Coaching Issue (I Hate to say it)
 

First of all I spent the last few months proclaiming my faith in Gibbs and telling everyone that would listen that we don't need a pro bowl quarterback in Gibbs' system.

I think part of the problem is Gibbs built the roster around his system, then he gave Saunders all the play calls. It looks like Saunders is not on the same page as Gibbs. He seems to be calling plays for a different team.

A good example is that Randel EL and Lloyd were supposed take the pressure off of Moss. This only works if you have all three on the field.

If Saunders is going to keep calling the plays, we need a play maker as quarterback, and that is not Brunell. If Gibbs takes the play calling over we can still use Brunell. One or the other has to change.

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i say...we concede the season and start fresh next year....

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OK.

Bring back Spurrier!

Jeff George is sitting at home right now (the Raiders came to their senses)!

Call Ricky Ervins!

Where's Leslie Sheppard? Albert Connell? Skip Hicks!?!?!?

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Which one was it Leslie Sheppard or Albert Connell, that had the sticky fingers? One of them was caught stealing out of other players lockers, like nfl players dont make enought already.

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[QUOTE=Stacks42;217864]Which one was it Leslie Sheppard or Albert Connell, that had the sticky fingers? One of them was caught stealing out of other players lockers, like nfl players dont make enought already.[/QUOTE]

Albert "the Playmaker" Connell

Re: Coaching Issue (I Hate to say it)
 

Yeah, Sheppard was the guy who was all legs, no hands. Fast but couldn't catch.

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[quote=Butzfan;217855]First of all I spent the last few months proclaiming my faith in Gibbs and telling everyone that would listen that we don't need a pro bowl quarterback in Gibbs' system.

I think part of the problem is Gibbs built the roster around his system, then he gave Saunders all the play calls. It looks like Saunders is not on the same page as Gibbs. He seems to be calling plays for a different team.

A good example is that Randel EL and Lloyd were supposed take the pressure off of Moss. This only works if you have all three on the field.

If Saunders is going to keep calling the plays, we need a play maker as quarterback, and that is not Brunell. If Gibbs takes the play calling over we can still use Brunell. One or the other has to change.[/quote] Did Saunders come in before El and Loyd or after? If it was before he had a say in those two picks.

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I also think Saunders could be causing some friction within the coaching staff. My main problem with him is his view that "It's not my system, it's the players". That doesn't seem like the type of coaching attitude that a player would respect. God forbid you adapt to the talent you have at your disposal, you self righteous prick!

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[QUOTE=Southpaw;217886]I also think Saunders could be causing some friction within the coaching staff. My main problem with him is his view that[B] "It's not my system, it's the players".[/B] That doesn't seem like the type of coaching attitude that a player would respect. God forbid you adapt to the talent you have at your disposal, you self righteous prick![/QUOTE]
Did he actually say that?

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[quote=ArtMonkDrillz;217891]Did he actually say that?[/quote]

When asked in preseason about the offensive struggles, he made the comment that his system is proven and the players just aren't executing. When asked about Brunell's struggles, he said the Kurt Warner won a Super Bowl in his first year in the system. Not that I mind him slamming Brunell, but that's still a dumbass comment to make to the media.

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[quote=Southpaw;217897]When asked in preseason about the offensive struggles, he made the comment that his system is proven and the players just aren't executing. [/quote]

Well, I think he's mostly right with that comment...not that he should've said it, but it IS tough to disagree with.

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[quote=Southpaw;217897]When asked in preseason about the offensive struggles, he made the comment that his system is proven and the players just aren't executing. When asked about Brunell's struggles, he said the Kurt Warner won a Super Bowl in his first year in the system. Not that I mind him slamming Brunell, but that's still a dumbass comment to make to the media.[/quote] Do you have a link to these comments? I'm not saying that he did not say them but I would think that we would have heard about these comments in the form of a thread or something like that. Those are not comments you make as a coach about your players that gets swep under the rug. You hear about it from one of the thousands of media sources and it then gets blown up as they ask the players what they think about the comments.

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[quote=firstdown;217901]Do you have a link to these comments? I'm not saying that he did not say them but I would think that we would have heard about these comments in the form of a thread or something like that. Those are not comments you make as a coach about your players that gets swep under the rug. You hear about it from one of the thousands of media sources and it then gets blown up as they ask the players what they think about the comments.[/quote]

I did not hear the comment about the players not executing first hand, but I heard it discussed on the John Riggins Show during the preseason. They didn't make a big deal about it, because they mostly agreed, and said the offense was still learning the huge playbook.

I actually heard the sound bite of the Kurt Warner comment early this week. I'll see if I can find it somewhere.

