Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

Everyone is saying we played Gibbs football this, Gibbs football that. But I think if Gibbs was calling the plays, we would not have ran so well. Obviously our passing was not all Saunders style(no deep passes, but some screens), our run game was all Al. This is why.

1)Gibbs is all about power running. Straight up the middle, hard earned yards.

2)Alot of Gibbs running plays are in the I formation.

3)What did we see in the game? Alot of singleback 2-4 wideout, runs. That is all Saunders, and something I feel Gibbs would not have done on his own.

4) There were alot of runs to the outside, with the line pulling, which Gibbs does not do.

Therefore, my claim is without Al, the game would been closer, and now with Al, our running offense is only getting better. Stop hating on Al.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

hey hoo, alittle love for Al? Saunders running style has the bigger chance for both the long run, and loss of yardage. almost like a home-run hitter. Gibbs straight ahead is almost guaranteed positive yardage, with the emphasis on getting what you earn. Saunders definitely has a higher chance of the big play

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

some people here are seriously bi-polar. asking for Al's head one week, then praising his 'record breaking' gameplan the next week.

fact is, so far, we've had two unequivocally terrible games against good, established teams, and one good game against a terrible team.

our offense is as yet unestablished and Al's 700 page playbook spans multiple games vs. multiple teams. Mike Sellers has confirmed as much. it's just too soon to tell.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

um, gibbs runs mainly out of singleback, saunders used LOTs more I form in KC than gibbs ever did here.

and gibbs doesn't pull? I seriously think you should look back at thomas and dockery last year as well as back at the hogs.

the thing al does more of is screen type plays to RBs and WRs, but last year gibbs did tons of that to cooley and moss too.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

The hogs trademark was pulling

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=hooskins;220298]Everyone is saying we played Gibbs football this, Gibbs football that. But I think if Gibbs was calling the plays, we would not have ran so well. Obviously our passing was not all Saunders style(no deep passes, but some screens), our run game was all Al. This is why.

1)Gibbs is all about power running. Straight up the middle, hard earned yards.

2)Alot of Gibbs running plays are in the I formation.

3)What did we see in the game? Alot of singleback 2-4 wideout, runs. That is all Saunders, and something I feel Gibbs would not have done on his own.

4) There were alot of runs to the outside, with the line pulling, which Gibbs does not do.

Therefore, my claim is without Al, the game would been closer, and now with Al, our running offense is only getting better. Stop hating on Al.[/quote]

Actually Gibbs made runs to the outside, with the line pulling, famous in the '80s. Ever heard of the Counter Trey? Jeff Bostic, Mark May and George Starke blocking to the left, giving the appearance of a run to the left. Russ Grimm and Joe Jacoby pulling around the right corner and down the field looking for linebackers and defensive backs to flatten? I'd say if anything, what Al Saunders is employing is a product of 'ole Joe Gibbs.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=illdefined;220307]some people here are seriously bi-polar. asking for Al's head one week, then praising his 'record breaking' gameplan the next week.

fact is, so far, we've had two unequivocally terrible games against good, established teams, and one good game against a terrible team.

our offense is as yet unestablished and Al's 700 page playbook spans multiple games vs. multiple teams. Mike Sellers has confirmed as much. it's just too soon to tell.[/quote]

I totally agree well said

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=D'BOYZ;220324]I totally agree well said[/QUOTE]


eek. thats not gonna win me any favors around here.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=illdefined;220328]eek. thats not gonna win me any favors around here.[/quote]

Ill, something you want to tell us??

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=12thMan;220329]Ill, something you want to tell us??[/QUOTE]


yes. Dallas sucks and always will suck. their toilet bowl stadium sucks, their fruity uniform sucks, their owner sucks, and so does their crybaby wide receiver. that is all.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=illdefined;220331]yes. Dallas sucks and always will suck. their toilet bowl stadium sucks, their fruity uniform sucks, their owner sucks, and so does their crybaby wide receiver. that is all.[/quote]

Don't forget that lame a$$ logo they have too.... Way to be original....

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

you forgot roy williams...he sucks too :)

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=illdefined;220331]yes. Dallas sucks and always will suck. their toilet bowl stadium sucks, their fruity uniform sucks, their owner sucks, and so does their crybaby wide receiver. that is all.[/quote]

Ohhhhh...okay....I was starting to wonder about your close affiliation with ole D'BOYz. He can come around all day long, but we can't have the fam getting too cozy with him.

In fact, I think we need to pass a [B]Man Law [/B]here:

No Redskin fan, no matter how congenial he or she is, must ever get too cozy with a Cowboys fan?

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=12thMan;220335]Ohhhhh...okay....I was starting to wonder about your close affiliation with ole D'BOYz. He can come around all day long, but we can't have the fam getting too cozy with him.

In fact, I think we need to pass a [B]Man Law [/B]here:

No Redskin fan, no matter how congenial he or she is, must ever get too cozy with a Cowboys fan?[/quote]

I am living by that rule... in fact I told this girl I was seeing (who hated break ups) all she had to do was say she liked the Cowboys and I would know it was over..... made it easy on her...

