentially Simmons for that trade[/quote]

We could get Simmons at 5 I think and then a CB at 18 . It wont happen but still

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[QUOTE=Buffalo Bob;1246296]Warthog, I tried sending you a couple PMs, but it doesn't look like it worked. Anyway if they didn't check out my parking lot post on Kratom for back trouble.[/QUOTE]



I just responded, thanks for the info!


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Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[QUOTE=EARTHQUAKE2689;1246313]I'd have to get 2 first rounders and a 2nd before I would even consider that. Because we'd be losing on on Chase. Tua, and potentially Simmons for that trade[/QUOTE]



I just don’t think we’ll get a first for Trent but we can always dream. Probably a second. Still, that second rounder will REALLY help our overall draft with a very good OT or WR.

For the #2 draft spot we’ll need Miami’s #5, #18 and probably #39. Highly, highly unlikely. If the football gods shined upon us with this mega-deal, that would land us Simmons at LB or maybe as a Sean Taylor clone (at FS), then a OT or WR with the # 18. #39 could go for TE. If we made that trade deal we would probably get to face Chase Young with the Giants twice a season for a decade. Their fans would certainly thank us!


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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[QUOTE=Giantone;1246319]With Trents age and injury history no way you get two first rounders but if you do trade Trent do you take an OT with the number 2 pick?[/QUOTE]



[img]https://media0.giphy.com/media/l3E6uhDAN3W7vylji/giphy.gif[/img]



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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

I'd take Tua over a Tackle at #2, u can get a good LT in Free agency this yr.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

This is how I would rate the likelihood of our current options:

1. Draft Chase Young - 70%
2. Trade down - 24%
3. Draft a QB at 2 - 4%
4. Trade up for Burrow - 1%

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;1246390]This is how I would rate the likelihood of our current options:

1. Draft Chase Young - 70%
2. Trade down - 24%
3. Draft a QB at 2 - 4%
4. Trade up for Burrow - 1%[/quote]

I'd say it's

1. Young - 50%
2. Tua - 25%
3. Trade down - 25%

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

Young 99%
Trade down 1%
Tua 0.0%


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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

CY is the common sense pick. Common sense ain't that common. Unless I get at least (3) 1st round picks and one of those 1st has to be 2021 I'm handing in my pick for CY with a big smile

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=MTK;1246394]Young 99%
Trade down 1%
Tua 0.0%


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

I agree that drafting Chase Young at #2 is the most likely scenario, but I don't agree that trading down has such a remote chance of happening. RR clearly stirred the pot regarding Tua, and I think that he would welcome trade offers and pull the trigger if a team offers us the moon. I think 67/33 is closer to what RR is thinking about the Young/trade down odds than 99/1.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=MTK;1246394]Young 99%
Trade down 1%
Tua 0.0%


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Yup

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[QUOTE=Number44;1246397]I agree that drafting Chase Young at #2 is the most likely scenario, but I don't agree that trading down has such a remote chance of happening. RR clearly stirred the pot regarding Tua, and I think that he would welcome trade offers and pull the trigger if a team offers us the moon. I think 67/33 is closer to what RR is thinking about the Young/trade down odds than 99/1.[/QUOTE]



I just don’t see that king’s ransom of an offer coming. Not for Tua.


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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

I think you try to create as much uncertainty and demand for the draft pick as possible. Leveraging national media, etc. to increase a sense of urgency to trade up for the pick.

We wont get 3 first round picks for our single pick. But if that moron should happen to call, you take the trade.

I was all about Chase Young, and then i listened to Mel Kiper's logic on taking Tua instead of Chase. It didnt completely sway me, but there is some fairly sound reasoning behind his view.

I think because of the injury, you pass on Tua, but you make the world think you love him.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=Monksdown;1246414]I think you try to create as much uncertainty and demand for the draft pick as possible. Leveraging national media, etc. to increase a sense of urgency to trade up for the pick.

We wont get 3 first round picks for our single pick. But if that moron should happen to call, you take the trade.

I was all about Chase Young, and then i listened to Mel Kiper's logic on taking Tua instead of Chase. It didnt completely sway me, but there is some fairly sound reasoning behind his view.

I think because of the injury, you pass on Tua, but you make the world think you love him.[/quote]

It's not just Kiper, others have suggested the same thing. Also who leaked the info on Haskins not reading the playbook? Seems oddly fishy that its just now coming out.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1246416]It's not just Kiper, others have suggested the same thing. Also who leaked the info on Haskins not reading the playbook? Seems oddly fishy that its just now coming out.[/quote]

Yeah, it would appear as though we may be running a bluff. And a bluff the other teams have to honor if they are particularly desperate.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

I won't be mad if they take Tua but man I love Young.. That is a tough decision IMO

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1246419]I won't be mad if they take Tua but man I love Young.. That is a tough decision IMO[/quote]

Easy decision for me.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=mooby;1246420]Easy decision for me.[/quote]

