Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Everyone is talking about Bush and he definitely has some mad skills, most notably his ability to elude tackles. But I am left to wonder if Bush has been oversold and over hyped. Can he pound the ball for 16 NFL games? Is he another Peter Warrick? Are people overlooking how good Lindell White is?

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

I have a hunch that Reggie Bush's stock may plummet a bit this evening... I don't think USC is as good as they seem. Hell fresno state nearly beat them. I know nearly beating someone isn't beating them, but they shouldn't even have been competetive.

Then again, we should've beaten the cards by 20.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Bush and Lindell White are good players, but the stud in the college football right now at the skill offense positions is Vince Young. If anyone has not seen him play before today, make sure you watch him tonight. The guy is the next Micheal Vick, but much bigger and possibly more athletic. At 6' 5" and 230 lbs he is much bigger than Vick and nearly as fast.

Young's run-pass ability has him within shouting distance of becoming the first player to throw for 2,500 yards and run for 1,000 in the same season. Already, he is 28-2 as a starter, tied with both Bobby Layne for the most wins in school history and Nebraska's Turner Gill for seventh-best winning percentage (.933).

The guy is originally from here (Houston), so I have followed his career closely since I moved here two years ago. IMO the guy is the best college player period.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Reggie Bush is so overrated....the USC o-line is amazing...if the texans draft him, they are morons, especially since they already have domanick davis who is probably better than bush

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

The game tonight is overhyped, and im finally glad it is gonna happen, im sick and tired of ESPN only showing crap on the Rose Bowl.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Has anyone here watched Bush more than once? Or more than a few plays? The guy is universally regarded by people who actually know what they are talking about as the best rb to come since Barry Sanders. As much as Kiper is a tool the guy knows college football players and he knows everything. He knows crap we don't even have the mind to consider. Stuff like a DT's ability to get his hands from his three point stance to the OLs upper body or the ratio of an OTs thigh angle to his lower leg angle. Just random stuff that seems to have an affect on when a football player is going to be good. He says Bush is the best player he has ever seen. I think he is a tool but I think he knows what he is talking about. Bush is most likely the real deal guys whether we want to emotionally admit it or not.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=canthetuna]I have a hunch that Reggie Bush's stock may plummet a bit this evening... I don't think USC is as good as they seem. Hell fresno state nearly beat them. I know nearly beating someone isn't beating them, but they shouldn't even have been competetive.

Then again, we should've beaten the cards by 20.[/QUOTE]

I have to point out that the only reason Fresno State didn't beat USC is because of Reggie Bush. He had 513 all purpose yards! That's freakin ridiculous. Reggie Bush shows up big when the games are on the line. Without Bush they don't beat ND either. He's a great ballplayer.

I am concerned that he may not be able to carry the load, but that's also why I think that going to the Texans is the best thing that could happen to him. You put him in the same backfield as Domanick Davis and that run game is really scary. All they would have to do then is figure out how to pass block and they could threaten the Jags for the wild card spot in that division since the Colts are gonna be winning for the foreseeable future.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

I don't think Reggie Bush's stock goes anywhere but up after tonights game. I think that USC will prove thats its worthy of all the hype. Vince Young is indeed a great athlete but I just think that USA can beat Texas on so many different levels with different players. I believe that USC has a higher caliber of players at the skilled positions. I do imagine a close game until the 3rd quarter when UCS has been known to make outstanding in game adjustments. USC wins by 14.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Vince Young, I'd like to take him as my running back!

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=saden1]Vince Young, I'd like to take him as my running back![/QUOTE]

he is definitely faster and stronger than I'd thought before watching most of the game. the other guys on the field seemed to be moving in slow mo even when he didn't seem to be going full speed and the guy kept on shrugging off all of his would be tacklers.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

That was one of the best college games I ever saw, Young is unreal, it's like the guy has a forcefield around him, no one can catch, or tackle him, what a game!

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=Defensewins]Bush and Lindell White are good players, but the stud in the college football right now at the skill offense positions is Vince Young. If anyone has not seen him play before today, make sure you watch him tonight. The guy is the next Micheal Vick, but much bigger and possibly more athletic. At 6' 5" and 230 lbs he is much bigger than Vick and nearly as fast.

Young's run-pass ability has him within shouting distance of becoming the first player to throw for 2,500 yards and run for 1,000 in the same season. Already, he is 28-2 as a starter, tied with both Bobby Layne for the most wins in school history and Nebraska's Turner Gill for seventh-best winning percentage (.933).