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

Okay, CSkin has weighed in on the matter. Can we get one or two more Warpathers and it's official:0

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=illdefined;220331]yes. Dallas sucks and always will suck. their toilet bowl stadium sucks, their fruity uniform sucks, their owner sucks, and so does their crybaby wide receiver. that is all.[/QUOTE]
And their cheerleaders are not nearly as hot as some fat assed, 50+ year old sports writers might have you believe.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

If we can run against Jacksonville I will be pretty darn surprised. Would love to see it, but they are way stout against the very best running attacks in the league. The outlook for the season will have done a complete 180 if this offense does any kind of damage especially on the ground un Sunday.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=wilsowilso;220341]If we can run against Jacksonville I will be pretty darn surprised. [B]Would love to see it, but they are way stout against the very best running attacks in the league.[/B] The outlook for the season will have done a complete 180 if this offense does any kind of damage especially on the ground un Sunday.[/QUOTE]
So juilius jones/marion barber, willie parker/et al, dominic rhodes/joseph addai are the [I]very best[/I] running backs in the league right now? Would you trade Portis/Betts for any of those combos?

edit: the steelers running game is very good, but still.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=12thMan;220335]Ohhhhh...okay....I was starting to wonder about your close affiliation with ole D'BOYz. He can come around all day long, but we can't have the fam getting too cozy with him.

In fact, I think we need to pass a [B]Man Law [/B]here:

No Redskin fan, no matter how congenial he or she is, must ever get too cozy with a Cowboys fan?[/QUOTE]


I'll be the first to sign. he's trying to divide the nation with his damned sensical comments. whatever happened to his Redskins conversion? weren't we close to making him defect last season?

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=wilsowilso;220341]If we can run against Jacksonville I will be pretty darn surprised. Would love to see it, but they are way stout against the very best running attacks in the league. The outlook for the season will have done a complete 180 if this offense does any kind of damage especially on the ground un Sunday.[/quote]

I want them to key on the run and I hope they were watching both CP and Betts run wild and get ready for that... then hopefully we can use a bunch of those passes in that 700 page playbook no one has seen and torch them through the air.... I think our first play from scrimmage should be play-action, deep pass to Moss.. You know they will be expecting the run..

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=ArtMonkDrillz;220344]So juilius jones/marion barber, willie parker/et al, dominic rhodes/joseph addai are the [I]very best[/I] running backs in the league right now? Would you trade Portis/Betts for any of those combos?

edit: the steelers running game is very good, but still.[/quote]


I mean over the last few years.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

That settles it: I journal these remarks in the Man Law Thread!!

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

Gibbs runs out of the I alot?

News to me.

Gibbs doesn't pull the line?

Counter trey sound familiar?

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=That Guy;220308]um, gibbs runs mainly out of singleback, saunders used LOTs more I form in KC than gibbs ever did here.

and gibbs doesn't pull? I seriously think you should look back at thomas and dockery last year as well as back at the hogs.

the thing al does more of is screen type plays to RBs and WRs, but last year gibbs did tons of that to cooley and moss too.[/QUOTE]

You are correct, sir. Not to mention that the Counter tre is the epitome of a pulling play--the classic Gibbs running play.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=wilsowilso;220351]I mean over the last few years.[/QUOTE]
I guess you're right. they do have one of, if not the best DT combos in the league. I like CanadianSkin's idea over trying to estbalish a passing game early to open up the run later. Sunday will be pretty interesting.


dallas sucks and their fans are typically jerks who like the smell of their own farts. pass it on.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=ArtMonkDrillz;220358]I guess you're right. they do have one of, if not the best DT combos in the league. I like CanadianSkin's idea over trying to estbalish a passing game early to open up the run later. Sunday will be pretty interesting.


dallas sucks and their fans are typically jerks who like the smell of their own farts. pass it on.[/quote]

it's not a question, it's a fact. stroud and henderson are the best DT combo in the league. the panther's DL may have been better overall when buckner was still in top form though... they've got good tackling DBs as well that help them take away the outside stuff too.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=ArtMonkDrillz;220358]dallas sucks and their fans are typically jerks who like the smell of their own farts. pass it on.[/quote]

heh, everyone likes the smell of their own brand ;)

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;220370]heh, everyone likes the smell of their own brand ;)[/quote]

Not all the time... I know I have let a few go that made my own eyes water....

But Cowboy fans stick their hands under the armpits and smell them.... they think they are superstars... Pass it on.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

To get back to the subject, I just watched the shortcut version of the game again and DAMN our offensive line, and I don't care who you're playing, owned that team. They're ALL professionals, and we just flat out dominated them.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

Thanks Malcolm for keeping us on the right path... yes our OLine did dominate and hopefully they can keep that momentum again. If they can give Brunell time in the pocket he can go after his own record and maybe whip out McNabbs record of 24 in a row....

