Darren Howard
 

Now that the super bowl is over we can really get into free agency. This guy is 29 years old, great at times but often injured. However with our great coaching staff i think he'll be great. Santana was often injured too and look how that turned out. We need a pass rusher and there are not too many other ones out there unless we trade. Plus i dont think we have anyone on our team capable of stepping up to be an elite pass rusher in the league. What do u guys think?

Re: Darren Howard
 

I also think Nate Clements would be an amazing pick up for depth in the secondary. Plus he was coached by Greg Williams in Buffalo and hes only 26. I know it might sound crazy but we went hard after jeremetrus butler too.

On a side note I think someone should analyze the free agents for each position according too our needs like Mattyk did with the report cards. Maybe ill do it lol

Re: Darren Howard
 

howard will be a short term fix, if he could stay healthy. id rather go after a prospect a little younger

Re: Darren Howard
 

yeah he doesn't have too many good years left in him. I say we go after someone younger as well. Too big of a risk.

Re: Darren Howard
 

i really want darren howard for one. I wanted him a few weeks ago. he should be one of our few major FA pick ups. I think we get someone through the draft at WR unelss we get Jurivisous or Antwaan(both will stay with their teams)

Re: Darren Howard
 

I can do a positional FA/draft option thing in a bit... I'll need to find a definitive list of FAs first though.

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=That Guy]I can do a positional FA/draft option thing in a bit... I'll need to find a definitive list of FAs first though.[/QUOTE]
[url="http://www.theredzone.org/2006/freeagents/showposition.asp?Position=DE"]I am sure you have seen this but here is a list of current FAs[/url]

[font=verdana][size=2]Aaron Kampman[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Anthony Weaver[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Antonio Cochran[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Antwan Lake[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Brandon Green [/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Carl Powell[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Carlos Hall[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Cory Redding [/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Darren Howard[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Demetric Evans[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]DeQuincy Scott[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Jacques Cesaire[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Jared DeVries[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Jarret Johnson [/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Jimmy Wilkerson[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Joe Tafoya[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]John Abraham[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Juqua Thomas[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Kalimba Edwards[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Kemp Rasmussen[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Kenny King [/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Kenny Peterson [/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Kimo von Oelhoffen[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Kyle Vanden Bosch[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Lance Johnstone[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Marcellus Wiley[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Marco Coleman[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]N.D. Kalu[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Orpheus Roye[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Raheem Brock[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]R-Kal Truluck[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Robert Mathis [/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Rodney Bailey[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Ross Kolodziej[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Ryan Denney[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Travis Hall[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Tyoka Jackson[/size][/font]

[font=verdana][size=2]Willie Whitehead[/size][/font]

Re: Darren Howard
 

i think kyle vanden bosch would be a nice pickup. He made huge strides this year. He might be a one year wonder though.

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=mooby]i think kyle vanden bosch would be a nice pickup. He made huge strides this year. He might be a one year wonder though.[/QUOTE]


he has been injured every year before this. major knees. a definite medical risk

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=bigm29]I also think Nate Clements would be an amazing pick up for depth in the secondary. Plus he was coached by Greg Williams in Buffalo and hes only 26. I know it might sound crazy but we went hard after jeremetrus butler too.

On a side note I think someone should analyze the free agents for each position according too our needs like Mattyk did with the report cards. Maybe ill do it lol[/QUOTE]

clements will cost 5 mil to franchise tag him..i do not see buffalo letting him go. that would be a steep price to pay for a number 3 corner. or do you want to move springs to safety?

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=Big C]howard will be a short term fix, if he could stay healthy. id rather go after a prospect a little younger[/QUOTE]

howard had knee problems but is a team player. he plays inside when asked and once was a terrific pass rushing end. it comes down to how much he has left.

to sign him would still mean using the 2nd round pick on the best defensive end still onthe boards inthe draft

Re: Darren Howard
 

thanks for the link.. i knew the DEs, but that seems to have a good rundown of every other position too. Too bad it doesn't have stats and such though :/

If we sign howard I think it might end up like hugh douglas, where he'd only work on 3rd downs, he'd be useless on counters and against many running plays and he'd be retired in a year.

fiore, vaghn, barrow, harris, springs, noble... those are the injury history guys we've gotten in the last few years. first 3 never played a down, next three had a great 1st seasons and very spotty 2nd seasons (noble never played, harris was awful, and springs was still good, but missed a good amount of playing time). Also once coles got injured he went from a great #1 to an average #1 (kennison level).