The guy is originally from here (Houston), so I have followed his career closely since I moved here two years ago. IMO the guy is the best college player period.[/QUOTE]

Any Questions?
Bush should return the Heisman. The wrong guy got it.
Vince Young will be the #1 pick if he decides to come out.
Even Lindell White will get drafted before Bush.
The Heisman voting system needs to be changed. What do a bunch of pencil necked geek press guys know about Football? Most of those guys have never even played the game. The coaches should vote instead of press. Plus the award should be given after the championship game.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Well, I said over and over before the game that Reggie will be the main focus of Texas' D... as such, he tried to do way to much (especially with the stupid lateral in the first quarter). Vince Young made a believer out of me tonight and i congratulate the Horns on a well deserved W.

but Houston should still draft Reggie. He's going to blow you out of this world in the L.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=Defensewins]Any Questions?
Bush should return the Heisman. The wrong guy got it.
Vince Young will be the #1 pick if he decides to come out.
Even Lindell White will get drafted before Bush.
The Heisman voting system needs to be changed. What do a bunch of pencil necked geek press guys know about Football? Most of those guys have never even played the game. The coaches should vote instead of press. Plus the award should be given after the championship game.[/QUOTE]

White's not going before Bush and I highly doubt that Young would either. First of all, Bush had 19 touches for 177 yards and a TD. That TD was electric. He didn't have a great game by his standards, but he still averaged over 6 yards per carry. The issue was that he didn't get the ball enough.

I won't argue that Vince Young had an amazing game, but USC's D isn't nearly as good as Texas's.

Also, you have to look at who has the pick. The Texans would pick Bush because they like Carr and they don't need 2 power runners. I would, however, think that Young should go ahead of Lienart.

I'm not necessarily directing this you at you Defensewins, but I don't like when people just wait for someone to fail. Reggie Bush made one bad play that game and you won't convince that that cost them the game because all USC had to do was tackle. Or Lienart could have made a play on the last play of the game. Or he could have not throw that pick in the end zone. USC made too many stupid mistakes to win that game. One of them was also not getting the football in Reggie Bush's hands.

USC didn't lose because of Reggie Bush.

I do, however, agree that the Hiesman committee should wait to vote until after the bowl games. I'm pretty sure that if they had Young would have gotten it. However, if coaches voted before the bowl games, I'd have to say that it would have still gone to Bush.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=Defensewins]Bush and Lindell White are good players, but the stud in the college football right now at the skill offense positions is Vince Young. If anyone has not seen him play before today, make sure you watch him tonight. The guy is the next Micheal Vick, but much bigger and possibly more athletic. At 6' 5" and 230 lbs he is much bigger than Vick and nearly as fast.

Young's run-pass ability has him within shouting distance of becoming the first player to throw for 2,500 yards and run for 1,000 in the same season. Already, he is 28-2 as a starter, tied with both Bobby Layne for the most wins in school history and Nebraska's Turner Gill for seventh-best winning percentage (.933).

The guy is originally from here (Houston), so I have followed his career closely since I moved here two years ago. IMO the guy is the best college player period.[/QUOTE]

Dude, you are so on the money. Vince Young dominated USC. He breaks tackles like a FB, has the speed of a tailback, and is a pretty damn accurate passer. When he got the ball back with two minutes, you just know USC was in big trouble. If I was Casserly in Houston, I would trade David Carr and pick Young #1 over Reggie Bush after what I saw this evening.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=jdlea]..I'm not necessarily directing this you at you Defensewins, but I don't like when people just wait for someone to fail. Reggie Bush made one bad play that game and you won't convince that that cost them the game because all USC had to do was tackle. Or Lienart could have made a play on the last play of the game. Or he could have not throw that pick in the end zone. USC made too many stupid mistakes to win that game. One of them was also not getting the football in Reggie Bush's hands.

USC didn't lose because of Reggie Bush.[/QUOTE]
I know you are not directing it at me, but nobody is saying R. Bush failed. He had a great game. R. Bush is one of 2 or 3 top players in the entire country.
I am not saying he is not great. The guy IS the next Barry Sanders. However he is also running behind one of the best O-lines in the nation and playing with Heisman winning QB, plus another 1st round RB helping him. He is not carring most of the offensive load like V. Young is.

Plus did you see the Texas vs. Ohio State game earlier this year? Besides tonights game, the second played best game this year. Very physical game! Vince Young removed Ohio State from National title hopes in the Horse Shoe. I am not sure if you ever seen a game at Ohio U but it is one of the toughest places to win. I knew from that day V. Young is the best period.
The guy by himself is a difference maker.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=Defensewins]I know you are not directing it at me, but nobody is saying R. Bush failed. He had a great game. R. Bush is one of 2 or 3 top players in the entire country.
I am not saying he is not great. The guy IS the next Barry Sanders. However he is also running behind one of the best O-lines in the nation and playing with Heisman winning QB. He is not carring the offensive load like Young is.
Plus did you see the texas vs. Ohio State game earlier this year? Vince Young remove Ohio State from National title hopes in the Horse Shoe. I am not sure if you ever seen a game at Ohio U but it is one of the toughest places to win. I knew from that day V. Young is the best period.[/QUOTE]

I'm not gonna argue that Vince Young isn't a great football player. I love watching him. He got me hooked against OK State. That pump fake and then turn on the after burners down the sidelines made me believe he was great. I don't doubt that he can play, all I'm saying is that I'm tired of the people who try to take everything away from Reggie Bush just because he's on one the most talented teams in the history of college football.