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Well, he's just pointing out the obvious. His system has a long and successful track record in this league. What did he say that was so bad?

I swear the players and coaches can't win. If they don't say anything they get blasted for not calling people out and covering things up, if they reveal a bit too much they get blasted for calling people out and not covering things up.

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It seems like a combination of coaching and player adaptibility that is wrong here. Saunders is sure of his stand-in-the-pocket/timing based offensive philosophy because he has enjoyed great success. Brunell has been a scrambling, play-making QB that enjoyed one of his best seasons last year. One or the other is going to have to adjust to the others style in order for this season to go any further.

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[QUOTE=DaveyFoSho;217856]i say...we concede the season and start fresh next year....[/QUOTE]

Uh NOOO!!!! That's what we've been doing every freakin' year for over decade....2 games and people are conceding. I really hope you're just kidding.

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[quote=Mattyk72;217906]Well, he's just pointing out the obvious. His system has a long and successful track record in this league. What did he say that was so bad?

I swear the players and coaches can't win. If they don't say anything they get blasted for not calling people out and covering things up, if they reveal a bit too much they get blasted for calling people out and not covering things up.[/quote]

Just about every great NFL coach takes the blame when a team fails to execute, which is exactly how it should be. If a player isn't performing to a respectable level, it's ultimately the coaches fault for putting the player in that position. Gibbs takes the fall for Washington's failings all the time. When a coach blames everyone but himself, for something that he is in direct control of, I lose respect for him.

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[quote=Butzfan;217855]
He seems to be calling plays for a different team.
[/quote]

Yes, he's calling plays for a team that could actually block. It's hard to make plays in the skill positions when our O-line has been getting dominated in both running and passing situations. I don't know what's happened to our front 5, but I really think that is the root of our problem.

We are also really feeling the effects of not have CP in to help pick up the blitzes.

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the problems seem to be with the QB. ugh... can anyone else just not wait for the game!?

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[quote=VTSkins897;217930]the problems seem to be with the QB. ugh... can anyone else just not wait for the game!?[/quote]

The QB is the easy answer, and I agree he really sucks right now, but it's the same old story with the offense. Run on 1st and 2nd down, desparation 3rd and long. It's hard for most QBs to look good when a defense knows you have to throw, go into nickel coverage, and gets penetration on a freakin sieve O line.

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I say the problem is the water boy. we need to bring in bobby boushet.

that is some high quality..........H2o!!

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This is all blasphemous. Gibbs is the general and motivator though his role has been reduced to his health. I once wondered the same what is Gibbs contributing if he is not calling the plays but he sets the tone of the team. It would seem he is the figure head to restore faith and pride for the community but we shouldnt doubt his importance of this team. I would assume the problems are due to Al, Mark which were expected bringing in a new language, plays to an old washed up QB. They will pick it up which I can say for certainty b/c the only way is up. Things couldnt get worse b/c the worse is now. My only concern is I doubt they can go 10-3 or 11-2 to finish the year although that would be awesome its highly unlikely. But this is when you get to see just how much heart they have with there backs against the wall.

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[quote=Buster;217862]OK.

Bring back Spurrier!

Jeff George is sitting at home right now (the Raiders came to their senses)!

Call Ricky Ervins!

Where's Leslie Sheppard? Albert Connell? Skip Hicks!?!?!?[/quote]

You make a good point. Every year we bring in big names before the games start, we have a disappointing season. We brought in as many people (and coaches) this year and the years we brought in people like Deion. This year, we seem to be going down that same road.

Last year, we pretty much went with whom we had and had the best season of the seven previous. Part of me wishes we had stood pat and kept the team we had last season intact.

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[QUOTE=DaveyFoSho;217856]i say...we concede the season and start fresh next year....[/QUOTE]

This team starts fresh every year and thats the problem. Nothing is ever built upon. They have a nice D last year so do they resign some of the D backs and keep building? Nope they give a huge contract to Archeletta so now its more learning, rebuilding, and chemistry.

The offense finally gets going, does the team keep building on that? Nope they bring a new coach with a huge playbook and it back to the drawingboard for another offseason.

Until this organization figures out you have to build upon the past and not rebuild every year they are going nowhere.

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[quote=irish;217964]
The offense finally gets going, does the team keep building on that? Nope they bring a new coach with a huge playbook and it back to the drawingboard for another offseason.

Until this organization figures out you have to build upon the past and not rebuild every year they are going nowhere.[/quote]

Do you really think the offense got going last year? You must not have watched the playoffs or the last game against Philly

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[quote=skinsguy;217908]Uh NOOO!!!! That's what we've been doing every freakin' year for over decade....2 games and people are conceding. I really hope you're just kidding.[/quote]

i wasnt even 0% serious...complete joke...10-6 11-5 are my projections either one...look for my post in the playoffs thread...i apologize for the confusion..