Its just a risk I wouldn't take on an older player. If he were 25 it'd be different. Lavar has missed 2 years due to an injury and just now is starting to look like he can be effective again. Daniels missed a year and came back to play the best ball of his career (while slightly out of shape) though, so there's always a chance he could be good. If he's near vet min its much easier to justify it cause if he sucks it up in camp he can be tossed without much thought. He's had 4.5 good years out of 6 though.

I'd want this guy:
[url]http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302065[/url]

how many DEs get 80+ tackles in a year?

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=That Guy]I can do a positional FA/draft option thing in a bit... I'll need to find a definitive list of FAs first though.[/QUOTE]

When I did the Free Agents spreadsheet last year, I took the info from ESPN when they put it up. I think that was sometime in mid-February.

I don't know if I'll be able to do it this year, I have a lot on my plate.

Re: Darren Howard
 

I'm starting to hold off on my hopes for FA until we find out who's gonna be gone and who's going to restructure and free up cap space for said FAs. The team has made really good choices with the d-line recently so I have faith they'll get a reliable impact player for a good price. I'm more worried about their ability to get a reliable receiving threat to help out Moss, cuz we all know jacobs is gone and Patten, atleast this past year when on the field, didn't perform the way the team thought he might.

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=skinsfanthru&thru]I'm starting to hold off on my hopes for FA until we find out who's gonna be gone and who's going to restructure and free up cap space for said FAs. The team has made really good choices with the d-line recently so I have faith they'll get a reliable impact player for a good price. I'm more worried about their ability to get a reliable receiving threat to help out Moss, cuz we all know jacobs is gone and Patten, atleast this past year when on the field, didn't perform the way the team thought he might.[/QUOTE]

pattens production wasn't great, but once he left, everyone else's ypg production went downhill fast (i believe it was 80+ less yards per game on average, 30 less from moss an a ton less from RB receptions too, plus his 25ypg).

I'd definately want an upgrade and at least have 1 wr depth in case someone gets hurt. I'm still wondering if brunell not looking for patten was also part of the deal with his yards or if he's just more of a slot guy...

Re: Darren Howard
 

I think we need three thing to be great:

1. A possession reciever.
2. Pass rushing DE
3. Solid Kicker

I 've said this before, but I think we should address the 2nd reciever problem by either taking Koren Robinson, or trading Ramsey for Charles Rogers of the Lions. I'd also add Az Hakim for special teams and a 4th options.

Pass Rushing D-end I think we should draft Daryll Tapp with our first pick. He remind me of Dwight Freeny and would be an execellent component to our D. Howard given his age I wouldn't take him because I think he may be another Bruce Smith.

As for a Kicker I'd take Vanderjek (how ever you spell his name), Or take a fella in the draft with a big leg.

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=diehardskin2982]I think we need three thing to be great:

1. A possession reciever.
2. Pass rushing DE
3. Solid Kicker

I 've said this before, but I think we should address the 2nd reciever problem by either taking Koren Robinson, or trading Ramsey for Charles Rogers of the Lions. I'd also add Az Hakim for special teams and a 4th options.

Pass Rushing D-end I think we should draft Daryll Tapp with our first pick. He remind me of Dwight Freeny and would be an execellent component to our D. Howard given his age I wouldn't take him because I think he may be another Bruce Smith.