In the NFL, You HAVE to have a QB to win , yes Chase is the best player in this draft but so was Clowney and what did that do for Houston? If we draft Young great, our D should be very good but what if Haskins is not the answer? Then you have to start over again. It's a legit concern especially for an organization starved for a QB. Tua looks like the real deal, injuries aside when healthy he's a franchise QB.. Haskins was not considered that, he was a project and is why JAY was against it. I'm all for keeping him but again it's not crazy to think Tua should be the pick.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1246424]In the NFL, You HAVE to have a QB to win , yes Chase is the best player in this draft but so was Clowney and what did that do for Houston? If we draft Young great, our D should be very good but what if Haskins is not the answer? Then you have to start over again. It's a legit concern especially for an organization starved for a QB. Tua looks like the real deal, injuries aside when healthy he's a franchise QB.. Haskins was not considered that, he was a project and is why JAY was against it. I'm all for keeping him but again it's not crazy to think Tua should be the pick.[/quote]

There is literally no way Dan would've hired Rivera if Rivera didn't have a plan to try and develop Haskins into a franchise qb. Haskins earned the benefit of the doubt based off his progression last year.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

All the Redskins/Tua stories in the media and crap about Haskins is just there to get the most trade juice for our #2 pick. It just shows that Rivera can spread the smoke with the best of them when necessary.


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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

Most of the people who don't want the skins to take Tua think that Haskins is going to be a franchise QB. With that being said none of us know for sure about either one of them. So if RR likes Tua better than Haskins I say take him and let them have a competition to see who the franchise guy is. Some people feel he has the potential to be a mix between Russell Wilson and Drew Brees. I would take that any day. I know this could be a smoke screen to get a haul and that is ok too. But if we don't consider him and Haskins doesn't become a franchise QB and Tua turns into a mix of those two players we will be talking about this for years to come. Most of the so called experts aren't expecting a playoff run next year anyway so if RR feels he could be the real deal, draft him.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

This is Haskins year to prove himself. NO ONE knows if he is the franchise QB. But he played well enough at the end of the rookie season to deserve a chance to show his stuff this season. If he DOESN’T improve and have a good season and wining games, then we will draft a QB in 2021. This year Haskin’s must show us if he’s the franchise QB or not.


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Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=Warthog;1246496]This is Haskins year to prove himself. NO ONE knows if he is the franchise QB. But he played well enough at the end of the rookie season to deserve a chance to show his stuff this season. If he DOESN’T improve and have a good season and wining games, then we will draft a QB in 2021. This year Haskin’s must show us if he’s the franchise QB or not.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

1. Haskins doesn't deserve a free run at the starting QB job. Football is supposed to be about competition. Are you worried about hurting his tender feelings if he has some competition? If his feelings are an issue, then I can tell you right now that he is not the right man for the job.

2. We shouldn't put all our eggs in one basket at the QB position. What if Haskins doesn't improve enough to win the job? Are we supposed to accept losing for an entire season hoping that we can get a promising QB in the next draft instead of giving another player a chance to succeed this season? I say no.

3. We don't have to draft Tua. There are other good QB prospects who will be available after the first round. We should draft someone like Jalen Hurts to push Haskins.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

We got awarded a comp 4th. I think this gives us 3 4R now. Preston?

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

I understand the thinking in drafting another QB, wherever you draft him. But the football logic isn't about hurting Haskins' feelings, or whatever, it's about being in a good place with your depth. Its one thing to have a camp battle for starter between a vet and a rookie, its another going into the season with a rookie battling a 2nd year. Your rookie wins that competition you need to trade your 2nd year guy fast and have a vet on standby, because you don't want your season in the hands of a rookie with just a demotivated 2nd year backing him up (who carries 3 QBs nowadays?) - you need the vet cover. Your 2nd year wins and your backup is a now probably demotivated rookie with no experience and obviously not good enough to start. So do you let the guy you just drafted drop to the PS while you bring a vet off the streets up to speed or do you pray that your rookie can step up when needed. Neither scenario is something a pro coach dreams about because the rarety of that working out is overshadowed by the far more likely probability that you end up with egg on your face.

If we draft Burrow or Tua, Haskins is out the door ASAP and we're scrabbling around for a decent vet to go into camp with, and likely long after the better guys were picked up in FA. If we draft a QB in the 2nd-4th round then you are in the above scenario, and likely the same problem in getting a good vet backup. Either way you'll have wasted last year's #15 or a 2nd/3rd/4th this year. With so many more needs I just don't see it.

It's not the same situation as Arizona because Rosen had a fair chance and stunk. Haskins was improving after starting the year with a coach that didn't even want him. I say play out this season and if he looks like he won't get it draft a QB next year to build on a roster you built up this year.

Re: Chase Young or Three First Round Picks?
 

[quote=Randall Nestor;1246451]Most of the people who don't want the skins to take Tua think that Haskins is going to be a franchise QB.[/quote]

I am not sold on Haskins yet, but he really needs at least another year to be evaluated, especially when he had poor techniques that need work along with everything else. Even if we didn't have Haskins I would not want Tua at #2. Considering the Redskin's history with QB injuries taking a guy that has had two ankles and a hip operated on already by the age of 21 is just plan nuts. In the old days before teams reached for quarterbacks no way Tua would go in the first couple pics.