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i think this is a minor speed bump...last year we had a 2 and 3 game losing streak...this weekend both sides of the ball will look sharp and gain much needed confidence back...and then its on!!! SB XLI

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[QUOTE=DaveyFoSho;217987]i wasnt even 0% serious...complete joke...10-6 11-5 are my projections either one...look for my post in the playoffs thread...i apologize for the confusion..[/QUOTE]

Ok....I am breathing normal now, lol!! I believe if we get on a 3 or 4 game winning streak, alot of people's minds will change. In all my years as a Redskins fan, I have never seen a Joe Gibbs coached team that rolled over and died after a couple of losses....even in the few losing seasons under Gibbs. I don't expect this season to be any different.

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Just about every team in the league schemes to place their player/talent in the best position to make plays. That is what a game plan is all about.

The Redskin coaching staff over the last 2 games has not put together a valid game plan for the talent on this team.

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[quote=DaveyFoSho;217989]i think this is a minor speed bump...last year we had a 2 and 3 game losing streak...this weekend both sides of the ball will look sharp and gain much needed confidence back...and then its on!!! SB XLI[/quote]

If you count our last playoff lost, pre-season, and the first two weeks, we're on a seven game losing streak.

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I have a comment regarding the "Al Saunders System". His "system", his playbook is a compendium of all the best plays from Don Coryell, Ernie Zampeze, Norv Turner, et al. Most of the coaches in the league have or have access to this information. Gibbs knows all that and invented at least some of it. What I'm saying is that Saunders' x's and o's are not proprietary, they are not copyrighted. We could have had the playbook for a lot less than 2 million a year. What coaches get paid to do is have their players execute on Sunday and to organize their offense in a way that gets the most production from the tools at their disposal. The "my system has worked before" thing is not an adeqaute response and he knows it.

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[QUOTE=12thMan;217998]If you count our last playoff lost, pre-season, and the first two weeks, we're on a seven game losing streak.[/QUOTE]

Geez...that's the spirit.

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[QUOTE=70Chip;217999]I have a comment regarding the "Al Saunders System". His "system", his playbook is a compendium of all the best plays from Don Coryell, Ernie Zampeze, Norv Turner, et al. Most of the coaches in the league have or have access to this information. Gibbs knows all that and invented at least some of it. What I'm saying is that Saunders' x's and o's are not proprietary, they are not copyrighted. We could have had the playbook for a lot less than 2 million a year. What coaches get paid to do is have their players execute on Sunday and to organize their offense in a way that gets the most production from the tools at their disposal. The "my system has worked before" thing is not an adeqaute response and he knows it.[/QUOTE]

Exactly! It goes back to when everybody was whinning about Joe running the offense. "His offense is outdated" blah,blah,blah! It all boils down to execution. We won our last 5 games last year because the team executed the plays that were called. The execution has not been there this year. No matter where you tell the WR to run his pattern to, where the QB should throw to, or where the RB should run to, it all comes down to them phsyically executing the plays...and if they can't do that, nobody's playbook is going to work.

I do believe it takes one spark to start a fire, and maybe when Portis returns, it will be just enough to help the skins jump start the offense. Not saying he'll do it alone, but if Portis is getting the job done, then everybody else is going to try harder.

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[QUOTE=Manusky91;217965]Do you really think the offense got going last year? You must not have watched the playoffs or the last game against Philly[/QUOTE]

I didnt say it was a machine and it ran out of gas but it was going in the middle of the year. My point isnt whether the O was going great guns or pop guns, my point it they didnt build on last year, they started over, AGAIN.

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I'm ready for Sunday. I'm tired of bitching about everything that's wrong. I just wont a win and if we dont get it sunday then we are in real trouble. Get the win and some confidence and move on.

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It's amazing how a couple of wins will quiet all this shit down and change prospectives

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Damnit..Just shut up and wait for sunday.....and if we lose..Then we'll talk about who's head will roll

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[quote=12thMan;217998]If you count our last playoff lost, pre-season, and the first two weeks, we're on a seven game losing streak.[/quote]

Yea i understand what ur saying...and Brunell hasnt thrown a TD since Jan 14th at seattle...but the only losses that matter right now are Dallas and Minn...and we will bounce back...i honestly think we should take a page out of SD's playbook...85 rushes 47 passes with 33 completions... give portis 20-25 carries...ducket 5 betss 5...then let Brunell or Campbell sling it...defenses wont know whats up or down.......its working for them...so why not us...we have better receivers for when we do pass!!

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It worked for us last year when we were winning.

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My whole thing is, did we really need to bring him in?