I also won't argue that USC has a great O Line, that said, I also don't think that he's necessarily overrated. He passes what Tom Jackson calls the "eye test." Every time I watch him play he amazes me at some point in the game. ND wins that game if Reggie Bush isn't on the team. Fresno State does too. And he was sick against Cal. I think he'll make a great pro just like Vince Young, who btw, should turn pro now.

I'm just sick of everybody saying that his o line is great so he's not that good. It's not true. I saw some stat tonight that showed how many 20+ yard plays he has this season and while I don't remember the number I know that it wowed me when I saw it. I think it worked out to like 5 a game or something. He's excellent in the open field, that's got nothing to do with the O Line.

I do however have real expectations for Reggie Bush. That's why I think the Texans are the perfect fit. I think he comes to Houston and splits time with Domanick Davis. It would help keep them both healthy which is good cause Davis has issues with that and who knows if Reggie can take the NFL grind, right? Now, I think if he comes into that situation David Carr immediately gets better because teams really have to respect the run now. They always have a fresh back who is more than serviceable. And I think Andre Johnson helps keep defenses honest. I think that he's can't miss if you don't ask him to carry the load. And I'll go out on a limb and say that if he gets 15 carries a game he could go for close to 1300 yards.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Yeah, I strongly agree with you, R. Bush is not overated.
We just agree to disagree on who is the better player. They are both awesome though.
I just read on ESpn:
"He (Young) ran for 200 yards and passed for another 267.....and became the first player in NCAA history to rush for 1,000 yards and pass for 2,500 in a season.

One other thing, IMO I do not see the Texans using that pick on Bush. The Texans need deperate help on both the offense and defensive lines. Casserly will try and trade down. There might not be any takers though.
Either way Young is saying tonight he is going to stay in school. Once he sees the $igns he might change his mind.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

I can't really say who I think the better player is after tonight's game. Vince Young showed me a lot more than I had really seen because this was such a close game. I didn't see the OSU game, so I can't speak intelligently on that. All I can say is it is too close for me to call right now.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=hooskins]The game tonight is overhyped, and im finally glad it is gonna happen, im sick and tired of ESPN only showing crap on the Rose Bowl.[/QUOTE]

Maybe it was, but it lived up to its billing and more. That's as good a game as you'll ever see.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Uh, his name is *LenDale* White, not "Lindell." I guess that answers the question whether he's overlooked or not. :)

Vince Young was sick tonight! He almost outrushed Bush and White COMBINED.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=redrock-skins]Maybe it was, but it lived up to its billing and more. That's as good a game as you'll ever see.[/QUOTE]

Yea it wasn't THAT bad lol. Actually it was pretty good, I just get annoyed with the media and when they keep on talking about the same thing.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=saden1]Everyone is talking about Bush and he definitely has some mad skills, most notably his ability to elude tackles. But I am left to wonder if Bush has been oversold and over hyped. Can he pound the ball for 16 NFL games? Is he another Peter Warrick? Are people overlooking how good Lindell White is?[/QUOTE]
I think I'll take Vince Young.....

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

I live in Austin and I am a Horn fan and if that wasn't the best damn game you have seen in a long time something is wrong!!!! HOOK ' EM, now onto more important things this Saturday where it really matters!

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Amen!

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

I'm not a big college game guy but I do catch some of the games. As a person who has not seen much of these players over the years this is how I saw the game. To me it looked like Bush while playing hard was playing not to get hurt. Vince Young wow, I would draft him just to keep him from going to another team. He can run like crazy and has a great touch on his passes and now we know he can perform in the big games. I was more impressed with White than Bush. If they did not say or have names on their jersey I would have thought White was Bush. This was a great game and I was realy glad I stayed up to watch what will go down as one of the best college games in history.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Leinert is currently playing in a pro style offense, while Vince Young isn't. There is more of a market for a quarterback like Leinert in the NFL than young. Vince Young will not be able to run like he does now in the NFL.

I'm not saying he isn't an awesome qb and he won't be able to run, but nothing like he does in the college game. Running qb's do not last as long as pocket qb's do in the NFL.

Also, if you draft Leinert, its not like your getting a qb with no mobility like Ramsey.