As for a Kicker I'd take Vanderjek (how ever you spell his name), Or take a fella in the draft with a big leg.[/QUOTE]

freeney is WAY WAAY faster and slightly stronger than tapp. At the senoir bowl he got pushed around a lot and never got very close to the QB (and he played almost the entire game since MK was out). Vander doesn't kickoff and is definately not a character guy, and for the contract he wants i doubt we'll pursue him. longwell is much younger and he's cheaper without issues. KR i like, rogers already has drug suspensions and has a TERRIBLE contract, so you absolutely would not want to trade for him.

Re: Darren Howard
 

Kyle Vanden Bosch looked great in the probowl,I wonder what his price tags gonna be

Late in the first quarter, Vanden Bosch burst past NFC left offensive tackle Chris Samuels with an up-field move and sacked quarterback Matt Hasselbeck for a 7-yard loss. On the ensuing possession, he disengaged from a block by tight end Alge Crumpler, worked his way inside with a nice counterspin, and then wiggled beyond tackle Orlando Pace to dump Michael Vick for a loss of 5 yards. In the same series, he flushed Vick from the pocket and forced a wayward pass that was nearly intercepted in the end zone, .

He's a deceptive guy," Samuels said. "You don't think he looks that strong or that quick, but he's got plenty of both those [elements] in his game. And he just keeps on coming. I didn't know much about him, but you had to be impressed."

Re: Darren Howard
 

they didn't get a lot of time to scout out bosch's tendencies, but he had double digits sacks, so yeah... bring him in. His price may be too high though.

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=That Guy]freeney is WAY WAAY faster and slightly stronger than tapp. [/QUOTE]
Tapp is also a rookie comming out of college who's play you are only talking about in 1 game. He was a dominating force in the college game and usually players like that make it far in the league

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=diehardskin2982]Tapp is also a rookie comming out of college who's play you are only talking about in 1 game. He was a dominating force in the college game and usually players like that make it far in the league[/QUOTE]

like desmond howard? like any of the 200 QBs (akili smith, ryan leaf, tim couch, etc)...

when he played better competition he had problems. He was in the right place, but he's short (for deflecting passes) won't win foot races (so no, i don't think he'll ever play OLB) and he got pushed bac a lot (though that's an easy problem to fix). He could be successful, but i highly doubt it'll be this season or even the next. He probably needs to bulk up too.

also in my last post that you quoted i didn't say anything negative about tapp, just the fact that freeney IS much faster and a bit stronger than him so that projecting one's success on the other is a huge mistake.

Re: Darren Howard
 

Shallyshal brings up a good point. but we need to begin to get ready to move springs because he's great but not getting any younger. he did have an injury issue at seattle. and he got injured this year too.something to think about

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=That Guy]like desmond howard? like any of the 200 QBs (akili smith, ryan leaf, tim couch, etc)...

when he played better competition he had problems. He was in the right place, but he's short (for deflecting passes) won't win foot races (so no, i don't think he'll ever play OLB) and he got pushed bac a lot (though that's an easy problem to fix). He could be successful, but i highly doubt it'll be this season or even the next. He probably needs to bulk up too.

also in my last post that you quoted i didn't say anything negative about tapp, just the fact that freeney IS much faster and a bit stronger than him so that projecting one's success on the other is a huge mistake.[/QUOTE]


things run in cycles.. like large receivers now.. guys like freeney are rare. just because someone like tapp is similar in size does not mean he will end up the same player

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=That Guy]thanks for the link.. i knew the DEs, but that seems to have a good rundown of every other position too. Too bad it doesn't have stats and such though :/

If we sign howard I think it might end up like hugh douglas, where he'd only work on 3rd downs, he'd be useless on counters and against many running plays and he'd be retired in a year.

fiore, vaghn, barrow, harris, springs, noble... those are the injury history guys we've gotten in the last few years. first 3 never played a down, next three had a great 1st seasons and very spotty 2nd seasons (noble never played, harris was awful, and springs was still good, but missed a good amount of playing time). Also once coles got injured he went from a great #1 to an average #1 (kennison level).