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

Seriously, re-watch the game. I don't care if it was the Texans or not. We play like that this weekend, we win.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=illdefined;220307]some people here are seriously bi-polar. asking for Al's head one week, then praising his 'record breaking' gameplan the next week.

fact is, so far, we've had two unequivocally terrible games against good, established teams, and one good game against a terrible team.

our offense is as yet unestablished and Al's 700 page playbook spans multiple games vs. multiple teams. Mike Sellers has confirmed as much. it's just too soon to tell.[/quote] I was one of the people who was criticising the playcalling after the Dallas game. I wasn't saying, "Saunders sucks, fire him!" or anything, but I was critisizing him for not doing EXACTLY what he did against Houston. A methodical offense that mixes short passes with runs is hard to defend, easy to execute, and universially effective. You really have to pull your safeties up to defend it, and Saunders (I absoulutely guarentee you) was waiting for his chance to go deep. The Texans never gave him that chance. I'm not sure the Jags will either. But the Giants...I know for a fact they will. Brunell has his confidence back, and this offense will be clicking on all cylinders over the next few weeks.

The defense however, I don't see improving anytime soon. It's good still, but weaker than last year, plain and simple.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

We need Springs back ASAP.. once that happens then Gregg will be more willing to blitz as he will have two corners that can cover man to man instead of only one right now. Any word yet on his return?

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

springs is out this week for sure.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=CanadianSkin;220408]We need Springs back ASAP.. once that happens then Gregg will be more willing to blitz as he will have two corners that can cover man to man instead of only one right now. Any word yet on his return?[/quote]

Which one that's playing now can play man-cover? Seriously?

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=70Chip;220428]Which one that's playing now can play man-cover? Seriously?[/quote]

Carlos Rogers is much much better than many Redskin fans realize. He has forgotten to turn around and make a play on a few deep balls this year and he doesn't have very good hands, but otherwise he can really play football. Young CB's have one of the hardest jobs and adjustments in the NFL and he is pretty darn good already. Sure he needs to improve in many ways but he is 1 on 1 in man more often than not over the last three games. He is a cover corner no question IMO.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

Oh and our pass rush really sucks right now so I don't see how a second year player playing man against NFL #1 wideouts with no pressure on the QB is supposed to look amazing anyway.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

He will be good, with Springs covering the #1 guy and Carlos covering the #2 guy we are way better off. I also totally agree that our pass rush is horrible, we give QB,s way way too much time to find an open guy. I thought Carter was supposed to be a specialist? This could also be due to the fact we need extra help covering right now.. but those front four need to get a better push for sure.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[QUOTE=hooskins;220298]Everyone is saying we played Gibbs football this, Gibbs football that. But I think if Gibbs was calling the plays, we would not have ran so well. Obviously our passing was not all Saunders style(no deep passes, but some screens), our run game was all Al. This is why.

1)Gibbs is all about power running. Straight up the middle, hard earned yards.

2)Alot of Gibbs running plays are in the I formation.

3)What did we see in the game? Alot of singleback 2-4 wideout, runs. That is all Saunders, and something I feel Gibbs would not have done on his own.

4) There were alot of runs to the outside, with the line pulling, which Gibbs does not do.

Therefore, my claim is without Al, the game would been closer, and now with Al, our running offense is only getting better. Stop hating on Al.[/QUOTE]

You don't know what you're talking about.

1. Gibbs doesn't run out of the I formation...it's a single back formation.
2. Gibbs bread and butter running play, the counter trey..is ALL about the line pulling.
3. Both Al's and Gibbs' offense is a variation of Don Coryell's offense. They're both based on the same principle, with Saunders mixing up a few of the formations (such as the WR's linging up in the backfield.)

So, therefore, your claim has no bases of truth. I'd suggest getting your hands on a copy of some games from Gibbs' first era. But, I will agree with you, I do think Al is a valuable addition to our coaching staff.

Re: Saunder's running game is a bit different than Gibbs, but it works better
 

[quote=hooskins;220298]Everyone is saying we played Gibbs football this, Gibbs football that. But I think if Gibbs was calling the plays, we would not have ran so well. Obviously our passing was not all Saunders style(no deep passes, but some screens), our run game was all Al. This is why.

1)Gibbs is all about power running. Straight up the middle, hard earned yards.

2)Alot of Gibbs running plays are in the I formation.

3)What did we see in the game? Alot of singleback 2-4 wideout, runs. That is all Saunders, and something I feel Gibbs would not have done on his own.

4) There were alot of runs to the outside, with the line pulling, which Gibbs does not do.

Therefore, my claim is without Al, the game would been closer, and now with Al, our running offense is only getting better. Stop hating on Al.[/quote]

Are you out of your mind? Let me know when Saunders gets his third ring.

Saunders can call a better game than Joe right now but to use a blanket statement to discount the power running of Joe Gibbs is completely false.

Watch the fourth quarter of Super Bowl XVII and come talk to me.