They will go in this order
1. Bush
2. Leinert
3. Young

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

Vince Young is who Michael Vick WISHES he could be.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

I'd like to point out that while Vince Young certainly looked great tonight the type of things he did won't necessarily translate to the NFL. What he basically did all night was exploit what looked like a completely overmatched defense that wouldn't cover the pass for fear of Young running and wouldn't really cover him running for fear he would pass. He had a couple really good runs but not every run was an OMG type run. Often times he simply had 20 yards of room to run and no one close by. Other times he did just run guys over but hell he is a big guy and I'll give him a lot of credit for that. As for his throwing, the USC secondary looked ridiculous bad. I think Young is going to be a very good NFL QB but I think tonight maybe his stats were inflated by simply playing against what looked like a poorly prepared defense. In the NFL he'll very rarely play a team that wont cover one or the other tight. One thing Vick had the Young didn't show(not that he doesn't have it though) was a serious ability to make guys totally miss in an OMG way. Vick was on such an overmatched talent team that he often had to make ridiculous moves to avoid tackles. Young didn't have to do that much. He pretty much hit seams, picked holes and ran it to house with ease. He didn't look too challeneged all night. I'd prefered to see him challenged at least.

Now Texas's defense on the other hand looked prepared. They shut down and took out of the game the best RB in the country to the point that USC didn't even bother getting him the ball in 4 and short situations. That's what a prepared defense does in college. It takes away the biggest weapon by over-committing and hoping they can outscore them. That's the difference between USC scoring 55 and USC scoring 38.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

If Michael Vick was the prototypical QB of the future, Young is version 2.0. He's as good or even better at scrambling than Vick, plus he was the nation's most efficient passer this past year. This equals scary, scary stuff.

Leinert versus Young last night looked like a Model-T versus a Viper.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=Skinsfanmania]Leinert is currently playing in a pro style offense, while Vince Young isn't. There is more of a market for a quarterback like Leinert in the NFL than young. Vince Young will not be able to run like he does now in the NFL.

I'm not saying he isn't an awesome qb and he won't be able to run, but nothing like he does in the college game. Running qb's do not last as long as pocket qb's do in the NFL.

Also, if you draft Leinert, its not like your getting a qb with no mobility like Ramsey.

They will go in this order
1. Bush
2. Leinert
3. Young[/QUOTE]

Vince Young is the real deal. His stock went way up after last night. If he came out now, he should be the number one pick. Bush is exciting, but he reminds me of Warrick Dunn. I'm not sure he will handle the pounding of the NFL. He may be a great returner or 3rd down back. It's questionable whether he will be a feature back. I like LenDale White as a feature back. He has great elusiveness and size. Leinert will make a very good NFL quarterback but if I had to pick one QB, I would select Vince Young first. Whether you pick Young or Leinert, you can't lose.

This is my order.
1. Young
2. Leinert
3. White
4. Bush

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

It's so funny how one nationally televised game can change America's opinion. I have been saying that drafting Bush at 1 would be stupid because he is not a huge guy and runs past inferior competition on a weekly basis. In the NFL, you have to have some MASS, a la Lindell White, to be a successful RB. Bush will be a great 3rd down/return specialist, but I dont see him as much more than that for at least a couple of years. If I had the first pick I would trade it to the Titans so they can draft Leinhart and take a bunch of future picks in return.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

[QUOTE=skindogger47]It's so funny how one nationally televised game can change America's opinion. I have been saying that drafting Bush at 1 would be stupid because he is not a huge guy and runs past inferior competition on a weekly basis. [/QUOTE]

this is bad logic... so basically, marshall faulk or barry sanders were only 3rd down backs because of their size? i'm sorry but reggie has just as much, if not more instinct than both of those guys.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

I still need to see more of both Leinert and Young and their accuracy with deeper and intermediate throws before I get my expectations for both players too high and drool all over myself. As I said last night/this morning Young definitely impressed me last night but there is absolutely no way he comes close to those type of stats in the nfl with the much higher level of speed and power of defensive players. even Vick who is a vastly superiour runner has yet to come even close to 200 yards rushing in a game much less 200 yards rushing and passing. Bush I think will be a special player but will need a reliable rb to help keep him from getting worn down and White seems like a reliable rb u could organize an offense around. last nights game showed how much USC misses all of the players they lost on the defensive side of the ball to the nfl by playing scared against one of the most potent offensive weapons the past 10-15 years especially on the ground.

Re: Reggie Bush vs Lindell White
 

There are at least a half dozen "LenDale White-style" running backs in the NFL and they are very valuable commodities.

The likes of a Reggie Bush only come along once every few years.

That's why if you have the chance you take Reggie Bush and go to church and light candles to pray that he doesn't get a career ending injury.