Its just a risk I wouldn't take on an older player. If he were 25 it'd be different. Lavar has missed 2 years due to an injury and just now is starting to look like he can be effective again. Daniels missed a year and came back to play the best ball of his career (while slightly out of shape) though, so there's always a chance he could be good. If he's near vet min its much easier to justify it cause if he sucks it up in camp he can be tossed without much thought. He's had 4.5 good years out of 6 though.

I'd want this guy:
[url]http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302065[/url]

how many DEs get 80+ tackles in a year?[/QUOTE]

kampman is a very fine young player.

but howard can be a 3 down player as well.he can play inside and has done it.

the only questions are his health and the size of his contract

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=That Guy]like desmond howard? like any of the 200 QBs (akili smith, ryan leaf, tim couch, etc)...
also in my last post that you quoted i didn't say anything negative about tapp, just the fact that freeney IS much faster and a bit stronger than him so that projecting one's success on the other is a huge mistake.[/QUOTE]

First~ Your comparing offensive failures to a defensive player. If I would compare him to anyone, it could be people like Zach Thomas, David Pollack, Kenechi Udeze,Troy polomalo Dwight Freeny... Players on defense who were undersized at their position and had the reputation similar to Tapp in college. ~Hard workers with high motors that always produced.

Second~ Dwight Freeny is 6-1 268, and has played in the NFL for 4 years ofcourse he is stronger and faster its a step up! At Syracuse Freeny emassed 34 sacks in college career. Tapp has 29.5 only, Freeny only has 4.5 more sacks than Tapp. To think Tapp was in the stronger division ACC and did this is a true accomplishment. These guys are very comparable especially given that Tapp has posted a 4.75 40 time. Is Tapp going to do what Freeny has done? I have no idea, but Tapp is worth a nod during draft time.

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=shallyshal]things run in cycles.. like large receivers now.. guys like freeney are rare. just because someone like tapp is similar in size does not mean he will end up the same player[/QUOTE]

grr, i wish people read better. [b]I[/b] was saying not to project him as the next freeney cause I had seen other people saying that in the media and in forums. freeney works on pure speed, something tapp doesn't have, hence a huge difference that renders that sspecific comparision worthless.

Re: Darren Howard
 

[QUOTE=diehardskin2982]First~ Your comparing offensive failures to a defensive player. If I would compare him to anyone, it could be people like Zach Thomas, David Pollack, Kenechi Udeze,Troy polomalo Dwight Freeny... Players on defense who were undersized at their position and had the reputation similar to Tapp in college. ~Hard workers with high motors that always produced.

Second~ Dwight Freeny is 6-1 268, and has played in the NFL for 4 years ofcourse he is stronger and faster its a step up! At Syracuse Freeny emassed 34 sacks in college career. Tapp has 29.5 only, Freeny only has 4.5 more sacks than Tapp. To think Tapp was in the stronger division ACC and did this is a true accomplishment. These guys are very comparable especially given that Tapp has posted a 4.75 40 time. Is Tapp going to do what Freeny has done? I have no idea, but Tapp is worth a nod during draft time.[/QUOTE]

they may be comparable in records, but not in projected success. Freeney is VERY fast, tapp can't make up ground on qbs, he's very average speed. Freeney posted a 4.38 40 time, thats a world of difference. Freeney has the speed to play safety, tapp would struggle at OLB (he's got a good initial burst though). Pollack and udeze have had average stats at best (and that being generous), and i would definately NOT classify those two as always producing. There's a reason he's not a first round pick, he's not terrible, but comparing him to freeney is insane though. freeney works on pure speed, something tapp just doesn't have.

Re: Darren Howard
 

howard is a good team player thats injury prone.maybe coming here and fitting into a rotation would keep him healthy but exactly what kind of money are we talking?too much above the veterans mininmum and i say no

Re: Darren Howard
 

this staff is VERY willing to extended low price contract to injruy risk players... overall it hasn't worked out great, but we haven't been burned either. springs, harris and noble gave us an insane year and then all got hurt and missed time this year :/ springs contract is below his healthy play though, when you're paying people to sit on IR though... fiore/vaughn/barrow were guys that just never worked.